What caliber do you think is the most versatile?

[Luis Leon]

The theoretical versatility of the .30 and above calibers in airguns are vast. But how many shooters are actually plinking at sub 12 FPE? And then taking out sparrows, and then finally an elephant with an airbolt? Covering the vast range with one caliber? In theory yes, in a practical sense not so much. In a general sense I believe that the .22 is most versatile (price, variety, availability). At some point a powder burner does make more sense.

[Nomadic Pirate]

The theoretical versatility of the .30 and above calibers in airguns are vast. But how many shooters are actually plinking at sub 12 FPE? And then taking out sparrows, and then finally an elephant with an airbolt? Covering the vast range with one caliber? In theory yes, in a practical sense not so much. In a general sense I believe that the .22 is most versatile (price, variety, availability). At some point a powder burner does make more sense.

Hahahaha, moving the goal posts
ok let's play that game.

So now is, ho yes .30 and .357 are more versatile, but who does really use them ? it's not practical !!!!!! LOL .....I do, as I've shown you I target practice in the yard, I take squirrel sized game and I don't have elephants but I hunt the biggest toughest game I have around and if I had bigger I would do to.

falling back to ..." Ho well at a certain point just bust out the firearms " as got nothing to do with the discussion at hand.

Also as much as I search, .......price, variety, availability doesn't show up in the definition of "Versatility" LOL

[Glem Chally]

The theoretical versatility of the .30 and above calibers in airguns are vast. But how many shooters are actually plinking at sub 12 FPE? And then taking out sparrows, and then finally an elephant with an airbolt? Covering the vast range with one caliber? In theory yes, in a practical sense not so much. In a general sense I believe that the .22 is most versatile (price, variety, availability). At some point a powder burner does make more sense.

Hahahaha, moving the goal posts
ok let's play that game.

So now is, ho yes .30 and .357 are more versatile, but who does really use them ? it's not practical !!!!!! LOL .....I do, as I've shown you I target practice in the yard, I take squirrel sized game and I don't have elephants but I hunt the biggest toughest game I have around and if I had bigger I would do to.

falling back to ..." Ho well at a certain point just bust out the firearms " as got nothing to do with the discussion at hand.

Also as much as I search, .......price, variety, availability doesn't show up in the definition of "Versatility" LOL

Yeah bit of a moving goal post there, price, variety have nothing to do with the original question. 

[Fate]

I'm pretty sure the buying public has voted... and it's the .22 caliber.

[Nomadic Pirate]

I'm pretty sure the buying public has voted... and it's the .22 caliber.

Again, it's not what you shoot of prefer, it's not supposed to be a subjective answer but an objective one.


Also ;

By saying " at a certain point I just bust out the firearms " .....right there you are admitting that your .22 isn't the most versatile because you need help at the other end of the spectrum : LOL

[Bryan Heimann]

That REX is a cool gun, but even if you max it out you can’t use it on big game in Texas and maybe some other places.  I only know for sure Texas, requires like 230 fpe or so.  Maybe it was 215, I can’t recall exactly just know it was over 200 fpe.  Might be able to use it with the air bolts though, I am not sure how the law is written with regards to “arrows”. 

I would use a 44 fpe .357 in the backyard if it was quiet enough, sure.  Still need a fairly decent backstop but a box of rubber mulch or something I think you could get away with that. 

But to shoot a trash panda, in the suburbs... only if I got a full trash can right behind him. Haha

You shoot trash pandas in suburbs with .25 cal airguns anywhere between 40 to 60 FPE .....a .357 predator at 44 FPE will penetrate less then a .25 at 44 FPE


My backstop is made of denim and other cloth ( I'll go see if I can find the thread when I made it ) and I shoot 200 FPE .50 into it,.......people make way to much of big bore airguns blowing through things   LOL


And this is the Mini-Carbine, my REX Carbine makes 225 FPE

Well it is because I have zero experience with big bores and very limited experience with PCP guns.

I have always compared them to pistols in my head.  I sure wouldn’t shoot a 9mm pistol in my backyard, even though I have nothing but woods behind me.  I live in a subdivision, and have neighbors very close by.

The Rex carbine is pretty close to a 9mm pistol.  But the Rex pistol with adequate sound suppression would do the ticket.

That said, it sounds like you’d still need two air rifles to cover all your bases even in a .357 gun.  Because the low powered gun is backyard friendly but you still want that 230 fpe hammer to really take advantage of the .357.

