HW98 w/Vortek PG2 - First 200 Shots

[Nitrocrushr]

Well I put 200 shots through the HW98 today The first 100 shots were documented on the top section of attached target picture.  During the 100 shot break-in I used JSB Exact 8.44 grain and shot 20 shots at each spot.  I then cleaned the barrel and shot another 100 shots through the chronograph, testing four different pellets, 20 shot strings for each test.  Each string of 20 shots was shot at a different spot with pellet type and group #'s listed accordingly.  Everything can be seen on the attached target, all spots being numbered in order from the very first break-in group, to the final chronograph test group (1 through 11).

All groups pictured below were shot on my 13-yard indoor range.  Test outline as follows;

Spots 1 through 5 (the initial break-in, no chronograph)
JSB Exact 8.44 grain
20 shots each spot

Group #1 was a large group
Group #2 through #5 were smaller, but still rather large

Spot #6
Continued with the JSB 8.44 Exact, but began using the chronograph
The group started to become more even, but still fairly large
Average 908.5 fps
SD 4

Spot #7
H&N FTT 8.64 grain (4.52)
This group started tightening up nicely, about half the size of the JSB 8.44
Average 890.8 fps
SD 4.9

Spot #8
Air Arms Diabolo Field 8.44 grain (4.52)
Now the rifle started printing a group!  The HW98 printed a 20-shot group in a single hole not much larger than the .177 pellet
Average 887.0 fps
SD 2.5

Spot #9
JSB Exact 7.87 grain
Although the chronograph indicated this was the most consistent pellet in this rifle, the group did not show it.  Group size was very similar to the JSB 8.44's.
Average 938.6 fps
SD 1.7

Spots #10 & #11 - This was a duplicate test of the JSB Exact 8.44's.  I wanted to see if anything had changed now that I had 180 shots through the rifle.  I also split this test into two halves.....10 shots with the brand new tin I had been shooting earlier, and the next 10 from a partial tin of the same pellet (JSB Exact 8.44) that I had been using for my TX200.  I wanted to see how much variation there was between tins since these have been shooting quite well in my TX200.  Results of this test were fairly substantial as you can see below.
First 10 shots the group size was on par with the previous JSB 8.44 groups, but the next 10 shots using the other tin of the exact same pellet showed a dramatic positive change in group size.  Velocity also dropped below 900 fps on this tin.  Group size on this second half was on par with the Air Arms Diabolo's.  I would bet that I could have continued in this hole for another 10 shots.

First 10 shots (Spot #10)
Average 907.1 fps
Scattered group

Second 10 shots using an older partial tin of JSB Exact 8.44 I had for the TX200 (Spot #11)
Average 892 fps
Very tight group, not much larger than the .177 pellet

Summary;

I LOVE the feel of this rifle The barrel breaks sooooo smoothly and with minimal effort!!!!!  It also has the most awesome, solid lock-up.  I agree with Joe P on this, it sounds like a bank vault closing

The adjustability of the stock is a very nice feature.  The Rekord trigger is also sweet

I also like the Hawk Sidewinder scope, very clear!!  Coupled with the BKL double straps it is a winning combination   I haven't made a single adjustment on this scope since I mounted it last night.  It is shooting low at the 13 yards I was shooting today, so I was always aiming at the spot above where I was actually hitting.  This always gave me a clear aiming point.  I will fine tune when I get it outside later this week.

So far it seems like this rifle is going to shoot best at just under 900 fps and pellets 8.44 to 8.64 grains.  The lighter and faster 7.87's just seemed a little unstable out of this rifle...not sure why this is?

I did notice that the consistency in ES, SD, etc was improving quite a bit after the first 150 shots.

It will be interesting to see what pellet groups best when I get it outdoors this week.  Todays testing would indicate that the Air Arms 8.44 (4.52) might be it's preferred food.  We shall see

Here is a picture of all groups shot today, starting out with the first 100 shots of break-in.  Also attached is a close u of the 20-shot group with the Air Arms 8.44's.  I will try to get the data posted for those interested in that level of detail.

That's all for now

Steve

[Krazynova]

That's a lot of good info Steve!  I've just been shooting mine to break it in with CPLs and barracuda match and some other pellet that the name escapes me. I absolutely love my 98!  Thanks again for all the information. I have some pellet testing in my future! So far it pretty much likes all the pellets I've put thru it.

[Brazos]

Don't overlook CPL's.  You will probably find they shoot as good as your best pellet and a lot cheaper.  I find my HW's like CPLs and H&Ns over JSB. 

[Pappy]

Steve, did you already have this rifle, then send it off to the spa?
Thanks, for the post, good info.
I think speed kills, at least with springers.  IMHO mid 800's and 13FPE, around there, is the most accurate.
Since my TX Tune, Express 7.87's averaged 901 with an SD of 5 ..... but too fast, not near the groupings of the H&N & AA 4.52's

Some nice days coming up this week, and I will be hitting the range hard.  Finally get to stretch out to 50 yards.  Can't wait.

