Gradually narrowing down pellet selection

[Oldgringo]

Thanks Greg- great lead on the source. I'll check that out!

You're welcome.  There may be some at the Texas Airgun Show in Arlington/Mansfield next month?  I've been to many gun shows in many different places but this will be my first Air Gun Show.  We've booked an RV site at Loyd Park for that weekend.  If they are not gone before then, I'm thinking that I might take my blue 96K and R9 with me and see if anybody wants 'em?  I need to start thinnin' the herd a little.

[nced]

Lizzie, Air Arms is manufactured by JSB.

No surprise they are frequently a good performer.

When I was on a "pellet head measuring frenzy" a while back I was starting to question my "pellet head measuring technique" after finding so few pellets from my 4.52mm labeled JSB Exact tins (most being smaller). Well....I also had a tin of Air Arms Diablos labelled 4.52mm and measured the heads of pellets from that tin. I really don't know how consistent the AA Diablos and JSB Exacts are from tin to tin but the Air Arms dome head sizes were considerably more consistent than the JSB Exacts and MOST AA heads actually measured 4.52mm which restored confidence in my pellet head measuring technique.

Anywhoo.....I don't use either the JSB Exacts or the Air Arms Domes but I've talked to a few field target shooters that also found the AA pellets to be more accurate from their guns.

While the JSB Exacts and the Air Arms domes are produced at the JSB factory, it's my understanding that the Air Arms pellets are made using dies supplied by Air Arms.   

[lizzie]

Lizzie, Air Arms is manufactured by JSB.

No surprise they are frequently a good performer.

When I was on a "pellet head measuring frenzy" a while back I was starting to question my "pellet head measuring technique" after finding so few pellets from my 4.52mm labeled JSB Exact tins (most being smaller). Well....I also had a tin of Air Arms Diablos labelled 4.52mm and measured the heads of pellets from that tin. I really don't know how consistent the AA Diablos and JSB Exacts are from tin to tin but the Air Arms dome head sizes were considerably more consistent than the JSB Exacts and MOST AA heads actually measured 4.52mm which restored confidence in my pellet head measuring technique.
   

That is the reason I commented that it was interesting. In my admittedly limited testing, with just anecdotal evidence, I find the Falcon accuracy plus  to be more consistent with accuracy than the JSB's I have on hand, and prior to this, JSB exact were the only pellets I used in my FWB124.

[Tack Driver 10]

H&N Barracuda Hunter Extreme pellets for all my 17 cal pumpers.
FTTs and Baracuda Match are next best.

https://www.pyramydair.com/search-results-ext?keyword=barracuda+hunter+extreme&sid=1375A617A415&N=0&Ntk=primary&q=barracuda+hunter+extreme&cx=002970863286801882398:jlcminxfwdw&cof=FORID:11;NB:1&saSearch

[lizzie]

Thanks TD!v I have had good success with the FTT in one of my R1's. Perhaps I should give those a try as well!

[Nod]

Hi Lizzie, I was reading your posts here about pellets and looked for my old notes on your newest 124. My notes from 01/10/13 read:

 " Installed Pro-Mac kit in 124 rifle- easy to do ! Mounted old ( bent Tasco) scope & adjusted, getting 3/4" groups w/ CP Pointed, adjusted scope a little now have 1/2" group @ 20 yds., adjusted a bit more , got 3/8" group @ 20 yds."

A few months later my notes read : FWB 124 favorite pellets, Crosman Premier Hunting 7.9 gr & Crosman Ultra Magnum 10.5 gr.

And then on 07/22/16 I noted that I was getting 640fps avg with the CUM's. That's the last note I have from that gun. Just thought I'd let you know what I found to work the best in that rifle. That thing shot so good I really wasn't looking for the perfect pellet because I figured if I missed it was my fault.

[lizzie]

It is an EXCELLENT shooter Nod!
Very likely in the top spot out of all my guns, and I have some really good guns, as far as vintage springers go!
Certainly, it shoots better than I have the capacity for doing justice.

[WD Feese]

I realize this thread is focused on pellet selection, however it raises the question (to me at least) about deep seating pellets.  It seems to me that tight fitting pellets forced into a bore will cause all pellets to have the same head size and solve skirt problems as well.  At least in theory it sounds good if accuracy does not go south for other reasons.  Deep seating pellets has been positive on a HW 70 pistol and several D34 (slanted breach bent skirts), for obvious reasons,  not so much on a D52.

[lizzie]

One of Ed's posts alludes to that, or at least that was my interpretation. He mentioned tight enough head fit that it hurts fingers, and it seems it adds to accuracy significantly. 

[WD Feese]

Thanks.  Thats what I thought I was reading.  Deep seating is basically swaging a pellet to the bore.  Seems like it should work more often than it does.

[nced]

Thanks.  Thats what I thought I was reading.  Deep seating is basically swaging a pellet to the bore.  Seems like it should work more often than it does.

Deep seating works fine for some guns (or so I've been told) but it doesn't work so well with my HW springers. For one thing, it seems to me that the piston needs to build up some pressure before the pellet moves and the resistance of the pellet entering the leade causes more pressure to build up just before the pellet "pops the leade". I know that if I use my old hardly used Beeman pellet seater and push the pellet into the leade till I can feel a "click" I get less velocity. Here is my old Beeman pellet seater that is seldom used since I only load the pellets by feel using the finder tip............

