Solving barrel droop with non removable Weaver rails

[pappa]

I have come up with a solution for barrel droop that will only work if you have a weaver mount. Most people shim up the rear ring either in the bottom of the scope cradle or under the mount where it clamps to the rail (or both). This is very workable if you only need a very small amount of shimming. But I have tried out 2 other methods that work quite well and possibly only requires altering one ring out of a set and can correct greater droop that shimming can correct.

Method 1: Get an extra set of rings from a different manufacturer than your current set but matches the height description of the current set, such as low or medium (it also helps if they are cosmetically compatible). One of these sets will very likely be shorter than the other. Using a caliper, if needed, use the ring with the least depth between the scope trough and the bottom (the part that rests on the Weaver mount) for the forward ring and the other (thicker) ring for the rear ring and mount the scope. Center the scope dials and attempt to zero the scope. If the front ring proves to be too short, then we went too far with this and we either need to try another manufacturer's rings and start over or I apologize for getting you into this mess. However, this has worked well for me.

Method 2: This is the surest method if you do your part and not get over exuberant with trimming and this also keeps you from having to order another set of rings. Note: This method only works if the bottom cross bolt is removable.

Remove the bottom cross bolt from the mount  Place the ring upside down in a vice or clamp that will hold it securely to be operated on (Be careful with pressure to keep from scaring the ring faces or use aluminum vice jaws). Using a file that fits comfortably within the ring's floor space, file off a small amount of the bottom of the ring's floor evenly all the way across, keeping the file as level with the ring as possible. When you are satisfied with what you have removed, remove the ring, put it back together, put it on the front of the scope and mount the scope to the rifle. Center the scope dials and attempt to zero the scope.

If the point of impact still cannot be brought within a comfortable range, remove the scope and front ring and try filing a little more off of the bottom of the ring's floor and repeat this process until you are comfortable with the impact point. In the end, you might want to sand any rough file marks off of the ring with fine sandpaper before finalizing the process. This will minimize the possibility of rough file marks collapsing under clamp pressure and loosening the mount.

Method 2 is the surest and cosmetically best approach to this and if you are careful with filing, extremely reliable.

Either of these 2 methods can save a bunch of worry and trouble if you ever experience barrel droop on a rifle that has a non-removable Weaver mount.

[RedFeather]

Can that induce stress in the scope tube since the rings are slightly out of line?

[dkwflight]

Hi

I have heard of mount manufactures that make mounts with built in drop compensation. The ones I have heard of make mounts for powder burners.
The outcome is the same as filing the front mount as mentioned earlier.
A good hand with a file is cheaper.
Go slow and check your work also start with the scope centered as mentioned in other posts.
Make an adjustment and remount the scope and take a couple of careful shots to check your work.

The other place to check is the breach on barrel cockers. Make sure the breach is in metal to metal contact. You can remove metal from the breach face to raise the impact point.
This is assuming the lock up is solid and the pivot is tight.

The last is a care full upward bend of the barrel. Bending the barrel is not such a cockamamie idea if done in small amounts and carefully.

[pappa]

Can that induce stress in the scope tube since the rings are slightly out of line?

No more stress than shimming the rear mount which is the most common remedy.

I have used this method more than once and the scopes always seem unaffected. Never see any external metal stress after scope is removed either.

[dkwflight]

Hi

If you are worried about the scope tube, take a piece of 1" bar and some valve grinding compound. You can then lap in the scope mount so they are in line.
I have done this with some very expensive scopes and mounts. Even the expensive mounts, unshimmed were slightly out.
Lapping the mounts will help prevent mount marks on the scope.

[dkwflight]

Hi

The first picture on this site shows a BSA adjustable base.

http://web.mac.com/photomark/iWeb/Airgun%20Adventures/Diana%20RWS%2034%20Spring%20Upgrade.html

[pappa]

Hi

The first picture on this site shows a BSA adjustable base.

http://web.mac.com/photomark/iWeb/Airgun%20Adventures/Diana%20RWS%2034%20Spring%20Upgrade.html

Dennis, This posting is for non-removable Weaver bases. The html shows a dovetail mounted rail which I don't think will help us.

[pappa]

Hi

I have heard of mount manufactures that make mounts with built in drop compensation. The ones I have heard of make mounts for powder burners.
The outcome is the same as filing the front mount as mentioned earlier.
A good hand with a file is cheaper.
Go slow and check your work also start with the scope centered as mentioned in other posts.
Make an adjustment and remount the scope and take a couple of careful shots to check your work.

The other place to check is the breach on barrel cockers. Make sure the breach is in metal to metal contact. You can remove metal from the breach face to raise the impact point.
This is assuming the lock up is solid and the pivot is tight.

