GTA
Airguns by Make and Model => Crosman Airguns => Topic started by: avator on January 17, 2022, 09:43:19 AM
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... there are many more like it but, this one is mine.
It has... so far:
The forward hole steel breech.
An 18" chopped and crowned .177 barrel.
A Baker brass trigger.
Hawke Airmax 2-7x32 AO scope.
The rest of the gun is completely stock... no porting, no piston rod adjusting, nothing but lubrication.
I do, however, plan to revisit the trigger group one more time to set travel.
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I shot a couple 'warm up' shots at 25yds. I was amazed. It was too cold/wet to continue that session.
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Two shots - two 10's. 8)
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Many of us spend more effort getting the maximum power from our airguns. I am more into accuracy.
I have over 100 airguns in a variety of power levels and caliber. Plenty of options to meet the task at hand.
Betty Lou and I enjoy plinking and playing challenging games together and accuracy is key.
We have another 362 inbound and that one will be converted to .177 as well. It will get a slightly longer barrel.
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Two shots - two 10's. 8)
Actually 4 shots but the top 2 were sighting in. Not only was I amazed at the accuracy, I also impressed myself with my guess on turret adjustments to get on target with the 3rd shot. I left it at one hole and moved to the next bull to the right because I was afraid I might mess up that near perfect shot.... ;)
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.... and again, this was a home chopped and crowned 18" barrel.
I can't wait to see what a factory crowned 24" barrel will do.
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Very nice! Didn't I see a thread saying the Baker brass trigger didn't fit/work in the 362? Do I need new glasses?
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Yessir, you did see that. This is why I wanted to begin my own 362 thread. The info is too scattered.
The Baker trigger WILL work.. just not as intended. And I will address that shortly with pictures and MY experience.
Unless you want to do drilling, tapping and modifying, there will be no changeable adjustments to the brass trigger.
It will be, at least in my case, a set it and forget it setup.
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First things first... Let's talk about the steel breech.
My goodness, I can't believe the amount of confusion and misinformation about the steel breech that has been posted in a matter of a couple short weeks... :o
FOLKS.... the 362 tube is ONLY drilled and tapped for the breech with the forward mounting hole..... period !
If you don't want to, or don't have the equipment or the experience to drill and tap a precise hole then I suggest you do the research and buy the correct breech. It's NOT a one size fits all situation.
Unfortunately, I am using breeches I already had on hand and I cannot direct you to the right one to buy because I have around 10 of them and a severe case of CRS.
That's about all I care to discus about the breech.... buy the right one!
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I'm sure that Crosman used the forward breech screw mainly because it's a .22, .177 will have more of a tendency to want to dive some when pushing the pellet home which is easy to avoid just put the pellet in the channel then point up to keep it from diving before going in the chamber.
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Oh wait.... I lied.
The rear breech mounting screw... The bigger one that attaches the rear of the breech though the factory sight and into the rear tube end plug....
If you don't plan to reuse the factory peep/notch sight, which BTW, is not plug and play on the steel breech (at least not on mine), the screw is too long. Modify it or find the right size. Being too long it will go too deep and bind and damage your hammer spring.
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I'm sure that Crosman used the forward breech screw mainly because it's a .22, .177 will have more of a tendency to want to dive some when pushing the pellet home which is easy to avoid just put the pellet in the channel then point up to keep it from diving before going in the chamber.
I think you may be right...
Another note... from my experience...
The forward screw is not flush with the pellet loading tray. The smaller .177 pellets tend to get deformed when they 'drop' into the counter sink. In the past I have dripped birthday candle wax in to fill the void. The .22 pellets, being bigger, tend to pass right over without dropping in. On the other hand, pellet shape matters... wadcutters of either caliber tend to 'snag'.
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If it turns out to be a continuing issue with my .177 converted guns, I will do the candle wax thing again.
I prefer candle wax because it can be dug out or melted away easily as opposed to something like JB Weld or what have you.
These little screws are easy enough to strip without packing the Allen hole with something hard. I've had to drill them out before and believe me, you don't want to go that route.
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If it turns out to be a continuing issue with my .177 converted guns, I will do the candle wax thing again.
I prefer candle wax because it can be dug out or melted away easily as opposed to something like JB Weld or what have you.
These little screws are easy enough to strip without packing the Allen hole with something hard. I've had to drill them out before and believe me, you don't want to go that route.
... and the candle wax residue is good lubricant for the drill bit if needed ;)
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If it turns out to be a continuing issue with my .177 converted guns, I will do the candle wax thing again.
I prefer candle wax because it can be dug out or melted away easily as opposed to something like JB Weld or what have you.
These little screws are easy enough to strip without packing the Allen hole with something hard. I've had to drill them out before and believe me, you don't want to go that route.
... and the candle wax residue is good lubricant for the drill bit if needed ;)
Probably so.
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OK, I'm headed to the work bench to test a couple ideas on that trigger.
Promise, I'll get pics this time... ;)
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There is a thread hereabouts where WyoMan (spelling) gives a description, drawing, and screw size to replace the breech screw.
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I like to use a black crayon.
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There is a thread hereabouts where WyoMan (spelling) gives a description, drawing, and screw size to replace the breech screw.
It's just a countersunk 4-48 hardware Phillip screw with the head reduced by drill-chucking it.
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If it helps any I purchased the long steel breech for the 2240 and it has the correct forward screw that fits the C362. I think any new steel breech for the 2240 will be correct. I am not even sure where I bought it most likely fleabay, but it's now installed on the C362. Next I would like to do the least invasive addition of the Baker brass trigger. Thanks.
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Sorry for the delay... Betty Lou decided she wanted to go out for breakfast.
Well, I opened the trigger group back up (I'm getting good at it) and took a good long study.
After pondering my options and considering how many times I would have to open/close it to get just the right setting, I decided to leave well enough alone. The 1st travel gives me that 2 stage affect and, although it would be nice to have a little less travel, it's a nice stop and predictable snap to the break. The gritty feel is all gone and I like it just fine. I don't have a trigger pull tester but, if I had to guess, it's better than half what it was out of the box.
In the picture below you can see the over size, yet lighter wire size spring. (circled in red) The molded ribs in the frame 'trap' that spring and hold it in place without binding. The only other thing I did was stone and lube the contact points.... moly for contact point and some red grease in the pivot points.
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And while I was typing, UPS dropped off the 24" .177 barrel for the next gun.
For you numbers folks, I plan to chrono the stock .22, the 18" .177 and the 24" .177 in this thread for comparison.
Then I'll do some accuracy comparisons in the 3 configurations.
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Crosman's barrel packing... I give it a C-.
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Sorry for the delay... Betty Lou decided she wanted to go out for breakfast.
Well, I opened the trigger group back up (I'm getting good at it) and took a good long study.
After pondering my options and considering how many times I would have to open/close it to get just the right setting, I decided to leave well enough alone. The 1st travel gives me that 2 stage affect and, although it would be nice to have a little less travel, it's a nice stop and predictable snap to the break. The gritty feel is all gone and I like it just fine. I don't have a trigger pull tester but, if I had to guess, it's better than half what it was out of the box.
In the picture below you can see the over size, yet lighter wire size spring. (circled in red) The molded ribs in the frame 'trap' that spring and hold it in place without binding. The only other thing I did was stone and lube the contact points.... moly for contact point and some red grease in the pivot points.
Excellent Bill!! This is just what I was looking for. The last thing I need to address is the trigger. By the way, I suppose there is not way to reduce the cocking effort? My experience for some time now as been PCP's and CO2 guns.
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As for the barrel...
It's right on at 24" but it's filthy and the crown could use some touching up.
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Sorry for the delay... Betty Lou decided she wanted to go out for breakfast.
Well, I opened the trigger group back up (I'm getting good at it) and took a good long study.
After pondering my options and considering how many times I would have to open/close it to get just the right setting, I decided to leave well enough alone. The 1st travel gives me that 2 stage affect and, although it would be nice to have a little less travel, it's a nice stop and predictable snap to the break. The gritty feel is all gone and I like it just fine. I don't have a trigger pull tester but, if I had to guess, it's better than half what it was out of the box.
In the picture below you can see the over size, yet lighter wire size spring. (circled in red) The molded ribs in the frame 'trap' that spring and hold it in place without binding. The only other thing I did was stone and lube the contact points.... moly for contact point and some red grease in the pivot points.
Excellent Bill!! This is just what I was looking for. The last thing I need to address is the trigger. By the way, I suppose there is not way to reduce the cocking effort? My experience for some time now as been PCP's and CO2 guns.
Yes, assuming you mean cocking effort as in pulling the bolt back as opposed to the effort it takes to pump the gun up..
You can reduce the cocking of the bolt by reducing the hammer spring tension. That would be done by putting a lighter hammer spring in the gun. The problem there is, with the lighter spring, the gun may not dump all 8 pumps. Proper lubing goes a long way for making things much smoother and easier.
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I have found that if I put my thumb on the breech end cap and cock the bolt with the crook of my index finger all in one smooth motion, it cocks just fine.
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Sorry for the delay... Betty Lou decided she wanted to go out for breakfast.
Well, I opened the trigger group back up (I'm getting good at it) and took a good long study.
After pondering my options and considering how many times I would have to open/close it to get just the right setting, I decided to leave well enough alone. The 1st travel gives me that 2 stage affect and, although it would be nice to have a little less travel, it's a nice stop and predictable snap to the break. The gritty feel is all gone and I like it just fine. I don't have a trigger pull tester but, if I had to guess, it's better than half what it was out of the box.
In the picture below you can see the over size, yet lighter wire size spring. (circled in red) The molded ribs in the frame 'trap' that spring and hold it in place without binding. The only other thing I did was stone and lube the contact points.... moly for contact point and some red grease in the pivot points.
Excellent Bill!! This is just what I was looking for. The last thing I need to address is the trigger. By the way, I suppose there is not way to reduce the cocking effort? My experience for some time now as been PCP's and CO2 guns.
Yes, assuming you mean cocking effort as in pulling the bolt back as opposed to the effort it takes to pump the gun up..
You can reduce the cocking of the bolt by reducing the hammer spring tension. That would be done by putting a lighter hammer spring in the gun. The problem there is, with the lighter spring, the gun may not dump all 8 pumps. Proper lubing goes a long way for making things much smoother and easier.
OK, OK, I'm trying to get my work done here at the office and keep up with this thread ... I can't do both, so I just quit my job ;- )
wll
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LOL William, it's gonna be a little while before I get to the numbers stuff that you are most interested in anyways.... get back to work. ;)
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I'm retired so I don't have to quit my job. and that's what my hand instinctively did also Bill with my thumb. I lubed the bolt all around before installing the steel breech and I assume a different Hammer spring would mess with the pumping outcome so I took that out of the equation. By the way, if this is meant to be a young person's guns I hope they have long arms. I am 6 feet tall and take a 14 inch LOP ( had to add a slip on butt pad to the C362) and I have to think about how to hold this thing before I start to pump.
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I am 6' but weigh in at 225 so I have alot to reach around before I get to the trigger... :-\
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OK numbers people.... the moment you've been waiting for...
Remember.. this is an 18" .177 barrel
First 4 shots is 5 pumps with 10.49 H&N hunters. Just look at the consistency of shot 2 3 and 4.... WOW !!
5 through 8 is at 8 pumps.
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Wow that's not packed well at all. At least with a TJs he tapes it to a strip of wood and tapes it into a triangle shaped box.
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Numbers like those 1st 4 shots is where you are going to get consistent accuracy.
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Hold up.... I just realized...
I grabbed stats out of the chrono at 4 shots and didn't get them after 8.
Those stats at the top are for the first 4 shots only.
Which in reality is ok by me... this gun will rarely be pumped 8 times.
No need with my intended use. ;)
5 pumps will be the norm.
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With accuracy like this at 25yds and 5 pumps and 8+ fpe on a stubby walk about/truck/plinker... I'm all kinds of gits and shiggles ;D
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Ladies n gents.... I think I'm all done tinkering with this one.
I'll take your questions now.... lol
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OK numbers people.... the moment you've been waiting for...
Remember.. this is an 18" .177 barrel
First 4 shots is 5 pumps with 10.49 H&N hunters. Just look at the consistency of shot 2 3 and 4.... WOW !!
5 through 8 is at 8 pumps.
What you have noticed with the consistency is what I have noticed also. if I pump her like you are supposed to and do things evenly --- me velocity is very, very consistent. I'm very happy with what I'm getting and with what you got also.
wll
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Now I'm kinda anxious to see the comparisons.
Probably have to wait until Sunday for that.
The new gun is set to arrive on Thursday and I'm scheduled to work Thursday thru Saturday this week.
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I'm sitting on my hands over here....
I stuck the 24" barrel in the breech that is waiting for gun#2 and set it next to gun #1 for a length comparison.
It really don't look like it reaches into the next county like I visioned. Providing I don't put anything crazy out on the end of it.
I keep telling myself "Ya Know Bill, it's only a few screws to swap it over and you are off work for the next 2 days".
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We'll get to it.
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LOL..... and 13 minutes later...
Sorry... tinker's hollow got to me.
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I am very proud to say with the help of Bill and the rest of you people that me with 9 1/2 thumbs have joined the C362 Brass trigger club. And all I can say is what a wonderful difference it makes.
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Absolutely.
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I described the stock trigger as rubbing two bricks together. That grinding feeling. Now, it's smooth as glass and very light.
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Ok, how about some numbers with the 24" barrel.
Again... I am amazed at the consistency.
First 4 shots at 5 pumps and next 4 at 8 pumps.
I did swap pellets to the CPUM 10.5 grainers.
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Side by side... the 24" and the 18"
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WOW look how close those numbers are relative to each other.
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Side by side... the 24" and the 18"
Those look like great numbers... if only I could click the image to enlarge it. If I do, and I tried it trice, I get a new window telling me I don't have access! I guess I have to get a C362 and find out for myself.
Never mind, I can see them now.... but I'll get a rifle anyways. The only changes I'm planning are Baker trigger, steel breech and 18 or 24 inch barrel (or one of each)
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Basically I get 1 FPE more at 5 pumps and 1.5 more at 8.
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Try again BB... I had to change that attachment 3 times to get it right.
Also try the link below the pic.
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WOW look how close those numbers are relative to each other.
Nice numbers!
You must have installed a regulator, Mr. Bill ;D
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Mr Rick, I learned with the 880s that slow and consistent pumps are the way to go. Takes just a second pause on the upstroke to let the gun gulp air.
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I'm beginning to wonder if I'm getting some diminished returns on that 24" barrel. 22" may be the sweet spot.
Either way, I'm not going to cut it as long as the accuracy is there. 1/2 fpe is not worth the effort to me.
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Mr Rick, I learned with the 880s that slow and consistent pumps are the way to go. Takes just a second pause on the upstroke to let the gun gulp air.
Truer words were never spoken !!!
wll
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Just found something I did.....
I put just a little pressure on the barrel and felt the slightest move movement. I think when I tightened the tiny grub at the barrel band and the one in the breech I was a bit gun shy because I know how easy those are to strip.
So I squeezed the barrel to the tube a bit and tightened those 2 screws again I got a full turn more out of each and the play went away.
I don't know if i was losing air to the pellet from a tp leak and losing accuracy from the barrel band being loose.
I'll had to rerun the numbers to know for sure... that's gotta wait because 'the family' (Betty Lou, Boss and Rambo) came to hang out in the mancave and Rambo is a Nancy Boy when it comes to guns.
So I guess I gotta settler for Netflix and beer drinking..... could be worse... 8)
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Besides... Netflix is sucking the poop out of the bandwidth streaming from the IPhone hotspot.
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I'm beginning to wonder if I'm getting some diminished returns on that 24" barrel. 22" may be the sweet spot.
Either way, I'm not going to cut it as long as the accuracy is there. 1/2 fpe is not worth the effort to me.
It's not as much of a gain as I was expecting, especially given the barrel lengths being compared. I may give up on trying to find a 26" barrel, Alliance Hobby is the only place I can find them so far, and they aren't replying to my inquiry email.
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DJ... that 26" is also gonna leave alot of barrel hanging out in front of that gun..... just sayin'
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I'm unfortunately alliance Hobby's recent track record from what I see isn't very good right now.
Bill I thought the mancave had wifi or is that still not done yet?
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Nope... not done yet.
Still considering cutting the cord.
Doing the 14 day trial on YouTube TV right now.
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I'm beginning to wonder if I'm getting some diminished returns on that 24" barrel. 22" may be the sweet spot.
Either way, I'm not going to cut it as long as the accuracy is there. 1/2 fpe is not worth the effort to me.
Where do you order the 22" barrel from? Alchemy.... nope! I'll be dead and gone by the time it ships!
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Just placed the order for another brass trigger for gun #2.
I'm gonna leave the 24" barrel on this gun and it will become Betty Lou's.
I'll put the 18", steel breech and brass trigger on #2 coming in for myself.
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One of these threads have all the sizes and part numbers in them for the Crosman barrels.
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I'm beginning to wonder if I'm getting some diminished returns on that 24" barrel. 22" may be the sweet spot.
Either way, I'm not going to cut it as long as the accuracy is there. 1/2 fpe is not worth the effort to me.
Where do you order the 22" barrel from? Alchemy.... nope! I'll be dead and gone by the time it ships!
That's unfortunate, the eBay store has some really nice brass stuff listed... I guess I'll order a steel breech from Crosman and find somewhere to find a Williams peep.
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Well snarkle farks.....
I've come to the conclusion that I'm not getting the accuracy out of the 24" barrel that I got from the 18".
Looks like it may be time to bust out the hacksaw and Dremel.... :-\
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Sorry folks, I spoke but my mouth was running at 78 and my brain at 33 1/3 (you more seasoned shooters remember LP players..)
Alliance Hobby is the one that is a hit and miss, slower than a snail on crutches. Alchemy Airworks has always done right by me but they're still out of .22 caliber barrels.
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Well snarkle farks.....
I've come to the conclusion that I'm not getting the accuracy out of the 24" barrel that I got from the 18".
