HW95 Update (tune)

[bReTt]

Ok guys, I have had four different set ups in the 95 since it's arrival on Friday! 

First was stock, TWAaaaang.  Cheap BB gun sound but good #'s.  Pretty jumpy comparatively but not harsh or bad.  Needed attention.

Second was a JM spring and guide taken from the R9.  No more twang and a solid thunk.  Gained 15 fps to bring it to 900 average and a Sd of 3.  Impressive but the idea was to bring it down to 12fpe which is right around 800 fps with 8 gr (approx) pellets.

Third was shimming the stock guide with shrink tubing and cut 2.5 coils off of the factory spring.  Easier cocking, very smooth and quick cycle with a speed average of 865 fps and Sd of 5.  Nice, very nice.  I could have stopped there but what if I cut some more off of the spring?

Fourth is where I am at now.  I cut one more coil off of the factory spring (same shimmed guide) for a total of 3.5 coils form original form.  Even easier cocking and less recoil yet.  8.4 JSB (which are about 10 fps av faster than the Superdomes that I have the previous #s from) shooting 850 fps average and a SD of 3.  Super smooth, super gentle, very easy to handle. 

Not sure if I want to cut another coil off to see where it goes or just leave it.  This shoots sweeter than my HW30S with Vortek kit shooting 625 fps average.  Hmmm.  Just wish that I had an extra spring in case I go to far and lose what I have already achieved with this. 

Anyway, this is my new favorite!  I just wish that it had a prettier stock but funtion over form at this point!

Thanks for reading and any thoughts, comments, suggestions...  good, bad or ugly always welcome.

Take care airgunnig brothers!

[JimL911]

I put my stock 50S spring in mine. 11.75 fpe with JSB express. Spring has same specs as the 95 with 4 less coils so you are in the right ball park.

[anuthabubba]

Thanks for reading and any thoughts, comments, suggestions...  good, bad or ugly always welcome.

Did you heat/soften and flatten that last coil against its neighbor and grind the end flat after cutting it off?  This will reduce its length a smidge and therefore the 'spacing'.

[bReTt]

Thanks for reading and any thoughts, comments, suggestions...  good, bad or ugly always welcome.

Did you heat/soften and flatten that last coil against its neighbor and grind the end flat after cutting it off?  This will reduce its length a smidge and therefore the 'spacing'.

Yep!  Did all that and polished it to a mirror shine!  Both ends in fact.

[TWBryan]

Sounds good. Did you have to do a lot of deburring,and did you replace the piston seal?

[bReTt]

Sounds good. Did you have to do a lot of deburring,and did you replace the piston seal?

I didn't have to do any debuurring which was surprising.  Every HW I have has needed it, especially the cocking slot.  This one has the new cocking shoe so I think the factory is paying closer attention to cleaning that area up because of the way it rides in the slot.  Just my opinion/observation on that.  Maybe I was just fortunate that mine was that way.  This is the only newer made HW that I have had since the changes.

I kept the original piston seal.  I just touch up the sealing edges with 1500 grit sand paper to clean them up.  There was metal shavings in the compression tube in front of the seal and embedded into the face of the seal.  Very small but there.  I think they forgot to clean it out after the deburr!  ha ha ha.  They tried I guess   

It's hard to see in the picture but this is what it looked like when I took it out the first time.  There was also sawdust or leather knap? all over the spring and guide and inside the receiver tube.  Crazy! 

Here is a picture of my lab assistant helping me get this rifle up to snuff!

[TWBryan]

Well,at least you have an assistant,most people insist I need a keeper.

Nasty looking gunk on the spring there.

Do you think the Lexus stock feels better,balances better than the standard stock?

[grauhanen]

A rifle shooting 850 fps with JSB Exacts (13.5 fpe) with an SD of 3, that's easy cocking and has little recoil is very good.  I'd keep it like that, but some folks must keep tinkering.

[bReTt]

I had a bit of time this afternoon so I decided to do some formal pellet testing with the HW95 .177. 

I mounted a Hawke Airmax 4-12x40 on it and removed the iron sights.  I got my targets drawn, pellet trap set up and the bench and I grabbed the four most likely suspects (pellets) to put in the line up.  The pellets I chose were Crosman Premier Ultra-Magnum 10.5 (I didn't have CPL or CPHP on hand), H&N FTT 8.64, RWS Superdomes 8.3, and JSB Exacts 8.44.