Great report, thanks.

Allan

[Nitrocrushr]

That's a lot of good info Steve!  I've just been shooting mine to break it in with CPLs and barracuda match and some other pellet that the name escapes me. I absolutely love my 98!  Thanks again for all the information. I have some pellet testing in my future! So far it pretty much likes all the pellets I've put thru it.

You're welcome Casey   I enjoy putting this stuff together, helps me wind down after my workweek   I know mine doesn't seem to like any of the JSB's, but the AA and H&N show some promise for sure, both are on par with my TX200 accuracy.

Don't overlook CPL's.  You will probably find they shoot as good as your best pellet and a lot cheaper.  I find my HW's like CPLs and H&Ns over JSB. 

Thanks for tip Brazos!  I will try some of the CPL's.  This rifle is shooting right with my TX200 at this point (with the exception of the JSB's), and like I said, the numbers were indicating it was gaining more and more consistency the longer I shot it   I am really liking the HW98

Steve

[Nitrocrushr]

Steve, did you already have this rifle, then send it off to the spa?
Thanks, for the post, good info.
I think speed kills, at least with springers.  IMHO mid 800's and 13FPE, around there, is the most accurate.
Since my TX Tune, Express 7.87's averaged 901 with an SD of 5 ..... but too fast, not near the groupings of the H&N & AA 4.52's

Some nice days coming up this week, and I will be hitting the range hard.  Finally get to stretch out to 50 yards.  Can't wait.

Great report, thanks.

Allan

Hi Allan!  Yep, I sent this one off to Scott as soon as it arrived.  I didn't want to go through the dieseling/issues like I had with the TX so I opted to get 'er done right away

I saw the exact same thing as you in my testing today.  You will see that my back-up tin of JSB 8.44's began to group tightly.  Although the pellets were the exact same type (JSB Exact 8.44), the fps in this tin dropped below 900 fps and began grouping nicely!  Makes me wonder what the weight variance is between tins on this pellet??? My TX is the same way.  In my TX the 7.87's are the most consistent through the chronograph, but not on target.  Every pellet that groups tightly in my TX200 is also sub 900 fps.  Just my observations, I am sure there are springers where this is not the case...but both of mine prefer sub 900 fps.

Steve

[Nitrocrushr]

Ok, lets try posting the data for this testing again.  Here is a PDF copy....hopefully it will attach this time.  All 4 tests are recorded, you might have to scroll down to see the 4th test.

Steve

[grauhanen]

While the Air Arms pellets are manufactured by JSB and are very similar in size and appearance, they are not the same.  They often shoot very differently from the JSB pellets in the same gun.  See, for example, http://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=78237.0

[Sfttailrdr46]

  Alright Steve now you're just bragging and I might also add really nice shooting . Are you looking to challenge Sharky for his throne?

[Nitrocrushr]

Alright Steve now you're just bragging and I might also add really nice shooting . Are you looking to challenge Sharky for his throne?

Why thank you Don   I can't hold a candle to Sharky though, he is a shooting machine

Steve

[rdeady]

That is some pretty darn good shooting man!

[Nitrocrushr]

While the Air Arms pellets are manufactured by JSB and are very similar in size and appearance, they are not the same.  They often shoot very differently from the JSB pellets in the same gun.  See, for example, http://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=78237.0

Very interesting info!!  This prompted me to go down in my shop and check the differences between the Air Arms Diabolo 8.44 (4.52) and the JSB Exact 8.44's that I was shooting during this testing.  I tried to get some close up detail in the attached pictures.  There is no doubt that the Air Arms Diabolo's are more nose heavy with a deeper skirt, weight forward.  I would guess this is giving more stability in my rifle.  Whatever it was they were extremely stable during my break-in testing yesterday and will be the pellet I take outside later this week.

[Nitrocrushr]

That is some pretty darn good shooting man!

Thanks Russell   Aside from the 8 spots shot with the JSB 8.44's and 7.87's, the others weren't bad.  In fact the older tin of JSB 8.44s printed every bit as tight as the Air Arms, granted it was only 10 shots into that hole as opposed to the 20 shots for the Air Arms, but they were still consistent, leading me to believe it was the lower fps as much as anything.  As you can see in the details, that 2nd tin of JSB 8.44's dropped over 15 fps, placing me below 900 fps, which seems to be the trick with this rifle.

[Nitrocrushr]

You know I'm still curious why there are identical model rifles that will shoot lighter/faster pellets accurately, while another rifle (same model) will prefer slightly heavier/sub 900 fps pellets.  I know in one of my PB's, a faster 1:7 twist will shoot better with heavier ammo, versus a slower 1:9 twist, which prefers lighter ammo.  Considering that the twist rates in HW98's would be the same, perhaps in some barrels the rifling is getting a better grip and/or spin on the pellets, thus being less accurate with the lighter pellets?  If this is true, then more pellets down the pipe might smooth and or polish the rifling a bit, getting less of a grip and increasing accuracy with lighter pellets?  I did notice that even the first tin of JSB 8.44's was shooting tighter and more consistently the more pellets I put through the barrel.  There is a chance that after another 200 shots, this rifle may shoot the +900 fps pellets just as accurately, time will tell.

