Sumatra Sorrows...SOLVED!!!

[ezman604]

What's involved in replacing the port with a Foster adapter? Drilling and tapping?

Dave, see my previous post above.  BTW what caliber did you get?  .22 or .25?

Thanks John. I got the .25.
Gonna be my Yote eliminator. It sure eats up a 12" piece of 1X8.

[caniborrowsomeammo]

Shoot it down. But no need to as the check valve is past the fill port. If that is what you are asking.

[ezman604]

LOL
I'm very skeptical to remove ANYTHING off of a charged reservoir. I understand the check valve is holding the air back but. If I'm going this far, I might as well open it up and check out the check valve operation. Improve it if possible. Just voids my warranty I guess.

[wilsonj1018]

Waranties are made to be vioided
 lol.

[caniborrowsomeammo]

Thanks John. I got the .25.
Gonna be my Yote eliminator. It sure eats up a 12" piece of 1X8.

Shooting Hunter Supply 52 grain It blows holes in a 2x6 then a 5/8 OSB then flattens out on 8 gauge plate. It may handle a songdog

IF you are going into the pressure tubes to remove the check valve I would consult someone that has done it before .  As far as I've been is barrel replacement ( Chuckster walked me through that) , not quite to the pressure tubes.

[ezman604]

Brother Ribbonstone has been there and offered up some advise. Appreciate that too!!!
Delrin-like material? And actual Delrin made a good replacement? I can do that.

Drain the air, loosen or remove the set screws from the end cap. Doesn't appear to be threaded. Just those set screws holding it in place?

[caniborrowsomeammo]

I believe you need a spanner wrench.

[PakProtector]

The Foster fitting is a fine solution to that foolish probe design used. Why are you draining it?
cheers,
Douglas

[ezman604]

The Foster fitting is a fine solution to that foolish probe design used. Why are you draining it?
cheers,
Douglas

To open it up as Ribbonstone says. The check valve MAY have issues and could be improved by machining one from Delrin. But again, might be an option for when my warranty expires.

[Ribbonstone]

Yeah, they aren't fun to get apart the first time.  The tube end cap is quite long, has 0-rings, is threaded, and locked with that slotted ring.  They really cranked down on that slotted ring, so getting it off the first time isn't a lot of fun.

Realize the only Sumatra I've had apart is one of the old ones, the new ones could change a a few parts without bothering to tell us.

The actual check part on my old Sumatra was just a length of Delrin-ish material, shaped on one end like a nose cone (the end that actually seals the inlet opening) and flat on the other.  Cross pin behind it. No spring, would just rattle back and forth (if it wasn't mashed/squished). Get it in your hand and it's an easy part to make. Actually, I appreciate how simple the check valve is, it's just getting to it.

Once you fully degas the gun, you might be able to hear that little part sliding back and forth.  IF it is, then your problem might just be the probe and not be the check, although the tip could be mashed or fouled with a bit of crud.

[Joncooper]

Oh, okay. So, the fill port actually has the same threads as the Foster adapter? From the looks of the cap of the fill port it would be quite larger.
Most definitely will order the adapter and change it then. Keep the original port just in case.

Does this one have a quick drain process or just have to shoot it out of air?

I had the same problem I called PA and they sent me a free Foster adapter , I unscrewed the fill port blew it out and reattached It made sure It was tight and walla that fixed the problem...Ill keep the Foster adapter just in case i ever need it . You dont have to drain the air out the check valve holds It in.

[QVTom]

I have a different take.  As much as folks hate the probes they are a sexy solution and makes the gun visually pleasing.  Dave, in you case it seems to be a o-ring clearance/crush (lack of) issue.  Meaning either the probe gland diameters  are too small or the receptacle is too diameter is too large and the o-rings are not sealing.  Proof of this is that when you hit it hard with the pressure you were able to get a partial seal and get the gun filled.  If the check valve is stuck the probe o-rings will hold the fill pressure in the whip with out leaking form either side.

An unfortunate QC problem.  Manny gets the A+ for stating the 10 for 10 would catch such a problem.  Too many QC issues in the AG world.

Tom

[Big Bore Bart]

 Dave, didn't you just get a new lathe??  Sounds like you have a nice chance to get to know it.   Making a fill probe that fits properly should be a very straightforward project.

