Hatsan Endcap Identify

[H95Kidd]

What model Hatsan does this endcap fit? It was included in a Type1 Vortex package for a 95. But this one does NOT look like it fits the 95??

[H95Kidd]

What model Hatsan does this endcap fit? It was included in a Type1 Vortex package for a 95. But this one does NOT look like it fits the 95??

Another pic---

[A.K.A. Tommy Boy]

Hi Joe.
This is a quote from mikeyb.

This image shows the difference between a coil spring Mod95 and a Vortex Mod95.
The vortex 95 endcap is the one shown in the bottom of the picture.

https://michaeljbernard.files.wordpress.com/2023/02/20230218_103434e.jpg?w=1024


Best Wishes - Tom

[H95Kidd]

Hi Joe.
This is a quote from mikeyb.

This image shows the difference between a coil spring Mod95 and a Vortex Mod95.
The vortex 95 endcap is the one shown in the bottom of the picture.

https://michaeljbernard.files.wordpress.com/2023/02/20230218_103434e.jpg?w=1024


Best Wishes - Tom

Tom, I saw that pic Mikey posted, but the one I took the pics of (the one that was included with the replacement Type1 ram) is somewhat different. Also, it was NOT exactly the same as the "factory" installed endcap in my 95 Vortex rifle, or I probably would have used it when I installed the new ram. Is it customary for Hatsan to include a new endcap with a replacement Vortex ram? I'm not sure what to make of it...

[mikeyb]

Looks like it might be Mod85 Vortex endcap. Different safety design than Mod95.

[H95Kidd]

Looks like it might be Mod85 Vortex endcap. Different safety design than Mod95.

Mikey--Thanks for that info. I knew it was slightly different than my 95 Vortex. I'm not sure what that cap was doing inside the package with the new Type 1 ram (as an aside, the ram I received still has the "bleed" screw feature), as I specifically ordered the ram for the 95? If there was a new endcap FOR THE 95 in there, that would have made a lot more sense to me. For those that have ordered new Vortex rams direct from Hatsan, has there typically been a new endcap included with the ram? Again, just a curiosity on my part.

[mikeyb]

Hatsan may be adding the Mod85 style endcap to  Mod95 Vortex parts orders intentionally. The action internals are very similar.

I suspect it is more likely to be an error on their end.

[Phoebe]

FWIW I recently received the same non-95 end cap with a new Type 1 Vortex Cylinder ordered specifically for a 95 Vortex. The Cylinder I received has no bleed screw.

[H95Kidd]

FWIW I recently received the same non-95 end cap with a new Type 1 Vortex Cylinder ordered specifically for a 95 Vortex. The Cylinder I received has no bleed screw.

That's interesting (the inclusion of the non-95 cap).... even if it doesn't make a lot of sense? Its got to be a mistake on Hatsan's part. Also, regarding the bleed screw, I ordered my type1 Vortex ram around late June or early July, and the ram I received definitely HAS the screw. If you ordered yours very recently, perhaps this is an indication Hatsan has decided to eliminate the bleed screw from Type1 rams? One less thing in terms of production...

[Phoebe]

Received the bleederless cylinder from Hatsan only 2 or 3 wks. back. So, yes, very new. There were also some tolerance issues compared to the Hatsan Cylinders I've used in the past forcing me to remove material from the ends of the flanges/ears receiving the cross pin.

[H95Kidd]

Received the bleederless cylinder from Hatsan only 2 or 3 wks. back. So, yes, very new. There were also some tolerance issues compared to the Hatsan Cylinders I've used in the past forcing me to remove material from the ends of the flanges/ears receiving the cross pin.

Steve, can you elaborate on this? Was the material removal necessary to get the endcap cross pin holes to line up or was it some other alignment problem? I didn't have any clearance/tolerance issues when I replaced mine.

[Phoebe]

The overall length was too long by about .025 which is too much of an error to get the cross pin in line with the holes in the compression tube. I could have made a undersized pin, but that's too much slop for the constant battering. I ended up chucking the body of the cylinder in a lathe and facing .025 from the machined fitting at the base (the ends of the two flanges the crosspin will go thru).

Hope this helps. For some reason I haven't been able to get pictures to post.... 

FWIW I told Hatsan.

[H95Kidd]

The overall length was too long by about .025 which is too much of an error to get the cross pin in line with the holes in the compression tube. I could have made a undersized pin, but that's too much slop for the constant battering. I ended up chucking the body of the cylinder in a lathe and facing .025 from the machined fitting at the base (the ends of the two flanges the crosspin will go thru).

