HW 80 K / R1 .22 Problem

[Mr.B_C]

Hi folks,

i have a big prob with my hw 80...
first, im really perturbed off at the moment!
Ok, i bought a brand new hw 80 k .22 cal from a shop - so far so good, i was really happy to get a brand new rifle.
The gun was manufacured in aug 13 2013.
I ordered with the gun a Titan XS FAC aftermarket spring and installed it. The hw 80  kicked like a mule - absolutely ok for me, this is a hw 80 not a hw 30 or something like that.
The major problem is that the hw does only 709 FPS with 14,3 gr JSB exact express pellet, ive done 50 shots then i chonied the hw.
What's wrong with the gun?

[Motorhead]

No hands on here either .... But that said, many times we read what a rifle shoots in .177 caliber being wow struck.
Then when we shoot the same in .22 caliber often disappointment is ending result 

** same powerplant ... the .177 will be shooting the light stuff 7-8 grains pretty well.
sadly in .22 cal the lightest pellets are 13-14 grain 
That nearly TWICE the weight in most cases and the guns power plant in so many instances just will not make the power we hope for.

Adding more spring can help some, but power is really governed by the Area/Stroke of the piston. Speeding up the cycle with more spring adds some punch but generally at the expense of a smooth shot cycle.

Just FYI ... nuttin more.

[Nathan]

I think John hit it right on the head. You said you have an aftermarket FAC spring so I'll assume yours was a 12 ft gun stock. Did you change out the piston seal when you changed the spring? The factory seal might be slightly undersized, loosing some velocity there. You mentioned it does 709 fps, so hows the SD and ES? Try a different pellet, many people (myself included) have seen lower velocity for JSB's compared to pellets of similar weight when used in spring rifles. If the JSB's are shooting well (low ES and SD) and are the most accurate, then I wouldn't worry too much about the fps. You might gain 50-75 fps, but if you can't hit anything, you're defeating the purpose. 709 fps while not the highest fps  (and a HW-80/R-1 in .22 with a FAC spring is very capable of more) it's not the end of the world.

Nathan

[Mark 611]

IMO having owned several new R1/HW80's in .22cal I'd say that power is a bit low IMO I've not had 1 new out of the box shoot under 750fps with 14.3gn CPHP's, I would say the spring your using is the problem if all else is correct? if you have a good extreme spread and standard deviation with your # then I'd say its in the spring! also you could have over Tarred the spring JMO

[Frank in Fairfield]

When Dr Beeman sold these rifles (He sold me mine), he told everyone to shoot 2 tins (1000 shots before you can expect the best performance. Tom Gaylord wrote the book on the R1. His numbers match yours....ps He works for PA and has blogs

[limbshaker]

Try to find a pellet that fits the bore tighter and see if your velocity comes up. Even if it is consistent now, a better sealing (bigger) pellet may shoot faster because all the air stays behind it.

Example: My Vortek tuned HW50S in .177 shoots JSB Express 7.9gr at 725fps. It shoots RWS Superdomes 8.3gr at 762fps.

Its worth a try, as all the HW's ive had in .22 seemed to have barrels that were a little on the big side. I've got a HW77K here now in .22 that a JSB will almost free fall down the bore. I'm about to put a Lothar Walther barrel on this one because the barrel is so oversized.

Also, if you're gun had a tight compression tube and your seal was too large, the friction between the two may be enough to rob power. I'd tear it down and size the seal to the tube if it seems overly tight.

Hope you get it straightened out.. Keep us posted!

[tjk]

I am with Mark. Your numbers seem a bit low. Simply adding a hot rod spring isn't going to up you fps. I have used the Titan wire with very good results but it came at a cost. That cost was called trial and error. First off the oem seals in the 80's are not really designed in form or material to handle the Titan type spring. I would recommend you replace the factory seal with a Maccarri seal and size it carefully. Spacing the spring and adding weight to the piston should help improve the fps and shooting behavior. Lastly, go easy on the lubes,....all of them. It may take you a few trials and errors, but I promise it will pay off in the long run. JM offers all kinds of spacers, bearings and piston weights. Vortek is another good source for seals and lubricants too. Good luck and have fun.

