Beeman P17-Cheap pistol with a great trigger

[Slavia]

I cut the head from a long screw and use it as a mandrel to spin the "T" nut in a drill.  While it is spinning I grind down the flange with a Dremel and abrasive cutoff wheel.  The "T" nuts can be cemented in place with epoxy, super glue, or JB weld (rough up the contact surfaces first).  You can also use the abrasive cutoff wheel to cut a screwdriver slot in the flange.

I'm working on a design that holds the pellet by its waist so that the forward portion of the pellet can be inserted into the chamber.  More on it later, after a prototype is made.

Mine are made from retractable ball point pens.  With the B3 I just put my thumb behind the pellet and push.  In guns with restricted access to the breech (Crosman, Sheridan, etc.)  I push the plunger and what's left of the ink tube pushes the pellet out.

[stalwart]

You, sir, are what is known as an "enabler"... and I, for one, could not be more grateful.

It's good to know this plastic does not require exotic adhesives (that can get $tupid... quick).

Your decision to bed your barrel makes a ton of sense now. When mine is tight, it is accurate enough that it is becoming obvious to me that it could easily become the most fired AG in my growing stable. I strive for real accuracy with all my rigs, but this is the only one I can toss into my desk with a tin of pellets, and always be ready to shoot in seconds. What was the extent of the improvement?

I plan to build a custom, and will need it to allow quick change barrels... so I'll have to come up with a stout system to hold down a longer Micro Groove. I'm thinking of anchoring the front with a tapered fitment (ala 1911 barrel bushing), threaded on.... but, for my desk gun that would be ridiculous.

Any hints before I fill the top half of one of these with epoxy? It sounds awfully permanent...lol.

[Slavia]

It sounds awfully permanent

It is that.  I polished the muzzle and breech crowns before I bedded the barrel.  I can still get a pull-through in there if I need to clean.  I never anticipated needing to take the barrel out again, and it has been several years now without a change of heart.  Someone anticipating barrel swaps or future mods should avoid the epoxy.

The truth is I don't have any before/after data regarding the barrel bedding and accuracy.  I read about it on the net, and it just seemed like the thing to do.

[stalwart]

"...it just seemed like the thing to do."

I believe it is, too. Anything that can keep solid alignment between the sights and the barrel will work (as you know). I cut the bevel, and polished both it and the muzzle. Also made a F shim that is a bit better fit than the stockers... just enough clearance to close the gun without applying pressure to anything but the ring.

I'll try it clamped, then glue it down... I'm not the shooter to prove tiny improvements, but if it makes a big difference... I may be able to demonstrate that.

I can't wait for the next pistols to show up. I'm checking dimensions with this one (some ideas gelling), and resisting the urge to chop this up. It will get the Tucannon mod, and then go to work. It doesn't seem to need anything else to excel at it's intended purpose.

One last thing I want is to have the safety fitted to eliminate the gap. The trigger job has settled in, and is clean enough, set to zero creep, that I can hit my steel desk sharply with the gun, at any angle, and not induce firing (on "safe" or not). However, at that setting, pulling the trigger firmly will fire it in spite of the safety. Tightening up the tolerances will mean the only slop left (~ 1mm, measured at the center of trigger's curve) will be what is needed to keep frame/pin mount flex from releasing the sear when pulled with extreme pressure.

Has anyone else set up a single stage trigger in theirs? It made a big difference in my groups. I'm really happy (and a bit impressed) the group is designed and built well enough to be so finely tuned (without cheating and using spring tension to hold it all together... Unsafe. Danger, Will Robinson!). It can be made too light for precise control by weakening the spring (ala BobH) without risking losing positive engagement. I stretched mine exactly per his post (let a little light through), and it was just enough to make it feel immediate without getting spooky.

I'll document the next trigger job, if it's desired... and allowed here. It's not a mod for the impatient, or the inattentive... a couple thou too far, might as well be a couple feet.

[Bob H.]

Please do document the trigger job for us.  Inquiring minds want to know, not to mention us tinkerers.

BobH.

I'll document the next trigger job, if it's desired... and allowed here. It's not a mod for the impatient, or the inattentive... a couple thou too far, might as well be a couple feet.

[Tucannon]

The pen mod is easy and makes the gun more enjoyable to load.

[stalwart]

Please do document the trigger job for us.  Inquiring minds want to know, not to mention us tinkerers.

BobH.

I'll document the next trigger job, if it's desired... and allowed here. It's not a mod for the impatient, or the inattentive... a couple thou too far, might as well be a couple feet.

