Older Benjamin 392 vs Newer

[NewGun]

I am looking to add my first .22 Air rifle and leaning toward a Benjamin 392. But their is mixed views online regarding the new vs old.. Some say the new is just as good others say its junk.. Id like to hear some opinions and to know what the difference is.

Also if I do decide to go with the old, any tips on where to find one and how to identify the old vs the newer? And what to look at when buying and older gun?

Cheers!

[BenjiHunter]

Take a trip to Mac1 Airguns in Gardena and talk to Tim.
It's possible that he has one. An old one.
Address is: 13974 Van Ness Ave, Gardena.

[NewGun]

Take a trip to Mac1 Airguns in Gardena and talk to Tim.
It's possible that he has one. An old one.
Address is: 13974 Van Ness Ave, Gardena.

Thanks yes I been hearing great things about him so I mailed him.  Thank you

[crosman999]

Welcome to the GTA Dan,glad you found it! Tim at Mac1 is the go to guy and not to far from you.

[Methuselah]

I am looking to add my first .22 Air rifle and leaning toward a Benjamin 392. But their is mixed views online regarding the new vs old.. Some say the new is just as good others say its junk.. Id like to hear some opinions and to know what the difference is.

Also if I do decide to go with the old, any tips on where to find one and how to identify the old vs the newer? And what to look at when buying and older gun?

Cheers!

Pretty much everything you read on these guns suggest the basic design is unchanged but a few parts are made from less durable material (iirc the valve?).  What is different is mainly QC.  If you opt new and get a good one you should be no worse off if you are handy and willing to tear it down and go over it (AFTER you are sure you got a good one...).

I suspect "the good old days" of looking for something with all the bugs worked out are just plain gone.  Nobody makes anything you can count on to arrive in perfect condition every time with the possible exception of the Bugatti veyron?  Not even NASA.

I miss the days remanufactured meant something was guaranteed to work!  We all know who the worst offenders are, but nowadays, it seems all manufacturers suffer from the affliction of arranging for their payday first, and providing for the services being paid for second (or dead last in some cases).

Don't be too afraid of buying a new one, just be aware of the realities 

Jeez, maybe I do need to be on Prozac

[Gresh24]

I wouldn't be afraid to buy new (although nothing wrong with buying used either).  With every product out there you have the "they don't make 'em like they used to" crowd.  While that may be true with certain aspects or materials and processes, new products are just fine.  There are many reasons things aren't made like they used to be.  Most are good reasons. 

[Ken T]

I have a Sheridan CB-9,a 392 and a 397.All of current production.I had to send the first 397 back to Crosman because of a BADLY bent barrel.It was replaced by Crosman.The ones I have are accurate and I haven't had any mechanical problems with them.It is a shame they dropped the .20 cal from their line.

[Methuselah]

I wouldn't be afraid to buy new

+1    I believe I said that too

you have the "they don't make 'em like they used to" crowd.  While that may be true with certain aspects or materials and processes

+1    I believe I said that too

There are many reasons things aren't made like they used to be.

Hmm, seems like the last two quotes suggest that you agree they don't make them like they used to.  Guess that makes you part of my "crowd".  OK, while it seems you agree he shouldn't be afraid to buy a new one (then disagree "they don't make them like they used to" with exceptions), you did say elsewhere:

But dealing with a reputable company with good customer service (like Crosman) can resolve that.
...
It's really no different than product offerings in any market.

Maybe you can agree without lumping anyone into some kind of us vs. them category that if customer service is good, the differences between how they used to be made and how they are made now should not necessarily make much difference?  (At least where the Benjamin 392 and 397 are concerned)

After all, the OP shouldn't be made to feel like joining the "they don't make 'em like they used to" crowd is some kind of transgression, especially when he is considering a used one from the get-go 

[bbv13]

  There are many reasons things aren't made like they used to be.  Most are good reasons.

No doubt manufactures would rather sell you three of anything instead of one. I guess that's good for them and why so much stuff is made over seas. I know there are some exceptions like cars and trucks.

When considering self contained pump air rifles older is better. I often defend the new Benjamin 397/392's because they are not that bad. But I also understand that Crosman changed them to make them cheaper and more profitable. If you get your hands on a Racine 392/397 or a early Bloomfield and compare it to a new gun you will quickly understand without even shooting it.