Looks like it may be time to bust out the hacksaw and Dremel.... :-\
Now you really got my attention! I was thinking of getting a 22 inch barrel from Mac1.
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Sorry folks, I spoke but my mouth was running at 78 and my brain at 33 1/3 (you more seasoned shooters remember LP players..)
Alliance Hobby is the one that is a hit and miss, slower than a snail on crutches. Alchemy Airworks has always done right by me but they're still out of .22 caliber barrels.
That's a relief! I really like what Alchemy has in stock, even if the brass stuff is a bit expensive.
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Well snarkle farks.....
I've come to the conclusion that I'm not getting the accuracy out of the 24" barrel that I got from the 18".
Looks like it may be time to bust out the hacksaw and Dremel.... :-\
Now you really got my attention! I was thinking of getting a 22 inch barrel from Mac1.
Yeah, I think I'll cut this one to around 22".
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Well snarkle farks.....
I've come to the conclusion that I'm not getting the accuracy out of the 24" barrel that I got from the 18".
Looks like it may be time to bust out the hacksaw and Dremel.... :-\
Now you really got my attention! I was thinking of getting a 22 inch barrel from Mac1.
Yeah, I think I'll cut this one to around 22".
Since the c362 already has a 21 inch barrel, i don't need to chang it, just a metal breech
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Sorry folks, I spoke but my mouth was running at 78 and my brain at 33 1/3 (you more seasoned shooters remember LP players..)
Alliance Hobby is the one that is a hit and miss, slower than a snail on crutches. Alchemy Airworks has always done right by me but they're still out of .22 caliber barrels.
I knew what you meant to say but didn't :)
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Well snarkle farks.....
I've come to the conclusion that I'm not getting the accuracy out of the 24" barrel that I got from the 18".
Looks like it may be time to bust out the hacksaw and Dremel.... :-\
Now you really got my attention! I was thinking of getting a 22 inch barrel from Mac1.
Yeah, I think I'll cut this one to around 22".
Since the c362 already has a 21 inch barrel, i don't need to chang it, just a metal breech
BB.... FYI, I'm running .177
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Well snarkle farks.....
I've come to the conclusion that I'm not getting the accuracy out of the 24" barrel that I got from the 18".
Looks like it may be time to bust out the hacksaw and Dremel.... :-\
Now you really got my attention! I was thinking of getting a 22 inch barrel from Mac1.
Yeah, I think I'll cut this one to around 22".
Since the c362 already has a 21 inch barrel, i don't need to chang it, just a metal breech
BB.... FYI, I'm running .177
Yes, sir! I got that. I find the .177 too small for these old fingers and bad eyes.
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I hear ya.... I shot the 880 Daisys so long I guess I learned how to just roll them in there with my thumb.
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I hear ya.... I shot the 880 Daisys so long I guess I learned how to just roll them in there with my thumb.
I honestly find the factory setup on the c362 annoying to load as well. If anything I expect .177 to be easier to load, aside from trying to pick up just one pellet out of the tin!
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LOL.... that's why I dump 10 or 12 at a time onto my cloth covered shooting bench.
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Bill up in the attic it's really hard getting them in there but wearing my readers helps tremendously, I ended up having to start uploading that video again because because on the first attempt it didn't work because I hadn't verified my account, if it fails again I'll just turn the speed up to 2x and upload it that way. You won't be able to understand me through the video but at least you'll be able to see the target being shot.
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Mr Rick, I learned with the 880s that slow and consistent pumps are the way to go. Takes just a second pause on the upstroke to let the gun gulp air.
Truer words were never spoken !!!
wll
And a wee bit of a pause on completing the downstroke to ensure the check valve seats.
Makes for least ES in MSP's.
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My hands are not able to grab pellets so I use suture forceps to pick them up by the skirts and place them on the probe.
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My hands are not able to grab pellets so I use suture forceps to pick them up by the skirts and place them on the probe.
I'm thinking about getting a pellet pen, this is the most annoying single shot I own to load.
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I agree, not sure about pellet pen but the loading is very fussy. Why is that?
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I find the 880 to be much harder to load. :o
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I find the 880 to be much harder to load. :o
Does it have the same breech as the 901? One thing I hate about the 901 is that short pellets can sometimes fall into the BB magazine area if the bolt is all the way back. I might try some forceps, I have a dissection set somewhere.
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Wanna talk about hard to load? How about a 2100? I have to use reverse squeeze tweezers for those.
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Wanna talk about hard to load? How about a 2100? I have to use reverse squeeze tweezers for those.
2100 and the Legacy 1000, I also have a Webley Rebel, that is a trick to load.
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Yep, I have several of that platform... AM77, 766, 2100 and 2200. I love them and they are quite special with after market wood furniture.... just a pita to load.
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The 362 is a breeze to load compared to some of the other single shots I have. It seems like there's more area to get your fingers in than the other guns.
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Guys.... I'm gonna step away from this one for a bit, at least until #2 arrives and I have time to spend with it.
I really need a PCP fix and I'll get that via the Buck in Black.... the BSA Buccaneer in the Gamo Urban stock.
Feel free to carry on in this thread.
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I find the 880 to be much harder to load. :o
Does it have the same breech as the 901? One thing I hate about the 901 is that short pellets can sometimes fall into the BB magazine area if the bolt is all the way back. I might try some forceps, I have a dissection set somewhere.
i find that if you make a habit of sliding the bolt probe forward 16 to 8th of an inch before each pellet load your pellets will never fall down into bb port i just do it now without even thinking about it. on that type of port especially the scoped winne 1977 i never shoot bbs anyways am thinking about filling the bb port with j b weld.
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These work great.
https://www.jewelrysupply.com/Cross-Locking-Fiber-Grip-Soldering-Tweezers--Curved-Medium-Point_p_11526.html?gclid=EAIaIQobChMI-PaOlOq-9QIVjeCzCh1faw1IEAQYBiABEgLk6_D_BwE (https://www.jewelrysupply.com/Cross-Locking-Fiber-Grip-Soldering-Tweezers--Curved-Medium-Point_p_11526.html?gclid=EAIaIQobChMI-PaOlOq-9QIVjeCzCh1faw1IEAQYBiABEgLk6_D_BwE)
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Guys.... I'm gonna step away from this one for a bit...
These work great.
https://www.jewelrysupply.com/Cross-Locking-Fiber-Grip-Soldering-Tweezers--Curved-Medium-Point_p_11526.html?gclid=EAIaIQobChMI-PaOlOq-9QIVjeCzCh1faw1IEAQYBiABEgLk6_D_BwE (https://www.jewelrysupply.com/Cross-Locking-Fiber-Grip-Soldering-Tweezers--Curved-Medium-Point_p_11526.html?gclid=EAIaIQobChMI-PaOlOq-9QIVjeCzCh1faw1IEAQYBiABEgLk6_D_BwE)
;D ;)
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hey firewalker thats the best saying about pellets i have heard
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My hands are not able to grab pellets so I use suture forceps to pick them up by the skirts and place them on the probe.
I'm thinking about getting a pellet pen, this is the most annoying single shot I own to load.
I use a pellet pen (blue-ish .177 from Pyramyd Air) to load my 1377 and it works quite nicely. Only way I see that getting better is if I get around to using Avator’s candle wax fix over the breech screw.
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hey firewalker thats the best saying about pellets i have heard
Blame credit goes to Deeco for that one though I 1000% agree! ;)
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My hands are not able to grab pellets so I use suture forceps to pick them up by the skirts and place them on the probe.
I'm thinking about getting a pellet pen, this is the most annoying single shot I own to load.
I use a pellet pen (blue-ish .177 from Pyramyd Air) to load my 1377 and it works quite nicely. Only way I see that getting better is if I get around to using Avator’s candle wax fix over the breech screw.
I may have to try the green one and see how it does.
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My hands are not able to grab pellets so I use suture forceps to pick them up by the skirts and place them on the probe.
I'm thinking about getting a pellet pen, this is the most annoying single shot I own to load.
I use a pellet pen (blue-ish .177 from Pyramyd Air) to load my 1377 and it works quite nicely. Only way I see that getting better is if I get around to using Avator’s candle wax fix over the breech screw.
I may have to try the green one and see how it does.
I have been using the .22 pellet pen for a grab n go outside use, at the bench testing I find it easier to eat them right from the tin :)
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Another mod I've used in the past to address the 'floppy' bolt was to make a bushing for the bolt knob shaft from a spent brass 22lr shell.
More on this later.
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Wanna talk about hard to load? How about a 2100? I have to use reverse squeeze tweezers for those.
Exactly! The guns that replaced the 140/1400 were made to look like dad's BAR, with the tapered barrel shroud, two-piece die cast receiver and that ridiculous loading port. Of course, the 140/1400 had their quirks too. I am not a fan of the "self-cocking" valve type, nor the sliding breech cover. The 362 is a return to a design of rifle Crosman hasn't made since the early 1950s. Plenty of plastic, just like everything else today, but this is necessary to keep the selling price down. I like the new gun a lot and I was trying not to expect too much from it.
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Tracking says #2 and the Baker brass trigger should arrive tomorrow.
It looks like they are going to cancel work Saturday so, depending on Betty Lou's plans, I should have more time to play with these.
I also had a Daisy 881 show up so I'll want to run that one through it's paces as well. No mods planned for that.
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Well snarkle farks.....
I've come to the conclusion that I'm not getting the accuracy out of the 24" barrel that I got from the 18".
Looks like it may be time to bust out the hacksaw and Dremel.... :-\
Hey Bill the se does not indicate the new in house barrels... If they are the old stock the SE barrels are the Disco barrels...
they did not start the in house barrels till the Maximus...
Also my early Maximus barrels needed Leade work and one had a small burr... point is do not be quick to chop the barrel till ya give it a good inspection...
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Well, to be honest... I'm thinking about changing both guns back to .22.
If I know me.... the tinkering could be a long process before I settle of the final product.... ;)
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Well, to be honest... I'm thinking about changing both guns back to .22.
If I know me.... the tinkering could be a long process before I settle of the final product.... ;)
I may convert mine to .25 cal long term.
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Well, to be honest... I'm thinking about changing both guns back to .22.
If I know me.... the tinkering could be a long process before I settle of the final product.... ;)
I may convert mine to .25 cal long term.
I think Baker still has some 25 caliber breeches, but where do you get the barrel from?
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Mine will stay .22, I've got a good amount of .22 molds I use all the time. I might try the 23.5 grain magnum hunters in it next if I can get them to fit because they're longer than the regular hunters.
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These barrels are the in house barrels but they are not choked. John told me that in PM. ;)
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Tinkering will continue...
I have been thinking about a couple things and they are steel breech/bolt related.
I've noticed that, after a few times swapping barrels and breeches, that I lost some accuracy.
Even going back to my original 18" .177 setup, accuracy was somewhat off from the first install.
One possible explanation could be due to the bolt loosening up and and becoming 'floppy'.
Wayne discovered the difference in bolt probe lengths from original and after market probes and explained the cure. I'm going to apply his fix.
I also saw another member go one step further with the Baker brass trigger. Instead of using the oversize spring method, he actually drilled and tapped the trigger and added a stop so the original trigger spring, or the supplied Baker spring, could be used as intended.
Both of these 'fixes' can be done right on my modest 'tinker bench' without owning every tool that Harbor Freight sells.... ;) :o
Stay tuned.
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Regarding the probe issue...
If the pellet is not seated properly and the skirt partially covers the transfer port, it would only stand to reason that the blast of air, when the valve is cracked open, could deform the skirt of the pellet. That would definitely affect accuracy.
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Tinkering will continue...
I have been thinking about a couple things and they are steel breech/bolt related.
I've noticed that, after a few times swapping barrels and breeches, that I lost some accuracy.
Even going back to my original 18" .177 setup, accuracy was somewhat off from the first install.
One possible explanation could be due to the bolt loosening up and and becoming 'floppy'.
Wayne discovered the difference in bolt probe lengths from original and after market probes and explained the cure. I'm going to apply his fix.
I also saw another member go one step further with the Baker brass trigger. Instead of using the oversize spring method, he actually drilled and tapped the trigger and added a stop so the original trigger spring, or the supplied Baker spring, could be used as intended.
Both of these 'fixes' can be done right on my modest 'tinker bench' without owning every tool that Harbor Freight sells.... ;) :o
Stay tuned.
I haven't read that one yet, do you have a link handy?
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Tinkering will continue...
I have been thinking about a couple things and they are steel breech/bolt related.
I've noticed that, after a few times swapping barrels and breeches, that I lost some accuracy.
Even going back to my original 18" .177 setup, accuracy was somewhat off from the first install.
One possible explanation could be due to the bolt loosening up and and becoming 'floppy'.
Wayne discovered the difference in bolt probe lengths from original and after market probes and explained the cure. I'm going to apply his fix.
I also saw another member go one step further with the Baker brass trigger. Instead of using the oversize spring method, he actually drilled and tapped the trigger and added a stop so the original trigger spring, or the supplied Baker spring, could be used as intended.
Both of these 'fixes' can be done right on my modest 'tinker bench' without owning every tool that Harbor Freight sells.... ;) :o
Stay tuned.
I haven't read that one yet, do you have a link handy?
Here you go https://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=195536.msg156274728;topicseen#new (https://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=195536.msg156274728;topicseen#new)
Following the thread, interesting that you're considering going back to .22
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Well, to be honest... I'm thinking about changing both guns back to .22.
If I know me.... the tinkering could be a long process before I settle of the final product.... ;)
I may convert mine to .25 cal long term.
I think Baker still has some 25 caliber breeches, but where do you get the barrel from?
He used to have two options in .25 barrels, one with a turned down breech end to fit standard steel breeches and one to fit the Big Bore Breech. The barrels were from Benjamin 725XL .25cal. springers that were 1/2" diameter, about 19-1/2" long and threaded for M12x1.75 brake. I emailed him a while back and he no longer had a source for the barrels. I don't know if they were long enough for the 362 but you could use that breech with any .25cal. 1/2" diameter barrel that's long enough if chambered in.25 and drilled for the exhaust port on a Crosman steel breech. Here is my Baker breech and.25 barrel with a LDC installed beside a ruler. I swap this on my Disco carbine when I want to go from .22 to .25. I corrected the length above after removing the LDC it measured 19-1/2" of barrel only total length. (http://)
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Personally. I don't think this gun has the poop to push a .25 fast enough to warranty the additional cost of .25 pellets. Some of you cast your own and that's great... I don't. I have enough bad habits in my life to begin another... :o
I think the main reason I am entertaining the thought of returning to .22 is because .22 pellets are easier to handle.... ;D
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Personally. I don't think this gun has the poop to push a .25 fast enough to warranty the additional cost of .25 pellets. Some of you cast your own and that's great... I don't. I have enough bad habits in my life to begin another... :o
I think the main reason I am entertaining the thought of returning to .22 is because .22 pellets are easier to handle.... ;D
Yeah .25 will need some uber adjustments to be perused. I will be putting a .25 LW barrel on my 2260 that I cannibalized last night to get on with playing Dr. Frankenstein with my 1st 362 AKA#999 . CO2 should get things moving in .25, have a new valve, in hand, so I will be doing a little bit of carving on that to get the CO2 juice flowing.
OK I am having C362 withdrawal symptoms, need to go shoot and tinker :)
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LOL.... enjoy James...
I just got confirmation that tomorrow's production has been cancelled so, I'll be firing up the heat in the mancave in the morning. Temps are supposed to drop to 25* tonight. That may not mean much to you northern folks but, here in the south things are different. We live in a damp, humid climate. The air don't dry out. It just gets real cold and wet.
I grew up 2 blocks from the banks of Lake Erie just east of Cleveland... (Ashtabula) Trust me, I know the difference.
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LOL.... enjoy James...
I just got confirmation that tomorrow's production has been cancelled so, I'll be firing up the heat in the mancave in the morning. Temps are supposed to drop to 25* tonight. That may not mean much to you northern folks but, here in the south things are different. We live in a damp, humid climate. The air don't dry out. It just gets real cold and wet.
I grew up 2 blocks from the banks of Lake Erie just east of Cleveland... (Ashtabula) Trust me, I know the difference.
Wait a minute young man! I'm still waiting for you to get my Hyundai ready! These mother loving dealers have already raised prices by $ 4,000 and that's cutting my play money funds severely.
I was wondering about the move to a .25 caliber, it didn't seem to me the power plant would have enough juice for a .25, not without some rather drastic "improvements". Casting is not too bad a hobby to get into, there are days when weather doesn't cooperate and staying indoors seems like a good idea.
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LOL.... enjoy James...
I just got confirmation that tomorrow's production has been cancelled so, I'll be firing up the heat in the mancave in the morning. Temps are supposed to drop to 25* tonight. That may not mean much to you northern folks but, here in the south things are different. We live in a damp, humid climate. The air don't dry out. It just gets real cold and wet.
I grew up 2 blocks from the banks of Lake Erie just east of Cleveland... (Ashtabula) Trust me, I know the difference.
Wait a minute young man! I'm still waiting for you to get my Hyundai ready! These mother loving dealers have already raised prices by $ 4,000 and that's cutting my play money funds severely.
I was wondering about the move to a .25 caliber, it didn't seem to me the power plant would have enough juice for a .25, not without some rather drastic "improvements". Casting is not too bad a hobby to get into, there are days when weather doesn't cooperate and staying indoors seems like a good idea.
BB... did you ever notice that the folks that work for McDonalds don't eat McDonalds? There is a reason for that.... :o
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LOL.... enjoy James...
I just got confirmation that tomorrow's production has been cancelled so, I'll be firing up the heat in the mancave in the morning. Temps are supposed to drop to 25* tonight. That may not mean much to you northern folks but, here in the south things are different. We live in a damp, humid climate. The air don't dry out. It just gets real cold and wet.
I grew up 2 blocks from the banks of Lake Erie just east of Cleveland... (Ashtabula) Trust me, I know the difference.
Wait a minute young man! I'm still waiting for you to get my Hyundai ready! These mother loving dealers have already raised prices by $ 4,000 and that's cutting my play money funds severely.
