30 fpe .177 pcp

[Back_Roads]

 I have an .177 AT44 10 PA that is a pinholer with pellets, never tried slugs as of yet, seemed no need to LOL
Yeah a closeout At44 could be a cheap option also.

[EdinGa]

I have an .177 AT44 10 PA that is a pinholer with pellets, never tried slugs as of yet, seemed no need to LOL
Yeah a closeout At44 could be a cheap option also.

I don't have a .177 but I haven't had good luck with slugs in Hatsan barrels so far.

[anti-squirrel]

The 20.5 NSAs in my Leshiy Classic can easily surpass 30 FPE in .177.    I don't own the .177 barrels... but I can throw the 28.5 NSA in .22 at 900 FPS from a 350mm barrel, topping 50 FPS by over 1 foot-lb of energy (@muzzle).  Just doing the math, my Leshiy- with the HUMA  reg and plenum combination- if I get the 350mm barrel in .177, 30 FPE is easy. 

From a pellet-vs-slug perspective, JSB Beasts, which I know for certain are very accurate in my Leshiy barrels (both the "factory" and the aftermarket Alpha barrels) shouldn't have a performance drop-off moving from .22 to .177- and if I can hit 960 FPS in .22, I'm certain the .177 barrel in 350mm with a Beast will surpass 30 FPE with ease.  Like I mentioned above, I have the Huma regulator and plenum in my Leshiy, so I have more "top end" at my disposal. 

[Ribbonstone]

Are likely several .177 PCPs that could make it to 30 foot pounds with JUST the provided adjustments.   Others you'd have to modify.

Problem is that normal weight pellets (10.3gr) often won’t shoot well at the speeds it takes 1150fps to get a 10.3gr pellet up to 25-30 foot pounds. Rule of diminishing returns makes that speed pretty darned hard to get to.

A 16.2gr pellet (there are two) only needs to get up to 950fps...which is a lot easier to do.

Most high energy shooters have moved on to slugs rather than pellets.


Years back I gave it a try with a BAM50.  Wasn’t heard to get it up-tuned (rifles were known for running  fast, most of the posts were about calming them down). Only 16.2gr. pellet then was the Eun Jin; a hit-or-miss pellet for accuracy.   This BAM50 was a miss but I got to the energy.

More recently the JSB 16.2 was hit...energy and accuracy enough to justify long shots.

Run head to head with a .22 shooting 15.9gr. JSB’s at the same speed (more energy) over the same target distance, the windage was enough better with the .22 to notice.
 
Don’t think that mattered in the real world. Windage is all about how well you guessed the wind.  The “winner” is the shooter with the better guesser.

[Wayne52]

Travis has a thread going about high powered .177 non pcp air rifles, so I thought I would ask about pcps. I said 30 fpe in the title, but somewhere around 25 or a little under would work too. I'm specifically looking for something to shoot 10.3 JSB Knockouts close to 1000 fps. Keep in mind that I'm not a high end kind of guy. 

Eddie I don't know if DAR is still making the .177, I do know they have the Gen 3's now but not sure about the calibers.  When I am finally able to buy one of the .177 BBT molds when they come out I'll be getting that .177 back out of the moth balls.  I bought that gun when they first came out.

[JMJ in NC]

My .177 Akela is tuned for afullmag of 16 gr Seneca Hunter pellets at just under 30 fpe. The thread on bargain gate about the .177 Akela has lots of info, especially good stuff from Thane, but I went power hunting tune.

What’s your setup?

I usually shoot 10.34 grain JSB Exact Heavies, but have Monsters (13.4) Beasts (16.2) on hand.

JMJinNC

[rsterne]

Even the JSB Monsters, at 13.4 gr. are marginal for use at 30 FPE, that works out to 1004 fps.... If I was trying to achieve that energy, I would use either the 16.2 gr. Beasts, or a slug of 14 gr. minimum.... Using 950 fps as a target velocity (maximum advisable for pellets) makes it easy to use to calculate the weight, FPE / 2 = weight in grains.... You can push slugs a bit faster, up to about 1050 fps, depending on the slug....

