XS60C PCP Repeater project

[stalwart]

That's a great idea.

I can't speak for Bob, but strongly suspect he will remind us that although we can determine thread size and quality... only Mr. Melick knows the metallurgy, and if it was consistent across the board.

I'm sure I'm not the only person who would be grateful to see a dedicated thread. If you want to fire one up, you can compile data from more sources than I can. I'll crank out all the data you need, on pressures.

It would be a service to many, and a big help to me.

[stalwart]

BTW... guys, the plan is to blow up a lot of guns, eventually. If needed I will destroy more G1s, after the 2 FDPCPs... but, the sooner I can get to putting together a rig that will ruin my 3K design, and get back to the present, the better. I have remained, for over a year, the very last guy who needs this data.

I am obligated, willingly, to generate data. That is it. I'm not capable of, nor am I willing to certify guns. I have an opinion formed, that is being proven here, based on data I have had since before the first production FDPCP was made. I am under an informal NDA, and frankly.... I'm glad of that.

This whole thing can be fixed... but not by just me. And, Bob's contribution goes deeper (and more costly) than all but a handful will ever know.

[avator]

That's a great idea.

I can't speak for Bob, but strongly suspect he will remind us that although we can determine thread size and quality... only Mr. Melick knows the metallurgy, and if it was consistent across the board.

I'm sure I'm not the only person who would be grateful to see a dedicated thread. If you want to fire one up, you can compile data from more sources than I can. I'll crank out all the data you need, on pressures.

It would be a service to many, and a big help to me.

I respectfully decline... something as important to the safety of my GTA brothers and sisters should be left in much more capable hands than mine.

[rsterne]

I qualified my comment on the safety at 2K by saying "based on this sample of one", and with threads at mid-tolerance.... As stalwart says, we have no idea (despite asking) what material has been used for the tube, or if it has changed along the way, or for that matter what the specified tolerances are.... Users also must be aware that the tubes supplied as an FD-PCP are longer and of different dimensions than those originally supplied with the XS-60c.... When stalwart tests a tube with minimum thread overlap we may see different results, the screws may no longer fail first (as they should).... Time will tell....

Bob

[avator]

I qualified my comment on the safety at 2K by saying "based on this sample of one", and with threads at mid-tolerance.... As stalwart says, we have no idea (despite asking) what material has been used for the tube, or if it has changed along the way, or for that matter what the specified tolerances are.... Users also must be aware that the tubes supplied as an FD-PCP are longer and of different dimensions than those originally supplied with the XS-60c.... When stalwart tests a tube with minimum thread overlap we may see different results, the screws may no longer fail first (as they should).... Time will tell....

Bob

An important and appreciated clarification/reminder.
Thank You.

[stalwart]

I respectfully decline... something as important to the safety of my GTA brothers and sisters should be left in much more capable hands than mine.

That's cool. I was thinking something along the lines of a compilation effort, but can certainly understand anyone being hesitant to expose themselves to expectations of having to make judgements (see my above disclaimer).

I put another couple turns of room in the fitting, for more overlap. It was either that, or over tightening... which NEVER works. Got the screw remnants out... the R was pretty smeared into the hole... and as soon as a gauge comes, will be back to wrecking guns.

I'll be very surprised if DT2 doesn't show completely different results, but... I'm easy to surprise (and startle). We shall see!

In the meantime, I have a couple things cooking up to show off. Back soon!

[rsterne]

I think your gauge likely suffered as a result of too many "g" being applied when the first test parts accelerated out of the video frame on failure.... I would suggest you mount the gauge part (above) to something heavy (or bolted down) that won't see that rapid acceleration if you want the gauge to live....

Bob

[stalwart]

I think you're right. I can't imagine another reason... it's odd that the gauge is frozen precisely at the halfway point.

Another is on it's way. I'll figure out something in the meantime. I was thinking tether, but your idea of just adding mass makes a lot of sense. Simple physics, simply applied.

[rokitman60]

Eric,
        You mentioned a substitute fluid. Could you possibly use ethylene glycol? Plain old antifreeze.
It's what we use in the internal valve jacks on our tank trailers. It keeps them operating even in sub-zero
temperatures, lubricates and even inhibits corrosion Also, there's no ignition risk. I know what can
happen when even a small amount of oil gets atomized. What do you think?

                                                                        Regards,
                                                                                         Butch

PS - my 60 is assembled for testing/tweaking, but kind of got back-burnered when Mama went in the hospital right before the holidays. But I WILL get to it...

[stalwart]

Butch, it sounds like a great idea. Do you have the mix ratio, or are we talking straight up?

Hope your sweetie is doing well. I am getting used to seeing AGs backburnered when reality sets in.... and have seen them benefit from being simmered a bit.

AG time seems to run slower than real time, but, indulging in it seems to slow aging here.

It'll happen when it happens... and I'm looking forward to seeing the detail work posted. I like your gun.