I was wondering about the move to a .25 caliber, it didn't seem to me the power plant would have enough juice for a .25, not without some rather drastic "improvements". Casting is not too bad a hobby to get into, there are days when weather doesn't cooperate and staying indoors seems like a good idea.
I think it could do light .25 pellets just fine. In fact a larger bore should yield more muzzle energy. H&N has an off the shelf 19.91 grain lead free alloy pellet, they are very accurate when fired at the appropriate velocity out of my unchoked Eagle Claw. The NOE .25 cal wadcutter mold drops a 22 grain pellet inlead, could cut that down to 14-15-ish grain casting in pure tin. I had no interested in converting to .25 until Firewalker sold me his NOE .25 WC mold.
A few weeks ago I emailed Alchemy Airwerks and he said the .25 cal barrels are set up for the Crosman steel breech, which I assume would apply to the aftermarket aluminum and brass breeches as well. They did not go into detail about how the barrel was set up for the breech, or anything really. I also inquired about some other stuff earlier this week, but have yet to hear anything back. I also tried to call the number listed a few days ago, but got no answer.
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LOL.... enjoy James...
I just got confirmation that tomorrow's production has been cancelled so, I'll be firing up the heat in the mancave in the morning. Temps are supposed to drop to 25* tonight. That may not mean much to you northern folks but, here in the south things are different. We live in a damp, humid climate. The air don't dry out. It just gets real cold and wet.
I grew up 2 blocks from the banks of Lake Erie just east of Cleveland... (Ashtabula) Trust me, I know the difference.
Wait a minute young man! I'm still waiting for you to get my Hyundai ready! These mother loving dealers have already raised prices by $ 4,000 and that's cutting my play money funds severely.
I was wondering about the move to a .25 caliber, it didn't seem to me the power plant would have enough juice for a .25, not without some rather drastic "improvements". Casting is not too bad a hobby to get into, there are days when weather doesn't cooperate and staying indoors seems like a good idea.
BB... did you ever notice that the folks that work for McDonalds don't eat McDonalds? There is a reason for that.... :o
I thought they were just tired of eating the same thing every day! I'm very happy with my 2008 Tucson but after nearly 300k miles it's starting to show it's age. As I'm preparing for retirement in a couple of years (I hope) I want a hybrid Tucson that I can pay off quickly.
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This just in.....
Baker brass trigger #2 is waiting for me at the house. 362 #2 is out for delivery.
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This just in.....
Baker brass trigger #2 is waiting for me at the house. 362 #2 is out for delivery.
:o
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This just in.....
Baker brass trigger #2 is waiting for me at the house. 362 #2 is out for delivery.
Green with envy! My 362 is “out for delivery,” but I’ll be lucky to have it in my hands by next week…no Baker trigger -yet-
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UPS stops here at work just before going to our house. Once again I offered to save him a trip and take the gun off his hands and once again, there are 2 trucks in the area and the gun is on the other one.
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It'll be interesting to see what your number is on this one Bill 8) I cast up some pellets, it's a little on the chilly side in the attic but not too cold to shoot up there 8) I still gotta sort them yet!
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Wayne... any guesses on the number? Low or high?
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I have a Baker .25 breech and an Alchemy barrel that's turned down for a standard Crosman breech. I also have a Crosman breech with the rear screw, so I'm up a creek. Well, maybe not. I cut some aluminum flashing last night and shimmed my turned down alchemy barrel to fit the Baker breech. Good idea? Who knows, but we'll see how it works when 362 #2 gets here.
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I'll guess it's 0095 that would be a good keeper number ???
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I'll guess it's 0095 that would be a good keeper number ???
The numbers when ordered from Crosman seem to be going lower as they sell of the top of the pallet.
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Maybe... depends, did they stack the pallets in layers or rows? And... how do they unstack the pallets (pick the orders)?
I'm always trying to make the job interesting so I would probably apply the 'jenga" method.... ;D
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Maybe... depends, did they stack the pallets in layers or rows? And... how do they unstack the pallets (pick the orders)?
I'm always trying to make the job interesting so I would probably apply the 'jenga" method.... ;D
No fifo with you.
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Yes, but the letters don't represent what you might think.... lol
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Oh well when you put it that way...
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I have a Baker .25 breech and an Alchemy barrel that's turned down for a standard Crosman breech. I also have a Crosman breech with the rear screw, so I'm up a creek. Well, maybe not. I cut some aluminum flashing last night and shimmed my turned down alchemy barrel to fit the Baker breech. Good idea? Who knows, but we'll see how it works whn 362 #2 gets here.
Eddie, In place of the flashing you can make a better shim from K&S brass tubes. Stock #8138 OD 15/32" will slip tightly inside stock #8139 OD 1/2" like a telescope & since the Id of the 15/32 tube is 7/16" it fits like a glove on the turned down barrel and the outside being 1/2" will fit inside the Baker Big Bore Breech. Just cut tubes to length slip smaller one inside larger one and drill the exhaust hole for the port the same as the barrel. It worked fine on my big bore breech. I got the tubing at Hobby Town Store also can get online at many hobby sites. You might try that to use this on the Big Bore if your shim is not satisfactory. I'm guessing the Alchemy BBL is 1/2" OD turned down to 7/16".
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I have a Baker .25 breech and an Alchemy barrel that's turned down for a standard Crosman breech. I also have a Crosman breech with the rear screw, so I'm up a creek. Well, maybe not. I cut some aluminum flashing last night and shimmed my turned down alchemy barrel to fit the Baker breech. Good idea? Who knows, but we'll see how it works whn 362 #2 gets here.
Eddie, In place of the flashing you can make a better shim from K&S brass tubes. Stock #8138 OD 15/32" will fit inside stock #8139 OD 1/2" like a telescope & since the Id of the 15/32 tube is 7/16" it fits like a glove on the turned down barrel and the outside being 1/2" will fit inside the Baker Big Bore Breech. Just cut tubes to length slip smaller one inside larger one and drill the exhaust hole for the port the same as the barrel. It worked fine on my big bore breech. I got the tubing at Hobby Town Store also can get online at many hobby sites. You might try that to use this on the Big Bore if your shim is not satisfactory. I'm guessing the Alchemy BBL is 1/2" OD turned down to 7/16".
Wow, thanks for that! I'll look into it. I wasn't happy about having to buy 2 more breeches.
I've got both of them on the way for less than $15. I really appreciate the tip.
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A warm and fuzzy feeling inside...... ;D
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The Baker brass trigger was in the mailbox today as well so, the gang's all here.... ;)
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I'll be in the mancave with the stove fired up and the coffee on bright and early in the morning.
Temps will be in the mid to upper 20's but that won't stop me.
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Both guns will get extreme make overs.
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My #2 order still shows pending so I won't be tinkering for awhile.
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I have a Baker .25 breech and an Alchemy barrel that's turned down for a standard Crosman breech. I also have a Crosman breech with the rear screw, so I'm up a creek. Well, maybe not. I cut some aluminum flashing last night and shimmed my turned down alchemy barrel to fit the Baker breech. Good idea? Who knows, but we'll see how it works whn 362 #2 gets here.
Eddie, In place of the flashing you can make a better shim from K&S brass tubes. Stock #8138 OD 15/32" will fit inside stock #8139 OD 1/2" like a telescope & since the Id of the 15/32 tube is 7/16" it fits like a glove on the turned down barrel and the outside being 1/2" will fit inside the Baker Big Bore Breech. Just cut tubes to length slip smaller one inside larger one and drill the exhaust hole for the port the same as the barrel. It worked fine on my big bore breech. I got the tubing at Hobby Town Store also can get online at many hobby sites. You might try that to use this on the Big Bore if your shim is not satisfactory. I'm guessing the Alchemy BBL is 1/2" OD turned down to 7/16".
Wow, thanks for that! I'll look into it. I wasn't happy about having to buy 2 more breeches.
I've got both of them on the way for less than $15. I really appreciate the tip.
I forgot to mention slip a 7/16" wood dowel inside the assembled brass tubes before cutting or drilling for support to keep it from bending the thin tubes. The big bore breech for 1/2" barrels loads different as you have to point the gun down and drop in a pellet as opposed to loading the regular way. Funny at first but works good when you get the hang of it. The supplied bolt seals flat to the barrel not inside.
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I forgot to mention slip a 7/16" wood dowel inside the assembled brass tubes before cutting or drilling for support to keep it from bending the thin tubes.
Will do, thanks again! Oh, I measured my barrel and you were spot on.
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Drum roll please................
Number 782 is in the house.
The inner box is the same but a huge difference in the outer box. # 805 had a vastly oversize box and the voids stuffed with packing paper. The pellets were also wrapped in paper and were snug in the end of the box.
In the case of #782, the outer box was just the right size for the inner box except for space for the pellets which were not wrapped in the bottom of the outer box. No packing paper at all.
However, in both cases, the inner box was pristine.
The white foam protecting the rear peep on #782 was shedding white dingle berries but nothing like what I've heard from others. The pump arm on both guns were left open and neither gun was 'charged'.
I put a couple pumps in 782, cocked the bolt and dry fired it. Rambo headed for the hills so it passes the function test... lol Nancy Boy.
It's kinda neat that the numbers are so close together. Kinda makes ya wonder if #782 was rolling off the production line and #805 was just hitting it at the other end.
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I ordered a couple of these just in case my bolt mod goes sideways.
https://onlinestore.magnumairpower.com/products/22-long-nose-bolt
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I ordered a couple of these just in case my bolt mod goes sideways.
https://onlinestore.magnumairpower.com/products/22-long-nose-bolt
The nose of that looks identical to the one in the 362 stock plastic breach. The price is great too!
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I would have bought these if I had seen them before I got them from Baker.
https://onlinestore.magnumairpower.com/products/custom-rifle-trigger-kit-7075
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I would have bought these if I had seen them before I got them from Baker.
https://onlinestore.magnumairpower.com/products/custom-rifle-trigger-kit-7075
And that will fit our rifles? I saw a listing on Ebay for a solid aluminum setup, but it was very expensive.
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I would have bought these if I had seen them before I got them from Baker.
https://onlinestore.magnumairpower.com/products/custom-rifle-trigger-kit-7075
And that will fit our rifles? I saw a listing on Ebay for a solid aluminum setup, but it was very expensive.
It will fit and work but, like the Baker trigger, the adjustment screws are not a drop in. The advantage is that the stock spring, or the one supplied will work and the blade is more straight.
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I would have bought these if I had seen them before I got them from Baker.
https://onlinestore.magnumairpower.com/products/custom-rifle-trigger-kit-7075
Guess i should have spent a little more time looking around on his site, lol. That is a perfect option. Oh well... I am very happy with the trigger group complete. 8)
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Best part is... shipping was less than $5.
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Best part is... shipping was less than $5.
Even better. 8)
It is interesting that he designed the trigger with the nub on it. I didn't open the cover on my trigger group as it was pre-adjusted and pre-lubed ready to install, but would guess the same trigger is in it? It is nice to know that there are more options. 8)
My plan is to go ahead and modify the stock trigger group to add the Baker trigger. Winter project to play with and add the adjustment screws. If it works, it works. ;)
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'bout to walk down to the mancave and fire up the heat and put on a pot of joe. I'll give an hour or so to warm up.
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I need to get back up in the attic to make sure my scope is good because I haven't checked it since I reassembled my gun with the modified bolt/probe. I do have plenty of wad cutters now. I'm also going to cast some with the next step heavier pin.
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I would have bought these if I had seen them before I got them from Baker.
https://onlinestore.magnumairpower.com/products/custom-rifle-trigger-kit-7075
And that will fit our rifles? I saw a listing on Ebay for a solid aluminum setup, but it was very expensive.
It will fit and work but, like the Baker trigger, the adjustment screws are not a drop in. The advantage is that the stock spring, or the one supplied will work and the blade is more straight.
Oh, I thought the listing was for the whole assembly, not just the trigger "blade"
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Best part is... shipping was less than $5.
Even better. 8)
It is interesting that he designed the trigger with the nub on it. I didn't open the cover on my trigger group as it was pre-adjusted and pre-lubed ready to install, but would guess the same trigger is in it? It is nice to know that there are more options. 8)
My plan is to go ahead and modify the stock trigger group to add the Baker trigger. Winter project to play with and add the adjustment screws. If it works, it works. ;)
You can adjust the MAP trigger assembly to be super light with nary a slack.
I'd like to buy another one, but its not cheap at $150 ;D
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You can adjust the MAP trigger assembly to be super light with nary a slack.
I'd like to buy another one, but its not cheap at $150 ;D
Bill has it adjusted pretty light as is. It is just a light little pull, right where i like it ;). I am very happy with how he set it up. I will need to watch his video on it again, excellent detail in that video 8).
No Sir, not cheap by any means but when you look at the precision he put it to making it... very well done for the money. ;D
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You can adjust the MAP trigger assembly to be super light with nary a slack.
I'd like to buy another one, but its not cheap at $150 ;D
Bill has it adjusted pretty light as is. It is just a light little pull, right where i like it ;). I am very happy with how he set it up. I will need to watch his video on it again, excellent detail in that video 8).
No Sir, not cheap by any means but when you look at the precision he put it to making it... very well done for the money. ;D
Mine was pre-adjusted as well, but I tweaked the adjustment set screws a bit more, then I dubbed it with a smidgen of Loctite--- beats my 10/22 KIDD s/a trigger!
Before the New Year, we had some family friends from TX who spent overnight at our house, and the dad, a PRS shooter, was so impressed by my MAP trigger he kept on shooting my PCP sans projectiles :D
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You can adjust the MAP trigger assembly to be super light with nary a slack.
I'd like to buy another one, but its not cheap at $150 ;D
Bill has it adjusted pretty light as is. It is just a light little pull, right where i like it ;). I am very happy with how he set it up. I will need to watch his video on it again, excellent detail in that video 8).
No Sir, not cheap by any means but when you look at the precision he put it to making it... very well done for the money. ;D
Mine was pre-adjusted as well, but I tweaked the adjustment set screws a bit more, then I dubbed it with a smidgen of Loctite--- beats my 10/22 KIDD s/a trigger!
Before the New Year, we had some family friends from TX who spent overnight at our house, and the dad, a PRS shooter, was so impressed by my MAP trigger he kept on shooting my PCP sans projectiles :D
I know I will have a hard time putting mine down, lol. I even like the flatter wide trigger, which was surprising ;). My fingers are a bit shorter, probably why?
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You can adjust the MAP trigger assembly to be super light with nary a slack.
I'd like to buy another one, but its not cheap at $150 ;D
Bill has it adjusted pretty light as is. It is just a light little pull, right where i like it ;). I am very happy with how he set it up. I will need to watch his video on it again, excellent detail in that video 8).
No Sir, not cheap by any means but when you look at the precision he put it to making it... very well done for the money. ;D
Mine was pre-adjusted as well, but I tweaked the adjustment set screws a bit more, then I dubbed it with a smidgen of Loctite--- beats my 10/22 KIDD s/a trigger!
Before the New Year, we had some family friends from TX who spent overnight at our house, and the dad, a PRS shooter, was so impressed by my MAP trigger he kept on shooting my PCP sans projectiles :D
I know I will have a hard time putting mine down, lol. I even like the flatter wide trigger, which was surprising ;). My fingers are a bit shorter, probably why?
Honestly, I find the MAP trigger blade shape uncomfortable in my 2260 stock but nice in my Boyd's Barracuda thumbhole ???
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#2 782 is done and ready for sighting in and some numbers.
I did a few things different with this one.
For some reason, that magnet setup was alot harder to open than the #805. I took the flat metal piece off and ity works much better. I could barely get the pump arm open so I know Betty Lou would have a problem. If it starts flopping open I'll have a closer look but for now it's working great.
Next, I polished all the contact points with a fine stone bit on the Dremel. Then I finished them off with a brass wire wheel on the Dremel. Finally I added a thin coat of moly. I did use the large spring behind the trigger like the other one. This one seems much smoother so I'll redo the other one when I get back into it.
The probe and bolt knob....
I followed Wayne's lead and used the one that came with the plastic breech. I ground the peen off with the Dremel then tapped the hole and used a knob from a steel breech. Once I made sure everything worked good I used some blue Loctite on the threads.
Finally, I added and LDC I had laying around.... I don't even know where it came from or who's design it is. One thing is for sure, it works very well. It's as quiet as my Rocker1 LDC.
Betty Lou dragged me off to the grocery store because she found 5 or 6 recipes she wants to make. We stopped McDee's for chicken biscuits and I made the mistake of sitting down in the recliner when we got back.
So now, I'm trying to gather the gumption to go back down to the mancave... :-\
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The Baker trigger arrived today and the breech from Crosman comes Monday. I will be following this thread and will copy most of what you come up with as long as you get good results. I have the benefit of bringing up the rear on this project and learning all what whet went well and what fizzled. ::)
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David.... If you're going to follow me you might want to slow down in the corners or you may break your neck....
I've now got both guns back to .22 with stock barrels, steel breeches, stock probes drilled and tapped and the Baker triggers.
:o ;D
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David.... If you're going to follow me you might want to slow down in the corners or you may break your neck....
I've now got both guns back to .22 with stock barrels, steel breeches, stock probes drilled and tapped and the Baker triggers.
:o ;D
Curious Bill why you swapped back to 22 barrels?
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I was having probe issues and the little .177 pellets were giving me fits fumbling to load them.
I wasn't originally going to buy 2 of these until Betty Lou showed interest.
We had 2 of the 392s and she had trouble pumping them.
After I got the #805 she was able to pump it without issue but complained about the little .177 pellets.
I want to make this enjoyable for both of us.
I have other guns that we don't have pairs of.... I can set anyone of them up in .177 for myself.
She has kinda drifted away from shooting since we started this whole relocating deal. I want to be ready when she regains her interest.
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Wayne.... BTW.
After I got both guns setup and running to my satisfaction I thought it would be a great time to try out some of your wadcutters that you have been raving about.