Bob

[EdinGa]

Thanks everyone, I'm learning a lot I never considered. I'm specifically interested in shooting the 10.3 Knockout slugs. 100 percent of my shots will be under 50 yards and probably 90 percent under 30. I want light and fast for short range pesting mostly. I'm not looking for a long range target setup. If I need to lower my power expectations, I'm more than willing to do that. One of the driving issues is the underwhelming performance of slugs at lower velocities.


At the moment it's looking like I might have to buy a cheaper gun and try to re-barrel it. I may even have to look at slug liners. I just don't have big bucks to throw at this right now. One thing is for sure, I came to the right place for answers. I appreciate the input from all of you.

[Spacebus]

Window shopping for a 30-ish FPE .177 PCP I like the Hatsan Vectis; fairly light, OEM irons, lever action, and advertised at 29 FPE. I've always liked the gun and think it would be a fun target gun or competent hunting rifle. I'm not in the market, but maybe some day I could be if it turns out to be a good .177 slugger. I haven't really been a fan of .177 pellets, but tiny FN/RN 177 slugs piqued my interest for good BC and small holes in game. Then reading some of the posts on this forum about PB .172 barrel liners using those "heavy" NOE .172 slugs really got my attention. Those builds are beyond my skill level, but a 32 grain slug moving 1000-ish FPS is pretty close to 22lr performance, and that's very appealing to me. My .25 cal Eagle Claw comes close, but so far it only likes swaged 33-44 grain HP slugs, which make MASSIVE holes in things on the exit wound. I lost the top halves of two red squirrels after hitting them in the boiler room with a 33 grain Apollo slug leaving the muzzle at 950 FPS, and one was at 25-30 yards away.

Anyway, a bit of a ramble, but I'll be following the smallbore PCP space.

[EdinGa]

I don't know if my wants are just different or maybe I'm dreaming of something that's not possible currently. All I'm really looking for is something that will push a 10 grain .177 slug fast enough to expand reliably at 50 yards and under.


I know could use pellets, but I'm not satisfied if I'm not tinkering with something I don't really need.

[Spacebus]

I don't know if my wants are just different or maybe I'm dreaming of something that's not possible currently. All I'm really looking for is something that will push a 10 grain .177 slug fast enough to expand reliably at 50 yards and under.


I know could use pellets, but I'm not satisfied if I'm not tinkering with something I don't really need.

Living about 1,000 feet from the shoreline I can't get .177 pellets to fly straight past 50' on most days. Plus my .177 collection is just a 901 and Ruger Airhawk. A .177 slug might buck the wind a little better and put smaller holes in animals.

[EdinGa]

I don't know if my wants are just different or maybe I'm dreaming of something that's not possible currently. All I'm really looking for is something that will push a 10 grain .177 slug fast enough to expand reliably at 50 yards and under.


I know could use pellets, but I'm not satisfied if I'm not tinkering with something I don't really need.

Living about 1,000 feet from the shoreline I can't get .177 pellets to fly straight past 50' on most days. Plus my .177 collection is just a 901 and Ruger Airhawk. A .177 slug might buck the wind a little better and put smaller holes in animals.

In my experience, they don't expand at all below 900 fps and some don't expand even beyond that. It might be a good way to save pelts. My daisy 35 with the 880 barrel seems to like 10.3 gr Knockouts.

[Spacebus]

I don't know if my wants are just different or maybe I'm dreaming of something that's not possible currently. All I'm really looking for is something that will push a 10 grain .177 slug fast enough to expand reliably at 50 yards and under.


I know could use pellets, but I'm not satisfied if I'm not tinkering with something I don't really need.

Living about 1,000 feet from the shoreline I can't get .177 pellets to fly straight past 50' on most days. Plus my .177 collection is just a 901 and Ruger Airhawk. A .177 slug might buck the wind a little better and put smaller holes in animals.

In my experience, they don't expand at all below 900 fps and some don't expand even beyond that. It might be a good way to save pelts. My daisy 35 with the 880 barrel seems to like 10.3 gr Knockouts.

