HW30S 177 Pellet Grain

[splitbeing]

The ftt greens seem pretty consistently sized. The one's I've had. 5.25 grains.

[EMrider]

Is 8.2 grain ok for the HW30S?

What is the maximum grain one would recommend to ensure smooth operation and longevity of the rifle?

I frequently shoot JSB 10.3s in my R7s as they deliver great accuracy and have put many thousands down the barrel. 
R

[Yogi]

I would suggest you buy a sampler of different pellets.  There is a fellow in the classifieds that will put together a sampler pack of pellets that you choose.  You can see what head sizes and pellet weights your barrel likes.

-Y

[Oldgringo]

Is 8.2 grain ok for the HW30S?

What is the maximum grain one would recommend to ensure smooth operation and longevity of the rifle?

I don't know what the maximum grain would be but, l do know that my three HW30S' and my Beeman R7 prefer the 7.44 gr. AA's.

Ooops, typo.  That should have been 7.33 gr. not 7.44.

[GlennS1956]

Barrel seasoning or (fouling in a good way) is very important to accuracy. It can take a hundred sometimes a thousand shots to season a brand new or newly scrubbed and polished barrel. Shooting six hard lead Crosmans can almost undo all that soft lead fouling or seasoning. The hard lead scrapes it right out. If you continually shoot Crosman pellets or more Crosman than soft lead brands the barrel becomes seasoned with hard lead.
Hth
Ron

Thanks for posting this.  When I bought my Silent Cat I ordered 1000 Crosmans with it.  My R9 is supposed to arrive today with 2000 JSB and H&N pellets.  So now I'll shoot all the remaining 700 Crosmans through the Silent Cat, and then clean it.  Would it be OK to use a brass bristle brush that one time to do the scrubbing?

[Bayman]

Barrel seasoning or (fouling in a good way) is very important to accuracy. It can take a hundred sometimes a thousand shots to season a brand new or newly scrubbed and polished barrel. Shooting six hard lead Crosmans can almost undo all that soft lead fouling or seasoning. The hard lead scrapes it right out. If you continually shoot Crosman pellets or more Crosman than soft lead brands the barrel becomes seasoned with hard lead.
Hth
Ron

Thanks for posting this.  When I bought my Silent Cat I ordered 1000 Crosmans with it.  My R9 is supposed to arrive today with 2000 JSB and H&N pellets.  So now I'll shoot all the remaining 700 Crosmans through the Silent Cat, and then clean it.  Would it be OK to use a brass bristle brush that one time to do the scrubbing?

Glenn I wish I could give you an answer. I've bronze brushed all my Weihrauch barrels that have had or may have had Crosman pellets run through them. It's also a part of every Weihrauch tune I've done on used guns since I don't know the guns history.

I can't vouch for the Silent Cat's barrel. I'm not sure of the integrity of the material. If it's a steel barrel the bronze brush should be fine.

When in doubt I'm a big proponent of JB bore paste. Perhaps a few tight patches of that though the barrel several times will remove the hard lead. Just expect the accuracy to be terrible until the bore is seasoned. It can take quite a few pellets to season a freshly scrubbed bore. Every barrel is different even among the same model rifle. This is all a pita and why a stay with soft lead pellets. So far I haven't cleaned a bore on a gun that's used solely soft lead pellets. It's a little more expensive but the results and reduced maintenance is worth it to me.

Good luck to you.

[GlennS1956]

Thanks!

[nced]

When I used the boxed hard lead Crosman Premiers one of the main "negatives" was the fact that the lead/antimony alloy would foul the bore rather quickly and the fouling was a "BEAR" to remove. My brother's .177 R9 bore got so fouled that the pellet lead packed in the rifling to the point that the rifling lands were completely buried and all multiple pulled patches did was to polish the fouling. To remedy the situation my brother soaked the bore witgh Hoppes #9 for an hour, then used a .177 brass brush to successfully remove the fouling.

A properly fitting die lot marked and dated boxed Crosman Premiers  (each box had a few that were undersized) were the most accurate pellet from our R9s so we started lubing our pellets to prevent the lead fouling from "packing like solder" in the rifling. First we tried FP10 which was used frequently by some at that time and it did minimize the bore fouling and the fouling was rather easily removed with a few pulled patches. The issue for us and the FP10 was that lubed Premiers stored in our pellet pouches would oxidize with a "goopy gungy" coating that fouled our bores even quicker. The next "pellet lube" we tried was aerosol Slick50 One Lube and it worked perfectly with proper application. Bore fouling was minimized, bore cleaning was easy using pulled patches and the pellet remained "corrosion free".

Slick50 OneLube will diesel if it gets into the pellet skirt so we would simply spritz a small amount in on the bottom of a dedicated pan, spread a film of lube on the pan, dump in a box of CPs, gently stir the pellets to distribute a film only on the pellet rifling surfaces, then dump the lubed pellets in the pellet pouch..........