[Nomadic Pirate]

I have a different take.  As much as folks hate the probes they are a sexy solution and makes the gun visually pleasing.  Dave, in you case it seems to be a o-ring clearance/crush (lack of) issue.  Meaning either the probe gland diameters  are too small or the receptacle is too diameter is too large and the o-rings are not sealing.  Proof of this is that when you hit it hard with the pressure you were able to get a partial seal and get the gun filled.  If the check valve is stuck the probe o-rings will hold the fill pressure in the whip with out leaking form either side.

An unfortunate QC problem.  Manny gets the A+ for stating the 10 for 10 would catch such a problem.  Too many QC issues in the AG world.

Tom

Tom you one of the few if not the only one I hear say that


When I used to have a Bunch of DAQs, Marauders, and a few other guns with Foster System, I converted all my Koreans to Foster to make the filling easier,
....... well Once I sold all the other guns I reconverted the Koreans to the Probe,......I actually prefer it to the Foaster

[ezman604]

LOL
Good info in this thread for sure. Many thanks to all.
Tom, that is the same thoughts I have. Either the port is too large or the probe was a tad smaller that it should be. Hence it does not seal properly, even when I add Teflon tape. I may try one last thing today. I may add some floss in the O-ring slots and reinstall them. Maybe the minor increase in diameter will help it seal better.
As for making a probe, sure can. I made one for my Hatty AT44.
Give me some needed bench time therapy also.

[QVTom]

Tom you one of the few if not the only one I hear say that


When I used to have a Bunch of DAQs, Marauders, and a few other guns with Foster System, I converted all my Koreans to Foster to make the filling easier,
....... well Once I sold all the other guns I reconverted the Koreans to the Probe,......I actually prefer it to the Foaster

Yeah, there is beautiful and there is functional.  They are not always mutually exclusive but mostly are   Hard to claim the foster is not a superior filling system; it is.  I love the way guns look without industrial fittings hanging off them but I'm practical enough know most will choose functionality over looks, that is why I put a foster on my new designs.

Tom

[Norm_m]

Yes Manny & Tom are 100% correct! The 10 for 10 is indeed something that should be done to all Airguns before they ship.

What D Ez is going through is one reason Discos R Us does a 24 hour pressure test as well as a complete shot string over out chrony before any new gun ships. On top of that there is  no extra cost to the customer as it is a free service that we provide. The Chrony printout is included with the gun so that the customer knows what his or her PCP does right out of the box. You would be surprised how my PCPs with leaks we do find and fix before the gun ships.

I do understand that our gun sales are very small compared to dealers like PA and that doing it for free with their volume would not be possible.

Norm

[Nomadic Pirate]

Good Business practice there Norm,
that will pay off in the long run, good customer service is always greatly appreciated.

[QVTom]

Yes Manny & Tom are 100% correct! The 10 for 10 is indeed something that should be done to all Airguns before they ship.

What D Ez is going through is one reason Discos R Us does a 24 hour pressure test as well as a complete shot string over out chrony before any new gun ships. On top of that there is  no extra cost to the customer as it is a free service that we provide. The Chrony printout is included with the gun so that the customer knows what his or her PCP does right out of the box. You would be surprised how my PCPs with leaks we do find and fix before the gun ships.

I do understand that our gun sales are very small compared to dealers like PA and that doing it for free with their volume would not be possible.

Norm

Shameless plug LOL.

Norm you are to be commended for testing for free.  I hope you are able to bill back your time to Crosman for fixing their leaks!

Tom

[caniborrowsomeammo]

Yes Manny & Tom are 100% correct! The 10 for 10 is indeed something that should be done to all Airguns before they ship.

What D Ez is going through is one reason Discos R Us does a 24 hour pressure test as well as a complete shot string over out chrony before any new gun ships. On top of that there is  no extra cost to the customer as it is a free service that we provide. The Chrony printout is included with the gun so that the customer knows what his or her PCP does right out of the box. You would be surprised how my PCPs with leaks we do find and fix before the gun ships.

I do understand that our gun sales are very small compared to dealers like PA and that doing it for free with their volume would not be possible.

Norm

Shameless plug        HA.

Norm, in the long run you are money and time ahead. You have but eliminated back and forth shipping and frustrated customers, much less your time fixing a problem that shouldn't have been there in the first place if the problem was there unnoticed.
In my business as in many others, callback costs in time and labor are tremendous. I commend you.
The next AG I purchase will be from you if it is available through you.

But like many others, " that was the last AG i'm going to get "
Fat chance.