Umm... not so fast... apparently I was all into .25 when I got them from you..... :o
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Bill I think that was probably around the time I bought that 25 cal Hatsan breakbarrel, it shot them good but not as good as my 362 shoots the .22 wad cutters.
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Bill I think that was probably around the time I bought that 25 cal Hatsan breakbarrel, it shot them good but not as good as my 362 shoots the .22 wad cutters.
Exactly.... I still have the Hatsan... I remember now.
I like that gun, I'll have to get it out and shoot it some.
Anyways... I got lots of .22 stuff to test. I actually had to take a break today, I got my back and shoulders throbbing from pumping the guns. I took an ibuprofen. Gonna grab a bite and see how I feel in a bit.
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David.... If you're going to follow me you might want to slow down in the corners or you may break your neck....
I've now got both guns back to .22 with stock barrels, steel breeches, stock probes drilled and tapped and the Baker triggers.
:o ;D
I best study up first, if you are going to double back all the time, I might get whiplash before I even make the corners! ;D ;)
Only 1 gun right now, momma is not happy with me getting more guns so I have to care for what I have for now and get the Chaser up and running first.
I do have the trigger in-house (LOVE the width of the shoe) but there isn't enough beef to drill and tap the edge so I may just follow your lead on the through hole. Steel breech is on the truck as well as a LDC from Buck Rail.
Are you opening the TP? I was thinking about the ice maker water line trick.... :P
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David.... If you're going to follow me you might want to slow down in the corners or you may break your neck....
I've now got both guns back to .22 with stock barrels, steel breeches, stock probes drilled and tapped and the Baker triggers.
:o ;D
I best study up first, if you are going to double back all the time, I might get whiplash before I even make the corners! ;D ;)
Only 1 gun right now, momma is not happy with me getting more guns so I have to care for what I have for now and get the Chaser up and running first.
I do have the trigger in-house (LOVE the width of the shoe) but there isn't enough beef to drill and tap the edge so I may just follow your lead on the through hole. Steel breech is on the truck as well as a LDC from Buck Rail.
Are you opening the TP? I was thinking about the ice maker water line trick.... :P
Nope.... I don't do all that power mod stuff... I like to read about others doing it though.
Like my PCP guns, everyone is busy jacking them up and I'm going the other way for consistent shot count.
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Bill I haven't been doing any of the power mod stuff since I went on my AEA binge, there's simply no need for it, now I've been enjoying watching what my cast stuff does and it's been doing good, even with these pumpers. The C362 I've got seems to have a plenty big valve exhaust plus a decent sized transfer and barrel port to boot. It's got plenty of poop for a gun of this kind.
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I've only pumped my 362 past 5 a handful of times, and to 10 twice. It does really well for me at 3 to 5.
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Ed even at 30 feet where I've been shooting mine the most so far the difference between 3-8 pumps is minimal when shooting that distance as far as elevation is concerned.
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Ed even at 30 feet where I've been shooting mine the most so far the difference between 3-8 pumps is minimal when shooting that distance as far as elevation is concerned.
Most of my shots have been 30 to 50 feet too. It's too hard to see smaller targets with the peep past those ranges. I've got a 4x scope that should be here Monday.
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I really like that old BugBuster that I put on mine after installing the steel breech. It's not a real fancy scope but I've never really gone overboard with scopes myself.
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I put one of the Buck Rail AO compact scopes on #805 yesterday. I have 2 of them but Betty Lou don't like the 'back up cam' lines.
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I put one of the Buck Rail AO compact scopes on #805 yesterday. I have 2 of them but Betty Lou don't like the 'back up cam' lines.
I'm pretty sure those are crossbow scopes, but I like mine. The lines can be handy for longer shots.
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Went out to the mancave to make sure the water wasn't frozen. We left the faucets drip last night. All is well.
Man, it's cold in there. I fired up both heaters and put on a pot of coffee.
Before retreating back to the house I grabbed a couple pictures.
First is #805....
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.... and #782.
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if anybody cares to read a few thoughts on my new 362s i guess first of all low cost pumpers are my air gun of choice this fits my bill to a t both arrived today its col out but been in the backyard range doing some testing i go serial number 1507 and 1333 heres my afternoon findings i will call the guns 13 and 15 for this post being a mass produced item there is somewhat surprising differances in the two 13 i had zeroed on to bullseye in two shots cpum14.3 pellets at 21 yds 13 pumps harder and it showed in a 50 fps more reading at all number of pumps it just feels good now 15 it took over 30 rds to get to bullseye land but now that its there it seems to be good also fooling with the peep site screw so much is now stripped but in my defense i did not overtighten it it just not that good in my opinion also 15 had a tiny nick on the crown which now that its zeroed seems to be fine and 15 also shoots 50 fps lower then 13 the factory bolt on both is stiff but i like the way once cocked the pellet just slides right in almost no effort so overall i am very happy with both 15 will get a scope at some point and 13 will remain stock i also like the fact that it will be easy to dial your shots in squirrel hunting because each pump makes about 50 fps more than the last thats my first impressions .
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Yup I cared enough to read ;) I have noticed the same between 2 362's myself, have a #3 ordered from crosman, so will see if 3rd time is the charm, not that either of the others were bad, just one was pellet picky the other doesn't seem to acre what I load in it. Yes the sighting system could be better but it is usable and will get you shooting, I imagine Crosman figured the hard core airgunners would get the metal breach ASAP.
My AR 2260 setup with the handguard, is a plastic breach but it is held solid by the handguard and added Buck Rail mounts, so the wobbly barrel issue was solved by accident there.
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Yup I cared enough to read ;) I have noticed the same between 2 362's myself, have a #3 ordered from crosman, so will see if 3rd time is the charm, not that either of the others were bad, just one was pellet picky the other doesn't seem to acre what I load in it. Yes the sighting system could be better but it is usable and will get you shooting, I imagine Crosman figured the hard core airgunners would get the metal breach ASAP.
My AR 2260 setup with the handguard, is a plastic breach but it is held solid by the handguard and added Buck Rail mounts, so the wobbly barrel issue was solved by accident there.
thanks for commenting back i am happy to have fairly low number guns little disapointed the elevation screw stripped out so easy but its really not that big of a deal theres enough room to rethread it in the mean time got it sighted in and just put a small drop of super glue on it will be fine for awhile they really are a nice solid shooting platform i for sure have bought worse pumpers for more money.
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It's been dipping down below freezing here at night so I've been dripping the faucets in the bar/mancave to prevent pipes freezing. I go down in the morning and shut them off.... no sense in water dripping all day.
This morning I just happen to notice #805 sitting on the tuning box, looking all lonely n junk... :'(
So I picked it up and brought it back to the house with me. I stepped out onto the screened in back deck where I keep an assortment of pellets on standby.
I pumped it up and inserted a CPUM. I opened the back door and leaned on the ramp rail. I spotted a can around 30 yds out. Took a few seconds to find the can in the scope because it was still before dawn. I switch on the red IR to help.
POP !!! Nailed It !!!
Yep, it's a keeper.
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It's been dipping down below freezing here at night so I've been dripping the faucets in the bar/mancave to prevent pipes freezing. I go down in the morning and shut them off.... no sense in water dripping all day.
This morning I just happen to notice #805 sitting on the tuning box, looking all lonely n junk... :'(
So I picked it up and brought it back to the house with me. I stepped out onto the screened in back deck where I keep an assortment of pellets on standby.
I pumped it up and inserted a CPUM. I opened the back door and leaned on the ramp rail. I spotted a can around 30 yds out. Took a few seconds to find the can in the scope because it was still before dawn. I switch on the red IR to help.
POP !!! Nailed It !!!
Yep, it's a keeper.
It's been so cold I can't even go up to the attic to shoot!
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Sounds like you need something like this. Those that have been around the airgun community for a long time probably remember L.D. This is his 53 yard shooting tunnel.
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Hey Bill... What scope are you using on #805? I have been looking at the illuminated reticle scopes as an option for my 362.
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Most all my scopes have an illuminated reticle however I don't use them. All my UTG's do, I've tried them in the field however they never did me much good so I never put batteries in them anymore.
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I have the Buck Rail 2-6x32 IR AO compact on #805.
I would buy another one but they haven't been available on the BR site.
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I have only one pumper in my arsenal, a vintage Crosman 101 in .22, but never considered a modern one until I followed this post
so now I have been getting very itchy in getting a C362. I only wish that the 362 had a wooden stock as I have too many plastic AG's.
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Bob, I would jump on in, it's just a matter of time before someone makes some wood furniture. These things are climbing the popularity ladder pretty fast.
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I have the Buck Rail 2-6x32 IR AO compact on #805.
I would buy another one but they haven't been available on the BR site.
Thanks ;D. I didn't see it listed on their site... I will keep an eye out for them. 8)
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I think I'm going to chop and crown that 24" .177 barrel.
I'm thinking 21 - 22 inches.
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Hey Bill... What scope are you using on #805? I have been looking at the illuminated reticle scopes as an option for my 362.
I found anything heavier than the tiny 4X32 to be too heavy for the 362. I have a lightweight 3X9X32 that loosens up the screws when pumping so the 4X32 looks to be permanent on mine.
I may bed my breech against the air tube if it loosens up with the 4X32 though.
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Hey Bill... What scope are you using on #805? I have been looking at the illuminated reticle scopes as an option for my 362.
I found anything heavier than the tiny 4X32 to be too heavy for the 362. I have a lightweight 3X9X32 that loosens up the screws when pumping so the 4X32 looks to be permanent on mine.
I may bed my breech against the air tube if it loosens up with the 4X32 though.
I currently have a CP 3-12x44 PLT on it. Great scope for the price and I have one on each of my guns. They are big though. I am just looking at smaller options. With my aging eyes, a big lens with good eye relief is important. An illuminated reticle would be nice to try. I'm researching... something will catch my eye eventually. ;D
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Hey Bill... What scope are you using on #805? I have been looking at the illuminated reticle scopes as an option for my 362.
I found anything heavier than the tiny 4X32 to be too heavy for the 362. I have a lightweight 3X9X32 that loosens up the screws when pumping so the 4X32 looks to be permanent on mine.
I may bed my breech against the air tube if it loosens up with the 4X32 though.
I currently have a CP 3-12x44 PLT on it. Great scope for the price and I have one on each of my guns. They are big though. I am just looking at smaller options. With my aging eyes, a big lens with good eye relief is important. An illuminated reticle would be nice to try. I'm researching... something will catch my eye eventually. ;D
robert you might want to take a look at apex air rifle hunting scope 3 by 9 by 40 it is around 30 bucks has a nice lite up crosshair red or green i own two both are excellent hold zero bright and clear on amazon also has a pellet holder for six 22 cal pellets
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Pumped up and shot one shot off the back deck this morning just for gits and shiggles while I waited for Betty
Slow err I mean Lou to get ready to run to town. I tried to cock the gun to shoot another and it wouldn't cock. When we got back from town I opened it up and found the problem....
The first time I put the steel breech on I discovered that rear breech screw was too long because it bound the hammer. Evidently it broke that green hammer spring spacer. The piece that broke finally found it's way to a place where it jammed things up. :o
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Hey Bill... What scope are you using on #805? I have been looking at the illuminated reticle scopes as an option for my 362.
I found anything heavier than the tiny 4X32 to be too heavy for the 362. I have a lightweight 3X9X32 that loosens up the screws when pumping so the 4X32 looks to be permanent on mine.
I may bed my breech against the air tube if it loosens up with the 4X32 though.
I currently have a CP 3-12x44 PLT on it. Great scope for the price and I have one on each of my guns. They are big though. I am just looking at smaller options. With my aging eyes, a big lens with good eye relief is important. An illuminated reticle would be nice to try. I'm researching... something will catch my eye eventually. ;D
robert you might want to take a look at apex air rifle hunting scope 3 by 9 by 40 it is around 30 bucks has a nice lite up crosshair red or green i own two both are excellent hold zero bright and clear on amazon also has a pellet holder for six 22 cal pellets
Thanks David... I will check it out. 8)
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Pumped up and shot one shot off the back deck this morning just for gits and shiggles while I waited for Betty Slow err I mean Lou to get ready to run to town. I tried to cock the gun to shoot another and it wouldn't cock. When we got back from town I opened it up and found the problem....
The first time I put the steel breech on I discovered that rear breech screw was too long because it bound the hammer. Evidently it broke that green hammer spring spacer. The piece that broke finally found it's way to a place where it jammed things up. :o
That stinks... the green spacer curse strikes again! I wonder why Crosman decided to use something like this in this gun? I switched mine to a brass one. Probably not much a buffer, but it keeps the tension of the spring close... if that even makes any difference?
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Pumped up and shot one shot off the back deck this morning just for gits and shiggles while I waited for Betty Slow err I mean Lou to get ready to run to town. I tried to cock the gun to shoot another and it wouldn't cock. When we got back from town I opened it up and found the problem....
The first time I put the steel breech on I discovered that rear breech screw was too long because it bound the hammer. Evidently it broke that green hammer spring spacer. The piece that broke finally found it's way to a place where it jammed things up. :o
The next time I have mine apart that bolt in mine needs some dressing up yet, it's a shorter bolt that came from a 2240 I had cut off, it needs a little grinding because there's a big burr marring up the plastic piece. If you've got a drill press it's easy to make one with a delrin 3/8" rod probably.
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It locked up again... I ended up removing that green spacer all together. I gave it 8 pumps and it didn't retain any air so I think I'm good to go... we'll see.
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Bill that plastic spacer is probably there for people that want to do 10.
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Not sure why it's there... plenty of preload without it.
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Wayne, you may be right. I'll never put 10 in either one of ours.
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I've done it one time to see if it retained air and it didn't, plenty of preload for 10 pumps in stock form. I just got back down from the attic again shooting a different target, the next target I take up there will be a bad guy target.
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In my "torture test," surgery gun I have pumped to 20 times with no retained air, just a puff, if so , not enough to budge a pellet in the breach. Seems Like a Maximus spring in these.
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My hands are not able to grab pellets so I use suture forceps to pick them up by the skirts and place them on the probe.
I'm thinking about getting a pellet pen, this is the most annoying single shot I own to load.
All of my air rifles have their own pellet pen. I buy the vinyl belts they sell at Dollar for a dollar and slice off 10 inches and then slice that in half for 2 five inch pieces. Duct tape those lightly together to hold the pen. I use a strip of gorilla duct tape to hold the scabbard and pen to the stock.
Looks tacky, of course. But, its very handy for keeping 15 pellets at hand.`
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Never had any joy with a pellet pen. If loading is a problem, I prefer to use squeezers.
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Never had any joy with a pellet pen. If loading is a problem, I prefer to use squeezers.
Except for springer's, I don't use pellet pens for loading pellets. Just for keeping them handy. I too use curved cross action tweezers sometimes with this one and other hard to load guns. If not for squeezers, loading my Winchester 1977 would have eventually driven me batty.
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With a single shot I've always just carried a small tin of pellets with me in the woods.
here's another C362 plinking video
https://youtu.be/n925CMrS3yY
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Talked to Mike today. he is the Sr. Supervisor in our tool and die department here at work.
I'm going to bring him my 24" .177 Crosman barrel this afternoon and he will cut it to 21" and crown it for me on the lathe.
My 18" barrel extends out the front of the factory barrel band by maybe 1/4". I think the added 3' will be perfect if I choose to put something on the end of it.
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I scavenged some scope stop grub screws from a few scope rings I had laying around. I'm going to see if these will do as trigger adjusting screws.
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My .177 barrel is in the trusting hands of Mike in the tool and die shop.
He will cut it to 21" and crown it and I'll have it back in a very short time.
Mike was one of the first guys I met when I came here in 2013. I actually applied for a tool and die position because that's what I did for Honda before moving south. Mike interviewed me and recommended me for the supervisor's position in the press department. A week later I got the call and was made an offer.
Since then, Mike and I, along with a few others, enjoyed riding our Harleys together up until I sold mine a couple years ago. We still spend alot of time talking about fishing and shooting.
Mike is one of the good guys.
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I'm still waiting on parts to put my .25 conversion back together. I need some free time to do some wadcutter casting before I get it done too. I'm also low on slugs. I thought life was supposed to slow down once the kids were grown but it hasn't happened yet.
It's good to have talented friends, isn't it? I've got a buddy like that too.
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Well, I used to have a cheapo HF lathe. The tooling was missing and they were scrapping it here at work. I could chuck the barrel is and cut them with a hacksaw blade then crown and polish with files and stones. The plastic belt finally broke on that lathe and I scrapped it out... no belt to be found.
Now I just bring stuff to Mike when I need it.
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Barrel is done. Just need to chuck up a brass screw in a drill and polish the crown a bit.
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Barrel is done. Just need to chuck up a brass screw in a drill and polish the crown a bit.
I think Ill do that as well, just not getting consistency. :-\
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Gathering 'stuff' for the #805 reinvention....
I probably have had this gun apart and back together more times than our resident Crosman engineer, John.... ;D
I'm hoping this one more time will seal the deal and I can lock it all in with thread locker.
Trigger..
Going with the Baker brass trigger. I plan on drilling and tapping the frame for short first stage pull and stop. I'll most likely use either the Baker brass trigger supplied screws or salvaged scope ring stop grubs.... or maybe a combination of both.
I ordered a couple bolt probes and I'm gonna give on a try... https://onlinestore.magnumairpower.com/products/22-long-nose-bolt If no good I will go with the current one. It's the stock one that came with the gun. I knocked the bolt knob out and tapped it for one of several I have on hand.
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Next will be the forward screw breech. I have the short rear screw from previous adventures.
I removed the green hammer spacer.
I'll be using the 1760SE Crosman 24" .177 barrel chopped and crowned at 21".
Also gonna use the red Maximus stock transfer port.
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Bill that looks like the perfect bolt/probe for a successful probe on a modified C362, no fuss no muss, well worth $11 8)
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Next I will be putting flat rubber washers on edge and trimmed to size in the cocking arm metal works to quiet the clakeiy clack.
I took the flat metal piece that the magnet grabs out of Betty Lou's #782 gun. It don't seem to want to pop open without it so I may look at removing the magnet and replacing it with a rubber bumper instead.