I used to tune my .177 R9 to shoot my hard lead CPs at 900-910fps plus I didn't sort my pellets prior to shooting. I have a suspicion that when I loaded a "loose fitter" and shot it the rifling would shave a bit of lead at the choke and then the following pellet would pack the "shavings" into the rifling so perhaps this was part of the "fouling issues" I had when shooting unlubed CPs. After a while I presorted my CPLs before shooting by dropping them into the leade and visually noting how how it sat before pushing it home. If the pellet visually dropped too deep into the leade it was shaken out and another was dropped. If it visually sat at the normal height it would be pushed flush with the pivot block and shot. I can tell from experience that both my brother and I would probably have an "unexplained" flier if a "pee-wee" that dropped too deep was shot.

The .177 R7/HW30 doesn't shoot pellets near the velocity of the R9/HW95 so perhaps bore fouling wouldn't be an issue however dry hard lead Crosman pellets are "known bore foulers".

[SpiralGroove]

Thanks Ed,
I'll wash and lube my boxed CPL's with T-9 as recommended by Hector. 
Since I have many guns, the positive is my 5 boxes (6,000 pellets) should last me a few years of more ... .

In the mean time you can determine what my next HW95 pellet should be .

[nced]

Thanks Ed,
I'll wash and lube my boxed CPL's with T-9 as recommended by Hector. 
Since I have many guns, the positive is my 5 boxes (6,000 pellets) should last me a few years of more ... .

In the mean time you can determine what my next HW95 pellet should be .

I still have about 6 boxes of die lot marked and dated CPLs left but a while back I started looking for alternatives since the boxed CPLs became "unobtanium". So far the two brands "in the running" are the 8.4 grain 4.52mm Air Arms domes and the 8.64 H&N Field Target Trophy..........




I haven't done any longer distance testing yet but perhaps I will before long.

[SpiralGroove]

Thanks again Ed,
I have many tins of 8.44 JSB's and H&N 8.64's, but haven't bought the AA 8.44's.

However, in my shooting have noticed AA version of JSB's seem to be a whisker more accurate.

[nced]

Thanks again Ed,
I have many tins of 8.44 JSB's and H&N 8.64's, but haven't bought the AA 8.44's.

However, in my shooting have noticed AA version of JSB's seem to be a whisker more accurate.

Before trying the 4.52mm 8.4gr Air Arma domes I bought several tins of supposedly 4.52mm 8.4 grain JSB Exacts and found the head sizes to be "all over the place". I also bought a tin of 4.50mm labeled JSB Exacts and compared the two tins. There were Exacts from the supposedly 4.52mm tins that had head sizes smaller than those from the 4.50mm tin and visa versa. I always found that the supposedly 4.52mm Exacts were "loose fitters" in the leade of my .177 R9 however this was driven home by a THAGC field target match a few years ago. During the match I had a "dry fire" and was annoyed at myself for neglecting to load a pellet for the shot. Well, later in the match I had ANOTHER dryfire and was very annoyed at my absentmindedness to "forget" loading a pellet the second time. As the match continued I reloaded another supposedly 4.52mm Exact but when I was relatching the barrel I SAW the JSB flip out of the leade before "latch-up". LOL...I wasn't previously forgetting to insert pellets, the "loosies" were flipping out of the leade before the actual "latch-up"!.

That fiasco prompted me to actually check the pellet head sizes of the remaining 9 tins of supposedly 4.52mm Exacts. Here are the results..........
JSB Exacts:


AA Domes:
I ended up selling those tins of Exacts "fer cheap" however later I tried some 4.52mm 8.4 grain Air Arms domes and found that even though they were produced in the same JSB plant (rumor claim using Air Arms supplied dies) and found that for whatever reason the AA dome head sizes were more consistent and closer to the advertised 4.52mm...........


Measuring pellet heads really isn't an "exact science" as pertaining to the "1/100th of mm" but I've developed a "satisfactory for my purposes" method that at least gives consistent accuracy based on the actual caliper reading. I'm not very concerned with the exact "third metric place reading", just that all pellets start with a consistent head size.  1st I needed a digital caliper with pretty good resolution and testing the accuracy with a micrometer test bar..........
 
The procedure.........


There are those that like to use "holes in a plate" to sort/size their pellets but I'm not convinced that this is any more accurate than my "caliper method" because I've found that pellet heads aren't always "perfectly round" finding that some .177 pellets were as much as .02mm out of round which was verified using multiple measurements at opposing sides of the pellet heads........
Holes in a plate...........


Measuring pellets is very tedious but if the pellet heads are large enough to be "swaged to size" when pressing them into the leade then I really don't think that that the "second decimal point" is very important (LOL, I could be wrong). To eliminate measuring pellet heads to determinr "ovality" (two measurement for each pellet plus a few more "verifying measurement") I made up pellet sizers for my particular break barrels. My newer .177 HW95 has a smaller leade than my older .177 Beeman R9 so I used to size pellet heads to 4.48mm for the HW95 and 4.52mm for the Beeeman R9. Later I found that a 4.50mm "measured head size" was
accurate from both of my HW springers so I only use my 4.50mm sizer (4.50 mm per my digital caliper)...........


