How much power is enough???

[americanpatriot10]

I have been working on a 2250 project and have got the gun shooting 18.1grn jsb exacts at 725 fps getting 21 fpe. Is this enough power for hunting  or should i keep modding for more power?? btw i hunt rabbit, nutters and birds , sometimes coons and beavers ,possums .

[Rescue912]

More than enough for rabbits and squirrels. Coons, beavers and possums I would put a head shot on and they won't go anywhere. Post pix ...

[americanpatriot10]

[Motorhead]

20 ft lbs will take out most small game indeed.
Other side of the BIG POND the Brits do it all the time with 12# 

Shot placement is key 

[only1harry]

21fpe is plenty for hunting.  That is a little more than a Diana 48 .22 Magnum Springer puts out at the muzzle.  Airgunners have taken plenty of coon, fox and Coyote with a 48/52 and good (head) shot placement. 

You hit any small game critter or furbearer in the brain with a minimum of 10-11fpe on impact, and it will drop in its tracks and won't go anywhere. Estimate the distance your pellet's energy drops down to 11fpe or so, and that would be the maximum effective range of your gun on possum, coon, fox, coyote and beaver.  That would be about 50-60yds out.  For beaver I would really try to get at least 13fpe or more on impact (to the head/brain).  They get pretty big.  A few 350 owners have taken them from 30yds with CP's or 14.x pellets, which would be around 15-16fpe remaining energy on impact.  For successful hunts I usually limit myself to 35yds, or where I can get dime size groups or better.  For most people that is 20-35yds, or they choose to hunt up to a distance they get nickel or quarter sized groups.  To me quarter size groups is a bit too much for accurate brain shots, and I don't take those kind of chances.  Everyone is different, but I think most everyone knows shot placement is what it's all about even with an 80fpe .25 PCP.
Good luck with your hunts!
Harry

[Ribbonstone]

I'd stop...maybe even back it don a little to 18 foot pounds or so if that gave better accuracy or a significantly longer shot count.


Kind of like the chicken the road....once you get the pellet coming out the other side, getting to coming out going faster doesn't help a lot.

Speed give more power and a better trajectory, but unless the accuracy is there to go along with that, doesn't increase killing range.

Guess its best to think in terms of energy at impact rather than muzzle energy.   Best would be the ChairGun program, but for quick work can use this calculator to guesstimate down range energy:
http://www.airguns.net/trajectory.php

Not real sure how low you can go and get total penetration on pest birds, but its pretty darned low.  Rabbits and squirrels, with normal weight RN .22's, generally show exits when impacting at about 8-10 foot pounds (depending on the size...got some tiny gray squirrels here but also some really big swamp rabbits). 

With good pellets, you’ have that at something like 60-65 yards.  If the gun can hold a good group at that range under the conditions you hunt (and darned few of us lug a bench rest round the woods on our backs), would be good to go.

For the big critters, kind of on your own. Figure beaver to be about the size of my local nutria, and unless you brain them, are not going to lay down and die.  Think your energy level would be more than the typical accuracy level needed...you'd run out of "hitting" before you ran out of "zap".

Real life kicks in… hitting nickel sized kill zones at ranges past 50 yards while leaning against the side of a tree or hunched over a rotten tree fall is a lot harder than it seems.

[Rescue35]

Nice rig.

+1 on what the others said.

[djdilliodon]

21 fpe is more than enough for hunting out to 30 yards on nutters, birds, and rabbits IMO. Shot placement will be most important if you ask me so accuracy is the key first. My disco shoots eunjin 28.4gr at 30 fpe and it will fold a nutter up like a lawn chair at 50 yards with ease. When it was stock I was getting 23 fpe out of it and they would drop nicely out at 30 no problem. I think right now you need to start shooting and getting all the accuracy you can out of it. Also shoot it a lot at various distances to learn your gun in and out cause it really helps on the long shots.

[Ribbonstone]

Two extreme examples.

Way more accuracy than power.

This rifle can lay in tiny groups on paper at 20 to 25 yards and I’ve zapped aspirins at that range.  BUT it starts out at about 4.5 foot-pounds and is down to about 2 ½ foot-pounds at 20 yards.  Got way more accuracy than hunting power (in fact, not enough power for anything but the smallest of pest birds).


May more power than accuracy.

Worked with this .32cal Philippine co2 rifle one summer. Could make it to 50 foot-pounds with a .32 ball.  BUT, at best, it was a 1 to 1 1/2” 25 yard shooter.  Had lots of power, but accuracy limited it to 25 yards.  If I could sneak up on Nutria and get inside of 25 yards (and 20 was better), would do the trick. (was also  deafeningly loud).

What I’m preaching for is a balance. Power without accuracy doesn’t help…accuracy without power doesn’t help…has to be some middle ground where you run out of both at about the same distance.

[Bill G]

All have given good advice.  I tend to limit the game to fpe as equal.  20fpe takes a 20lb animal.  Know you energy at engagement range and make a good decision and a better shot and you'll certainly be fine.  With good shot placement, I find this method to leave me with more than adequate energy For a humane kill.

