Author Topic: Dead B3 (Read 5470 times))

gashinshotan · « **on:** July 31, 2014, 01:24:48 PM »

So I added some motor oil and put the gun muzzle up for about 6 hours... So I shot it this morning and it seemed to have more oomph - one shot had smoke but nothing crazy. And then I noticed the power drop of dramatically until.... It won't even generate enough power to push the pellet pass the breach.... When I pull the cocking lever down I hear MOVEMENT in the receiver if I shake the gun around. Is this a sign of a broken spring or spring guide?

Doug Wall · « **Reply #1 on:** July 31, 2014, 01:53:04 PM »

Well, let's see- Could be a broken spring, bad piston seal, or bad breach seal. Only one way to find out. Open it up, and let us know what you find.

gashinshotan · « **Reply #2 on:** July 31, 2014, 02:24:22 PM »

I just got my vantage np yesterday and have a tf87 from MM coming in... Perfect timing for this to happen. Guess the qf2 kit is a must have in my situation... And building a spring compressor.

avator · « **Reply #3 on:** July 31, 2014, 02:50:32 PM »

Where did u put motor oil and how much did u put there?

gashinshotan · « **Reply #4 on:** July 31, 2014, 03:07:32 PM »

I put maybe a half capful down the barrel.... Looking back I think that was too much but the gun was losing power already.... I prob shot about 2500 through it before that. My sessions are long - at least 250-300 at a time so that may have been a factor. I may have to hold off on a rebuild as qf2 kits are hard to find online.

avator · « **Reply #5 on:** July 31, 2014, 05:42:28 PM »

Yeah... don't put any oil down the barrel.. ever. Go to the GTA library and do some reading on springers. Once a a proper seal, spring and lube tune is done you shouldn't need to add anything else until it needs tuned again. Maybe a drop or 2 on pivots to keep things smooth. My guess is you may not need a spring. Maybe just break it down and wash it out with soap and water. Dry it real good, inspect the piston seal for nicks. Lube it properly and put it back together if nothing is wrong with the spring. You are going to want to clean that barrel out as well. Again, info is in the GTA library. These aren't like pumpers that need oils to keep o-rings soft. Also, don't even put any lube in that vantage or your gonna make alot of noise and break things.

gashinshotan · « **Reply #6 on:** July 31, 2014, 05:45:02 PM »

We'll guys so I realized I didn't need a spring compressor.... I could move the spring with a screwdriver... Is this the biggest B3 fail ever? Anyone know where to get a spring guide?

avator · « **Reply #7 on:** August 01, 2014, 07:10:26 AM »

That's a pretty good wreck ya got there. Might as well pull that piston out while you're in there and have a look at the seal. Careful not to nick it. I don't know off hand where to get the guide but I do know you will need a compressor to put it back together. Do a search, I'm sure there are guides out there to be had. Give Mike Mellick a shout over at Flying Dragon, he might have a hook up for you. Clean all that oil out of there and lube it up according to what you read in the GTA Library. A lot of help here if you need it. I would be more than happy to do the work if you lived within driving distance but you would have way too much invested to ship it here and back.
Good Luck

mikeiniowa · « **Reply #8 on:** August 01, 2014, 09:52:30 AM »

I may have some B-3 parts, just got a ton of parts for the TF rifles and they did sell the B-3 for awhile...let me know what you need and I will go through the pile and see what there is...Mike

TooJung2Die · « **Reply #9 on:** August 01, 2014, 11:24:41 AM »

Quote from: gashinshotan on July 31, 2014, 05:45:02 PM

We'll guys so I realized I didn't need a spring compressor.... I could move the spring with a screwdriver... Is this the biggest B3 fail ever? Anyone know where to get a spring guide?

My B3 spring didn't last long. There is a B3 repair kit that has a new spring and other common replacement parts on the web if you search. Less than $20 with shipping if I remember correctly.

You don't need a new spring guide. Use your broken guide to make a better one. I got the bolt at Lowe's.

Jon

gashinshotan · « **Reply #10 on:** August 01, 2014, 12:24:22 PM »

Thanks for the tips everyone. I think this was meant to happen haha - the B3 needed a tune and I was lagging about making the spring compressor. Im gonna start my polish of everything according to the guides and am gonna copy Jons spring guide. I apparently ordered the last qf2 kit on ebay before Mike posted and I can't find it anywhere else so another funny coincidence there. Emailed Mike about more spares though I may consider a crosman spring next time. Fun hobby!

Privateer · « **Reply #11 on:** August 01, 2014, 01:53:28 PM »

Quote from: gashinshotan on August 01, 2014, 12:24:22 PM

Fun hobby!