[Pappy]

Steve, lots of interesting points here.  Something I noticed is that each pellet, using it's average FPS, came out to 15 FPE.  If I did it right.  Seems like she is running a little hot?  I think it will settle down a bit, maybe 13.5 to 14 FPE, after you run a couple thousand  pellets through her.  Good stuff .... hoping to get out this week to shoot, weather nicer, hope the wind keeps calm.


Allan

[Motorhead]

Steve,
Was waiting on a PM from you on how rifle was shooting ? ... guess this post anwsers my concerns 
Looks like your finding out what it likes / dislikes for food with the extensive tests so far.
Darn fine shooting I must say !!!

Scott

[T-Higgs]

Very interesting info!!  This prompted me to go down in my shop and check the differences between the Air Arms Diabolo 8.44 (4.52) and the JSB Exact 8.44's that I was shooting during this testing.  I tried to get some close up detail in the attached pictures.  There is no doubt that the Air Arms Diabolo's are more nose heavy with a deeper skirt, weight forward.  I would guess this is giving more stability in my rifle.  Whatever it was they were extremely stable during my break-in testing yesterday and will be the pellet I take outside later this week.


[/quote]

Interesting.  Long distance bench rest shooters usually strive to keep the projectile mass centered or rearward.   They will use hollow points to get the weight out of the bullet nose.  I could very possibly be the way the lands/grooves are touching the AA pellet.

[Nitrocrushr]

Steve,
Was waiting on a PM from you on how rifle was shooting ? ... guess this post anwsers my concerns 
Looks like your finding out what it likes / dislikes for food with the extensive tests so far.
Darn fine shooting I must say !!!

Scott

Sorry Scott, forgot to drop you a pm.  Yes, I am very pleased with the HW98!!!  Thank you for yet another awesome tune  

It definitely doesn't like the JSB's, which were pushing above 900 fps (at this point).  But as I mentioned,  it was getting more and more consistent even with those. Those groups were gradually trending smaller the more I shot.  I have confidence that this rifle is gonna drill holes even with the faster pellets after another tin or so, maybe not even that long.  Now the sub 900 fps pellets.....WOW...one tiny hole for 20 shots   It is going to be a performer no doubt about it

Steve

[palonej]

Hey Steve!!!!
I would get some more lead thru her before deciding on the best pellet.
I found this changed during and after break in. Mine loved the JSB 7.87 during break in, but not so much now.
Mine, after ~ 5,000 post tune, is lights out with a few pellets.
CPLs are great. I'll shoot them when wind is down. They avg 921 and shoot real straight!!
She'll shoot AA 8.4 just about as accurate, but much slower. Avg 863.....think it's the looser fit...maybe??
If the wind is up I'll shoot AA 10.3. She loves them at an avg of 829. Extremely accurate in this gun and the fit is perfect....just a touch snug.
Give her some more reps.....she'll smooth out even more and the SD & ES numbers will tighten up even more!!!
How do you like the firing cycle??
And you're right.....that scope rocks!!

Now wipe that silly grin off your face darn it!!!
Enjoy brother!!

[Nitrocrushr]

Hey Steve!!!!
I would get some more lead thru her before deciding on the best pellet.
I found this changed during and after break in. Mine loved the JSB 7.87 during break in, but not so much now.
Mine, after ~ 5,000 post tune, is lights out with a few pellets.
CPLs are great. I'll shoot them when wind is down. They avg 921 and shoot real straight!!
She'll shoot AA 8.4 just about as accurate, but much slower. Avg 863.....think it's the looser fit...maybe??
If the wind is up I'll shoot AA 10.3. She loves them at an avg of 829. Extremely accurate in this gun and the fit is perfect....just a touch snug.
Give her some more reps.....she'll smooth out even more and the SD & ES numbers will tighten up even more!!!
How do you like the firing cycle??
And you're right.....that scope rocks!!

Now wipe that silly grin off your face darn it!!!
Enjoy brother!!

You're right, I had a big grin on my face Sunday night...still there when I think about this new rifle   I love the shot cycle!!  It feels stronger than the TX on the shot.  The break barrel action is incredibly smooth, making almost no noise at all and the lock-up...WOW, you called it right by comparing it to a bank vault.  EXTREMELY positive lockup on the HW98.  I love it.  And that bull barrel..sweet..

Thanks for the advice on more lead through it.  Everything I saw would indicate this thing I gonna get even better over the next couple hundred to 1000 shots.  I really had 3 pellets showing tiny single hole capability.  The AA's were a slam dunk, as was my older tin of JSB 8.44's, and the H&N FTT 8.64's would have been right with them in a singe hole but I had a dropped shot...DOH.  So for a brand new rifle with a fresh tune I couldn't be happier   Thanks for pointing me in the direction of the HW98

Steve