I have to agree that .357 Rex carbine is about the most versatile hunter in the airgun world.  But it still doesn’t cover all my bases, being a backyard friendly plinker that will still kill small game. 

I have a deer rifle that serves the purpose a big bore air rifle would do for me.  To move up to a .357 big bore would be purely for the fun and satisfaction, for me.  I don’t have a niche for one.

[Nomadic Pirate]

That REX is a cool gun, but even if you max it out you can’t use it on big game in Texas and maybe some other places.  I only know for sure Texas, requires like 230 fpe or so.  Maybe it was 215, I can’t recall exactly just know it was over 200 fpe.  Might be able to use it with the air bolts though, I am not sure how the law is written with regards to “arrows”. 

I would use a 44 fpe .357 in the backyard if it was quiet enough, sure.  Still need a fairly decent backstop but a box of rubber mulch or something I think you could get away with that. 

But to shoot a trash panda, in the suburbs... only if I got a full trash can right behind him. Haha

You shoot trash pandas in suburbs with .25 cal airguns anywhere between 40 to 60 FPE .....a .357 predator at 44 FPE will penetrate less then a .25 at 44 FPE


My backstop is made of denim and other cloth ( I'll go see if I can find the thread when I made it ) and I shoot 200 FPE .50 into it,.......people make way to much of big bore airguns blowing through things   LOL


And this is the Mini-Carbine, my REX Carbine makes 225 FPE

Well it is because I have zero experience with big bores and very limited experience with PCP guns.

I have always compared them to pistols in my head.  I sure wouldn’t shoot a 9mm pistol in my backyard, even though I have nothing but woods behind me.  I live in a subdivision, and have neighbors very close by.

The Rex carbine is pretty close to a 9mm pistol.  But the Rex pistol with adequate sound suppression would do the ticket.

That said, it sounds like you’d still need two air rifles to cover all your bases even in a .357 gun.  Because the low powered gun is backyard friendly but you still want that 230 fpe hammer to really take advantage of the .357.

I have to agree that .357 Rex carbine is about the most versatile hunter in the airgun world.  But it still doesn’t cover all my bases, being a backyard friendly plinker that will still kill small game. 

I have a deer rifle that serves the purpose a big bore air rifle would do for me.  To move up to a .357 big bore would be purely for the fun and satisfaction, for me.  I don’t have a niche for one.

No I don't need 2 guns, my Mini Carbine cocked at the low power shoots the Predator at 40 FPE, perfect for backyard target/Plinking ( done every day by a myriad of airgunners ) also perfect for small game.
Then I cock the same gun at the full power level and I can shoot the AirBolt at 475 fps which will kill every animal on the planet,....only one gun.

I would and never shot my Glock 19 in my yard, but shoot the .357 airguns any time I feel like


And,......your last point brings it home, the fact that I don't have to bust out my Henry to hunt big game shows the versatility of the .357 airgun.

[grand-galop]

If the caliber is above .30,  most of them can shoot arrows and pellet..

I'm not even  touching the cast slugs..

[Bullfrog]

The theoretical versatility of the .30 and above calibers in airguns are vast. But how many shooters are actually plinking at sub 12 FPE? And then taking out sparrows, and then finally an elephant with an airbolt? Covering the vast range with one caliber? In theory yes, in a practical sense not so much. In a general sense I believe that the .22 is most versatile (price, variety, availability). At some point a powder burner does make more sense.

In real life I actually do have a .30 that I hunt a wide range of different sized game with. My Texan SS .308 is a great squirrel gun with the power wheel turned down to the first line, set for a 2200psi fill, and loaded with any commercial pellet or the NOE light .30 cast pellets. I can then take the same gun, turn it up to just below the top power line, and fill it to 3000psi, and get 5 shots with a cast 97 grain NOE bullet or a 99 grain NSA bullet averaging 935fps and go kill a whitetail with it on a lung shot at 100 yards.

It may not run from sparrow to elephant but it definitely runs from squirrel to deer just by changing out the projectiles and adjusting the power wheel and fill pressure. 

The only versatility I care about is hunting versatility. One caliber and gun that can hunt every legal game animal in my state.

Now if I wanted to ponder not just one caliber but one projectile and tune, I would agree that a .357 shooting pellets would probably be it. I’ve already demonstrated on video how clean a .357 pellet can lung kill a deer with no expansion. It should do fine head shooting squirrel.

I currently don’t own a .357. I think a .45 shooting round ball could accomplish the same. My .45 Texan SS shoots cast round ball excellently. Accurate enough to head shoot squirrel at 50 yards. I would just hate to tear up the trees with the round ball after blowing the squirrels’ head up.