Ideally I want something that can send the upcoming NOE 16g FN BBT slug at 1000 FPS, although getting the NSA 12.5g slugs up to 1000 FPS would probably be just as good if they don't expand. My swaged 33 grain 25 cal HP slugs definitely expand at 950 FPS, wayyyy too much expansion.

[EdinGa]

My Cayden pushes the 17.5 NSAs just over 900 and I haven't had much luck with them expanding. It shoots them like a laser though.

[Wayne52]

Eddie the best expanding slugs I've used in an airgun have been the BBT hollow points,  I've actually shot a chipmunk straight on at about 25 yards with the Sentry in my signature and the slug traveled the full length of that large chipper, I've shown the pic of it quite a bit but might as well show it again.  Pure lead really expands great for sure. All my cast stuff has been tested 24BHN with pure lead (99%).  That's even ammo that's aged as well
as freshly cast. I'm REALLY looking forward to the .177 BBT mold that's supposed to be coming out soon



It actually launched that chipper back about 2 feet off the log that it was on.

[EdinGa]

Eddie the best expanding slugs I've used in an airgun have been the BBT hollow points,  I've actually shot a chipmunk straight on at about 25 yards with the Sentry in my signature and the slug traveled the full length of that large chipper, I've shown the pic of it quite a bit but might as well show it again.  Pure lead really expands great for sure. All my cast stuff has been tested 24BHN with pure lead (99%).  That's even ammo that's aged as well
as freshly cast. I'm REALLY looking forward to the .177 BBT mold that's supposed to be coming out soon



It actually launched that chipper back about 2 feet off the log that it was on.

I agree with you on that, Wayne. I'm really looking for something lightweight and fast in .177 though. Maybe the new .177 BBTs will be the answer.

[Back_Roads]

 I have a .177 QB78 that I am planning on putting the Safe Pack, I just received, in and see what it does with slugs, have my home cast, and some NSA offerings around to try from 12.5 up to 21 gr IIR.
 Will start a thread when that happens, might be this weekend.

[EdinGa]

I have a .177 QB78 that I am planning on putting the Safe Pack, I just received, in and see what it does with slugs, have my home cast, and some NSA offerings around to try from 12.5 up to 21 gr IIR.
 Will start a thread when that happens, might be this weekend.

I'm interested. I was just looking at the QB Chief 2 plus last night.

[miksatx]

how bout a bara1100z .177? i can see what my tanker will do. might have a few nsa 12.5s hp.
Full hammer spring. 3000 to 2400
Shot count: 11
Low: 907
Hi: 977
Avg: 949
STD Dev: 21.1
Spread: 70.0

1/13/23 3:09:45 PM,977
1/13/23 3:10:00 PM,970
1/13/23 3:10:14 PM,970
1/13/23 3:10:24 PM,963
1/13/23 3:10:33 PM,958
1/13/23 3:10:41 PM,956
1/13/23 3:10:48 PM,946
1/13/23 3:11:59 PM,944
1/13/23 3:12:08 PM,923
1/13/23 3:12:20 PM,928
1/13/23 3:12:33 PM,907
 

[EdinGa]

how bout a bara1100z .177? i can see what my tanker will do. might have a few nsa 12.5s hp.
Full hammer spring. 3000 to 2400
Shot count: 11
Low: 907
Hi: 977
Avg: 949
STD Dev: 21.1
Spread: 70.0

1/13/23 3:09:45 PM,977
1/13/23 3:10:00 PM,970
1/13/23 3:10:14 PM,970
1/13/23 3:10:24 PM,963
1/13/23 3:10:33 PM,958
1/13/23 3:10:41 PM,956
1/13/23 3:10:48 PM,946
1/13/23 3:11:59 PM,944
1/13/23 3:12:08 PM,923
1/13/23 3:12:20 PM,928
1/13/23 3:12:33 PM,907

That's not bad. I have been looking at the Barra, so I'll definitely keep it in mind. Thanks for the suggestion.