I started with the Crosmans, went to the Superdomes next, the FTT were after that and last was the JSBs.  I was rested on a bench on bags front and back.  Nothing between the bags and the rifle, just right on the bags.  I sighted the scope in and had a few warm up shots then started with a fresh target and the first pellet.  I had the scope magnification on 8x and had the parallax dialed out with the AO for all of the pellets.  I was shooting at a distance of 20 yards.

All pellets did acceptable at that distance with only one keeping the 10 shot group together except for one pellet.  I was actually surprised that it was the Crosman Ultras that kept it the tightest.  Next best were the Superdomes with the FTTs coming up third and the JSBs coming in fourth.  All of them were kept under a dime except for the JSBs.   The Crosman Ultras were quite a bit heavier than the others in the test so they impacted low on the target from the POA.  I would like to pick up some of the lighter Crosman Premiers to see how they will do.

Next testing will be done at 30 or 35 yds and I will be sure to clean the barrel and get a few shots down it before I officially start to test the same 4 pellets.  I didn't clean the barrel when it arrived so that may have played a factor in all of this but still, all performed well enough for me. 

Thanks for reading!  Comments always welcome.

[TWBryan]

At 20 yds it doesn't seem to dislike any of the pellets,though I think the jsb's might have a slight edge. Shooting at further distances should thin out the herd a bit. At 20 yds 8x seems a lot, I shoot 4x at 15 yds and 8X at 30 yds. Beyond that I don't know,my yard isn't that big.

[ptpalpha]

It's coming along nicely, Brett.
Couple observations: give the JSB 7.87's a try when you get a chance...you never know, and they might just be the magic pellets.
Did you button the piston or do the plastic sleeve trick?  Just curious.
And as to the stock...you know what to do about that!  I've seen your work, and it's stunning.  Make a new stock for her!

[nced]

It's coming along nicely, Brett.
Couple observations: give the JSB 7.87's a try when you get a chance...you never know, and they might just be the magic pellets.
Did you button the piston or do the plastic sleeve trick?  Just curious.
And as to the stock...you know what to do about that!  I've seen your work, and it's stunning.  Make a new stock for her!

For decades I used the 7.9 grain CPLs when shooting my HW springers and found that no pellet exceeded the accuracy in my HW77k or R9s. Then it happened.....the last two cases of CPLs I received were nicely formed and consistent, but they also had excess parting compound on them that turned my loading fingers black. I've lubed my CPs since I learned that they tend to foul a R9 bore quickly when shot dry which was always a rather quick and painless process.........UNTILL I received the cases with too much parting compound! Now the pellet lubing created a kind of thin black "gunge" which fouled the bore so before the lubing a wash & dry cycle was added. This was a hassle for a guy like me who prefers not messing with pellets anymore than necessary and usually shot unsorted pellets from the pouch.

Well.....just for grins I ordered a couple tins of 4.52mm 8.4 grain JSB Exacts for my R9 and found that they shot equally well as the CPLs WITHOUT washing them! Then I found that they also shot well without even going through the "lubing process" and I've been using the Exacts since! Funny thing is that my current R9 is the only HW springer I've owned that shot the Exacts as accurately as a good fitting CPL!

Concerning buttoning R9 pistons........years ago my HW springers had a lot of slop between the piston skirt and the receiver ID so they were buttoned. I do have to say that my newest R9 with the new design piston seal, cocking shoe, and bolt on detent bracket (now a few years old) had a really nice close fit to the receiver and I didn't even mess with the buttoning process with this one! All I did was to polish the OD of the piston skirt a bit to smooth it up!....
Uploaded at Snapagogo.com
Uploaded at Snapagogo.com
LOL....even the centering of the latch rod was within .005 total runout and I've had older R9 pistons where the piston latch rod "orbited" about .060 total runout before I straightened them!

I especially like the new style cocking shoe that rides the sides of the receiver tube rather than riding on a thin piston liner like the old HW95/R9s used!
Here is a pic of old design "cocking shoe riding on piston liner" damage..........
Uploaded at Snapagogo.com
I don't know how the owner of the gun did this, but years ago I used to roll replacement piston liners for $10! 

Personally,  if the newer HW95/R9s are all assembled as well as the one I currently own, I give HW a rousing WELL DONE!

[bReTt]

It's coming along nicely, Brett.
Couple observations: give the JSB 7.87's a try when you get a chance...you never know, and they might just be the magic pellets.
Did you button the piston or do the plastic sleeve trick?  Just curious.
And as to the stock...you know what to do about that!  I've seen your work, and it's stunning.  Make a new stock for her!