[Luis Leon]

The theoretical versatility of the .30 and above calibers in airguns are vast. But how many shooters are actually plinking at sub 12 FPE? And then taking out sparrows, and then finally an elephant with an airbolt? Covering the vast range with one caliber? In theory yes, in a practical sense not so much. In a general sense I believe that the .22 is most versatile (price, variety, availability). At some point a powder burner does make more sense.

Hahahaha, moving the goal posts
ok let's play that game.

So now is, ho yes .30 and .357 are more versatile, but who does really use them ? it's not practical !!!!!! LOL .....I do, as I've shown you I target practice in the yard, I take squirrel sized game and I don't have elephants but I hunt the biggest toughest game I have around and if I had bigger I would do to.

falling back to ..." Ho well at a certain point just bust out the firearms " as got nothing to do with the discussion at hand.

Also as much as I search, .......price, variety, availability doesn't show up in the definition of "Versatility" LOL

Yeah bit of a moving goal post there, price, variety have nothing to do with the original question.

It’s not moving the goal post. How can a PCP caliber be versatile if it’s too expensive to shoot regularly? Hundreds of rounds per week or more?  Or not available locally? Offers less choices in projectiles?

[Nomadic Pirate]

The theoretical versatility of the .30 and above calibers in airguns are vast. But how many shooters are actually plinking at sub 12 FPE? And then taking out sparrows, and then finally an elephant with an airbolt? Covering the vast range with one caliber? In theory yes, in a practical sense not so much. In a general sense I believe that the .22 is most versatile (price, variety, availability). At some point a powder burner does make more sense.

Hahahaha, moving the goal posts
ok let's play that game.

So now is, ho yes .30 and .357 are more versatile, but who does really use them ? it's not practical !!!!!! LOL .....I do, as I've shown you I target practice in the yard, I take squirrel sized game and I don't have elephants but I hunt the biggest toughest game I have around and if I had bigger I would do to.

falling back to ..." Ho well at a certain point just bust out the firearms " as got nothing to do with the discussion at hand.

Also as much as I search, .......price, variety, availability doesn't show up in the definition of "Versatility" LOL

Yeah bit of a moving goal post there, price, variety have nothing to do with the original question.

It’s not moving the goal post. How can a PCP caliber be versatile if it’s too expensive to shoot regularly? Hundreds of rounds per week or more?  Or not available locally? Offers less choices in projectiles?

I guess my friend you just have cotton in your ears and ham on your eyes LOL

But carry on, it's actually kinda funny,...LOL

[Nomadic Pirate]

The theoretical versatility of the .30 and above calibers in airguns are vast. But how many shooters are actually plinking at sub 12 FPE? And then taking out sparrows, and then finally an elephant with an airbolt? Covering the vast range with one caliber? In theory yes, in a practical sense not so much. In a general sense I believe that the .22 is most versatile (price, variety, availability). At some point a powder burner does make more sense.

In real life I actually do have a .30 that I hunt a wide range of different sized game with. My Texan SS .308 is a great squirrel gun with the power wheel turned down to the first line, set for a 2200psi fill, and loaded with any commercial pellet or the NOE light .30 cast pellets. I can then take the same gun, turn it up to just below the top power line, and fill it to 3000psi, and get 5 shots with a cast 97 grain NOE bullet or a 99 grain NSA bullet averaging 935fps and go kill a whitetail with it on a lung shot at 100 yards.

It may not run from sparrow to elephant but it definitely runs from squirrel to deer just by changing out the projectiles and adjusting the power wheel and fill pressure. 

The only versatility I care about is hunting versatility. One caliber and gun that can hunt every legal game animal in my state.

Now if I wanted to ponder not just one caliber but one projectile and tune, I would agree that a .357 shooting pellets would probably be it. I’ve already demonstrated on video how clean a .357 pellet can lung kill a deer with no expansion. It should do fine head shooting squirrel.

I currently don’t own a .357. I think a .45 shooting round ball could accomplish the same. My .45 Texan SS shoots cast round ball excellently. Accurate enough to head shoot squirrel at 50 yards. I would just hate to tear up the trees with the round ball after blowing the squirrels’ head up.

Precisely Travis,

those that try to argue against them is just because they never used them so they claim they are just a theoretical thing.

