The P-17 is a steal. You have to get one if you like to shoot pistols. Shoot that while you skim a gun fund.Then pounce on what your research tells you. I research for months and then buy the shiny one.
A P 17 is not a competition pistol and you will not get into a good competition pistol for $300. The v 10 (Gamo compact) is about the best cheap pistol and it has adjustable width rear sights and grips. A used Daisy 717 or 747 will have target styled sights but no width adjustment or grip adjustment unless you get custom grips. All of the single pump pistols cause you to move your hand grip while loading every shot. If shooting with friends, buy a P17. If competing grow a bigger bank account but have fun either way.
Once you get your P17, there are number of threads on tuning/mods to refine an already great pistol.Example https://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=166452.0You didn't say where your practice range will be. There are some useful targets for both 10M and 5M in the shooting match gateshttps://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?board=17
If getting the P17 one of the best mods is doing the champagne glass mod to the loading end of the barrel. It makes loading pellets so much easier.https://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=203277.msg156376882#msg156376882
how do any of you feel about buying used guns? I know buying used items in any circumstance has risk involved but have most of you had good results when buying used guns or would you advice against it?
Quote from: WhatUPSbox? on August 06, 2024, 06:16:51 PMOnce you get your P17, there are number of threads on tuning/mods to refine an already great pistol.Example https://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=166452.0You didn't say where your practice range will be. There are some useful targets for both 10M and 5M in the shooting match gateshttps://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?board=17oh this will be very helpful, one things i was kinda worried about is i have zero experience doing anything with the gun haha so i wouldnt really know how or what i should be doing however I gotta start somewhere. Im not 100% sure on where my practice range will be, i will most likely be just doing it at my house because i dont live in a very populated area so there arent really much options in regards to air pistol classes or groups. Ill probably just make my own set up at home and measure it out etc
We all love accuracy but what does accuracy really mean? Accuracy from a bench rest is nice and the tiny groups are fun to photograph and feel good about. I'm guessing that my P-17 is not as accurate as my V-10 which is not as accurate as my IZH 46M, from a bench rest but they are all probably pretty close and I've never checked because it's not that important. 10M competition is not from a bench rest. Offhand accuracy is a whole nother world and is dependent on more than theoretical bench rest accuracy. With competition level guns your money hopefully buys a MUCH better adjustable trigger, much better sights (irrelevant if you use aftermarket optics), better ergonomics, better reliability.Although I did some trigger work on the P-17, it's not at all in the same league as the more expensive guns. In offhand shooting, the trigger matters a LOT. I can't overstate how important the trigger is when you are competing. It's not everything but it's a LOT. Adjustable triggers are a wonderful thing and is missing on the P-17. The P-17 still has a pretty nice trigger for a $30.00 gun but not at all compared to a $300.00 or more gun.The P-17 sights are pretty good although the fiber optics don't contribute anything for 10M shooting. More expensive guns will definitely have much better sights and a longer sighting radius. I don't particularly like the adjustment controls on the P-17 and have found that Point Of Impact moves around a bit. This never happens on my IZH 46M. Again if you use aftermarket optics the deficiencies of the stock sights are irrelevant. Ergonomics are a very much a personal thing so check out every gun you can. Adjustability is a nice feature which the P-17 lacks but the P-17 ergonomics might be perfect for some. I like a grip that makes my hand feel welded to the gun. I ended up using a soldering iron to melt/stipple the grips on the P-17 which was a huge improvement.You'll care about reliability and consistency if you start practicing a lot. I've had to fiddle/repair the P-17 a few times. Minor stuff but I did have to take it apart a few times while firing it approximately 4,800 times. The V-10 has been rock solid reliable over 3,800 shots. I've had to fix the IZH 46M a couple times. Minor stuff but one time a tiny internal spring broke and I made a new one by modifying a ballpoint pen spring. The IZH46M is up to approximately 21,500 shots. Shooting/practicing a lot usually means you better know how to fix your guns but breakdowns are often simple to repair and the guys here can tell you how to fix anything.Nothing matters more than the skill level of the shooter. Consistent, quality practice is a big deal. By quality practice I mean making every shot count and focusing on the fundamentals of marksmanship on every shot. Your skill will improve more by shooting 20 quality practice shots every day onto a 10M target and tracking your scores than blowing off 200 shots at tin cans on a weekend (no matter how much fun tin can shooting is). Marksmanship is a mental game as much as it is a physical skill. A good shooter with a mediocre gun will beat a mediocre shooter with an excellent gun every time.All this is just my personal experience and opinion. I'm not much of an expert and certainly not exactly an Olympic level shooter. I have been competing in various forms of offhand pistol competition since the early 70s with occasional minor league success. I also hope I don't sound like I'm disrespecting the P-17. It's a wonderful gun for $30.000 and a great choice to see if you like pistol target shooting.
The Gamo Compact or V10 is so much easier to cock and shoot than the P17 or HW40. I have strong arms and hands but find the Beemans to be annoying to cock in comparison. A long session gets to be tedious. I also like the Gamo target grips better. It's trigger is easy to improve as well. Definitely prefer the Gamo to a Daisy 717. All day.
The P3/P17/HW40 cocking effort is surprisingly high, but it can be done much more easily with a technique that uses mid and upper body instead of only the hands and wrists. You would need to be good with kneeling repeatedly. I am a small, 60-something woman and have done sessions of 100+ pellets from the P3. That is more than I can concentrate well for, but it is doable. Also, I switch cocking sides when I shoot shooting hands, so that distributes the “weight training” over both sides.The point about keeping shot numbers fairly low but with sharp mental/physical focus is good advice. If nothing else, your eyes are likely to get tired until they become accustomed to shooting. They need training, too.An eye doctor warned me long ago that my eyes would feel tired after going through a standard eyesight exam. All that focusing on things both fuzzy and sharp, letters getting smaller and smaller, simulating different corrections, WAS tiring indeed. Small muscles are involved in focusing. You have three different distances to account for when shooting, even with focus concentrated on the front sight.This will apply no matter which pistol you start with, assuming you use open sights.
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