Author Topic: Millennium Pumper Production - The Beginning - And The Lousy End (Read 292105 times))

CarsonRatSniper · « **Reply #140 on:** November 14, 2014, 09:23:26 PM »

Quote from: sfttailrdr46 on November 14, 2014, 09:13:42 PM

I want one in .357

Believe me, we kicked that around! Theres enough meat in the breech to do it...but that's asking a lot from a Disco based powertrain.
It would be a stand alone caliber meaning no caliber/barrel swaps - or it would dissolve the .22 from being an option due to available maximum barrel OD of .500" in .22

I can only imagine how many pumps that would take for a classic Pump N Dump!

Mike

Sfttailrdr46 · « **Reply #141 on:** November 14, 2014, 10:44:17 PM »

Actually .22 is fine for most of what I will be using it for

Matt15 · « **Reply #142 on:** November 14, 2014, 10:52:45 PM »

Quote from: sfttailrdr46 on November 14, 2014, 09:13:42 PM

I want one in .357

Start eating your spinach.

CarsonRatSniper · « **Reply #143 on:** November 14, 2014, 10:55:03 PM »

Good!
I have two .22 barrels that need homes on customers guns!

Mike

rsterne · « **Reply #144 on:** November 15, 2014, 12:02:21 AM »

Yes, a .357 could be done, but to get any decent power (eg 100 FPE) you basically need to dump about half the air in the valve in one shot.... and that mean's a LOT of pumping.... The lack of compatibility with other calibers, and still relatively limited power and velocity (for a .357) were the reasons to leave that as a possible "one of" custom approach when we know for sure how the .30 cal performs.... Trying to extrapolate from .25 cal to .357 was just too big a leap.... Once the performance of the .30 cal is mapped out and we know what the maximum (and sane) performance levels are, then we will be in a better position to make a better guesstimate of what a .357 might (or might not) be capable of.... and whether there is realistically any point, other than bragging rights (mine's bigger than yours!)....

Bob

Sfttailrdr46 · « **Reply #145 on:** November 15, 2014, 08:48:13 AM »

No, I understand that there are practical limitations and accuracy + performance long term are way more important than the bigger is better concept. With good shot placement the Millenium will make a great survival rifle in either .22 or .25

Habanero69er · « **Reply #146 on:** November 15, 2014, 09:13:06 AM »

Not to mention the human effort that's going to be needed to pump up a .357 rifle! Get out the dumbbells & do some chest butterflies to get in shape to pump up one of these rifles. Sounds like a good chest/arms workout.

aom22 · « **Reply #147 on:** November 15, 2014, 09:57:43 AM »

Quote from: rsterne on November 15, 2014, 12:02:21 AM

Yes, a .357 could be done, but to get any decent power (eg 100 FPE) you basically need to dump about half the air in the valve in one shot....
and that mean's a LOT of pumping....

Might be the .357 would be a better candidate as a bottle rifle.

rsterne · « **Reply #148 on:** November 15, 2014, 01:05:42 PM »

It seems that once guys go to .357, they are looking for a deer rifle or similar sized game, which IMO means 200 FPE.... I've built three rifles of that caliber based on a Disco platform, the Carbine was 74 FPE starting with a 2000 psi fill.... The rifle version broke 100 FPE with a 2400 psi fill.... and got 127 FPE max. at 3000 psi, with a 4 shot string averaging 120 FPE.... All of those were with EunJin pellets, the velocity with cast bullets was under 700 fps.... My latest Disco Double has been pushed up into the 140-170 FPE range at 3000 psi, and will drive a 78 gr. JSB pellet at roughly 850 fps when the pressure is down to 1800 psi (140 FPE), but that is with 135 cc of air on deck (the entire upper tube).... It would never get to that with a 45 cc reservoir at that pressure....

When you refer to a bottle gun, if you mean regulated, then to get to that 140 FPE power level, with the size ports possible in a Disco valve, you would need a very large plenum, at least the size of a standard Disco tube, and at least 1800 psi.... I think that unless some breakthrough comes along, 200+ FPE big bores will remain primarily unregulated, large reservoir guns with only a few shots.... Hatsan is facing the same thing with it's big bore versions of the BT65.... the .30 cal looks like a winner, the .357 needs a lot of work just to produce acceptable FPE.... I didn't want to see the Millennium Pumper criticized because a .357 version was underpowered....

Bob

NickB79 · « **Reply #149 on:** November 15, 2014, 01:55:13 PM »

Any closer to deciding on a ballpark price yet?

Sfttailrdr46 · « **Reply #150 on:** November 15, 2014, 02:00:56 PM »

My true interest is with a .22 or .25 at under 40 yards it will be plenty of power with a well placed shot as long as the shooter is patient. If a hunter can and does take large wild boar with a .25 to the noggin then it will put meat on the table if the skills of the hunter are sufficient

CarsonRatSniper · « **Reply #151 on:** November 15, 2014, 02:44:19 PM »

I *should* have a price within a week or so...it will be listed in my Vendor Gate when I do.