But plenty of us out there in the field can show the excellent versatility not theoretical but practical.


when experience is limited maybe is better to listen and learn then keep talking

[Bryan Heimann]

The theoretical versatility of the .30 and above calibers in airguns are vast. But how many shooters are actually plinking at sub 12 FPE? And then taking out sparrows, and then finally an elephant with an airbolt? Covering the vast range with one caliber? In theory yes, in a practical sense not so much. In a general sense I believe that the .22 is most versatile (price, variety, availability). At some point a powder burner does make more sense.

Hahahaha, moving the goal posts
ok let's play that game.

So now is, ho yes .30 and .357 are more versatile, but who does really use them ? it's not practical !!!!!! LOL .....I do, as I've shown you I target practice in the yard, I take squirrel sized game and I don't have elephants but I hunt the biggest toughest game I have around and if I had bigger I would do to.

falling back to ..." Ho well at a certain point just bust out the firearms " as got nothing to do with the discussion at hand.

Also as much as I search, .......price, variety, availability doesn't show up in the definition of "Versatility" LOL

Yeah bit of a moving goal post there, price, variety have nothing to do with the original question.

It’s not moving the goal post. How can a PCP caliber be versatile if it’s too expensive to shoot regularly? Hundreds of rounds per week or more?  Or not available locally? Offers less choices in projectiles?

I guess my friend you just have cotton in your ears and ham on your eyes LOL

But carry on, it's actually kinda funny,...LOL

The only one with cotton in the ears and ham on the eyes is the one getting nasty about it.

It’s just a discussion and if you get butthurt or wanna insult someone for a different opinion maybe you need to grow up a little.

Thread titled “what caliber DO YOU THINK is most versatile.”

We all know “YOU THINK” the .357 is the most versatile.  No need to bully anyone with a different opinion.

[Bryan Heimann]

Too big for your britches these days manny.  I get it.  You kill a lot of pigs.  Good for you.

[Nomadic Pirate]

The theoretical versatility of the .30 and above calibers in airguns are vast. But how many shooters are actually plinking at sub 12 FPE? And then taking out sparrows, and then finally an elephant with an airbolt? Covering the vast range with one caliber? In theory yes, in a practical sense not so much. In a general sense I believe that the .22 is most versatile (price, variety, availability). At some point a powder burner does make more sense.

Hahahaha, moving the goal posts
ok let's play that game.

So now is, ho yes .30 and .357 are more versatile, but who does really use them ? it's not practical !!!!!! LOL .....I do, as I've shown you I target practice in the yard, I take squirrel sized game and I don't have elephants but I hunt the biggest toughest game I have around and if I had bigger I would do to.

falling back to ..." Ho well at a certain point just bust out the firearms " as got nothing to do with the discussion at hand.

Also as much as I search, .......price, variety, availability doesn't show up in the definition of "Versatility" LOL

Yeah bit of a moving goal post there, price, variety have nothing to do with the original question.

It’s not moving the goal post. How can a PCP caliber be versatile if it’s too expensive to shoot regularly? Hundreds of rounds per week or more?  Or not available locally? Offers less choices in projectiles?

I guess my friend you just have cotton in your ears and ham on your eyes LOL

But carry on, it's actually kinda funny,...LOL

The only one with cotton in the ears and ham on the eyes is the one getting nasty about it.

It’s just a discussion and if you get butthurt or wanna insult someone for a different opinion maybe you need to grow up a little.

Thread titled “what caliber DO YOU THINK is most versatile.”

We all know “YOU THINK” the .357 is the most versatile.  No need to bully anyone with a different opinion.

Do you even realize that he's only argument for caliber versatility is cost of ammo LOL

So yeah it's getting kinda funny,..and if you think that's bullying, my friend you got thin skin

[Nomadic Pirate]

I'm actually here with an open mind, I started with .30, then someone made an argument for .25 and I saw the value of it and swang that way,
then someone made and compelling argument for .357 and it sounded good and I moved that way,...I even when out and tested certain aspects of the caliber I never did before

even when someone mentioned high power .22 I gave it a though

so I just didn't come here and stud my grounds, I moved, listened and evolved

that's what you supposed to do in this kinda threads

 don't have cotton in my ears or ham on my eye because I like to learn

[UnderPressure]

Backspin will make the trajectory flat over some useful range, but it won't make any given shot accurate.  Nor the next one.

How would one impart backspin to a lead ball?  By means of a sharp "speedbump" at the muzzle perhaps.  The end of the barrel would need to be raised or bent up slightly, to offset the downwards reaction from running into the speedbump.  The round ball will suffer considerable damage from running into the speedbump.