Still.......best to try "deep seating" to see how it works for you and your gun because I'm sure that all leades aren't the same!

[nced]

One of Ed's posts alludes to that, or at least that was my interpretation. He mentioned tight enough head fit that it hurts fingers, and it seems it adds to accuracy significantly. 

I found that as long as the barrel leade "swages" the pellet head a bit when loading I get acceptable without "sore finger syndrome". To solve the pellet fit dilemma with my tight leade HW95 I made up a couple pellet sizers to reduce the pellet heads without reducing the pellet skirt. The CPL heads start at about 4.53mm-4.55mm before sizing and I've been reducing the CPL pellet heads to 4.50mm which is a "happy medium" that works well with the looser leade R9 and tighter leade HW95 without "finger hurtin' pressure".
IMHO, as long as all pellets from the tin have heads that are tight enough in the leade to be "swaged a bit" when loading all pellets will fit the bore consistently. The issue is when pellets in the mix that have heads too small so be "swaged a bit" when loading which gives inconsistencies. A perfect example of this is when I used (supposedly) 4.52mm JSB Exacts with my Beeman R9 at a field target match. During that match I had two dry fires and would have had a third if I didn't see the loose Exact flip out of the leade when relatching the barrel! 

[lizzie]

One of Ed's posts alludes to that, or at least that was my interpretation. He mentioned tight enough head fit that it hurts fingers, and it seems it adds to accuracy significantly. 

A perfect example of this is when I used (supposedly) 4.52mm JSB Exacts with my Beeman R9 at a field target match. During that match I had two dry fires and would have had a third if I didn't see the loose Exact flip out of the leade when relatching the barrel! 

Yikes!
I am always a little paranoid about doing that, and when I have a pellet with a really loose fit, I take extra care not to let it fall out...it's happened before. 

[Oldgringo]

One of Ed's posts alludes to that, or at least that was my interpretation. He mentioned tight enough head fit that it hurts fingers, and it seems it adds to accuracy significantly. 

A perfect example of this is when I used (supposedly) 4.52mm JSB Exacts with my Beeman R9 at a field target match. During that match I had two dry fires and would have had a third if I didn't see the loose Exact flip out of the leade when relatching the barrel! 

Yikes!
I am always a little paranoid about doing that, and when I have a pellet with a really loose fit, I take extra care not to let it fall out...it's happened before. 

I've had that happen a time or two and have learned to be extremely careful with my very hard to close (?) Diana 34.  The HW break barrels not so much.

[nced]

One of Ed's posts alludes to that, or at least that was my interpretation. He mentioned tight enough head fit that it hurts fingers, and it seems it adds to accuracy significantly. 

A perfect example of this is when I used (supposedly) 4.52mm JSB Exacts with my Beeman R9 at a field target match. During that match I had two dry fires and would have had a third if I didn't see the loose Exact flip out of the leade when relatching the barrel! 

Yikes!
I am always a little paranoid about doing that, and when I have a pellet with a really loose fit, I take extra care not to let it fall out...it's happened before. 

Years ago when shooting Crosman Premiers from the die lot marked box, at around die #7 (Crosman used "numbers" at that time) there was a rash of boxed premiers with a bunch of undersized pellets in the box and I learned first hand that a "loose fitter" would be a flier. Before I started lubing the CPLs for my .177 R9 I also found that the loose fitting "hard lead CPs" would strip off lead and the "shavings" would pack tightly in the rifling, especially at the choke, and the bore would rapidly need cleaning. Decades ago I stopped shooting the "loose fitters" by pulling, shaking (and occasionally blowing them out from the muzzle) leade before seating if they sat too low in the leade. Not a biggie with the normal half dozen in a 1250 count box but a real hassle when the box had over 100 undersized pellets.

The issue with the supposedly 4.52mm JSB Exact was that they ALL fit loose in the leade so it was hard to judge the "loose fitters" from the "exceptionally loose fitters" when loading. As mentioned previously, my .177 R9 barrel has a larger bore than my .177 HW95 barrel so the loose fitters" with the R9 might have worked well with the HW95. I've never tried the Exacts (or H&N FTTs) in the HW95 but I am skeptical considering the large variation in pellet head sizes of both brands.
H&N FTT head size variations...............


JSB Exact head size variations............


Anywhoo......I found it best to sort pellets according to head sizes and shoot groups from the sorted lots.       

[Oldgringo]

Lizzie, my 97K's and 50S seem to prefer the 7.87 gr. JSB Express pellet.  Just sayin'....

[nced]

Lizzie, my 97K's and 50S seem to prefer the 7.87 gr. JSB Express pellet.  Just sayin'....

LOL....with the Air Arms equivalent and my .177 Beeman, "not so much" compared to the boxed CPL. I haven't tried either the Air Arms or JSB 7.33 grain offerings from the HW95 with the tighter leade but the results might be different.

[cobalt327]

Don't know if this has been linked to, Crosman @ eBay has the Benjamins for $7.95, free shipping. I've stocked up on them in hopes they're good for more than leading barrels...