Thanks Paul!  I will try some of those 7.87 JSBs.  I have spent a lot of money lately and would have a tough time getting them right now.  I will try some though.  I am running out of .22 JSBs for the R9 so I can put a pellet order together when the $$$ are there.

I also ordered a couple black walnut blanks for stocks.  Those should be here in a week or so.  Not sure what I want to do with them yet.  I saw a stock on the Yellow that I liked the lines of and I requested some more pictures of it if he has them and would he send me some.  I hope so.  I want to copy it.  I don't want to deviate too far from the factory stock, it feel really nice in my hands.  I basically just want to extend the fore end to cover the breech block for a more finished look.  No checkering on the fore end either like the one in this picture.

I did not button the piston and I didn't do the plastic sleeve.  Not sure if I will do either of them or not.  Maybe be later but I should have at least polished the rear flange of the piston.  I am finding that I don't need to button every piston.  Ed said it well up above.  I have been finding that out myself.  I took buttons off of the HW30S piston when I put a Vortek kit in it. 

[bReTt]

It's coming along nicely, Brett.
Couple observations: give the JSB 7.87's a try when you get a chance...you never know, and they might just be the magic pellets.
Did you button the piston or do the plastic sleeve trick?  Just curious.
And as to the stock...you know what to do about that!  I've seen your work, and it's stunning.  Make a new stock for her!

For decades I used the 7.9 grain CPLs when shooting my HW springers and found that no pellet exceeded the accuracy in my HW77k or R9s. Then it happened.....the last two cases of CPLs I received were nicely formed and consistent, but they also had excess parting compound on them that turned my loading fingers black. I've lubed my CPs since I learned that they tend to foul a R9 bore quickly when shot dry which was always a rather quick and painless process.........UNTILL I received the cases with too much parting compound! Now the pellet lubing created a kind of thin black "gunge" which fouled the bore so before the lubing a wash & dry cycle was added. This was a hassle for a guy like me who prefers not messing with pellets anymore than necessary and usually shot unsorted pellets from the pouch.

Well.....just for grins I ordered a couple tins of 4.52mm 8.4 grain JSB Exacts for my R9 and found that they shot equally well as the CPLs WITHOUT washing them! Then I found that they also shot well without even going through the "lubing process" and I've been using the Exacts since! Funny thing is that my current R9 is the only HW springer I've owned that shot the Exacts as accurately as a good fitting CPL!

Concerning buttoning R9 pistons........years ago my HW springers had a lot of slop between the piston skirt and the receiver ID so they were buttoned. I do have to say that my newest R9 with the new design piston seal, cocking shoe, and bolt on detent bracket (now a few years old) had a really nice close fit to the receiver and I didn't even mess with the buttoning process with this one! All I did was to polish the OD of the piston skirt a bit to smooth it up!....
Uploaded at Snapagogo.com
Uploaded at Snapagogo.com
LOL....even the centering of the latch rod was within .005 total runout and I've had older R9 pistons where the piston latch rod "orbited" about .060 total runout before I straightened them!

I especially like the new style cocking shoe that rides the sides of the receiver tube rather than riding on a thin piston liner like the old HW95/R9s used!
Here is a pic of old design "cocking shoe riding on piston liner" damage..........
Uploaded at Snapagogo.com
I don't know how the owner of the gun did this, but years ago I used to roll replacement piston liners for $10! 

Personally,  if the newer HW95/R9s are all assembled as well as the one I currently own, I give HW a rousing WELL DONE!

Thank you Ed!  I appreciate the detail in which you respond.  It's always a good education! 

I also agree with you about the new style cocking shoe, that is a nice improvement.

I also read about bagging the springers.  I know that, I was being somewhat lazy at the time and experimenting too.  I should do another 20yd test with the rifle resting on my hand and see how, if any, that changes the results.  My shooting has been changing quite a bit lately meaning that I have been shooting less and less from a bench and more off hand, standing kneeling, sitting.... things like that and using something like a branch or a trunk of a tree to steady off of.  I have been bored with the standard sit at a bench and try to make a small hole in paper.  I have been shooting more reactive targets (steel, resettable) and I have also taken the scopes off of my rifles except for the R9 (no sights or way to mount any) and shooting them like that.  I has taken the expectation out of shooting and added more fun to it for me. 