Bryan

[Gresh24]

I wouldn't be afraid to buy new

+1    I believe I said that too

you have the "they don't make 'em like they used to" crowd.  While that may be true with certain aspects or materials and processes

+1    I believe I said that too

There are many reasons things aren't made like they used to be.

Hmm, seems like the last two quotes suggest that you agree they don't make them like they used to.  Guess that makes you part of my "crowd".  OK, while it seems you agree he shouldn't be afraid to buy a new one (then disagree "they don't make them like they used to" with exceptions), you did say elsewhere:

But dealing with a reputable company with good customer service (like Crosman) can resolve that.
...
It's really no different than product offerings in any market.

Maybe you can agree without lumping anyone into some kind of us vs. them category that if customer service is good, the differences between how they used to be made and how they are made now should not necessarily make much difference?  (At least where the Benjamin 392 and 397 are concerned)

After all, the OP shouldn't be made to feel like joining the "they don't make 'em like they used to" crowd is some kind of transgression, especially when he is considering a used one from the get-go 

I'm not sure what's so confusing for you or hard to understand.  I'm not trying to lump anyone into any categories.  I'll attempt to clarify.  Anytime you research buying anything new, many people have the attitude "they don't make 'em like they used to".  Of course there is truth to that.  Manufacturing is different now than it was 30 years ago.  Some materials and processes are different.  Some are better for consumers, some worse. 

Personally, I'm not afraid to buy new or used.  My only point was I don't think the OP should avoid new.

And yes, in the past I've said buying new with a reputable company that stands behind their products takes the majority of the risk out of worries of quality control issues. 

[Airhunter177]

I have a 2014 392 that I use for squirrels, pests, etc. that I really like. I am confident in its accuracy and reliability to get the job done.
 I also have a 1995 model 397 that I wouldn't trade for 2 new model 397's. It AWSOME!
 It's a WIN-WIN either way...

[Gertrude]

on these models of guns, new and old versions are both fine shooters.
Where the difference comes in, is when you choose to have Tim do the full on "Steroid Power Mods".
 IIRC, The pump lever/linkage on the older models are stiffer/stronger, and can better handle the greater pumping pressures with the Steroid upgrades.

 When doing a Steroid job to a newer model, Tim recommendeds to replace the pump handle linkage. this is not necessary with the older "Racine 'Dans".

Here,... I went ahead and got the links for you....

http://mac1airgun.com/steroidbenjaminsstreaks.html

http://www.mac1airgunshop.com/sheridan-rocker-bolt-lug-p/m1bilevki.htm

http://www.mac1airgunshop.com/sheridan-rocker-bolt-lug-p/m1bilev.htm

http://www.mac1airgunshop.com/product-p/mstlevlk.htm

[NewGun]

Thanks for all the input guys much appreciated.  And this might sound like a silly question but Tim at Mac1 suggests only putting work into an accurate rifle which makes perfect sense.  But how long do you spend and what tests do you do to determine its accuracy.  I am a newbie please forgive me.  Is it as simple as getting the rifle and spending a little time hitting targets? 

Cheers!

[bbv13]

He means you should buy and sell, shoot or collect them until you find a really good one that's worthy of being tuned. You will know when you find it.

Bryan

[Methuselah]

Thanks for all the input guys much appreciated.  And this might sound like a silly question but Tim at Mac1 suggests only putting work into an accurate rifle which makes perfect sense.  But how long do you spend and what tests do you do to determine its accuracy.  I am a newbie please forgive me.  Is it as simple as getting the rifle and spending a little time hitting targets? 

Cheers!

I took over a half-century break then picked out a .25 cal., was given a broken Daisy 880 and because I was unable to get the accuracy I wanted, grabbed up a bargain D34 (that probably can't be fixed but that's a different story), This all since around March.  I'm still learning diagnosis, and making mistakes in the way I'm shooting them.  I guess it takes as long as it takes.

My point is, if you wait until you learn it all, you may be waiting a long time...   

[Tater]

Thanks for all the input guys much appreciated.  And this might sound like a silly question but Tim at Mac1 suggests only putting work into an accurate rifle which makes perfect sense.  But how long do you spend and what tests do you do to determine its accuracy.  I am a newbie please forgive me.  Is it as simple as getting the rifle and spending a little time hitting targets? 

Cheers!