Sights.... this is where it gets interesting....
https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1005064221?pid=186476 (https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1005064221?pid=186476)
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Thanks Wayne... they should arrive tomorrow, I ordered 2.
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Bill you must have gotten the last of those bolt/probes because they're now showing out of stock ???
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Some of you might remember my 2240 stubby builds, Willie G. Stubbs and his Twisted Sister. These are the peep sight I used on those guns.
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Wayne, maybe so, I ordered them a week ago.
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You have to get a little riggy with these peeps. The cross groove on the steel breech is too wide for the dovetail on these sights. What I did was cut the shank off the proper size drill bit and wedge it into the groove with the peep. These are great sights and are fully adjustable.
They also flip down out of the way if you want to add a scope or a red dot.
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Bill if I had that pistol I'd be entering it in the "Crosman Pistol Airgun Owners" monthly 5 meter off hand contests. I didn't enter January's because I was so danged involve with the frickin C362's . . . they're an awesome cure for us northerner's 8)
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I haven't quiet decided on the muzzle sight yet. I'll go through my parts and pieces bin to see what I have. I've also been known to rob from other guns.... :P
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Wayne, that's "Willie G. Stubbs" in .22. I also built it's blacked out "Twisted Sister" in .177.
They are just fun Co2 camp and trail guns. Willie G. is always on my side when mowing.
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Even the old 150's can be some fantastic shooters, I should rig up one of the later 1st variant's I bought with one of the 2240 barrels. I wonder if they're the same diameter ??? Probably close I imagine.
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The barrels on the C362's seem to be a tighter bore than the majority of the 22XX's because you're aren't going to chamber the same BBT's like I can in the Prod, Disco and vintage pistols. Mine are both a little tighter bore.
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Guys...
If you ordered, or plan to order the bolt probes from Magnum Power you might want to settle back and be patient. My order was confirmed on Jan 24th and tracking shows them in Conn. via USPS from Mass. That's 8 days to travel one state. I understand weather is an issue but, I'm just glad I'm not waiting on life dependent medications. :o
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Mine hasn't shipped and I placed the order almost 3 weeks back.
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Sorry for the delay... Betty Lou decided she wanted to go out for breakfast.
Well, I opened the trigger group back up (I'm getting good at it) and took a good long study.
After pondering my options and considering how many times I would have to open/close it to get just the right setting, I decided to leave well enough alone. The 1st travel gives me that 2 stage affect and, although it would be nice to have a little less travel, it's a nice stop and predictable snap to the break. The gritty feel is all gone and I like it just fine. I don't have a trigger pull tester but, if I had to guess, it's better than half what it was out of the box.
In the picture below you can see the over size, yet lighter wire size spring. (circled in red) The molded ribs in the frame 'trap' that spring and hold it in place without binding. The only other thing I did was stone and lube the contact points.... moly for contact point and some red grease in the pivot points.
I have a question? Well, actually a couple of questions.
My 362 won't fire.
I started a thread about it.
Firewalker suggested I take the barrel and breech off to get to the trigger sideplate.
I did that then I took off the stock and the sideplate.
My trigger assembly is now a jumble of parts. Obviously, I'm going to have to learn how to fit the parts together. The half inch long cylinders are a mystery at the moment.
While its apart though I might as well get the right spring to replace the stiff OEM spring.
..."over size, yet lighter wire size spring" in your post above doesn't tell me what the diameter of the spring is.
Say I was going to swap out the OEM sear spring in a 1377 with a lighter spring, I'd use a spring of 0.26 diameter.
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Jacob... I apologize but I can't answer your questions on wire size because I just picked one out of the springs I had on hand and snipped it off to fit.
Mine is going to be completely different than it is right now when I'm done with this new setup anyways.
Not sure what it is you are referring to as 'cylinders'. Do you mean the pins?
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Reply #20 in this thread shows a picture of the trigger group with the side cover off. It shows the Baker brass trigger and the oversize spring. But the pins are in the normal locations.
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Reply #20 in this thread shows a picture of the trigger group with the side cover off. It shows the Baker brass trigger and the oversize spring. But the pins are in the normal locations.
I copied that pic and am looking at it. I suppose the cylinders are the pins. Ok, except for the retaining spring and the stiff OEM spring, I think I can put it back together.
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Yes... those are the pins... you can see where they go in the picture. They provide the pivot points.
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Yes... those are the pins... you can see where they go in the picture. They provide the pivot points.
Right. Thanks. I figured that out. I'm still having trouble with the retaining pin and the stiff OEM spring. WAsn't there a nub or something on the trigger the OEM spring fits on? I'm not seeing that.
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In the picture below, disregard the red circle.
In the green circle you can see the leg of the lawyer spring goes under and behind the sear.
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In the picture below, disregard the red circle.
In the green circle you can see the leg of the lawyer spring goes under and behind the sear.
I was calling the lawyer spring the retaining pin ...my bad. Ok, Upper end of the leg of the lawyer spring goes under and behind the sear...what does the lower end of the leg of the lawyer spring hook into?
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In the picture below, disregard the red circle.
In the green circle you can see the leg of the lawyer spring goes under and behind the sear.
I was calling the lawyer spring the retaining pin ...my bad. Ok, Upper end of the leg of the lawyer spring goes under and behind the sear...what does the lower end of the leg of the lawyer spring hook into?
Nothing yet.... once the stock is back on the gun you'll need to reach in there with a pick and move it forward before putting the safety bar back in. Then let it go and it rides on the front of the safety bar. This just may be the most frustrating part of getting it back together.... at least with my sausage fingers it is... :o
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The lower end of the lawyer spring holds the safety pin in - after you put action back into stock - use a small screwdriver and pull lawyer spring back and slide safety pin in.
Maybe why gun won't fire - it will not fire without safety pin in place ( lawyer spring will not work )
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In the picture below, disregard the red circle.
In the green circle you can see the leg of the lawyer spring goes under and behind the sear.
I was calling the lawyer spring the retaining pin ...my bad. Ok, Upper end of the leg of the lawyer spring goes under and behind the sear...what does the lower end of the leg of the lawyer spring hook into?
Nothing yet.... once the stock is back on the gun you'll need to reach in there with a pick and move it forward before putting the safety bar back in. Then let it go and it rides on the front of the safety bar. This just may be the most frustrating part of getting it back together.... at least with my sausage fingers it is... :o
I agree. That part will be tricky.
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The lower end of the lawyer spring holds the safety pin in - after you put action back into stock - use a small screwdriver and pull lawyer spring back and slide safety pin in.
Maybe why gun won't fire - it will not fire without safety pin in place ( lawyer spring will not work )
It wasn't firing before I moved the end of the lawyer spring to remove the safety pin.
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It may fire without the safety in but it may not cock without the tension of the lawyer spring setting the sear in the hammer.
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Jacob, I'll do a teardown on my gun and show you the parts, locations and what I did to get a very nice trigger feel.
BUT, it seems that something is off... I have to ask this question all of the time, it's part of my profession and it's met with belligerence, anger, disbelief, violence, tears, resignation and often, complete denial.
What have you done to bring you to this place?
The steel breeches are mass produced, we can remove that from the equation due to commonality. Same with the gun itself, if there was a mass production issue, we would have all seen it.
Occam's razor, paraphrased as, "the simplest explanation is usually the best one" or in this case, what happened that your not telling us?
Please forgive my audacious locution but something smells in denmark.
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Never been to Denmark but if the statement read "something smells in Texas" I could probably tell you what it is... ::)
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If one ever gets into a pinch where the valve is charged, and the hammer will not latch,, point it in a safe direction and pull the bolt back and let it snap forward, that should release all the air, do it 2 times, just to make sure. one should be able to push the valve stem in freely with some force if it is empty.
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Never been to Denmark but if the statement read "something smells in Texas" I could probably tell you what it is... ::)
I know you are not referring to Lizzy lol.
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Never been to Denmark but if the statement read "something smells in Texas" I could probably tell you what it is... ::)
I know you are not referring to Lizzy lol.
NOT funny! (OK, just a little) ;D
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Interesting thread.cheers.
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Woke up early enough this morning to go down to the mancave and swap into the 21" .177 barrel. All done except for setting up the rear peep sight.
I also took a picture of the mysterious green spacer and I'll upload that out of my phone when I get to work. I guess I missed the trash can with it because it was laying on the work bench... :o
I can't believe others can't find it, mine don't seem to want to go away... lol
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The 'booger'..
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You can see where the long rear screw damaged it. The missing trash was floating around in the spring and had to be cleaned out.
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One thing I did notice this morning...
Remember, I knocked the knob out of the original .22 bolt and tapped it for a threaded bolt.
I used that original bolt in the .177 setup this morning. It made a really nice seal against that .177 barrel.
I only had time to pump and dry fire a couple times but I couldn't detect any leak around the bolt or breech.
Maybe things will be different when I start testing actual pellets in the gun.
The Magnum bolts have not arrived yet. I ordered them in .22 but I bet they will work the same in the .177.... we'll see.
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Had a few minutes to gets some pics at lunch today....
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That peep is temporary until the new on arrives. The hole in that one is drilled out to big. It's for a pistol. The new, unmodified one will have the hole about the size of the stock 362 peep.
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Sorry about the dark pics... the mancave is actually our bar and a bar is supposed to be dark, and smelly, and.... well, the ones I grew up in were... :o
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Sorry about the dark pics... the mancave is actually our bar and a bar is supposed to be dark, and smelly, and.... well, the ones I grew up in were... :o
What adapter is the sight put on ?
Thank you,
wll
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The rear sight is in the cross dovetail groove on the steel breech.
Here is a better pic...
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Here is the overall gun... I think it is the perfect size and weight for a utility pumper.
It really is a throw back to what we had as kids and what brought us to this forum.... at least for me it is.
I can see this strapped across the handlebars of my fat tire Huffy bike from way back then.... peddling down the country dirt road to meet up with my buddies and head for the gravel pit, railroad tracks, the creek and the abandoned saw mill back in the woods.
Click on the pic and it will magically flip over ;)
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Here is the overall gun... I think it is the perfect size and weight for a utility pumper.
It really is a throw back to what we had as kids and what brought us to this forum.... at least for me it is.
I can see this strapped across the handlebars of my fat tire Huffy bike from way back then.... peddling down the country dirt road to meet up with my buddies and head for the gravel pit, railroad tracks, the creek and the abandoned saw mill back in the woods.
Click on the pic and it will magically flip over ;)
Those are great memories of the good-old-days. I have many.
You enablers caused me to order one. ;D
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Here is the overall gun... I think it is the perfect size and weight for a utility pumper.
It really is a throw back to what we had as kids and what brought us to this forum.... at least for me it is.
I can see this strapped across the handlebars of my fat tire Huffy bike from way back then.... peddling down the country dirt road to meet up with my buddies and head for the gravel pit, railroad tracks, the creek and the abandoned saw mill back in the woods.
Click on the pic and it will magically flip over ;)
Those are great memories of the good-old-days. I have many.
You enablers caused me to order one. ;D
Keep it simple Bob and enjoy it.
I'll be leaving one in .22 with only the steel breech, Baker trigger and a scope. The other will be the 21" .177 barrel, steel breech, Baker trigger and peeps with a red dot option.
Both have all the power needed to do what I want without any power mods and both will run common OTC pellets.
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Keep it simple Bob and enjoy it.
I'll be leaving one in .22 with only the steel breech, Baker trigger and a scope. The other will be the 21" .177 barrel, steel breech, Baker trigger and peeps with a red dot option.
Both have all the power needed to do what I want without any power mods and both will run common OTC pellets.
I think that I will stick with a metal breech with upgrades peep sights, like you and Wayne did.
I have found that with my aging eyesight I get a good sight picture with a small peep aperture.
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Yeah, peeps do it for me as well. It also gives me more side to side view to pan and scan. I can open both eyes and locate the target, then close the one eye and zero in on it with the peep. The front sight is just out of focus but the target is clear. That fiber optics front sight makes it easier to see.
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Avator, what front fiber optic sight are you using?
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The rear sight is in the cross dovetail groove on the steel breech.
Here is a better pic...
Sorry, the front sight adapter, what type and make is it :-)
Thank you,
wll
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It's the stock Discovery muzzle break. It's temporary until I decide what I'll hang out there... ;)
I want to keep it short so a TKO won't do for me. I'm still digging through my spares to find something better.
These things take time.... ;D
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Bill I haven't even bothered putting on my TKO because these guns really aren't that loud IMO. I just got done uploading another video with 20 shots to four bullseye's. Also just cleaned up the Hunter mold because I used up most all of my Hunters for .22 and they do shoot good out of this pumper. I did get one bad flyer but no biggy . . . . good enough for me 8)
https://youtu.be/u6EPwld7_dc
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I've got the lead and mold warming up right now 8)
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LOL.... Wayne, looks like you're really enjoying these low end pumpers... it's refreshing.
I just love cheap guns that shoot cheap ammo well.
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I figured I'd do some casting today, the hunters won't be the only thing that I'll be casting, I promised some 218 slugs to someone, we're doing a nice swap, his custom cleaning kit for some slugs and pellets.
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Realized I didn't have a .177 cleaning kit so I ordered this little kit this morning...
https://www.walmart.com/ip/Umarex-177-and-22-Cal-Air-Gun-Cleaning-Kit/35599453 (https://www.walmart.com/ip/Umarex-177-and-22-Cal-Air-Gun-Cleaning-Kit/35599453)
I just got an e-mail that FedEx will deliver it tomorrow.
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It's the stock Discovery muzzle break. It's temporary until I decide what I'll hang out there... ;)
I want to keep it short so a TKO won't do for me. I'm still digging through my spares to find something better.
These things take time.... ;D
Thank you very very much !!
wll
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That Disco muzzle brake sits the front sight too high for my peep setup. Since I chopped this barrel I no longer have the bevel front sight alignment. So I took a drill bit and cleared the alignment tab out of the factory front sight and tapped it back on the barrel. I had to raise the peep adjustment all the way up to get on the bull at 9yds. inside the mancave. After a bit of tweaking I'm getting good accuracy results.
More after breakfast.
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I can flip that peep down and put the scope on the gun. This 21" .177 barrel is really accurate.
We're having fun now !!
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LOL.... sitting here in the mancave with the side door open waiting for FedEx so I can stop them before they pull that truck in the yard and make a mess.
Boss is hanging out with me and she is standing in the doorway looking out. We are surrounded by water due to the massive amounts of rain last night.
Pretty sure if someone drives by we would look like Noah's Ark.
... and no, we don't need or want them two by two.. :o
Could someone please send an olive branch?
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You have already started the 2x2 lol boss and rambo...
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Rambo aka Nancy Boy is in the house. He don't want to ruin his nail polish.... :o
Ok, the rain has stopped and the sun is trying to peek out... I even heard a bird chirp.
Thanks to whoever did that.
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Well, it seems the FedEx driver is into airguns.... he is now anyways.... lol
I met him at the gate and he said he noticed I came out of this old building and said he knew some of the history of this place from back in the day. I invited him in and he was amazed... we spent the next 20 minutes or so taking about airguns. He said he didn't know they made much more that a Daisy 880.
Nice kid, I invited him back sometime for a cold drink and some shooting.
Yes Sir, my work here is done. 8)
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Well, it seems the FedEx driver is into airguns.... he is now anyways.... lol
I met him at the gate and he said he noticed I came out of this old building and said he knew some of the history of this place from back in the day. I invited him in and he was amazed... we spent the next 20 minutes or so taking about airguns. He said he didn't know they made much more that a Daisy 880.
Nice kid, I invited him back sometime for a cold drink and some shooting.
Yes Sir, my work here is done. 8)
You seem to be off on another tangent at the moment. I found the elusive green booger you're talking about. It's intact. I think I need to wrap some sandpaper around a dowel rod and sand out the pump tube a little bit where the hammer is.
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LOL.... if you read my threads you'll know I do that quite often.
I usually end up back on topic.
I spent the morning shooting at just under 10 yds inside the mancave.
When we took over this place I found 3 of the steel tip dart boards.
I hung on up inside the mancave and I staple paper targets to it.
I have yet to have a pellet pass though it.
I'll get back out there tomorrow and post some targets.
This thing is shooting really good with the 21" .177 barrel.
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LOL.... if you read my threads you'll know I do that quite often.
I usually end up back on topic.
I spent the morning shooting at just under 10 yds inside the mancave.
When we took over this place I found 3 of the steel tip dart boards.
I hung on up inside the mancave and I staple paper targets to it.
I have yet to have a pellet pass though it.
I'll get back out there tomorrow and post some targets.
This thing is shooting really good with the 21" .177 barrel.
I wish I was shooting. My 362 is back to being in pieces again. I'm starting to understand why people are buying 2 and even 3 or more of these things. It's so they have something to shoot while they're working on the other one.
My gut is acting up on me. Likely my pancreas. Lab where I got tested is closed due to weather. Won't be open until Monday. Pepto Bismol will have to do me until then.
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Well, it seems the FedEx driver is into airguns.... he is now anyways.... lol
I met him at the gate and he said he noticed I came out of this old building and said he knew some of the history of this place from back in the day. I invited him in and he was amazed... we spent the next 20 minutes or so taking about airguns. He said he didn't know they made much more that a Daisy 880.
Nice kid, I invited him back sometime for a cold drink and some shooting.
Yes Sir, my work here is done. 8)
You seem to be off on another tangent at the moment. I found the elusive green booger you're talking about. It's intact. I think I need to wrap some sandpaper around a dowel rod and sand out the pump tube a little bit where the hammer is.
Why would you sand it?
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What is the difference between the bolt that comes with the 2240 breech kit and the Magnum Air Power bolt?
Can the stock 2240 bolt be modified to improve its function or is it better to order just the breech and the
Magnum Air Power bolt? Where is the best source to purchase the Magnum Air Power bolt?
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Bob..
Have a look at the probe end of the stock 362 bolt compared to the probe end of the 2240 bolt. Also look at the orings
If they are as long and the orings are the same then you won't need the MAP bolt.