You are a sick individual.
I'm glad I'm not the only one!

Ghosth · « **Reply #12 on:** August 01, 2014, 05:20:55 PM »

Hey, 40 $ airgun, get to shoot it for a while. (How long + spin the wheel, maybe get lucky)
Then when it breaks you get to fix it, maybe make it better than it was.

Rack it all up to the cost of education in the school of hard knocks.

In the process you learn a lot. Considering cost of repair parts, seals, springs is low, I don't see ANY higher education being cheaper.

IMO yes a 40$ B3 IS fun. (Yes even when it breaks)
Sitting on a pair of them, one still in box, and parts waiting for mine to go

avator · « **Reply #13 on:** August 01, 2014, 05:51:06 PM »

I also cut my teeth on B2s and B3s. I bought 5 of them from a wholesale club for $21 each. They are still with us. They have taken up various locations in our home and are on display much like family pictures. We shoot them once in a while but we normally give most of our attention to our better shooters. I predict that your "fun hobby" is about to turn into the same addiction the rest of us have. Owning a spring compressor is like owning a welder... you are always looking for something to use it on.

gashinshotan · « **Reply #14 on:** August 04, 2014, 04:11:27 AM »

Finally made the compressor today

. Can't wait to get my new springs - got the qf2 coming and also a 38 coil spring MM found for me which I think will be longer. I also have a B4 so having an extra spring is always a good thing. I'm planning to add a 1/2 inch of washers which got some guy in the high 600s with the stock spring and already did the debur/trigger. I'm still debating on whether to tar the spring or not but will prob put a washer on the guide. Thanks for the encouragement/advice - I was about to abandon the B3 because it broke right after I got my vantage np and right before I got the tf87 but your posts helped me realize I'd be abandoning a great gun/chance to learn more about tuning.

gashinshotan · « **Reply #15 on:** August 04, 2014, 06:58:53 AM »

Spring guide - everything was press easy to make. Maybe cuz I've been researching for weeks and have a lot of help here. QF2 should be here tom according to tracking - when Mikes spring comes I'll try it out if it's really different.

TooJung2Die · « **Reply #16 on:** August 04, 2014, 10:52:04 AM »

You will have to experiment with the spacers if you use the 38 coil spring. 1/2" of spacers may be too much because the compressed length of the spring is longer than the 35 coil spring that was probably already in there. How far into the spring guide did you embed the bolt? The threads on the bolt should not be visible. Drill deeper or grind the threads smooth or they will rub the spring when cocking and firing. It is a good idea to use a lubed thrust washer on the spring guide at the base of the spring as you stated. I would take the sharp edge off the bolt where you cut it off. Make it more rounded. I am able to get 650 fps with 7 gr pellets in my B3 after doing the things you mentioned. Middle weight pellets get low 600 fps.

gashinshotan · « **Reply #17 on:** August 04, 2014, 06:07:40 PM »

She lives

Added a half inc worth of washers - cocking is significantly harder, even than when it was new. Power seems higher - I am shooting two inches higher with the same pellets

. The wind age is set to the lowest on the sights so I know for sure I gained a lot more power as before they were spot on. The polishing seemed to help a lot - it's smoother now than it was right before it broke with the weak spring. Also, did what toojung2die suggested for the guide.

I used the qf2 spring for now, but I got Mikes spring also. Mikes spring is significantly longer and has 38 coils vs the 34-35 of the qf2 one. The qf2 spring was about the same length as the stock spring when I assembled the pieces together. The attached pic shows MMs spring top, qf2 middle, and reassembled stock bottom. I ordered some moly paste on ebay and will install Mikes spring then. I'm using moly grease for now which is working ok.

Thanks again everyone for the help. This tune/repair was fun as heck and my B3 is powerful

.

avator · « **Reply #18 on:** August 04, 2014, 06:51:57 PM »

again, be carful with the longer spring and spacers, you might get coil lock...

gashinshotan · « **Reply #19 on:** August 04, 2014, 08:42:01 PM »

I'm reconsidering installing the longer spring - MAN this thing shoots so accurately and smoothly its amazing. Its smoother than the Vantage NP. I put the red dot back on and its hitting ragged hole groups @ 12 yards. Should I even bother opening it up again when its doing so well? I have a B4-2 im thinking of putting the longer spring in. Yeah I prob won't put nearly as many washers if I put that spring in - it's really long, but I really think that guide washer is smoothing things out. It's amazing how much a tune turns these guns into smooth shooters, I'm liking it more than the TF87 now! hahaha

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Dead B3

Author Topic: Dead B3 (Read 5470 times))