The last is a care full upward bend of the barrel. Bending the barrel is not such a cockamamie idea if done in small amounts and carefully.

To support Dennis' suggestion on barrel bending, the following web site has instructions with photos for a magnificent barrel bender that can be built at home. It was developed and posted by our own CharlieDaTuna. It is under the "Charlie's Barrel Tool" category of the page.

http://charliedatuna.com/Airgun%20Info.htm

Thanks, Dennis, for the suggestion.

[Kailua]

Anyone heard of or tried Burris Zee Signature scope rings?  They have removable shims to compensate for different angle in barrel droop.  Like to know if they work well.

[pappa]

Anyone heard of or tried Burris Zee Signature scope rings?  They have removable shims to compensate for different angle in barrel droop.  Like to know if they work well.

I have seen them and understand the concept and would dearly love to get a set and try them out - but I can't stand the thought of $40+ for a set of rings. Maybe if I were rich LOL.

They are steel rings with concave insides that are lined with synthetic split rings that are tapered all the way around to allow the inner rings to be rotated around the scope, thus changing the angle of the scope on the front and rear mounts. The reason for the concave arrangement is to allow for angle changes of the scope without stressing the scope tubes. One BIG plus with this design is that not only can you adjust for barrel droop, but you can adjust for sideways variations. They are available for both Weaver and dovetail mounting.

An absolutely ingenious concept and design. Just wish that I had thought of it first.

[dkwflight]

Hi The burris ZEE rings work very well.
I have a set on a powder burner.
They come in weaver style and a "Universal dove tail" A reverse dovetail.
Too bad they don't come in the 11mm dovetail we can use.

BKL has a dovetail to weaver adapter. Looks like they are around 1/2" tall. add that to the scope mount.  Too bad BKL does not have a drop compensator mount.

[K_sqrd]

BKL Dovetail Compensated mount ...

http://www.bkltech.com/1x4x0-6-DC-007-Scope-Rings-Unitized-Dovetail-p/bkl-260d7.htm

Don't know if this fits your needs.

[Pete]

well ...yer havn't solved the barrel droop''
yer just jerry rigged the rings to work around the prob..
Solve the prob..then yer won't need to use a band aid...

[dkwflight]

Hi

I did a little research( Very Little)

https://www.pyramydair.com/product/bsa-1-pc-mount-w-1-rings-11mm-dovetail-adjust-a-scope-without-taking?a=1816

https://www.pyramydair.com/blog/2007/07/bsa-adjustable-scope-mount/

I just found these discontinued,

Optics planet.com is where I found this

BSa has a different system, I haven't seen these before.  

BSA Optics Adjustable Aluminum Scope Ring Mounting System (BSAARA)
BSA Optics
Store Home » BSA Optics + Riflescope Mounts, Rings & Bases » BSA Optics Riflescope Mounts, Rings & Bases » BSA Optics Adjustable Aluminum Scope Ring Mounting System
BSA Optics Adjustable Aluminum Scope Ring Mounting System

[john]

Anyone heard of or tried Burris Zee Signature scope rings?  They have removable shims to compensate for different angle in barrel droop.  Like to know if they work well.

I also popped for those and I was worried because of some bad reviews out there but they are great...love 'em!

[pappa]

I just don't understand you guys. This posting applies to WEAVER rails and people keep suggesting dovetail alternatives?  Read the heading!!!

[Kailua]

I had done this, with the scope centered.  Shot a given distance and measured the amount of drop from the point aimed.  Then calculated the the angle.  Had taken a measurement from the back to the front of the rings at what ever distance they would set on the receiver.  Then calculated the height needed on the front and back of the front ring to get the right angle need then using a 3/4'' drum sander to get the slight bevel on the ring.  Checking with a caliper that the heights were maintained.  Same with the rear scope ring.  Checked with a straight edge to make sure the bevel from front to back ring was straight.
Oh and there was a member who had a suggestion somewhat like dkwflight's.  Use a 1'' wooden dowel with sand paper to get a bevel on the scope ring.

[Tarheel]

Guys,

Check out this website . . .

http://www.mac1airgun.com/droopers.html

Be sure not to miss the "CUSTOM DROOP" section !

Dave

[bluesdaddy]

When mis alignment is suspected always lap your rings in to eliminate stress on the tube. I lap always.

[ccfree]

I've lapped in  a Russian scope that wanted to twist on a real gun it worked so well I did it on the remainder of my scope rings. I have used epoxy and a small shim on the rear ring.
Is anyone working on correcting the problem not the symptom?
I'd think something on the lines of an adjustable cocking arm to apply upward pressure should do it.
Possible using a softer gasket and stronger spring in the chisel detent.
 I remember there used to be pellet guns that came with a barrel lock on top of the gun.