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Jacob...
Some good pictures of your setup in stages of assembly would really help me understand what you have going on.
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Bob..
Have a look at the probe end of the stock 362 bolt compared to the probe end of the 2240 bolt. Also look at the orings
If they are as long and the orings are the same then you won't need the MAP bolt.
I just received the 362, but I don't have a 2240 bolt/breech to compare it with.
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I'll try to post some pictures comparing them when I get down into the mancave this morning.
The Allen head on my small breech screw is really getting worn from so many times taking it in and out. I need to see if I have some replacement in my spares. Seems like I ordered some but I haven't seen them. I also want to have a look at the cocking pin in the hammer, it's just too wobbly for me. I have other hammers and pins and I'll chose the best of the best.
I almost hate to take it apart again... it's shooting so good right now.
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Thanks Bill!
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Have not noticed any hammer pin slop, but they do go in and out easier that they do when first removed, wonder if they put a little loc-tite on them for assembly ???
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Bob I've had mine apart and back together about 4 times already, I haven't noticed any slop in my cocking pin however on my old 2240's that were previously modified with very heavy hammer springs I did however that was long since resolved. The steel breech that I used on mine is one that I bought a long time ago, it works well after addressing the bolt/probe by removing the original riveted in handle, drilling and tapping the bolt to 8-32 threads and screwing in a 2240 handle to it during reassembly. I haven't been doing anything out doors since the heavy snow storm hit here Wednesday but today's the day I need to start digging out. All my shooting with it has been at 30ft in my attic, it's cold up there too but not near as cold as it is outside.
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Jacob...
Some good pictures of your setup in stages of assembly would really help me understand what you have going on.
I wish I could do that, Bill. I lack both a cell phone and a photobucket account. I suppose I could look around the web for suitable pics and/or vids that describe whats wrong.
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I haven't done it yet on my 362's, but in the past I have used the shaft of a numbered drill bit cut to length to replace the hammer pin. I can't remember the size/number. Fits and works better than the stock pin.
I think I'll check the size and order a stick of drill rod from mcmaster. I need to order a few more things from them anyway.
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The question is... how much more do you want to invest in your 362?
Read the description.. specifically the red.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/113116090370?mkevt=1&mkcid=1&mkrid=711-53200-19255-0&campid=5338722076&customid=&toolid=10050&amdata=enc%3AAQAGAAAAkL%2FHf2lDVmlY4UsMhcyCq2Z7SfeHGkieqtD9vB6JjVBeqg7NL0ip3CursK0brcg%2B%2FxfdWivPvMz7jOR4cSF%2F%2Bwz7QKTHDjOTZsI4Mc6y9JWGARPG8iWFtQTXHSABPiRwbQ4WLSavFd40QOZl16iySyDbkrAQEgHVdsgT30kvL43aSTjUolb4gX%2FLpPGigWxuKA%3D%3D (https://www.ebay.com/itm/113116090370?mkevt=1&mkcid=1&mkrid=711-53200-19255-0&campid=5338722076&customid=&toolid=10050&amdata=enc%3AAQAGAAAAkL%2FHf2lDVmlY4UsMhcyCq2Z7SfeHGkieqtD9vB6JjVBeqg7NL0ip3CursK0brcg%2B%2FxfdWivPvMz7jOR4cSF%2F%2Bwz7QKTHDjOTZsI4Mc6y9JWGARPG8iWFtQTXHSABPiRwbQ4WLSavFd40QOZl16iySyDbkrAQEgHVdsgT30kvL43aSTjUolb4gX%2FLpPGigWxuKA%3D%3D)
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The question is... how much more do you want to invest in your 362?
Read the description.. specifically the red.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/113116090370?mkevt=1&mkcid=1&mkrid=711-53200-19255-0&campid=5338722076&customid=&toolid=10050&amdata=enc%3AAQAGAAAAkL%2FHf2lDVmlY4UsMhcyCq2Z7SfeHGkieqtD9vB6JjVBeqg7NL0ip3CursK0brcg%2B%2FxfdWivPvMz7jOR4cSF%2F%2Bwz7QKTHDjOTZsI4Mc6y9JWGARPG8iWFtQTXHSABPiRwbQ4WLSavFd40QOZl16iySyDbkrAQEgHVdsgT30kvL43aSTjUolb4gX%2FLpPGigWxuKA%3D%3D (https://www.ebay.com/itm/113116090370?mkevt=1&mkcid=1&mkrid=711-53200-19255-0&campid=5338722076&customid=&toolid=10050&amdata=enc%3AAQAGAAAAkL%2FHf2lDVmlY4UsMhcyCq2Z7SfeHGkieqtD9vB6JjVBeqg7NL0ip3CursK0brcg%2B%2FxfdWivPvMz7jOR4cSF%2F%2Bwz7QKTHDjOTZsI4Mc6y9JWGARPG8iWFtQTXHSABPiRwbQ4WLSavFd40QOZl16iySyDbkrAQEgHVdsgT30kvL43aSTjUolb4gX%2FLpPGigWxuKA%3D%3D)
At least 52 owners (of 1377, 1322, 2289) plus sales on his own website, spent well over half the price of their guns in searching for the benefits of a tight cocking pin, adjustable striker, possibility of rear located 4-48 breech screw, and a bit less air cushion on firing.
It is quite a fine piece. I would have more heavily grooved the sides or slabbed the entire sides (easier with my equipment).
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I've got a little over $300 into 362 #2 right now, and I'm probably not done yet.
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That's nice, but pricey!!
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The question is... how much more do you want to invest in your 362?
Read the description.. specifically the red.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/113116090370?mkevt=1&mkcid=1&mkrid=711-53200-19255-0&campid=5338722076&customid=&toolid=10050&amdata=enc%3AAQAGAAAAkL%2FHf2lDVmlY4UsMhcyCq2Z7SfeHGkieqtD9vB6JjVBeqg7NL0ip3CursK0brcg%2B%2FxfdWivPvMz7jOR4cSF%2F%2Bwz7QKTHDjOTZsI4Mc6y9JWGARPG8iWFtQTXHSABPiRwbQ4WLSavFd40QOZl16iySyDbkrAQEgHVdsgT30kvL43aSTjUolb4gX%2FLpPGigWxuKA%3D%3D (https://www.ebay.com/itm/113116090370?mkevt=1&mkcid=1&mkrid=711-53200-19255-0&campid=5338722076&customid=&toolid=10050&amdata=enc%3AAQAGAAAAkL%2FHf2lDVmlY4UsMhcyCq2Z7SfeHGkieqtD9vB6JjVBeqg7NL0ip3CursK0brcg%2B%2FxfdWivPvMz7jOR4cSF%2F%2Bwz7QKTHDjOTZsI4Mc6y9JWGARPG8iWFtQTXHSABPiRwbQ4WLSavFd40QOZl16iySyDbkrAQEgHVdsgT30kvL43aSTjUolb4gX%2FLpPGigWxuKA%3D%3D)
That is a very nice hammer and the price isn't that bad... will it fit the 362 correctly though? I don't see the taper towards the front where typically the sear catches it... this one is straight across the length.
I think you hit the real question on the head though... "how much more". ;)
These lego guns are all like this though. We get them, hold them in our hands, go through the "oohing and awing"... then we rip them apart and change just about everything making them better, many $$$ spent, lol. ;D
That hammer pin is the same in all my 13xx's... sloppy. I saw where someone posted in one of these threads and drilled / tapped the hammer for a screw in pin. Making one from a correct size drill bit would be an option too but how would you keep it from coming out without the flange? You could wrap the original with Teflon but it probably wouldn't last long, or make a brass sleeve spacer but that small of one would be very hard to do.
I have a spare 13xx hammer that I put flats on the sides. I going to use it but looking at options to get rid of the slop before I do. ;)
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Bob here's a stock 2240 bolt/probe compared to a C362 bolt/probe.
(https://i.imgur.com/9FwfC2w.jpg)
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Guys... I only linked that MAP hammer as an example of the threaded pin.
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Here are the 2 different hammer pins I have. I tried the thicker one but without making the counterbore on the hammer deeper it won't slide in the tube under the pin slot.
That said, I'm not sure if drilling the counterbore deeper would let the bottom of the pin interfere with the spring. I think tapping the hole and make a new pin would be the best option. You won't need a shoulder on the pin if you use thread locker.
BTW... I think the thicker pin is from a 2240 hammer.
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Bob here's a stock 2240 bolt/probe compared to a C362 bolt/probe.
(https://i.imgur.com/9FwfC2w.jpg)
Wayne, thanks, much appreciated. I assume that the left one is the 362, is that correct?
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Yes Bob.... Wayne may still be getting his beauty sleep.... LMBO
... or maybe he's stuck up in the attic?
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Yes it is, Bill is supposed to be getting a couple of the MAR bolt/probe's that look virtually identical to the bolt/probe used in the C362. They're out of stock now though, if I put a steel breech on the last one I bought (haven't even had it out of the box yet) I'll remove the riveted in handle from it, drill and tap that one too, I might even do that even if I don't put a steel breech on it. Right now I've got some good clean lead warming up for casting more "Hunter's" for some more shooting in my attic.
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I did receive the 2 MAP bolts but I haven't used them yet. The stock one I tapped (like you are suggesting) is working just fine. I plan on getting back inside #782 today. I may use one in that.
#805 is done.... for now... ;)
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I need to get up into the attic and do some more shooting soon, it's been weeks! Once I can figure out if my gun leaks or not I would like some power mods.
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Here are the 2 different hammer pins I have. I tried the thicker one but without making the counterbore on the hammer deeper it won't slide in the tube under the pin slot.
That said, I'm not sure if drilling the counterbore deeper would let the bottom of the pin interfere with the spring. I think tapping the hole and make a new pin would be the best option. You won't need a shoulder on the pin if you use thread locker.
BTW... I think the thicker pin is from a 2240 hammer.
I see what you mean. That's a shame as that thicker pin looks like it might have been perfect otherwise. Thanks for the pic. ;D
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Back down in the mancave on this brisk Sunday morning. There is ice on the puddles in the driveway so it fired up both propane heaters to knock the chill off.
Think I'll put on a fresh pot of coffee while things are warming up.
The plan is to get back into #782. This one is virtually stock .22 save the steel breech and Baker trigger. I did add a TKO but I don't find it's a 'must have'.... at least not for me.
I am going to install an MAP bolt to it. I also want to check that hammer pin and see if it's as sloppy as #805.
I've never had the end cap off of this one so it will be interesting to see if it has the green booger in it.
#782 has the exact 2-6x32 AOEG Buck Rail compact scope on it as I have one #805. It will also get the 10/22 flip up peep sight.
That is such a sweet setup.... You can just flip the peep down and pop the scope on... no need to remove or readjust the peep. And if you put a small mark on the breech to align the scope when you put it back on, it's virtually spot on POA. Maybe a click or 2 on the turrets if at all.
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Here are the 2 different hammer pins I have. I tried the thicker one but without making the counterbore on the hammer deeper it won't slide in the tube under the pin slot.
That said, I'm not sure if drilling the counterbore deeper would let the bottom of the pin interfere with the spring. I think tapping the hole and make a new pin would be the best option. You won't need a shoulder on the pin if you use thread locker.
BTW... I think the thicker pin is from a 2240 hammer.
I see what you mean. That's a shame as that thicker pin looks like it might have been perfect otherwise. Thanks for the pic. ;D
I think that thicker one might be from a 2240 hammer. The 2240 hammer is a larger diameter than the 13XX and the counterbore could be deeper. I'll have a look.
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In between shooting and tinkering on #805 yesterday, I put a new scope on the remaining 392s, one I could bring down to focus on the 9yd. target inside the mancave. It's not quite as accurate as #805 362 but I probably don't have 100 shots through it yet and it may need some more breaking in. The 392s are known to have over spray in the barrels so that might also be an issue.
You can definitely feel the difference in pumping the 2. I also think the 392 nets me the same power with 4 strokes as the .22 362 gives with 5. The chrony will answer that question.
IMO, there are unique advantages to both guns. Maybe once I'm satisfied with the 'tinker' results of #362 and get the 392s broke in and hitting POA I'll do a side by side comparison.
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Here are the 2 different hammer pins I have. I tried the thicker one but without making the counterbore on the hammer deeper it won't slide in the tube under the pin slot.
That said, I'm not sure if drilling the counterbore deeper would let the bottom of the pin interfere with the spring. I think tapping the hole and make a new pin would be the best option. You won't need a shoulder on the pin if you use thread locker.
BTW... I think the thicker pin is from a 2240 hammer.
I see what you mean. That's a shame as that thicker pin looks like it might have been perfect otherwise. Thanks for the pic. ;D
I think that thicker one might be from a 2240 hammer. The 2240 hammer is a larger diameter than the 13XX and the counterbore could be deeper. I'll have a look.
Thanks Bill ;).
These might be a good cheap option...
https://www.ebay.com/itm/291268923286?epid=5005589862&hash=item43d0fb0f96:g:6C4AAOSwEK9UI50d (https://www.ebay.com/itm/291268923286?epid=5005589862&hash=item43d0fb0f96:g:6C4AAOSwEK9UI50d)
I emailed Davio to ask if these pins of his addresses the pin wiggle? Will let you know what he says. 8)
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That would be a great question to ask.... thanks
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$15 for a hammer pin is just too much ???
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$15 for a hammer pin is just too much ???
not necessarily ;)...
When you don't have the means or skill to machine it yourself and someone else does... you pay for that ;). It is a lot cheaper than spending $45 for a custom hammer and pin... when all you need is the pin. 8)
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I wonder how much Crosman gets for hammer pins ??? I've never bought any before, they're the ones to buy from IMO, it's when you get into the custom aftermarket stuff is when it gets pricey.
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I think that thicker one might be from a 2240 hammer. The 2240 hammer is a larger diameter than the 13XX and the counterbore could be deeper. I'll have a look.
Thanks Bill ;).
All use the same pin - part number 2100A011
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I was just rebuilding a Crosman 1400, it has a beefier hammer pin and breach screw :o ;)
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That may be where this fatty came from James.
If there comes a need to replace it, I'm going to tap the hole in the hammer and find a screw with a shank on it. I'll cut the threaded and shank ends to length then loctite it in. I sure miss my mini lathe... maybe that should be the next thing on my wish list.
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I have #782 all back together but I've just been summoned to the house for breakfast.
I'm not inclined to be late for breakfast..... ;)
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I sure miss my mini lathe... maybe that should be the next thing on my wish list.
The sale of my first mini-lathe turned out to be a mistake. But the sale was part of a plan - that did not work out.
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Happens to the best of us Craig.
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I don't know how it can get any better than this....
We got the big screen hooked up so we can watch the NASCAR opener on a brand new venue... LA Coliseum.
It's nice and toasty in here.
We are surrounded by airguns with a 9yd. plinking setup.
.. and the orange Power Aid moonshine creek water is flowing freely.... ;) 8)
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Oh yeah, I forgot the rule... pics or it didn't happen...
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#782 with the stock .22 barrel is not giving me the accuracy results I had hoped for. I am getting 1/2 groups at 9yds compared to dead nut with #805 with it's 22" .177 barrel setup.
The plan now is to swap out the barrel with the stock .22 barrel left over from #805. If that don't give me any joy I will convert it to .177 with the 18" barrel. That barrel only leaves me 1/4 inch past the barrel band and no room for a front sight/muzzle brake.
That's not a big issue if the plan was to keep it scoped but, I want the peep sight option on both guns. I do have a solution in mind.... I'll replace the barrel band grub screw with one of the longer ones that came with the baker brass trigger... ;)
It's like the old saying.... where there's a will there's a relative.... no, wait... nevermind, :o :-\
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I'm somewhat what some may refer to as a knuckle dragger. I got long arms. And believe it or not, with my bionic reverse should replacement and broken collar bone on the left and the torn up rotator cuff on the right, I tend to hang even lower than normal.... not that hanging low is a bad thing, depending on anatomic thereabouts... But in this case it's location, location, location.
Where was I ? Oh yeah.... LOP. :o
I don't know 'bout y'all but I sometimes feel like the 362 has a bit of 'child's play' feel to it.... enter the rubber baby buggy bumper mod. Not to be confused with the infamous elastomer bushing in the daisy 880.
Some time back I bought a pair of Maximus from our own "Rat sniper". Paul made me h#ll of a deal, as he usually does, on them. They came to me with modest mods, one of which were stock extension (for lack of a better description due to current BAC). One of the Maximus' has since been sold and the other has gone through extensive mods including a Boyd's thumbhole laminate stock. That negated the need for the 'RBBB'.
But wait, there's more.....
Turns out the 'RBBB' is a perfect fit for the 362... or is it that the 'RBBB' makes the 362 a perfect fit for me? It fits nice and snug on the 362... matter of fact, if you told me it was made by Trojan, I wouldn't be surprised. :-X
So, if you haven't invested enough in your 362, here is another option.... ;D
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It's the stock Discovery muzzle break. It's temporary until I decide what I'll hang out there... ;)
I want to keep it short so a TKO won't do for me. I'm still digging through my spares to find something better.
These things take time.... ;D
Is this break round or does it have a cut out area for the Discovery air tank. I want a break that is round that can use the Williams front right. A pic would be great if you can.
Thank you very much for all your information.
wll
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That would be a great question to ask.... thanks
David Said...
"Yes, and sometimes ours have to be gently tapped in. Remember that in any case of Crosman OEM hammer and pin slop, it may be because of tolerances on both the pin and the hammer."
I'll give one a try. ;)
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It's the stock Discovery muzzle break. It's temporary until I decide what I'll hang out there... ;)
I want to keep it short so a TKO won't do for me. I'm still digging through my spares to find something better.
These things take time.... ;D
Is this break round or does it have a cut out area for the Discovery air tank. I want a break that is round that can use the Williams front right. A pic would be great if you can.
Thank you very much for all your information.
wll
This break is not round and will most likely not work for you.