Definitely, to "break it in", most shoot anywhere from 100-500+ pellets through until it "settles down". Each airgun is different, but if after a few hundred rounds through it and accuracy is horrible you might be concerned that there's issues. Eliminate as many variables from the testing as possible and use a bench or stable shooting table each time and use the same hold. Shoot further, or at least at the distances you plan to shoot normally.
Someone will correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe the newer 392's have an issue with paint at the end of the barrel that needs to be cleaned out.
That's just one example.

[GumpIsrael]

Thanks for all the input guys much appreciated.  And this might sound like a silly question but Tim at Mac1 suggests only putting work into an accurate rifle which makes perfect sense.  But how long do you spend and what tests do you do to determine its accuracy.  I am a newbie please forgive me.  Is it as simple as getting the rifle and spending a little time hitting targets? 

Cheers!

Definitely, to "break it in", most shoot anywhere from 100-500+ pellets through until it "settles down". Each airgun is different, but if after a few hundred rounds through it and accuracy is horrible you might be concerned that there's issues. Eliminate as many variables from the testing as possible and use a bench or stable shooting table each time and use the same hold. Shoot further, or at least at the distances you plan to shoot normally.
Someone will correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe the newer 392's have an issue with paint at the end of the barrel that needs to be cleaned out.
That's just one example.

You're most certainly right, Tater, there is always paint about 2" into the barrel on the newer models, some nail polish remover on a q-tip will solve this. 3 out of 4 of my 392's (I did the buy and return thing until o got a straight shooter) also had paint in the breech as well. That problem can only be solved with extreme care and a q-tip or disassembly. Another noteworthy thing to beware of (and I know not everyone had the same experience as me) is that crosman virtually does not plug the gun at all when they paint it. I had paint in the area where the cup slides toward the valve, behind the valve, in the hammer area, in the entirety of the bolt area, as well as deep inside the breech area. When I disassembled the gun I used tons of acetone and nail polish remover and cotton balls   (as well as pulling rags back and forth through the compression tube). When I pulled out the valve (it had been dieseling in btw) everything was covered in crud. The valve spring, exhaust valve, check valve...everything.

The moral of this story is that even if you get a good one, you will have to go through a labor of love to make it last without any major hiccups. Personally I don't mind taking the whole thing apart cuz to me it's worth it.

P.S.- if right out of the box the gun shoots 3' to the right at 10yrds, take it back. The breech and the barrel are not soldered correctly and this will not change with time.

[454ho]

I have an older 'transitional' 392, I believe made in 1994 in Bloomfield, NY. Has walnut stock, metal trigger guard and push-pull safety at the tang.

My older brother has a newer model, don't know the exact year, but it has the mystery hardwood stock, modular trigger with cross-bolt safety and cartridge valve.

My gun will shoot a CHP pellet clean through a 1x6 cedar picket at 5 pumps. Also dumps all the air with 8 pumps. At 5 pumps my brothers gun just embeds the same CHP pellet halfway into a cedar picket, and at 8 pumps it has enough air left over to shoot a second pellet.

Yes, there is a difference. 

I've been wanting a 397 to go with my 392 for quite a while. Decided against getting a new one. Just bought what looks like a twin to my 392 on GB for $100 plus shipping. These older ones don't come up very often, so I jumped on it even though the price is a bit high. I feel it will be worth it.

[NewGun]

I have an older 'transitional' 392, I believe made in 1994 in Bloomfield, NY. Has walnut stock, metal trigger guard and push-pull safety at the tang.

My older brother has a newer model, don't know the exact year, but it has the mystery hardwood stock, modular trigger with cross-bolt safety and cartridge valve.

My gun will shoot a CHP pellet clean through a 1x6 cedar picket at 5 pumps. Also dumps all the air with 8 pumps. At 5 pumps my brothers gun just embeds the same CHP pellet halfway into a cedar picket, and at 8 pumps it has enough air left over to shoot a second pellet.

Yes, there is a difference. 

I've been wanting a 397 to go with my 392 for quite a while. Decided against getting a new one. Just bought what looks like a twin to my 392 on GB for $100 plus shipping. These older ones don't come up very often, so I jumped on it even though the price is a bit high. I feel it will be worth it.

Sweet nice find!  What site is GB btw?

Cheers!

[454ho]

What site is GB btw?

http://www.gunbroker.com/ - be careful, the place is addicting. 

My purchase just arrived today. Will try to get some pictures posted this weekend.