Williams peep update

[AB173]

A few threads down,I asked about peep sights for my newly acquired HW30s.
I received my Williams FP-AG-TK peep sight yesterday.I mounted it this morning and took it to the range to see the results with the peep sight and my not so good eyesight.Well,I am happy to report that I am real satisfied with this sight.From 30 feet to 50 feet,I am putting them all in the 3/4 " round sticky bull from a rest.The peep is definitely much faster then trying to line up the notched rear sight.On a few targets I even had the little .177 pellets touching.Even though the bull is a little fuzzy,the front sight is clear but with proper sight alignment,this is whats suppose to take place.Thumbs up for my purchase.

[Frank in Fairfield]

Ray,
The only thing, repeat only thing, that should be clear is the front sight.
Do not try and center the front sight in the peep.
The human eye is an amazing machine.
It will do it for you.
In fact, if you want really fine accuracy, make the hole in the peep smaller.
Some rifles (Mostly German) had adjustable rear peeps for that very reason.
So, ignore the peep, fuzzy target, sharp front sight.
Enjoy....

[cwlongshot]

Exactly!

Front site is all that SHOULD be clear and in focus!! That's why peeps work so well. Single focal plane just like a scope. Only no magnafication.

CW

[airnutz]

AB173, congrats on your venture into the peep sights (German, Diopter).

These things rock when it comes to accuracy, and consistency.

If you feel the target is a bit fuzzy, and you wear eyeglasses, or your eyesight is somewhat weakened, then the Diopter is still usable.  You'll need an aperture sighting device screwed on to the existing peep sight.  I have no idea about the sight you've mounted already, but do know a bit about Optics.  I wear glasses, and have several high quality old Diopter shooters that have new apertures/filters mounted.  Things become clear again with these things mounted.

I paid about $60 for an entry level piece, and have since moved a bit upward.  Things get clear and better.

Enjoy the system, it is accurate for sure.

[AB173]

Thanks for the tips. Here I was trying to center the front sight in the peep.Very nice to know you don't have to do that.I really was amazed to the accuracy of the peep sight.I'm looking forward to more shooting with the peep now.

[Frank in Fairfield]

Until recently, all of our wars were fought with a peep sight.
Now they use electric red dots and such.
No fun. IMHO

[AB173]

Until recently, all of our wars were fought with a peep sight.
Now they use electric red dots and such.
No fun. IMHO

Come to think of it,you are right.I was just struck with the fact that my M-16 that I carried in the Nam was peep sighted.I just couldn't remember back that far but then again,it was mainly spray and pray.

[Frank in Fairfield]

Yep.
My M16 too
My Garand here in my room
The M1 and M2 Carbines, too

[Oldgringo]

A few threads down,I asked about peep sights for my newly acquired HW30s.
I received my Williams FP-AG-TK peep sight yesterday.I mounted it this morning and took it to the range to see the results with the peep sight and my not so good eyesight.Well,I am happy to report that I am real satisfied with this sight.From 30 feet to 50 feet,I am putting them all in the 3/4 " round sticky bull from a rest.The peep is definitely much faster then trying to line up the notched rear sight.On a few targets I even had the little .177 pellets touching.Even though the bull is a little fuzzy,the front sight is clear but with proper sight alignment,this is whats suppose to take place.Thumbs up for my purchase.

E-mail sent with comments from Mick, the Fuzzy Limey.  Enjoy!

[AB173]

A few threads down,I asked about peep sights for my newly acquired HW30s.
I received my Williams FP-AG-TK peep sight yesterday.I mounted it this morning and took it to the range to see the results with the peep sight and my not so good eyesight.Well,I am happy to report that I am real satisfied with this sight.From 30 feet to 50 feet,I am putting them all in the 3/4 " round sticky bull from a rest.The peep is definitely much faster then trying to line up the notched rear sight.On a few targets I even had the little .177 pellets touching.Even though the bull is a little fuzzy,the front sight is clear but with proper sight alignment,this is whats suppose to take place.Thumbs up for my purchase.

Thanks Greg. That made for some very good reading about the 6 O'Clock hold.

E-mail sent with comments from Mick, the Fuzzy Limey.  Enjoy!

[FMB42]

Thanks for the informative update AB173.

Peep sights seem to be under-rated these days. But the fact is that they can be a very effective sight system that's usually very sturdy and easy to use. This, and their light weight, make them an excellent choice for field use imo.

[dwalk]

Thanks for the informative update AB173.

Peep sights seem to be under-rated these days. But the fact is that they can be a very effective sight system that's usually very sturdy and easy to use. This, and their light weight, make them an excellent choice for field use imo.

that's the truth!

i used to visit a forum for M4 carbines and stopped visiting because some of the users were so rude about open sights it was incredible.

i trained with M1 Garand, M1 carbine and  M14. the M16 was still three years down the road...my unit had M1 Carbines for the nam.

all are/were open sights and very effective.

[Not The Brightest Bulb]

i used to visit a forum for M4 carbines and stopped visiting because some of the users were so rude about open sights it was incredible.

Why am I not surprised. Yes indeed that is incredible.

No matter what you do in life it appears there will be somebody out there yelling "my way, do it my way"

[Wood Boats]

Cool that you are liking your receiver sight.  Aperture and short range focus issues can sometimes be addressed by moving the sight fore and aft on the rail.  Further from the eye makes the aperture smaller while closer makes it larger.  Move it around a bit to find the sweet spot where it disappears.