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It's the stock Discovery muzzle break. It's temporary until I decide what I'll hang out there... ;)
I want to keep it short so a TKO won't do for me. I'm still digging through my spares to find something better.
These things take time.... ;D
Is this break round or does it have a cut out area for the Discovery air tank. I want a break that is round that can use the Williams front right. A pic would be great if you can.
Thank you very much for all your information.
wll
This break is not round and will most likely not work for you.
Thank you very much.
wll
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I swapped over to the Baker aluminum breech and MAP transfer port and lost a lot of power with a lot of "blow back" when I shoot. I'm going to see if the hammer is hitting the back of the probe, but I noticed a lot of hammer pin play when I was swapping breeches anyway. This rifle is a bit of a disappointment for me.
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I swapped over to the Baker aluminum breech and MAP transfer port and lost a lot of power with a lot of "blow back" when I shoot. I'm going to see if the hammer is hitting the back of the probe, but I noticed a lot of hammer pin play when I was swapping breeches anyway. This rifle is a bit of a disappointment for me.
Update, picked up another 10 MPS by going back to the plastic breech with the stainless bolt probe and MAP transfer port, but still 10+ MPS down from where I was before. I'm not really sure what is going on.
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I swapped over to the Baker aluminum breech and MAP transfer port and lost a lot of power with a lot of "blow back" when I shoot. I'm going to see if the hammer is hitting the back of the probe, but I noticed a lot of hammer pin play when I was swapping breeches anyway. This rifle is a bit of a disappointment for me.
Update, picked up another 10 MPS by going back to the plastic breech with the stainless bolt probe and MAP transfer port, but still 10+ MPS down from where I was before. I'm not really sure what is going on.
Test number three was with the OEM breech and probe and MAP transfer port and no change from the previous numbers. Next thing is to swap TP's back.
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Here's a video, this did happen this morning with my C362
https://youtu.be/JBPAvEqDoAM
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I swapped over to the Baker aluminum breech and MAP transfer port and lost a lot of power with a lot of "blow back" when I shoot. I'm going to see if the hammer is hitting the back of the probe, but I noticed a lot of hammer pin play when I was swapping breeches anyway. This rifle is a bit of a disappointment for me.
Update, picked up another 10 MPS by going back to the plastic breech with the stainless bolt probe and MAP transfer port, but still 10+ MPS down from where I was before. I'm not really sure what is going on.
Test number three was with the OEM breech and probe and MAP transfer port and no change from the previous numbers. Next thing is to swap TP's back.
The rifle is 100% stock now and my velocity is about 600 FPS at eight pumps with Crosman Premier 14.3's. I've lost another 35 FPS since I tested a few weeks ago. I think it's time to talk to Crosman customer service.
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Yeah, something is going on there.
Don't be offended but, what is your oiling routine?
I add a couple drops of Secret Sauce every hundred or so shots.
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Yeah, something is going on there.
Don't be offended but, what is your oiling routine?
I add a couple drops of Secret Sauce every hundred or so shots.
I put some pure silicone oil in all the lube spots before my first shot and then every 100 or so. Crosman says their own Pelgun oil is the only thing, but I've seen several GTA "veterans" using pure silicone oil, so I don't think that is the problem. Unfortunately I don't think I can return this rifle now that I've marred the barrel with the set screws from my baker breech, plus some of the bluing came off from having it up in the attic for a few weeks, which is frustrating.
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Here's a video, this did happen this morning with my C362
Wayne, as always, very nice. I do enjoy your videos and I save on pellets because I feel like I'm pulling the trigger.
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Yeah, something is going on there.
Don't be offended but, what is your oiling routine?
I add a couple drops of Secret Sauce every hundred or so shots.
Mine is probably due for some more oil it'self, on pumpers either secret sauce or pellgun oil is what I use. I researched pellgun oil quite some time back, it's actually diesel oil that's made in Austrailia which can be bought however not in small quantities, I ordered some from ebay abut 4 years ago which was a good size bottle, it does a great job too. I completely forgot about a bottle of secret sauce that I have, I'll have to use that also.
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Yeah, something is going on there.
Don't be offended but, what is your oiling routine?
I add a couple drops of Secret Sauce every hundred or so shots.
Mine is probably due for some more oil it'self, on pumpers either secret sauce or pellgun oil is what I use. I researched pellgun oil quite some time back, it's actually diesel oil that's made in Austrailia which can be bought however not in small quantities, I ordered some from ebay abut 4 years ago which was a good size bottle, it does a great job too. I completely forgot about a bottle of secret sauce that I have, I'll have to use that also.
Back about a year ago, I looked into Macs secret sauce and found that the YH compressor oil had the same specs. I have been using a 5ml syringe with a blunt tipped 16ga needle full of NUVAIR 455 for oiling air guns but I do drop pure silicone oil on all my o-rings and on the fill probe on PCP's.
Pellgun oil reduces to a sticky mess when it dries out IMHO so I don't own any.
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Being new to pumpers, what is Secret Sauce? I just used 10 weight Silicone oil on the pumper seal, is that good or bad? :-\
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Being new to pumpers, what is Secret Sauce? I just used 10 weight Silicone oil on the pumper seal, is that good or bad? :-\
Here's what it is Bob, it's good for pumpers, co2's, works good for the valves on them too. https://www.mac1airgunshop.com/secret-sauce-10-oz-refill-size-p/m1ss6oz.htm (https://www.mac1airgunshop.com/secret-sauce-10-oz-refill-size-p/m1ss6oz.htm)
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Here's what it is Bob, it's good for pumpers, co2's, works good for the valves on them too. https://www.mac1airgunshop.com/secret-sauce-10-oz-refill-size-p/m1ss6oz.htm (https://www.mac1airgunshop.com/secret-sauce-10-oz-refill-size-p/m1ss6oz.htm)
Wayne, thanks again.
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I see the large bottle is out of stock. I have 1/2 small bottle left. Hope he gets some soon.
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My 15 year old grandson, who is in the ROTC, in high school, practices three times a week in school. They use Crosman Challengers and compete with all NE high schools.
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I've got the small bottle but it's still almost full, the only thing I've really used it for is lubing my Crosman 130 and my co2 vintage pistols. It don't take a whole lot to lube them either.
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sorry wrong gate
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My 15 year old grandson, who is in the ROTC, in high school, practices three times a week in school. They use Crosman Challengers and compete with all NE high schools.
LOL.... if they had that back when I was in school I may have stayed around long enough to graduate instead of waiting until I was 50 years old to get a GED.... :o
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Bill I got my GED in Allegan county jail, actually scored in the top 99 for science. I was 39 years old and off the bottle for good.
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Got GED when 17, scored great, was accepted in a local college, then I dropped out and went to work :)
I use AW45 Hydraulic in my pumpers, and CO2, Hydraulic Fluid also gives metal to metal friction protection, same as Secret Sauce. Used to use pell gun oil until I heard it left a sticky residue after time.
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James in basic training I was one of three that qualified for OCS but when they told me I'd have to do four years instead of 2 years I said no way.
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James in basic training I was one of three that qualified for OCS but when they told me I'd have to do four years instead of 2 years I said no way.
I assume because you have a four year degree. I met a few enlistees who went through basic training and OCS.
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My 15 year old grandson, who is in the ROTC, in high school, practices three times a week in school. They use Crosman Challengers and compete with all NE high schools.
None of the JROTC (ROTC is college) programs I went to had a rifle team. I did instead compete in the Raider Challenge (HS version of the Ranger Challenge) and wrestled competitively.
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Here are the 2 different hammer pins I have. I tried the thicker one but without making the counterbore on the hammer deeper it won't slide in the tube under the pin slot.
That said, I'm not sure if drilling the counterbore deeper would let the bottom of the pin interfere with the spring. I think tapping the hole and make a new pin would be the best option. You won't need a shoulder on the pin if you use thread locker.
BTW... I think the thicker pin is from a 2240 hammer.
I get rid of the slop in the hammer pin by holding it upside down with needle nose pliers or vise grip on anvil or hard surface and lightly peen with a ball peen hammer the short bottom section of the pin. Just a few light strokes on the soft metal will peen it for a tight fit. If too much just file or sand it until it goes in for a tight fit.
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Here are the 2 different hammer pins I have. I tried the thicker one but without making the counterbore on the hammer deeper it won't slide in the tube under the pin slot.
That said, I'm not sure if drilling the counterbore deeper would let the bottom of the pin interfere with the spring. I think tapping the hole and make a new pin would be the best option. You won't need a shoulder on the pin if you use thread locker.
BTW... I think the thicker pin is from a 2240 hammer.
I get rid of the slop in the hammer pin by holding it upside down with needle nose pliers or vise grip on anvil or hard surface and lightly peen with a ball peen hammer the short bottom section of the pin. Just a few light strokes on the soft metal will peen it for a tight fit. If too much just file or sand it until it goes in for a tight fit.
Good idea.... thanks
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Do the "upgraded" hammers offered by the various online retailers offer any advantage beyond a tapped hole? They seem like well made items, but I'm dubious that a heavier hammer would make more power with a stock valve. My hammer pin is very sloppy, so I'm considering the MAP hammer because of the threaded hammer pin, but I do also plan on a valve upgrade down the road, when an off the shelf piston is available.
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Check my reply #292 :
https://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=195418.msg156282797#msg156282797 (https://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=195418.msg156282797#msg156282797)
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Check my reply #292 :
https://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=195418.msg156282797#msg156282797 (https://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=195418.msg156282797#msg156282797)
Thanks! Things get swallowed quick.
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Did you know?......
I decided to go back to the 18" .177 barrel on #805. And use that Ruger rear flip up cross notch peep...
https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1005064221?pid=186476 (https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1005064221?pid=186476)
I described how to install it above.
Well, as you can imagine and I also reported above, the 18" barrel only extends 1/4" beyond the front of the barrel band.... it ends up looking much like a 392 barrel. But it leaves nothing to hang a muzzle break or a front sight on.
I'd really like to keep this gun a little compact critter gitter.
I just happen to be looking around on the bench and spotted the plastic bag containing the leftover screws and spring from the Baker brass trigger. Sure enough, those adjustment screws for the Baker trigger are the exact thread and Allen wrench size as the grub for the front barrel band. And even better enough sticks up to be near perfect for a front sight blade.
Even better.... I had bought 100 .177 bolt o-rings so I stacked 5 of them on the screw to make it look much better than a raw grub screw sticking up. I left maybe a 1/16" of the screw showing at the top.
Camera battery was dead so I'll have to post a pic later.
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Did you know?......
I decided to go back to the 18" .177 barrel on #805. And use that Ruger rear flip up cross notch peep...
https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1005064221?pid=186476 (https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1005064221?pid=186476)
I described how to install it above.
Well, as you can imagine and I also reported above, the 18" barrel only extends 1/4" beyond the front of the barrel band.... it ends up looking much like a 392 barrel. But it leaves nothing to hang a muzzle break or a front sight on.
I'd really like to keep this gun a little compact critter gitter.
I just happen to be looking around on the bench and spotted the plastic bag containing the leftover screws and spring from the Baker brass trigger. Sure enough, those adjustment screws for the Baker trigger are the exact thread and Allen wrench size as the grub for the front barrel band. And even better enough sticks up to be near perfect for a front sight blade.
Even better.... I had bought 100 .177 bolt o-rings so I stacked 5 of them on the screw to make it look much better than a raw grub screw sticking up. I left maybe a 1/16" of the screw showing at the top.
Camera battery was dead so I'll have to post a pic later.
If that doesn't work out, you could get one of those 3/8 dovetail sight holders and put it right against the barrel band with a Lyman (or whatever) front sight on it. Would look good and alleviate the need for a muzzle brake.
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Thanks but this seems to be gonna work just fine.... ;)
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Mine got the soup can test today 8)
(https://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=182911.0;attach=390998;image)
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Mine got the soup can test today 8)
(https://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=182911.0;attach=390998;image)
Thru and thru? That is niiice!
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I should have put a big rag behind it, it hit and old computer cover and flattened out pretty good by that time.
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Killed that soup can deader than dead.
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Killed that soup can deader than dead.
And it made soup of the innards too!
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Nothing like some good ole can damage. I need to try it with a 27 grain Hunter. Hmmm.. So c a r n a g e is a forbidden word?
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I think someone did call the 362 the Crosman Can Opener 8) ;D
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#805 now has an 18" .177 stubby barrel and my flip up peep setup on it.
It also has the Baker brass trigger adjustment screw in the place of the front barrel band screw and doubles as a front sight. It's the same size and thread as the stock screw. I put .177 bolt orings on it to make it look a bit better than a raw screw sticking up.
The rear peep flips down under spring tension to clear the way for the scope to mount.
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I received 3 of the TKO Prototype Trigger V4.1 from Mike.
I randomly pulled one out of the bag to use in #805.
I had previously smoothed and lubed all the contact points in the trigger group.
I also had previously put a slight bend on the lawyer spring as others have done.
The only other different thing I did as opposed to others is, I used the trigger return spring that came with the Baker brass trigger. It's much lighter than the stock spring.
I did nothing to the TKO trigger. I pulled it out of the bag and dropped it in.
Let me just say...
If the other 2 triggers in that bag are exactly the same as this one then I'll be replacing the Baker trigger in #782 with one. ;D
In my case... there is such a short first stage that I hardly even know it's there. The hammer release is so crisp and light. IMO, it's perfect.
I've read others suggest changes on the angle and/or length of the trigger blade but I don't find and issue with either. I don't even find the need for added adjustment screws. I can't imagine what might be done with V4.2 to improve what I have here. I have no idea what Mike plans to sell the final revision for but it will be money well spent.
If I might suggest anything at all it would be to copy the Baker trigger spring and sell it as a kit.
Great job Mike..... thanks
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In my experience, one of the main things required for accuracy is the trigger.
If the trigger distracts my concentration from my aim then results are less than desired.
A long pull, gritty, spongy, non predictable trigger is a no go for me.
I dropped this trigger in and I did concentrate on it for the first 2 shots because it was something new and I wanted to feel the difference.
On shot number 3 I never even thought about the trigger. It was like I already knew exactly what to expect and it responded.
So for me... the trigger improvement on this gun is done.
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In my experience, one of the main things required for accuracy is the trigger.
If the trigger distracts my concentration from my aim then results are less than desired.
A long pull, gritty, spongy, non predictable trigger is a no go for me.
I dropped this trigger in and I did concentrate on it for the first 2 shots because it was something new and I wanted to feel the difference.
On shot number 3 I never even thought about the trigger. It was like I already knew exactly what to expect and it responded.
So for me... the trigger improvement on this gun is done.
I too was able to get stellar results with this trigger but I did have a small clearance issue with the frame.
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In my experience, one of the main things required for accuracy is the trigger.
If the trigger distracts my concentration from my aim then results are less than desired.
A long pull, gritty, spongy, non predictable trigger is a no go for me.
I dropped this trigger in and I did concentrate on it for the first 2 shots because it was something new and I wanted to feel the difference.
On shot number 3 I never even thought about the trigger. It was like I already knew exactly what to expect and it responded.
So for me... the trigger improvement on this gun is done.
I too was able to get stellar results with this trigger but I did have a small clearance issue with the frame.
Please, feel free to explain that.
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I honestly thing that all my trigger needed was the smoothing of of the friction points with a fine hone stone, I actually found that little honestone digging in the dirt with my metal detector years back, never bothered using it for much until I started using it on these airguns, it's just too small for even sharpening a pocket knife.
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Wayne... a softer return spring makes a World of difference.
The angle of Mike's V4.1 trigger blade eliminates the need for a stop adjustment screw.
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In my experience, one of the main things required for accuracy is the trigger.
If the trigger distracts my concentration from my aim then results are less than desired.
A long pull, gritty, spongy, non predictable trigger is a no go for me.
I dropped this trigger in and I did concentrate on it for the first 2 shots because it was something new and I wanted to feel the difference.
On shot number 3 I never even thought about the trigger. It was like I already knew exactly what to expect and it responded.
So for me... the trigger improvement on this gun is done.
I too was able to get stellar results with this trigger but I did have a small clearance issue with the frame.
Please, feel free to explain that.
Which part? The text I highlighted in red or the clearance issue?
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The clearance issue.
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Mike sent an instruction sheet with the likely places to be trimmed, I had one such place that has the yellow arrow denoting the bump that had to be shaved down some to clear the frame.
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Mike sent an instruction sheet with the likely places to be trimmed, I had one such place that has the yellow arrow denoting the bump that had to be shaved down some to clear the frame.
Hmmmm.... I didn't experience the issue. maybe they varied slightly from print to print. I've only tried one of the 3.
Hang on, I'll go put one in #782....
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Let me see if I can explain without pics... camera is in the house and I'm old and lazy.... lol
Specifically regarding the nub clearance on the front of the trigger....
It's a bit tedious because you have to compress the return spring to get the trigger to go in with the nub below the frame. Be careful.... if not for my roller magnet I would be shopping for a new spring... lol
Once you get the trigger in like that it virtually eliminates the need for the top Baker adjustment screw. It sets the trigger in the perfect position.
Basically, I have a very light 1/8" first stage pull to a crisp break. Like I said... I wouldn't change a thing on my V4.1.... Mind you, I have done all the typical polishing and lubing of the contact points in the trigger group. I also put a slight over bend on the lawyer spring.
I do have a SS trigger shoe from previous 'lego' projects and I may give it a try but I really don't feel the need.
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HA HA HA .... I'm an idiot !!!
The good news is.... the TKO V4.1 trigger works exactly the same in Betty Lou's #782.
However, it was way, way down on power and pellets were flying everywhere....
Well ya big dummy... you didn't swap it to the .177 barrel yet and .177 pellets don't do so good in a .22.... lol
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However, it was way, way down on power and pellets were flying everywhere....
Well ya big dummy... you didn't swap it to the .177 barrel yet and .177 pellets don't do so good in a .22.... lol
I hide my mistakes and never speak of them. :o
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Bet ya can't guess what I'll be doing next.... lol
Yep, putting the custom 21" .177 barrel on #782.... ;)
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However, it was way, way down on power and pellets were flying everywhere....