Hope this helps. For some reason I haven't been able to get pictures to post.... 

FWIW I told Hatsan.

So, the .025" excess length (of the "ears") was preventing the two crosspin holes that retain the plastic ENDCAP from properly lining up, and not the single crosspin hole that positions/retains the Vortex ram itself? I ask because if you machine the end of the "ears" (that face towards the endcap) this would not change the alignment of the RAM retention crosspin hole to the ram and receiver tube, but WOULD change the relationship of the ram itself to the endcap. Just trying to understand what the alignment issue actually was, just in case I run into this down the road. Like when I need to replace the ram in my 95 again .

[Toxylon]

I remember reading this past summer about the new Vortex rams being not user adjustable. A huge blow to their usability / versatility.

[Phoebe]

The extra .025 would shift everything behind it rearward. If I used it as it was I would have had two pairs of crosspin holes out of alignment. As received, it would have been impossible to reassemble the gun. If you take a 95 Vortex apart you'll understand what I'm attempting to explain.

[Ronno6]

FWIW I recently received the same non-95 end cap with a new Type 1 Vortex Cylinder ordered specifically for a 95 Vortex. The Cylinder I received has no bleed screw.

Does Hatsan not sell the Type 1-B ram for the Model 95??

[Phoebe]

I'm not aware of the difference between the Type 1 and 1-B, but the new cylinder I mentioned above (now installed in Model 95) reads "Type 1" on the body, I.e., not 1B.

[Ronno6]

I'm not aware of the difference between the Type 1 and 1-B, but the new cylinder I mentioned above (now installed in Model 95) reads "Type 1" on the body, I.e., not 1B.

Per Hatsan's list, the 1-B fit only the model 88, 95 and 99
I don't know if it is the end block that is different.......
If you receive an honest to goodness mod 1-B designed for those rifles, the original breech block would work and the one supplied with the replacement ram, if different, would not be required.

Anyway, it is pretty simple to reseal those rams, if yoiu  have the tools..

[H95Kidd]

I'm not aware of the difference between the Type 1 and 1-B, but the new cylinder I mentioned above (now installed in Model 95) reads "Type 1" on the body, I.e., not 1B.

Per Hatsan's list, the 1-B fit only the model 88, 95 and 99
I don't know if it is the end block that is different.......
If you receive an honest to goodness mod 1-B designed for those rifles, the original breech block would work and the one supplied with the replacement ram, if different, would not be required.

Anyway, it is pretty simple to reseal those rams, if you  have the tools..

All I can say is that I ordered a Vortex replacement specifically (that would be a type 1-B) for the 95, but received one marked type 1. The endcap that was included with the type 1 Vortex was NOT usable on my 95, as it was totally different. The Vortex ram, however, was identical down to the bleed screw. Re your statement about it being "simple" to reseal the Vortex ram, I'm not sure I would describe it that way! I know it can be done, and your "tools" qualifier is really key here. Also, assuming you DO get it resealed, you have to have a way to refill it to approx 125 Bar or therabouts...  That means access to, at a minimum, a good hand pump and Hatsan fill probe. Simple? I would describe the process as "do-able". As you mentioned in another post, the Vortex ram can be filled, IF your receiver tube is drilled for it, after installation in the rifle. This would make assembly a bit easier. I'll probably find out just how "simple" this process is when the replacement Vortex that currently resides in my 95 craps out again . 

[Ronno6]

The "Type 1-B" nomenclature comes from Hatsan'sVortex ram listing:  https://hatsan.com.tr/vortex-gaz-piston-en/  (Thanks, mikeyb...)

I believe the ram itself just says "Type 1"
The

I lump the pre-charging equipment under the "special tools" category.
The process itself is straight forward:
Remove the ram
Clamp in a vise
Heat the 1" or so beneath the brass gland
Remove the gland using an 18mm open end wrench
Remove ram rod
Allow to cool
Extract the old O-rings using an appropriate tool..be careful not to mar the brass bore...
Clean the O-ring grooves...
Install new O-rings inside gland and outside
Clean the threads on tube and gland
Clean out the inside of the cylinder
Insert rod thru gland w/ a drop or 2 of silicone oil
Put 4 or 5 drops of silicone oil into the cylinder
Apply Loctite to gland threads
Reassemble...

If you can air up after installation, great!
If not, air it up, then reassemble the rifle using a suitable spring compressor...

If the ram has a bleed screw, make sure it is tight!

OK. Maybe not simple, but certainly not complicated IMO