Will do, Bob.

The pen mod is easy and makes the gun more enjoyable to load.

Not to mention:

Bore sighting... with or without a laser.
Slugging
Cleaning
Loading darts, Q-tips, etc.
And, last but not least, showing other P3-17 guys that you aren't here to mess around.

 

[stalwart]

Slavia, which areas did you fill to bed the barrel?

Tucannon, what are the ODs of the Crosman pen's tip and body?

Thanks, guys.

[Tucannon]

Tucannon, what are the ODs of the Crosman pen's tip and body?

The tip is 8mm and the body is 5mm

[TleVta]

I'm starting to look around for the smallest soft case for this gun. Any recommendations?

[stalwart]

The desk gun is done. $0 spent. The only thing that bugged me about these was the fake slide release. It's the widest part of the gun, and is all corners and edges.

Milled it off, and went over the whole gun with an ultra fine Scotch pad with a bit of liquid dish soap. The plastic looks new.

The next 2 are coming Wed. I'll sweeten and detune 1 for my old girl, and nut up on the other. I'll fire up a new thread then.

Thanks, guys. I'm shooting the heck out of this, and loving it. Without this thread I would have missed out completely.

[Slavia]

Slavia, which areas did you fill to bed the barrel?

Here's a picture.

I'm starting to look around for the smallest soft case for this gun. Any recommendations?

By the time I got the flashlight, scope, and grip extensions in place the gun was too big for most soft-sided cases.  Here is a case I made from a garage sale power tool case, construction sytrofoam, and polar fleece.

went over the whole gun with an ultra fine Scotch pad with a bit of liquid dish soap

I use a soft paint brush and Armor All.  The Armor All has emulsified silicone, so be careful to not use the brush again for paint.

[althawk]

Hmm looking at your last pic, I am reminded that I've always been a bit confused why the manufacturer didn't add an accessory rail in front of the trigger. Would be a perfect place to mount a laser (or maglite solitaire now that the LED ones are coming out).

[Bob H.]

Slavia,

Building on the last post,  how did you attach the laser sight onto the P17?  What laser did you use?  I would also like to a laser to the underside of my P17.  I currently have a Center Point laser attached to the rail of my P 17.  I would like to keep the factory sights unobstructed. 

BobH.

Hmm looking at your last pic, I am reminded that I've always been a bit confused why the manufacturer didn't add an accessory rail in front of the trigger. Would be a perfect place to mount a laser (or maglite solitaire now that the LED ones are coming out).

[stalwart]

Turns out the new (Big Supply) 17s have the FO sights. I like them... looks a little like Christmas, but easy to acquire.

Got a batch of MG barrels in... time to see what these 17s will do with them. The simple shape of 17 barrels will make it easy to keep the labor costs down on these. If anyone wants to try one, drop me a note.

[robert w]

Just got this a couple days ago. Love the trigger! Wish I could copy it and put it my other guns. It also has some nice fiber optic sights. Can't go wrong at $40. I am getting used to the single stroke. It's all in technique.

after reading all that is posted about this pistol, I am thinkin I need 1 /want 1 whew wife didn't see that .but for $40 it cant be a bad pistol, has to be better than the Benjamin /crosman nitro piston pistol I had for a whole day

[Slavia]

It's not a laser - it's a flashlight.  I scraped the point of a small pocketknife sideways along that little ledge on the bottom to create a dovetail.  The flashlight sits in two scope rings from one of those cheap little 15mm scopes.

[Bob H.]

Well, I lowered the compression in one of my P 17s today.  The FPS was dropped from 400ish down to 370ish.  I cut a counterbore in the piston face.  I went about .040" deep.  At 10 meters that should add .01 seconds to the flight time.  There is a noticeable difference in the force needed to close the pistol.  Maybe I can punch some paper with it later.  I want to see how the POI has changed at 10 meters.

BobH.

 

The next 2 are coming Wed. I'll sweeten and detune 1 for my old girl, and nut up on the other. I'll fire up a new thread then.

Thanks, guys. I'm shooting the heck out of this, and loving it. Without this thread I would have missed out completely.

[stalwart]

If there isn't a big drop, will you be slowing it more?

[Bob H.]

Stalwart,

It appears that the drop was an additional 5 MM at 10 meters.  I want to see what is going at 15 meters before I take the c'bore deeper. Also, if my laser is bright enough, I want to find where the pellet passes the laser beam after it has reached it maximum altitude.  So, the answer is yes, I may yet lower the compression again.

BobH.

If there isn't a big drop, will you be slowing it more?