Do I prefer .20? What can I buy on a budget?

[splitbeing]

I think I do prefer .20, just haven't spent much time with the caliber yet.

I recently acquired a silver streak from mike baker.  Nice to have what I was missin'! [chuckling]

I don't think I can swing an HW in .20 from AoA or Krale.

The pellets are really nice. They're the perfect size.  A Platonic pellet, if you will [chuckling].

[airgunaut]

I do! We were thinking along the same line today, what a coincidence.

It helped that I just came in from shooting a few pellets with the Streak in gusty winds.

[Nate the airgunner]

I’m a fan of them. It’s a shame it’s phased out so much. Only 4 real pellet option anymore.

[nced]

Drecades ago I considered a .20 pellet after hunting squirrels with a .177 R9 and R10 thinking that the extra pellet weight and diameter would be advantageous. I bought a .20 cal R9 and used it for one year finding no "effectiveness advantage" after the hit but a few "ballistic disadvantages" that caused me to sell the .20 barrel replacing it with a .22 barrel (a pro chopped and shortened R1 barrel).

Disappointment with effectiveness on tree squirrels was the fact that there was LITTLE difference between the .20 and .177 with hits THROUGH the vitals. I guess I shouldn't have been too surprised since I had hunted squirrels with a .22 rimfire for years before the "pellet years". LOL, I've had some squirrels take a .22 cal bullet through both lungs at 100ish fpe and still travel several feet along a limb to die in a "tree hole". The main issue with the .20 (and .22) pellet with a R9 power level springer (tuned to 15fpe) was that the trajectory of a .20 dome was "too loopy" for me to guess the holdover past my zero distance which made for more "off the mark" hits under field conditions with my sqill level!

Bottom line, after hunting with the .20 cal barrel for one season and the .22 barrel for half a season I sold both larger cal barrels reverting back to an accurate .177 dome pellet never to look back! 

[splitbeing]

Boy, the journey you describe, Ed, is akin to the one I was taking.

I was imagining a .20 R9 as ideal.

Your hunting experience is what I might have done with said R9.

What about an HW50 in.20?  At 12ish fpe, would the pellet still loop more than the .177?  My guess is yes, but it's all hypothetical to me, lacking .20 cal experience.

That said, I guess I do enjoy the energy level of the silver streak: it flips my steel targets at 50 ft with just five pumps.  My crosman 100 and my r7 (in .177) cannot flip them. 

[eeler1]

I had a .20 cal R7, and found it to be kinda fun.  You can watch the pellet in flight, like a curveball headed towards home plate.  But, yeah, that was before we had all the fancy scopes with christmas tree reticles so it was holdover guesstimation.  Inside 25 yards was pretty good shooting, though.  I was mainly just plinking around with it, sometimes keep used it to keep the pests out of the blueberry patch.  I sold it after a while, looking for a more suitable distance shooter.  Now, with pcp guns, the .20 cal is great, as you can easily get whatever velocities you want.  No more loopy shooting.  Don't know where you can find a budget .20 pcp though, at least not unless your budget is pretty big.

[nced]

A few personal comments:

"What about an HW50 in.20?  At 12ish fpe, would the pellet still loop more than the .177? "
Pellet trajectory is pretty much dependent on velocity plus the "sectional density" of the pellet. As long as all your shooting distances are at your "zero distance" the caliber doesn't matter very much since the placement is easily determined (air dead on for all shots). The issue is when the range is different than than your zero distance, especially when the larger pellet can drop an inch or more for a mistake of 10+ yards past your zero distance. The "zero distance" chosen can also affect the holdover so I use a 30 yard zero for my .177 R9/HW95. With the trajectory of a good high sectional density .177 dome pellet at 850ish to 900ish fps I can "brain" a squirrel by holding "dead on" from roughly 17 yards to 30 yards. Something I also do is to shoot targets at various distances from 10 yards to 50 yards with the zero set at 30 yards. Here is a target I made to check out the trajectory of a 7.9 grain die lot marked and dated boxed Crosman Premier with this home made target..........

Notice that with my setup the apex of the pellet trajectory is 3/16" above the 30 yard zero so a bit of "adjustment" is needed for a 20 ayrd shot and the poi is about 1/4" low at 35 yards.

When I started shooting Fielf Target matches a few decades ago I would mark the AO of my Bushnell Elite 4200 scope like this to get a "better handle" on the holdover/under needed for sharp focus distances at 12x and I would "guestimate" the holdover between 30 and 50 yards...........


A few years later I bought scopes with more "reticle aim points" and a larger side wheel for focusing so there wasn't as much need for the "mid range guestimation"...........

[splitbeing]

Impressive as always, Ed.  I like the symbols on the tape.  Am I right if I say that the symbols are representing where the bull should be relative to the duplex reticle?  For instance, the symbol that is a dot above a line means "aim with the bull just above the crosshairs"?

[splitbeing]

I had a .20 cal R7, and found it to be kinda fun.  You can watch the pellet in flight, like a curveball headed towards home plate.  But, yeah, that was before we had all the fancy scopes with christmas tree reticles so it was holdover guesstimation.  Inside 25 yards was pretty good shooting, though.  I was mainly just plinking around with it, sometimes keep used it to keep the pests out of the blueberry patch.  I sold it after a while, looking for a more suitable distance shooter.  Now, with pcp guns, the .20 cal is great, as you can easily get whatever velocities you want.  No more loopy shooting.  Don't know where you can find a budget .20 pcp though, at least not unless your budget is pretty big.

I did see AirForce has .20 pcps, but they're outta my price range and I was thinking a springer anyhow.

I might end up just enjoying my streak, but can I have just one gun in .20?