The problem here is that a plastic sphere is very strong for the change in momentum induces force required to induce backspin.  Lead is heavy and soft, so the change in momentum to impart that spin will take so much force that the lead is deformed significantly.

Perhaps a curved smoothbore tube, that is formed as part of a down-pointing spiral could be used.  It would roll a lead sphere more gently and use friction against the upper wall to roll the ball.  You might have better results with a steel ball....

That is very insightful. You make a good point about the higher  momentum (and softness) of the lead roundball in comparison to the airsoft BB which has lower momentum.

So there needs to be a way of doing this that is a lot more gentle than an abrupt speed bump (abrupt speed bump is basically what the default airsoft method is).

In Paintball I have seen two different types of "gentle" backspin adders used together on one gun. Google "MonsterSpin Paintball" and you will see a Youtuber (TrailsofDoom) who combines the Flatline curved barrel with the Apex 2 tip (which is basically an "R-hop" at the end of the barrel rather than at the beginning of the barrel). (NOTE: He mentions it is not necessary to use the Apex 2 tip with the curved flatline barrel (to get the extended range effect) but he likes to do it I believe for the purposes of doing trick shots).

http://www.020mag.com/en/news/1237/what-is-a-r-hop-

An R-hop still uses a protruding rubber bump to apply rotation onto the BB with friction, however it’s applied in a much gentler way over a longer period of time. R-hop is less like a speed bump and more like a gentle hill, both impart the same amount of backspin but an R-hop does it in a much gentler fashion.

Perhaps for lead ball (or even steel ball) a person could use up to three "gentle" backspin adders (e.g. R-hop at the beginning of the barrel and R-hop end of barrel + curved barrel) as a means of reducing the stress of the heavy round ball?

P.S. As far as accuracy goes smoothbore with backspin doesn't look too bad:



(I noticed he was sometimes changing his point of aim despite previously making a hit with his cross hair directly lined up. Wind compensation?)

EDIT: One criticism I have read about using backspin in paintball is that while it does add range it doesn't help the paintball break after it has slowed down while traveling over that extended range.

[Nomadic Pirate]

.

[darkcharisma]

why did i subscribed to this thread?

now someones talking about lead balls and back spin while Manny is thin skinning people.

man, one of these days...ill give gta a rest

[Luis Leon]

The theoretical versatility of the .30 and above calibers in airguns are vast. But how many shooters are actually plinking at sub 12 FPE? And then taking out sparrows, and then finally an elephant with an airbolt? Covering the vast range with one caliber? In theory yes, in a practical sense not so much. In a general sense I believe that the .22 is most versatile (price, variety, availability). At some point a powder burner does make more sense.

Hahahaha, moving the goal posts
ok let's play that game.

So now is, ho yes .30 and .357 are more versatile, but who does really use them ? it's not practical !!!!!! LOL .....I do, as I've shown you I target practice in the yard, I take squirrel sized game and I don't have elephants but I hunt the biggest toughest game I have around and if I had bigger I would do to.

falling back to ..." Ho well at a certain point just bust out the firearms " as got nothing to do with the discussion at hand.

Also as much as I search, .......price, variety, availability doesn't show up in the definition of "Versatility" LOL

Yeah bit of a moving goal post there, price, variety have nothing to do with the original question.

It’s not moving the goal post. How can a PCP caliber be versatile if it’s too expensive to shoot regularly? Hundreds of rounds per week or more?  Or not available locally? Offers less choices in projectiles?

I guess my friend you just have cotton in your ears and ham on your eyes LOL

But carry on, it's actually kinda funny,...LOL

The only one with cotton in the ears and ham on the eyes is the one getting nasty about it.

It’s just a discussion and if you get butthurt or wanna insult someone for a different opinion maybe you need to grow up a little.

Thread titled “what caliber DO YOU THINK is most versatile.”

We all know “YOU THINK” the .357 is the most versatile.  No need to bully anyone with a different opinion.

Do you even realize that he's only argument for caliber versatility is cost of ammo LOL

So yeah it's getting kinda funny,..and if you think that's bullying, my friend you got thin skin

Yes, Manny my ONLY point has been cost of ammo? Really? Then you are not reading. From sparrows to small hogs with a .22 with abundantly available ammo choices at good prices. Not knocking the thirty... for a high percentage of backyard shooters in small lots. It’s impractical to lob .30s in close proximity to neighbors, houses, etc. Are you killing pigs everyday? No. Same here I hunt and pests, but not everyday. I do shoot almost everyday. I couldn’t afford to shoot a .30 everyday... that makes it less versatile to me in a practical sense.