[Mr.B_C]

Ok - now im a litte bit more clever...
Ive the new design of the Piston-Seal. (Not the old one with the parachute-design)
Its maybe the stiffness of the new design, the older parachute-design iss maybe better for sealing - but i dont know exactly.

I will shoot some more pellets down the bore, because its a new rifle and needs a little bit shooting to break-in.
I dont shot the original factory-spring! As the postman comes along and delivers me the hw i changed the spring
without shot the original.
The Vortek is an other option. - But now im going to shoot a little bit!

[snakebite4767]

I was at first disappointed with my HW95's velocity of 633 fps with the 14.3 (14.5) pellets.. figured that I should have "More Power". I considered a upgrade spring kit... but the thing is settling in so well, and the accuracy is getting pretty darn good, I think that I will just let it be... not sure that there is anything to gain. Even at this power, it will put a pellet through both sides of a can and into the tree at 80 yds! The really good news here is that I can hit the can!

Snakebite

[tomykay12]

Check out straight Shooters site. They have a velocity chart with different pellets. Find the HW80, then click on "our take". I think JSB exacts are listed about 750 fps. Shoot it awhile and I bet the velocity climbs a bit, tk

[Mr.B_C]

Ive checked out Straight Shooters Site! My HW is underpowered... 750 is the velocity on StraightS mine does only 709...
I think the quality of the titan xs mainspring from jk is not the same as in the past!
      

[White Eagle]

Check the breech seal.  I would not rule it out, even on a new rifle.  You might be amazed what a difference that can make.  I gained about 40 fps just by replacing the breech seal on my D34.

[Mark 611]

after I have read what you have included you may have a tight piston seal and if so it will kill your power! piston seals need to be properly fit to the tube!

[Mr.B_C]

Hi folks,

@Mark 611: Is the newer design of the weihrauch piston-seal more tight than the older one?

[Mark 611]

it could be how old is the rifle? the only way to know is to gauge the tube and seal, the easiest way to check it is to feel how much pressure is on the piston with the seal on it, take the gun apart clean it all up, remove all the lube off of everything put the piston with the seal on it back into the tube and see how much pressure it takes to push the piston down the tube? {a good fit} the piston should almost fall under its own weight! most folks like about 1 to 2 LBS of pressure forced to move the piston down the tube and it should glide smoothly as it moves!

[BlueSteel50]

IMO having owned several new R1/HW80's in .22cal I'd say that power is a bit low IMO I've not had 1 new out of the box shoot under 750fps with 14.3gn CPHP's, I would say the spring your using is the problem if all else is correct? if you have a good extreme spread and standard deviation with your # then I'd say its in the spring! also you could have over Tarred the spring JMO

Try the Beeman Silver Bear @ 10.65 gr. they shoot great out of my HW50S and do 650 in that med powered gun, should bring your s up to a good 750  Don't be too concerned aboyut advertised speeds they are  for marketing and shot with the light 4 gr stuff. ~~BS50~~

[Mr.B_C]

@BleSteel50: I know that about advertised speeds, but ive dont seen a new HW 80 with under 740 FPS. THe rifle is brand new i hope the FPS increases after break-in.

[Mr.B_C]

The Velocity increases slightly... Im now at 750 FPS. Maybe the Velocity climbs to 760-770 FPS.

[fritz1]

Miine does low 750-740 with JSB 14.3  about 300-400 down the pipe.

[Mr.B_C]

Hi folks,
same Rifle, new Problem! The Recoil is so harsh that all screws rallin' loose after 30 to 50 shots... what can i do? Maybe should i use brass screws or something else... no idea...
need help.

reg Mr.B_C