[nced]

At field target matches a lot of shooters use paper "dope sheets" as a reminder which mark to hold at different "sharp focus distances" and they actually mark the yardages and how many "clicks" to adjust their elevation turret similar to this...........


When I started shooting field target decades ago I only shot so I would have some off season target practice for squirrel hunting when I lived in West Virginia. It was too and slow for me when trying to get an "aiming solution" for a fidgety squirrel on a limb. Using a dope sheet I needed to first "sharp focus " the squirrel at high magnification, take note of what yardage lined up on the sidewheel, consult my separate dope sheet if I didn't remember the holdover, aim and take the shot. LOL, squirrels in West Virginia normally didn't sit still on a limb long enough to go through all the steps. My solution was to mark the sidewheel with symbols to represent the appropriate reticle feature to use for aiming. My "system" was only valid for one gun and scope magnification but it worked well for me at both field target and squirrel sniping. 

For example, I would focus sharply on a target, glance at the symbol on the AO/sidewheel and know exactly what reticle feature to put on the squirrel noggin. Here is one side wheel marking I used..........

The + represented "crosshair aimed on", a single dot represents hold the first reticle dot under the crosshair on.
Stacked "dot slash,dot" ., slash |, . represents "hold between the first and second dot under the crosshair.
Two stacked dots  .. means hold the second lower dot under the crosshair on the aim point, "so on and so forth".

"Regular class rules" allowed very high power scopes (I've seen a few 50x scopes) plus "clicking on" with the elevation turret so all aiming was done using the actual crosshair. In contrast the "hunter class" allowed only "hold over/ hold under" after focusing to an approximation of the distance to the target at 16x max (initially only 12x max was allowed).

[splitbeing]

Thanks for the clarification, Ed!  Your system and its rationale make more common sense to me than the too long for hunting dope chart process. [chuckling]

[airgunaut]

I bit the pellet today and pre-ordered the HW30S in .20 cal. Call it low-powered, but the other models are too long and heavy for me to consider for grab-and-go carry. Since I prefer open sights or peep, it won't be used for shooting beyond about 100 ft anyway, and mostly 33 to 80-something ft.

Although I don't expect to deal with replacing parts soon, what is most likely to wear down first? Breech o-ring?

[nced]

"what is most likely to wear down first?"

I'm Guessing (I've never owned a R7 or HW30) the spring if you're shooting relatively heavy .20 cal pellets with a lower powered plinker like the R7 or HW30. I really don't THINK the piston seal would fail quickly with the low powered plant. I can't imagine needing to replace the breech seal because the HW factory breech seals for my R9 & HW95 have lasted YEARS without needing replacement. 

For my heavier mid powered  .177 R9 and HW95 the spring (especially the factory HW spring vs a good ARH aftermarket spring) and then the piston seal.........

[splitbeing]

Excited to live vicariously, Pat, as you tell us about your .20 hw30...whenever it arrives.  Any projected timeframe?

[Back_Roads]

 .20 on the cheap, try a WTB for a Webley VMX, they were selling for about $50 some years ago.

[airgunaut]

Thanks, Ed. I expect to use the gun at least once a week if I like it, so low power but possibly high number of shots. I'll read and search for videos on maintenance.

Rion, what AOA told me was about 1 to 3 months, but it depends on the manufacturer's schedule and output, so I view that as the minimum wait. If it is longer than that, I might drive to pick it up instead of having it delivered here. Combine the pickup with a good look inside the store/picking their brains 🧠 if it's not busy, and a tiny vaca along the way back. I don't want to make that drive in summer.

[Bayman]

Hw20s aren't much faster than 22. Unless you're using the 11.42 maybe 20 fps  If you're trying to avoid loopy, it's not the way to go unless you're willing to roll the dice that your HW will do well with the 11.42 FTTs. IMO the R9 is bare minium HW power for 20 cal. They'll go 800 with the 11.42s and 725 with the other pellet, 13.73 JSB. Don't bother with the 15.89 heavies or 13.58 Barracuda because these guns loose alot of efficency with those two.

Fwiw I have 3 Hw95 family guns in 20 and one in 177. I've either owned or tuned multiple Hw30s, 50s and 95s in all three popular calibers.

HTH
Ron

[Rick67]

I had a .20 cal R7, and found it to be kinda fun.  You can watch the pellet in flight, like a curveball headed towards home plate.  But, yeah, that was before we had all the fancy scopes with christmas tree reticles so it was holdover guesstimation.  Inside 25 yards was pretty good shooting, though.  I was mainly just plinking around with it, sometimes keep used it to keep the pests out of the blueberry patch.  I sold it after a while, looking for a more suitable distance shooter.  Now, with pcp guns, the .20 cal is great, as you can easily get whatever velocities you want.  No more loopy shooting.  Don't know where you can find a budget .20 pcp though, at least not unless your budget is pretty big.

A 22xx or 13xx platform would be my suggestion.

Mountain Custom Airguns can do a .20 up to 24” for $295.

Must be my imagination but I think I remember the price not being close to $300 

Airgun Revisions also has a .20 MROD 👍

[Rick67]

I think I do prefer .20, just haven't spent much time with the caliber yet.

I recently acquired a silver streak from mike baker.  Nice to have what I was missin'! [chuckling]

I don't think I can swing an HW in .20 from AoA or Krale.

The pellets are really nice. They're the perfect size.  A Platonic pellet, if you will [chuckling].

I think I recall you being an owner of an Anniversary model 362 that doesn’t shoot.

That would be a perfect candidate for a MCA .20 LW barrel 👍

I’m curious with the caliber myself and it’s not getting any cheaper.

[splitbeing]

I have a disco barrel for the 362 anniversary now, rick, just haven't getten around to putting it in.  The screws on the receiver of the parts gun are stripped so it's not a quick and easy task.

Where does one acquire an MCA LW .20 barrel?