As a side note......... I tried to use my 4.48mm pellet sizer to sort out the supposed 4.52mm JSB Exacts and found that a HIGH percentage of the pellets dropped through the die without any sizing. I did the same with my stash of 4.52mm Air Arms domes and almost all were sized to 4.50mm! I also found that H&N FTTs had larger heads that fit snugly in my leade without sizing which is probably the reason they were accurate without "molestation" however I still sized them because it only takes about 5 seconds to size via the "homemade pellet sizer" plus each sized pellet is guaranteed to be as round as the die itself.......

[Denby95]

I shoot the H&N FTT 4.52 cause Field Supply sells them for 8.99 a tin 

[jmmartn]

Another vote for the JSB 7.33 gr. They work well for me in my HW30

[nced]

Another vote for the JSB 7.33 gr. They work well for me in my HW30

I tried 7.33 Air Arms Falcons in my mild tune .177 HW95 (7.33 AA @ 900fps and CPL @ 850fps) along with 8.4 Air Arms domes and 7.9 grain die lot marked and dated boxed Crosman Premiers at 50 yards and the "light weights" where the least accurate and the boxed CPLs the most accurate. The boxed CPL (now "unobtgnium") grouped about 1/2" ctc and the 7.33AA grouped about 1 3/8"-1 1/2" ctc. LOL, still not bad for "bucket and sticks" groupings at 50 yards .........

[tjk]

Is 8.2 grain ok for the HW30S?

What is the maximum grain one would recommend to ensure smooth operation and longevity of the rifle?

Tom,...as long as you don't abuse your 30 with excessive dry firing,.... you can pretty much shoot whatever weight pellet you want including the barracuda's. These guns are solidly built so longevity really isn't and issue as far as that goes. But for optimal performance, accuracy, and power longevity, you would be wise to stick with any pellet in the 7 to 9 grain area. Just whatever shoots the most consistently,.....that is where you will have to try a few different pellets and see what your 30 prefers. The HW30/R7 is an awesome gun once you get it dialed in with the right pellet!!  Please kept us updated on your progress. tjk

[SpiralGroove]

Is 8.2 grain ok for the HW30S?

What is the maximum grain one would recommend to ensure smooth operation and longevity of the rifle?

Tom,...as long as you don't abuse your 30 with excessive dry firing,.... you can pretty much shoot whatever weight pellet you want including the barracuda's. These guns are solidly built so longevity really isn't and issue as far as that goes. But for optimal performance, accuracy, and power longevity, you would be wise to stick with any pellet in the 7 to 9 grain area. Just whatever shoots the most consistently,.....that is where you will have to try a few different pellets and see what your 30 prefers. The HW30/R7 is an awesome gun once you get it dialed in with the right pellet!!  Please kept us updated on your progress. tjk

Too heavy a pellet just lessens spring life, but they can be replaced very easily.  The gun itself will last more than a (human) lifetime if properly cared for.

Jim Mccari (ARH - Spring God) feels anything above 9 grains in .177 is too much even for the R1/HW80S, .... and will diminish spring longevity.
This was his comment to me a few years back .

[Yogi]

Is 8.2 grain ok for the HW30S?

What is the maximum grain one would recommend to ensure smooth operation and longevity of the rifle?

Tom,...as long as you don't abuse your 30 with excessive dry firing,.... you can pretty much shoot whatever weight pellet you want including the barracuda's. These guns are solidly built so longevity really isn't and issue as far as that goes. But for optimal performance, accuracy, and power longevity, you would be wise to stick with any pellet in the 7 to 9 grain area. Just whatever shoots the most consistently,.....that is where you will have to try a few different pellets and see what your 30 prefers. The HW30/R7 is an awesome gun once you get it dialed in with the right pellet!!  Please kept us updated on your progress. tjk

Absolutely!
FWIW-There is a fellow in the classifieds, no relation just a happy customer, who will custom make a sampler pack of different pellets.  4.51 head or 4.52 head on the same pellet type.  Well this guy will send you 25 pellets to find out...Just a very happy customer and the easiest, and cheapest way to find out what pellet your gun/barrel likes best.

-Y

[MDriskill]

For whatever it's worth - every individual gun will vary a bit of course - my older R7 is so much smoother-shooting and more accurate with the Air Arms Falcon (a 7.3 gr roundhead made by JSB), than with any other pellet, that it's rather startling. JSB's own-label Exact 7.3 is also very good.

[Oldgringo]

Thanks again Ed,
I have many tins of 8.44 JSB's and H&N 8.64's, but haven't bought the AA 8.44's.

However, in my shooting have noticed AA version of JSB's seem to be a whisker more accurate.

Me too.