Mike

farmerjoe99 · « **Reply #152 on:** November 15, 2014, 02:59:42 PM »

Agreed my interests are in .22 and .25
although I would be interested in a 20 fpe
.177 for field target...
Looking forward to more pics! I'll be watching for the price to

Joseph

aom22 · « **Reply #153 on:** November 15, 2014, 03:56:25 PM »

Quote from: farmerjoe99 on November 15, 2014, 02:59:42 PM

... although I would be interested in a 20 fpe .177 for field target...

Joseph, Mike has already addressed this concern.

Quote from: CarsonRatSniper on November 06, 2014, 12:48:25 PM

If your really set and serious about a .177 I can build you one using a choked Lothar Walther barrel and tune it to 12 ft lbs.
I will PM you when we get to that point...

I'd like to have an Mil-Pump in .177 as well.
However ... like you ... my priority is .25 caliber.
The real question is "how many buyers are interested in a .177 Millennium Pumper."

rsterne · « **Reply #154 on:** November 15, 2014, 04:03:32 PM »

Any platform ends up having an "ideal" caliber, and in the Millennium Pumper I think that may be .25 cal.... That's not to say that the .22 cal won't be a great gun, with more shots and cheaper ammo.... and the .30 cal for the guys who get a grin when they smack something hard.... When you go further, then you have to make some compromises, either turning the power down (.177) or accepting a lower velocity and a lot of pumping per shot (.357).... This gun won't be any different than any other PCP in that respect....

Bob

cclingma · « **Reply #155 on:** November 15, 2014, 05:01:27 PM »

Just curious, will these rifles continue to be manually machined after this first batch or will you guys go CNC?

CarsonRatSniper · « **Reply #156 on:** November 15, 2014, 08:12:17 PM »

We will go CNC if the demand for the guns is there...the first 10 or 20 will most likely be manually machined.
Sales will determine what I'm willing to put out up front.
If sales are slow then manual machining suits me just fine...CNC is only worth the cost if you're running 50-200 pieces of whatver part.
We have a local CNC shop, so that option has already been addressed.

Mike

jvanschoonhoven · « **Reply #157 on:** November 16, 2014, 04:56:25 AM »

I had a question about the stick mag and side lever.
So you load the stick mag insert it into the breach and close the side lever shoot your shot cock the side lever again at this point does the mag index to the next round? Also wondering if you can accidently double load it. I have an fx that I can accidently double load and I have a hatsan Galatian that wont let you double feed.
Just wondering what you came up with

CarsonRatSniper · « **Reply #158 on:** November 16, 2014, 11:48:47 AM »

There's no side lever - its a bolt that functions just like the factory Discovery bolt. The exception is when you pull the bolt back it recesses completely into the breech, fully exposing the loading port - you slide a stick mag into the loading port until it stops on a ball detent - close the bolt. Now the gun is loaded but it is not cocked.
The cocking lever attached directly to the hammer will be located on the side of the gun - you will need to cock it separately from loading.
Once you shoot - repeat...open the bolt - manually index the mag over one stop - close the bolt - cock - fire.

If you double load the gun it is because you moved the magazine over 1 click before you shot the last round.

There are 2 main reasons the gun has a manually indexing aluminum stick mag and a separate cocking function:
It *has* to cock separately in order for the bolt to recess fully into the breech so the loading port is clear for the magazine;
The magazine is a piece of machined 7075 aluminum with a couple of o rings around the circumference... There's nothing to go bad or break.

I wanted this to be as robust of a design as possible so the Millennium Pumper fits the bill of an Ultimate Survival Tool...that also means simplicity of function and design.
If you drop a stick mag then stomp on it with your boots, just pick it up...wipe off any dirt or grime and keep on going.
I think a Marauder magazine would fail that test horribly!

Mike

grhouse · « **Reply #159 on:** November 16, 2014, 12:18:23 PM »

I have been following this from the beginning and am wondering if you plan to set up any distributors in any areas around the country? I am considering becoming a distributor for the SMG22 line but this pumper may have more appeal in my area than the automatic. I live in the hills and mountain area of East TN and we have a lot of survivalist type folks around here that might be interested in one of these for squirrels and other small game. Gene

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Millennium Pumper Production - *The Beginning* - And The Lousy End

Author Topic: Millennium Pumper Production - *The Beginning* - And The Lousy End (Read 292105 times))

grhouse

Millennium Pumper Production - The Beginning - And The Lousy End

Author Topic: Millennium Pumper Production - The Beginning - And The Lousy End (Read 292105 times))