[PakProtector]

Real life kicks in… hitting nickel sized kill zones at ranges past 50 yards while leaning against the side of a tree or hunched over a rotten tree fall is a lot harder than it seems.

I say that to myself every time I draw a bead on something 'way out there'...this even after putting five shots into a very respectable group at 70 yards...it isn't just doing it once, it is doing it right now...lots like FT, which of course is supposed to resemble "the real thing" so I s'pose they're on to something...
cheers,
Douglas

[rsterne]

My Grouse gun is 20 FPE at the muzzle, about 16 FPE at my maximum hunting range.... For ground squirrels out to 100 yards I use a 35 FPE rifle, and the residual energy at that range is about 19 FPE.... Both are lots of killing power for small game....

Bob

[djdilliodon]

My Grouse gun is 20 FPE at the muzzle, about 16 FPE at my maximum hunting range.... For ground squirrels out to 100 yards I use a 35 FPE rifle, and the residual energy at that range is about 19 FPE.... Both are lots of killing power for small game....

Bob

Not trying to go off topic here but how do you like your .25cal disco? Any info you can share on it (pics, specs, fill pressure ect)? Down the line I really wanna make my disco a .25 cal. Always wanted a .25 but never had one yet .

[rsterne]

My .25 cal Disco is great, but the 35 FPE rifle I mentioned above is a 2260 cal HPA conversion.... My .25 cal Disco does 11 shots at 45 FPE per fill (to 2100 psi)....

Bob

[Ribbonstone]

Have a couple that will shoot +50fpe, and some that shoot in the 30's and 40's, but the teo guns that have shot the most squirrels (tree squirrels) over the last years have been a 2260 HiPac conversion giving 16 foot pounds and a 5mm QB HPA conversion making it to 13foot pounds.

2260:


5MM QB HPA:



Sometimes I force a gun to shoot to some set energy level high or low, for various reasons.  The above to I just let airgun-nature take its course, fiddled around with the adjustments, and took whatever energy THEY decided they needed to "run happy".  Just keep track of air use and accuracy, an let the results decide where to leave the settings.

Third and forth most used were both forced into the 12 foot pound area.  I like the guns well enough, but they are both in such good condition that I don't beat it up in the areas I tend to hunt nearly as often as the above two.  An AA 200T in .177 and an AA s200 .22, both running right at 12.5 foot pounds.


Most shots are in the 20-30yard range. To get a shot more than 35 yards, i'd have to trap the squirrel and back off.

Now I will admit that I'd have to duct-tape two of my little gray squirrels to make one of those great big fox squirrels I use to hunt in Va. (right near the VA/KY line), but the results from using 177, 5mm, 22 at this energy level is about the same:  put a pellet though the "good bits" and they fall down.  Miss the good bits, and they run.

Last season, set three guns to  shoot 13.4-13.5gr. pellets at 635-640fps. The trick was one was a .177 shoots 13.4gr. JSB "Monsters", one was a 5mm shoot 13.5gr. JSB Exacts, and one was a .22 shooting AA's "falcon" (which are JSB's) 13.5gr.  Same weight, same speed, same energy, but a different caliber for the 3.  Thought I'd see some major differences.  Didn't.  Put one though the good bits, squirrel falls down...miss the good bits, squirrel runs.

Looking over the guns i use the most, come to the conclusion that:
1. I like long guns.
2. A bit of weight-forward balance helps me.
3. Only 1 of the 4 is a .177, so evidently I like bigger holes.

[Sqrl Klr]

How do you determine what fpe your rifle is shooting?

Here is the highest figure for my disco so far. 964fps using h&n ftt 14.6gr pellets.
 
Here is the highest figure for my air hawk. 987fps using destroyer ex 7.9gr pellets.

What fpe are they shooting that way?

[1377x]

How do you determine what fpe your rifle is shooting?

Here is the highest figure for my disco so far. 964fps using h&n ftt 14.6gr pellets.
 
Here is the highest figure for my air hawk. 987fps using destroyer ex 7.9gr pellets.

What fpe are they shooting that way?

like this
http://www.1728.org/energy.htm
enter your values - velocity and pellet weight
your disco is putting out 30.1fpe i guess thats at the muzzle
and your air hawk is putting out 17fpe
those shooters have some nice power

[jimmie lee]

AOA has a calculator to determine your fpe and fps on the left side of there web home page. It works well.

[jimmie lee]

The Delmarva silver fox squirrel has been a protected species since 1967. Weighing up to three pounds, they are meaty critters. Their habitat was originally pennsylvania, delaware on down through the Md eastern shore and virginia. They are now mostly on Md eastern shore and VA due to habitat destruction. I used to hunt deer when I was younger on eastern shore and the Silver fox squirrel was plentiful; I haven't seen one since 1973.

[SwampDonkey]

How do you determine what fpe your rifle is shooting?

Here is the highest figure for my disco so far. 964fps using h&n ftt 14.6gr pellets.
 
Here is the highest figure for my air hawk. 987fps using destroyer ex 7.9gr pellets.

What fpe are they shooting that way?

how many good shots per fill are you getting from the disco? what fill pressure?