The 4.52 8.44 gr JSBs are what I was testing with.  What was funny when I was testing this group of pellets, the FTT started out really well and I got very excited about them.  I took the first shot and saw the hole.  I took the second shot and I didn't see the hole.  It went through the first hole exactly!  I was thinking WOW to myself and was sooooo hoping that the rest of the group would stay close to that but it didn't!  ha ha ha!  Oh well. 

Thanks again for the insight brother!  Did you ever use that safety button I sent a couple years back???

[nced]

Did you ever use that safety button I sent a couple years back???
Yep......the button was for my brother's R9 and it worked well. The safety buttons for the large and small diameter HW receivers are different lengths and all I had at the time was a button from my HW77.

Thanks again!

[bReTt]

I had a chance this morning to set up and shoot at 30 yds to test the same group of pellets with one more choice added (Winchester Round Nose 9.8 gr).

I did a little warm up shooting with about 15 shots and I also adjusted the scope a bit to keep it centered (refining the zero).  I then started shooting 10 shot groups of each pellet on 12x magnification on the scope.  I stuck with the same shooting as I did with the 20 yds groups, on the bags, front and rear rested, no hand under the fore end, one on the trigger and my shoulder placed on the butt end. 

I will let the pictures do the explaining but the pictures are shown in the order that I shot the different brands.  Remember, I am an average shot here.

[Tomcat]

I think you have very nice groups there, Brett.  I would be pleased with any of them other than possibly the Winchesters.  I hope I can do as well when I get outside.  The weather here is still not the best.  Gray, rainy and in the 40-50's.

[grauhanen]

When you get down to your final two-three contenders for most accurate pellet, shoot a few hundred of each in the final "shoot off" to determine the winner.

[nced]

You wrote........"I also ordered a couple black walnut blanks for stocks.  Those should be here in a week or so.  Not sure what I want to do with them yet."

LOL....about 10 years ago when living in West Virginia a friend in Virginia had a LARGE hollow black walnut tree fall across his driveway and I saked if I could have the remains of the stump since he had already sawed off the rest and carted it away!

Well....a Saturday was spent cutting up the stump and sharpening the chainsaw chain till the cutters were mere nubs (there be stones in them there stumps) I ended up with a few pretty good but short slabs. LOL....I mentioned to my friend that I wished he had left another 6" on the stump but I do think what I have is adequate for my own special walnut R9 stock whenever I have the courage to actually start shaping the slabs.

When I got the slabs home the first thing I did was to paint several heavy coats of latex paint on the end grain and put them away to dry. That was about 8 years ago and the slabs have been air drying upstairs in my garage ever since. Here are a few pics.......
Uploaded at Snapagogo.com
Uploaded at Snapagogo.com
Uploaded at Snapagogo.com
As seen in the second pic the slabs are sufficient to cut the old style R9 stocks without the extended forearm (why I wished the stump was 6" longer).
I also have the stock from my R10 that was parted out decades ago to use as a pattern, however I'm not sure that I have blanks long enough without extending the forearm with a contrasting hard wood. While contrasting wood for the forearm does look good, I'm really not too keen on it because the wood on each side of the cocking lever slot isn't very wide. Humm.....I guess that the stock doesn't need to be only 1 3/4" wide at the forearm!  The slabs are thick enough to make a sort of "beavertail forearm" if needed since the slabs are 2 1/4" and 2 1/2" thick after surfacing.

Perhaps this particular slab could be used for a complete "extended forearm stock" judging by the old R10 stock on top........
Uploaded at Snapagogo.com
The foreshortening of the camera lens makes it look like the R10 stock is longer but it's actually flush "butt to forearm tip". It seems that the sealing did a good job since I see no checking after about 8 years but I don't know for sure till it's been band sawed!

My intent for the overall stock shape was to simply copy the factory stock profile by laying the stock on a piece of underlayment and then transfer points from the stock edge to the underlayment with my machinist square. After the "profile dots" are made the intent is to "connect the dots" and saw/sand the template for tracing onto the slabs to be cut to shape on the band saw. I do have a LOT of nervousness about properly locating the stock mounting holes. I assume that they will need to be done while the bandsawed blank is still "in the square", but it would also seem that the transfered points would need to be made from two straight perpendicular edges before shaping is started.

Any insight on the best procedure to use for duplicating a stock without a duplicator would be greatly appreciated? LOL....at least the stock mounting screw holes for my R9 aren't angled through the stock like some stocks!   

[Tomcat]

You have some great looking blanks there, Ed.  I have never tried making a rifle stock.  I have whittled out some pistol grips for the crosman, but that is about it.  Hope to see what you come up with.