As others have stated you want to look through the peep not at it.  The human eye is great at resolving circles.  Target, Globe and receiver sight makes for a circle inside a circle inside another circle.  Focus on the rear of the front sight and your brain does the rest.

For more than 20 years I have been using the rear aperture to tell me when it is time to see my eye doctor.  When the hole gets fuzzy to the point where no amount of adjusting resolves the issue it is time to see the doc.  I see the issue beginning through the peep before I see it any where else.

[airnutz]

Guys, I don't understand what you're talking about?

The part about focusing on the front sight, and not the peep for instance.

Don't you have a tunnel type front sight with a match type insert?

Or are you using an open front sight?

I focus on the target.  The insert narrows the target down to a very small area, about inch at 33 feet.  Thats the size of a bullseye in our type of shooting environment.

I guess you are talking about open front sights.

Anyone?

[AB173]

airnutz,
What they were explaining to me was to not be concerend about trying to center the front sight,whatever front sight,in the center of the rear peep.Your eye will automaticaly do that for you without any effort on your part.Just focus on the front sight,which should be clear and of course,while making the front sight clear,the target will be somewhat fuzzy.I for one can not have both the front sight and the bull clear at the same time.Hence,I use a 6 O'Clock hold on the bull.

[airnutz]

OK.
I think I understand.
I know when I aim with my setups, I have to, while looking through the peep, look over the front sight to get the general picture of the target area.  When I find the black spot, I really no longer can "see" the front sight, just the hazy outline of the insert, and clearly the target itself.

But I only shoot match rifles at 33 ft. anyway.  When the pigeons get rowdy and occupy a big tree in the back of the yard, I'll take a shot or two till they're gone.  The tree is 100 ft away, and it's hard to find the target at first, but when zeroed in, I have them clear in view.  I haven't dropped one yet at this distance because with a Diopter it's too difficult to aim six inches high.  30 Meters doesn't allow me to see much of a target area with my Diopter and the competition front sight.

My best shooter for longer distances is a Diana 75, with a Nikko Gold Crown 4x32 scope.  I have a larger view of the target (pigeons), and can see the feathers fly when I get one.  What a shooter, no recoil, a super trigger, and fun as heck to shoot.

Greetings to Ohio.

[Wood Boats]

Guys, I don't understand what you're talking about?

I feel like this most days.  I know this can be confusing if it has not been explained correctly.  I will do my best and if for any reason I lose you let me know and I will try harder.

The part about focusing on the front sight, and not the peep for instance.

Don't you have a tunnel type front sight with a match type insert?

Or are you using an open front sight?

While it does not matter to this discussion lets stick with the Globe type (tunnel) sight.  The term "match type" insert can mean many things depending on the match.  Silhouette matches (metal critters) use the inserts with holes while Bullseye (paper target) would use a post.  Size of the hole or width of the post would depend on the type of target and range.  I am happy to go into detail if you wish.

When you look through the rear sight you see the front sight.  My saying "focus on the rear of the front sight" could be taken in ways other than what I had intended so it is my fault that it was confusing to you. 

Regardless of the type of sight you always focus on the rearward most part of the front sight.  Be it a light pipe, a shotgun bead, or a post in your Globe, you are always looking at the rearward most part of the sight as that is all you should be able to see.  Your focus should be on the rear of the front sight with that centered on your target.  The rear sight simply gets in the way to help put your cheek and focus on the same plane every time.

I focus on the target.  The insert narrows the target down to a very small area, about inch at 33 feet.  Thats the size of a bullseye in our type of shooting environment.

From this I am guessing you use a circle and not a post or cross hair?  When shooting paper targets use the post.  Circles are for silhouette not paper.

Post inserts come in varying widths depending on the target and distance used by whatever shooting discipline you might be engaged in at the moment.  I would love to tell you that I had special knowledge but I do not so will not blow smoke at you. 

Every award I have won over the years is due to this guy  http://stores.homestead.com/hstrial-LeeShaverGuns/-strse-Front-Sight-Insert-Cards/Categories.bok

Read the site and look at the inserts and the intended uses and you get an idea of how specific a post or circle might be.  I prefer the single cross hair for targets and use the double cross hair grid for game in the field.

The whole point is to look through the rear sight at the back of the front sight.  Do not use a circle front insert to try to do a double peep.  Double peeps are in the big boy leagues where cost go into the thousands.

Thanks Greg. That made for some very good reading about the 6 O'Clock hold.

E-mail sent with comments from Mick, the Fuzzy Limey.  Enjoy!

I would like to see this if someone would send it please

[airnutz]

I use the inserts you showed on the link.  Various types and sizes.  My guns are German 10M match rifles of the older variety.  Diana 60 and 75, and 2 Walther's of the past.

The mention of crosshairs is good!  I like this.  Since I shoot at paper targets with a wooden back to reduce reflection, I'm grateful for suggestions.

Fun too, is shooting them thick and pesky horseflies that abound in warm weather.  I smear a little butter on a white board and wait.  Sure enough, an ugly fly will appear and get his last lick of life.  Crosshairs is a good idea.

[Wood Boats]

Happy to be of assistance. 

If you try the cross hair and like it then try the double one with the four point grid.  The center acts as the silhouette sight with multi-point references for elevation and windage.

Fun stuff