Well ya big dummy... you didn't swap it to the .177 barrel yet and .177 pellets don't do so good in a .22.... lol
I hide my mistakes and never speak of them. :o
I don't like laughing alone..... folks get the wrong impression.
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It may be a sign of inbreeding... :o
There was a kid back in middle school that walked around with his hands in in pockets and laughing. ??? :-\ :-X
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Bet ya can't guess what I'll be doing next.... lol
Yep, putting the custom 21" .177 barrel on #782.... ;)
Will you then be loading a .22 pellet? ;D ;)
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Bet ya can't guess what I'll be doing next.... lol
Yep, putting the custom 21" .177 barrel on #782.... ;)
Will you then be loading a .22 pellet? ;D ;)
If I do you'll be the first to know.
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Well... #782 is now a 21" barrel .177.... easy peasy.
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But, 5 minutes to green flag so testing will have to wait.... 8)
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It may be a sign of inbreeding... :o
There was a kid back in middle school that walked around with his hands in in pockets and laughing. ??? :-\ :-X
Now that is funny. I love your postings as they keep me smiling. If you are not doing stand-up comedy on the side, you're losing a lot of money.
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Thanks Bob, I'll be here all week.
Try the veal. ;)
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Good morning from the mancave !! This is where the magic happens. ;)
Happy Saturday morning. It's a balmy 60* at 6:30 am CT.
Today we'll be continuing our quest to mold a pair of Crosman C362s into pellet pukers that are garunteed not to rust, bust, collect dust, chip, rip, tear, bend, whistle or break.
If you've been insane enough to have been following this thread, first of all, let me apologize. Motrin seems to help me but, as they say.... liquor is quicker. ;D
Ok, where were we.... oh yeah...
As you may know, I've converted both guns to .177. One has a 21" barrel and the other an 18" barrel.
This past week I received a few little trinkets to add. One of which is the Buck Rail 2240 silencer. I opted for the non front sight version. Why? one might ask. Simple... I've come up with my own front sight solution as shown above in reply #365... https://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=195418.msg156288775#msg156288775 (https://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=195418.msg156288775#msg156288775)
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This little doodad has a dual function.
1) It replaces the grub screw in the barrel band.
2) It adds the front sight blade without the need to fiddle with the perfect alignment of the silencer with incorporated front sight blade.
I was lucky enough to discover that the adjustment screw that comes with the Baker brass trigger is the exact thread and height to use. 5 .177 bolt orings that are perfect to make it not look like a screw that was too long but leave just enough of the top of the screw to be visible in contrast.
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The next question is...
How does the $18 Buck Rail silencer perform?
First of all let me just say this....
All due respect to TKO, they make awesome products that are worth every penny. However, many of us who bought these C362 guns did it because of the low cost of the gun. The attraction, for me anyways, is the 'lego'/'erector set' variables this platform brings to my tinker bench without breaking the budget.
Literally, I can build it, enjoy it, tear it down and build something else.
That said... the Buck Rail silencer is every bit as effective as the TKO I replaced on this gun. I can buy 3 of them for the cost of the TKO. I'm sure the same goes for the DonnyFL, Rocker1 and all the other options out there.
Not knocking those guys or their products. I own some of all of them and I'm very satisfied with them. But again... Cheap gun that shoots cheap pellets and gives me hours of fun doing more than just putting little holes in paper.
YMMV
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Next up....
Speaking of TKO.
Mike was gracious enough to send some of us his prototype 3D printed C362 (it will fit other models as well) replacement triggers. I received 3 of the V4.1 versions.
Some of the others that received them have suggested that Mike make some modifications including the removal of material here and there. To that I say..... nope, nope and nope.
"Care to elaborate Mr. Bill?"
Sure, don't mind if I do. After all, I wouldn't want to disappoint those who accuse me of being a bit 'chatty". No idea where they get that impression (35,000 posts since 2013) :o
Besides, it gives me the opportunity to take the gun apart, again, to take photos.
Be right back after I do just that.....
BTW.... wish me luck that springs don't 'sproing' requiring me to bust out the led head lamp and my trusty roller magnet.. :-\
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Bill I tried bot .218 slugs and .215 slugs in mine today the .215's fit loose however they give me better groups than the .218's do. I just ordered a .216 and .217 size bushings from NOE. I think if I size them to .217 they'll be perfect for the gun but I did order the .216 also.
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Wayne.... you bring a whole nuther approach to the "cheap fun" factor to the game. That being casting your own ammo. I'm digging it but, so far, I have not convinced my accoounting department of the long term cost savings that the initial investment will produce. For some weird reason, she thinks paying bills and putting food on the table is more important.... yeah, I don't get it either.
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You know me Bill I've been hooked on casting since NOE made airgun molds available thanks to Bob Sterne and his fantastic design's. I don't know if Bob designed the .218's or Al did but they're fantastic shooting slugs, especially in my AEA Challenger LS.
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Oh well it's time to get some more casting done 8)
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Wayne... I suppose if Al did, they would be called Al's Boat Tails... lol
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Wayne.... you bring a whole nuther approach to the "cheap fun" factor to the game. That being casting your own ammo. I'm digging it but, so far, I have not convinced my accoounting department of the long term cost savings that the initial investment will produce. For some weird reason, she thinks paying bills and putting food on the table is more important.... yeah, I don't get it either.
If I may make a suggestion, buy the moulds from NOE whenever you find them. I have yet to talk to them about the undersized .22 magnums moulds but the .22 hunter pellets are perfect. The .22 wadcutter moulds are still unavailable and I've been checking their site daily for about six months now. There is a thread on the NOE forum so we live with the hope they're going to make them this year. Should you decide to cast your own pellets, it is a arduous task in obtaining the moulds. In order to make the casting idea more cost-effective you need pellet traps to recover and recast used pellets. I'd say my investment so far is about $500 in casting paraphernalia.
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So simple even a caveman could do it.... get it? Caveman... Mancave... nevermind.... moving right along now..
First.... look at the pic below. If your trigger don't sit back in the trigger frame like this one does, you done it wrong.
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BB... love ya bro but I'm trying to do a tutorial over here... ;)
It's not very often I get to share my vast knowledge... mainly because I don't have a vast knowledge. But even a blind squirrel finds a nut now and then.... 8)
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So, how does one get the trigger to sit back in the trigger frame like that? Well, certainly not by grinding any material off of the V4.1 trigger so put your little Dremels away, we won't be needing them now.
This is where a caveman may struggle... you see, cavemen have 20 toes. 10 of them on their hands... at least this caveman does...
In the area circled in red you can see that the nub on the front of the trigger acts as a stop to prevent the trigger from rotating up into the frame. That stops that long first stage travel. I don't know if Mike did this intentionally but if he did, the man is a genius. If not, I want some of his luck because it sets the trigger at the perfect location to give us a short and very safe 1/8" first stage pull to a very crisp release of the hammer.
Ok, remember the toes?
The biggest challenge for me is getting the trigger return spring in place while positioning the nub on the trigger below the frame. I had to put the spring in and compress it with a flat blade screw driver to drop the trigger into position. Hence the LED head lamp and roller magnet...... twice. :o
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BTW.... the return spring included in the Baker brass trigger is SWEET !! The problem is.. you have to buy the Baker kit to get one.... I happen to have 2... :o
An ink pen spring clipped at the right length would have saved me lots of money.... don't tell the accountant. :-X
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Moving right along....
The next question one might ask is... "Mr. Bill, why all the little colored circles in your picture? Are you having problems with holding your crayons with your toes?"
Well, yes but, no.
The yellow one shows another example of Mike's genius... whether he knows it or not, he made that hole in the trigger snug on the pin. This causes the pin to rotate in the pockets rather than the trigger rotating on the pin. This eliminates slop. Ya feel me? Well, ya won't feel the slop. That's also due to the nub circled in green. That nub rides the rib in the frame.... hint: polish this area of the frame and put some moly on it.
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Digging into my box of 64 colored crayons I found this nice little blue one. I just had to find a way to get this color into the program... I like blue. Matter of fact, I like blue so much that I used it to point out 2 things...
The first one is the lawyer spring.... STOP !!! Why do they call it a lawyer spring? Well, that's because it controls the safety which keeps the lawyers off the manufacturer's butts. In this case it also supplies the tension to set the sear into the hammer when the gun is cocked. Oddly enough, tension is a two way street... the tension pushing the sear into the hammer is equal to the tension required to pull it back out releasing the hammer.
Again... ya feel me? Reducing that tension reduces trigger pull.
And to reduce trigger pull you simply hold the lawyer spring between your index toe and your thumb toe and give it a squeeze.... not too much... just enough to relax the tension a bit.
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Now for part two in blue... I crack me up... ;D
I've read some say they had trouble with this area of the trigger not leaving clearance for the safety bar to function. Yep, I can see that but, only if you didn't install the trigger like I've shown above.
You see, if the trigger is allowed to rotate up into the frame then that upper radius on the back of it will rotate down into the path of the safety bar.
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That concludes my tutorial on the installation of the TKO V4.1 trigger.
Now go outside and play with your BB guns.
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That concludes my tutorial on the installation of the TKO V4.1 trigger.
Now go outside and play with your BB guns.
Fascinating….I give it 5 ⭐️…….
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(https://www.picclickimg.com/d/l400/pict/114104188132_/Oh-No-Mr-Bill-Fox-TV-Show-Advertising.jpg)
I was putting the TKO C362 prototype trigger in my 362 #760 and read along as you posted.
I was working with a factory stock gun, so I thought I would test with original spring, but squeezed the OE spring to compression with a plyers set to the wide opening, it did take a set and helped with installation, along with setting the trigger pin so it was just past the back side of the trigger enough to find and catch the hole that the pin will seat in once into position. Start with the trigger forward the larger squarish notch in the trigger allows it to line up in front of the trigger spring, and then slide back to set the pin and trigger in the hole.
Bill answered my question that came up with the trigger I installed yesterday in # 999, there I trimmed the the tab that is supposed to be on the outside, and if I push it forward I can set the safety, but there was the extra 1st stage travel issue coming of of safe. Though the trigger would function as a short 1st stage when not engaging the safety, and just shooting.
On this one that I followed bills instruction on I found the safety, will engage by pulling the trigger back while pushing the safety on, after a few cycles mine did wear in to work just fine, in only a few cycles.
With OE springs and the trigger spring compression, and the sear spring compression mod that Bill noted, it is a very light predictable trigger, just dry firing I have no issues with the sights moving off target with a predictable point of break.
Thanks for stopping me before I made the same mistake twice Bill 8) ;D
(https://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=195418.0;attach=392661;image)
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Wayne.... you bring a whole nuther approach to the "cheap fun" factor to the game. That being casting your own ammo. I'm digging it but, so far, I have not convinced my accoounting department of the long term cost savings that the initial investment will produce. For some weird reason, she thinks paying bills and putting food on the table is more important.... yeah, I don't get it either.
If I may make a suggestion, buy the moulds from NOE whenever you find them. I have yet to talk to them about the undersized .22 magnums moulds but the .22 hunter pellets are perfect. The .22 wadcutter moulds are still unavailable and I've been checking their site daily for about six months now. There is a thread on the NOE forum so we live with the hope they're going to make them this year. Should you decide to cast your own pellets, it is a arduous task in obtaining the moulds. In order to make the casting idea more cost-effective you need pellet traps to recover and recast used pellets. I'd say my investment so far is about $500 in casting paraphernalia.
I just cast up some of the .22 Magnum Hunters the other day, I've never had them come out undersized ever, they're about the best shooting 22 cal pellets I cast, especially when doing them long 50+ yard shots.
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Wayne.... you bring a whole nuther approach to the "cheap fun" factor to the game. That being casting your own ammo. I'm digging it but, so far, I have not convinced my accoounting department of the long term cost savings that the initial investment will produce. For some weird reason, she thinks paying bills and putting food on the table is more important.... yeah, I don't get it either.
If I may make a suggestion, buy the moulds from NOE whenever you find them. I have yet to talk to them about the undersized .22 magnums moulds but the .22 hunter pellets are perfect. The .22 wadcutter moulds are still unavailable and I've been checking their site daily for about six months now. There is a thread on the NOE forum so we live with the hope they're going to make them this year. Should you decide to cast your own pellets, it is a arduous task in obtaining the moulds. In order to make the casting idea more cost-effective you need pellet traps to recover and recast used pellets. I'd say my investment so far is about $500 in casting paraphernalia.
I just cast up some of the .22 Magnum Hunters the other day, I've never had them come out undersized ever, they're about the best shooting 22 cal pellets I cast, especially when doing them long 50+ yard shots.
Not to step on Bill's toes, but my moulds are from the second run and they are undersized, there is a thread around here where I posted pictures with calipers measurements.
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So, how does one get the trigger to sit back in the trigger frame like that? Well, certainly not by grinding any material off of the V4.1 trigger so put your little Dremels away, we won't be needing them now.
This is where a caveman may struggle... you see, cavemen have 20 toes. 10 of them on their hands... at least this caveman does...
In the area circled in red you can see that the nub on the front of the trigger acts as a stop to prevent the trigger from rotating up into the frame. That stops that long first stage travel. I don't know if Mike did this intentionally but if he did, the man is a genius. If not, I want some of his luck because it sets the trigger at the perfect location to give us a short and very safe 1/8" first stage pull to a very crisp release of the hammer.
Ok, remember the toes?
The biggest challenge for me is getting the trigger return spring in place while positioning the nub on the trigger below the frame. I had to put the spring in and compress it with a flat blade screw driver to drop the trigger into position. Hence the LED head lamp and roller magnet...... twice. :o
AHHHHHHHHHH! Thank you Bill! I now know why he sent me TWO of them! ;D ;)
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Yeah, sorry it took so long to get motivated enough to take the pictures. It was very hard to explain what I did without the pictures.
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BTW.... it's not a one gun fluke. I've installed the trigger this way in both guns and the results are exactly the same.
What a transformation !!!
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I'll get out to the shot and see if this was the same issue I was seeing, if so, I will put the second trigger in and see if I am getting a different outcome. Stand By... ::)
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David... like I said...
If your trigger don't sit back as far and mine in the first picture then it's not right.
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OK, I don't mean to say "it's not right". What I mean is.. it's not installed the same as mine.
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Is anyone having a problem getting the seer to catch the hammer after installing the TKO 4.1 trigger? My seer no longer catches the hammer after installing the TKO trigger on my 362.
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Do you have the safety bar back in the gun?
Did you pull the Lawyer spring in front of the safety bar?
Look at the picture I posted with the colored circles... is every thing set the same?
Did you over bend the Lawyer spring too much?
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Yeah lawyer spring and safety re-installed. Everything seems to match up with the pics.
I'm wondering if the nub that comes down off the trigger and pushes the bar up into the seer is too long, and therefore not allowing the seer to travel upwards far enough to catch the hammer?
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Yeah lawyer spring and safety re-installed. Everything seems to match up with the pics.
I'm wondering if the nub that comes down off the trigger and pushes the bar up into the seer is too long, and therefore not allowing the seer to travel upwards far enough to catch the hammer?
When I hold the stock trigger and the tko trigger next to each other that nub drops atleast an eighth of an inch lower on the tko trigger.
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Does your TKO trigger look just like mine in that area?
Did you take anything else apart on the gun besides the trigger group?
Not being a wiseguy... just trying to help.
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Don;'t get frustrated... if all else fails head on over to the Welcome new comers gate and greet some new members until you get the minimum 20 posts so you can post pictures.
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Will do, thanks for the help. Everything seems to match up with your pictures and the triggers look the same. I only removed the stock and trigger plate this time. Ill keep plugging away. I didn't take anything you suggested negatively, I really appreciate you taking the time to help troubleshoot.
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The top of that Lawyer spring has a 'L' shaped bend in it... it needs to sit under and behind the sear.
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I just bit the bullet and took off a little bit of that nub with a dremmel. All is good now! Thanks
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Good on you, glad it worked out. And thanks for sharing in this thread so others can benefit from it.
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David... like I said...
If your trigger don't sit back as far and mine in the first picture then it's not right.
Yup, lookin good! Seems like someone else had an issue with the "hump" too. 🤔
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I find it very difficult to walk past one of these guns without picking it up and shooting in.
The plan was to move into springer mode but I had a setback when the Diana 48 knocked the snot out of the scope. The replacement scope will be here Monday or Tuesday.
So today it will be C367s and NASCAR in the mancave.
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Update....
Betty Lou wanted to shoot guns on Mother's Day (yesterday). This would be the first official time for her shooting her .177 C362 with 21" barrel.
I've shot both hers and my .177 18" barrel many times. Both have the TKO triggers.
Around 10 shots into the session my gun wouldn't shoot. The trigger was flat... no pull. Then the trigger blade just fell off onto the bench.
I opened the gun and the body of the trigger was also in 2 pieces.
Remembering that Mike sent me 3 triggers, I went to the spares bin and located the 3rd one still in the bag.
I installed it with no issues and we went on to shoot for a few hours at cans and flippers until our arms were wore out from all the 5 pumps shots.
No idea why that trigger busted like that.
BTW... Betty Lou hates her scope and wants a different one. She wants mil dots and not the 'driveway' as she refers to it.. lol
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I received 2 of the test TKO triggers and one was broken in the envelope - TKO said it was a design flaw he was going to fix.
I have not tried the 2nd one - may get to it yet.
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I was shooting the 362 today and the second TKO test trigger broke into the same 3 pieces.
So now I'm back to the stock trigger with a lighter spring.
I think I'll just figure a way to take the travel out and call it good.
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Bill
If you want my 2nd one let me know, I figured after the 1st one broke it was not worth the trouble of using the 2nd till it broke.
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Thanks Robert. Tom actually sent me 3 and the 3rd one is in Betty Lou's gun.
Like I said, I'll figure a way to take the travel out of the original and with the lighter spring, they work acceptably. When Betty Lou's breaks I'll do the same with hers.
These guns were cheap tinker projects for me and the thrill is about gone with them.
We'll get them out now and then and shoot them but they are far from goto guns for us.