[Gertrude]

Well this is a bit overdue, but better late than never as the saying goes   

I just wanted to say that I think it is very nice of Eric to be taking on this task, (at much of his own expense I might add), in the common interest of ALL here.
 He is basically doing this all alone, with no bias, with no personal agenda or manipulation, and is providing the data as it presents itself.
 He is not profiting in any way on this, and it does take a LOT of time and effort away from his regular shop activities. It's actually COSTING him !

 For myself, My HOPES are, that the data will put at rest, the issues and questions on the safety of these guns... or AT LEAST give us the parameters to "self inspect" our own guns to determine if they are within a reasonably safe spec.
 These guns ARE a lot of fun, and they DO lend themselves well to some Great upgrades and modifications.
I DO like mine a lot. I will do what is necessary to insure it is safe, and worthy of continued use.
 (I'll have a bunch of GS's coming out this spring, and they will need to be introduced to this fun affordable rifle        .
  I eventually would like to "massage it" up into a respectable 50yd "yote buster"      (yeah, we all know who the "Masseuse" will be for that !) Haha.

Keep up the good work Eric ! BRAVO to You !
 It's guy's like you, (and lets certainly not forget Mr. Sterne here too  ), who once again have continued to demonstrate and share and work, for the common good of everyone in the Airguning Community.

  THANK YOU SIR('s) ! ! ,
  for all of your time and efforts.

[avator]

Well this is a bit overdue, but better late than never as the saying goes   

I just wanted to say that I think it is very nice of Eric to be taking on this task, (at much of his own expense I might add), in the common interest of ALL here.
 He is basically doing this all alone, with no bias, with no personal agenda or manipulation, and is providing the data as it presents itself.
 He is not profiting in any way on this, and it does take a LOT of time and effort away from his regular shop activities. It's actually COSTING him !

 For myself, My HOPES are, that the data will put at rest, the issues and questions on the safety of these guns... or AT LEAST give us the parameters to "self inspect" our own guns to determine if they are within a reasonably safe spec.
 These guns ARE a lot of fun, and they DO lend themselves well to some Great upgrades and modifications.
I DO like mine a lot. I will do what is necessary to insure it is safe, and worthy of continued use.
 (I'll have a bunch of GS's coming out this spring, and they will need to be introduced to this fun affordable rifle        .
  I eventually would like to "massage it" up into a respectable 50yd "yote buster"      (yeah, we all know who the "Masseuse" will be for that !) Haha.

Keep up the good work Eric ! BRAVO to You !
 It's guy's like you, (and lets certainly not forget Mr. Sterne here too  ), who once again have continued to demonstrate and share and work, for the common good of everyone in the Airguning Community.

  THANK YOU SIR('s) ! ! ,
  for all of your time and efforts.

Well put Ron.

[rokitman60]

Eric,

       If I've failed to mention it already, your work IS greatly appreciated. As to the mix ratio, I'd say 50/50
would do the trick. You'll get the benefits of the anti-freeze, but being half water it'll be that much cheaper.
Hooh-rah for shoe-string budgets!  

                                                                        Best Regards,
                                                                                                 Butch

[avator]

And hopefully easier to clean up...

[stalwart]

And hopefully easier to clean up...

What HE said!

I am going to take some of what I learned here ( http://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=102871.new#new ), and refine the rig to restrict flow... go for Butch's idea (it's a good one)... then, after we are done with the destruction of 1.8Ks, I'm going to put all I learned into a rig that is powerful and clean... and not rushed to completion.

Thanks, guys. I can always count on you...

I feel a lot better about this whole thing. Tons.

[stalwart]

Tapped the probe passage to 5mm, drilled a .035" hole through the screw...

Nothing is getting through the probe in a hurry.

[rsterne]

Should work, just pump slowly....

Bob

[StevenG]

Eric,

       If I've failed to mention it already, your work IS greatly appreciated. As to the mix ratio, I'd say 50/50
would do the trick. You'll get the benefits of the anti-freeze, but being half water it'll be that much cheaper.
Hooh-rah for shoe-string budgets!  

                                                                        Best Regards,
                                                                                                 Butch

Would propylene glycol work? It is used as antifreeze in food and in commercial aircraft deicing. This is because it is non-toxic. It is classified as GRAS.
That way it could be done outside and no cleanup needed at all.

[stalwart]

I don't know, but would love to.

I make my own vape juice, and can get the stuff from 250ml to 55G drums.

[stalwart]

Well, guys, it looks like the gauge will be delayed. Here's why: Northern Tool's site does not allow you to list a PO Box in your shipping address, yet allows UPS to divert their "ground" shipments to "smart post", a USPS system. As my PO will return anything that has no POB number... the odds that someone will actually think to hang on to it, for a long time, frequent customer... are almost nil (happened once, in years of doing business). We'll see.

I mentioned earlier that I have decisions to make, and one is made:

I have decided to limit sales of G1 parts, and the couple dozen MIB G1s left (in the world?), to previous customers and a small hard core of known fanatics. I am amply stocked to cover these people's needs, and want to remain that way... as I have promised I would all along.

More, soon...