new caster learning

[triggertreat]

Bob Rsterne I believe has the same pot and has modified the spout for better results he states:  https://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=154047.msg155696284#msg155696284

[scion19801]

trigger thanks for that link. gonna have to try that. First i'm gonna try to make an adjustable mold block guide that i can use to adjust height from the pour spout and see if that helps. if not i'll take the nose off the spout. i'll update later on how i make out. time to head out to the garage.

[Bob Pratl]

trigger thanks for that link. gonna have to try that. First i'm gonna try to make an adjustable mold block guide that i can use to adjust height from the pour spout and see if that helps. if not i'll take the nose off the spout. i'll update later on how i make out. time to head out to the garage.

NOE makes a reasonably priced mold guide for the LEE bottom pour pot which works great for a non-pin molds so I had to mill out a slot to accommodate the bottom pin retainers that are on my NOE pellet molds.

[scion19801]

thanks for the info Bob Pratl,,,i got the pin retainers on my mould. i did hear about the noe mould guide. plus i don't think it will fit the lee pro pot IV. i think it may be the the lee 4-20 pot. I got the 10#.
So made another attempt last night. I ended up at 820"s for temp. but just did a weight check and my pellets are 26.6 grains. so even lighter yet.not good as i was getting 27.2 grains ladle pouring at 700. pulled down my mould as my cavity closest to my handels seem to wanna stick alot and have flashing at the skirt area. found some trash at the pin shoulder. so that should be good now. I tried my mould guide and it seems that if the lead stream doesn't hit the sprue plate hole center, then its gonna be a defective pellet.
so gonna notch the tip and try with it right tight to the sprue. may have to try a lower temp as well. if i am right the higher the lead setting the lighter the pellet becomes from what i'm seeing. My plate i made to heat my mould on top of the pot did seem to work very well.

[scion19801]

ok.. so i think i got this monster figured out now. i did try Bob Rsterne mod on the pot spout. man what a mess. Mine apparently had the flow wide open, hot lead everywhere. So i let the pot cool to solidify some. pulled off the handle assembly and tweaked my rod so that lift was limited. Now i can lift it repeatedly to the same amount and flow is more consistent, made a mold guide. Now as long as the pour hits the sprue hole fairly close i'm getting good casts now.
A long run will determine if all is well now. i was running at 820° range. If it is i'll post some pics of my setup. With any luck my ssr and heatsink should be here tomorrow. then i can get the pid running on the pot. Right now i'm using my Digital volt meter and my temp gauge.
Been thinking about using my meter to watch mold temp, but didn't get the hole drilled. where is the best place to put the prole hole? how deep should it be? i have two k-temp probes, and once the pid is running the probe in the pot will be for that, and my volt meter could be used to watch the mold. I tested both my temp probes, they are within .3° of each other.

[Madd Hatter]

https://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=174831.0

[triggertreat]

ok.. so i think i got this monster figured out now. i did try Bob Rsterne mod on the pot spout. man what a mess. Mine apparently had the flow wide open, hot lead everywhere. So i let the pot cool to solidify some. pulled off the handle assembly and tweaked my rod so that lift was limited. Now i can lift it repeatedly to the same amount and flow is more consistent, made a mold guide. Now as long as the pour hits the sprue hole fairly close i'm getting good casts now.
A long run will determine if all is well now. i was running at 820° range. If it is i'll post some pics of my setup. With any luck my ssr and heatsink should be here tomorrow. then i can get the pid running on the pot. Right now i'm using my Digital volt meter and my temp gauge.
Been thinking about using my meter to watch mold temp, but didn't get the hole drilled. where is the best place to put the prole hole? how deep should it be? i have two k-temp probes, and once the pid is running the probe in the pot will be for that, and my volt meter could be used to watch the mold. I tested both my temp probes, they are within .3° of each other.

Good to read you are having some luck.  I may have to give that spout mod a try.  Mine is the Pro 4-20 with a vertical spout which is better at stopping the flow I would assume than the angled rod, and it is slotted to adjust the flow amount.  I don't want to screw it up though with them not being available anymore.

I always have my molds drilled for a probe when ordering.  I use the NOE electronic temp gauge with probe.  The Madd Hatter link is what the hole looks like on mine, too.  Just make the hole where it will be convenient to use once you sort out how you want your handle and mold arranged (left-hand/right-hand).

[scion19801]

i think the single largest improvement was bending my handle to limit/adjust the flow rate. my handle now only moves about 1/8-3/8" inch. I can either cast like bob did with the spout notched, or just rest it on my custom mold guide and pour into it as long as it hits fairly centered. Found 790-830 is a good area to cast at.
Looked at my mold...not sure on the best placement of the temp probe. my mould is the 250-27-rf, it has the pin keepers on the left half with the handles facing you. this seems to be the common area to put the temp probe. so i may have to use the right side, bottom corner as it seems to be less clustered with screws and what not.
I was just getting into a rhythm last night and my spout clogged up twice on me.  just checked weight and it seems that i'm still on the lighter side. 27 grains. still need to figure out how to get lower temps and be good on casting as i think the higher temp is giving lighter casts. I'm running pure lead. I'll get some pics up shortly.

[scion19801]

pics as promised
1st pic is my movement of the spout rod that i tweaked to get same flow every time.
2nd is the notched and flattened spout. my custom adjustable mold guide, made out of oak.
3rd is my custom hot plate to hold my mold.

then the rest are my pid temp controller that needs a few more pieces added to be functional. Custom bow with aluminium top and bottom.

[triggertreat]

Looks like you are all set now!  I would add some ventilation to the PID controller to help the heat sink out. I went with the 40 amp SSR for a couple coins more.  Many uses...

With hotter lead and better fill out, the weight should be maxed with pure lead.  You may see some shrinkage though as the lead cools. 

[scion19801]

yeah i got the 40 amp ssr as well. Planning on cutting a hole and having the bottom of heat sink mounted outside on the bottom. figued that would help any heat issues. if they even get hot. but may have to do some hole, time will tell.

[scion19801]

got my pid all wired up and running. My auto tune takes forever to cycle. when i leave the factory settings for P, I & D it seems to do a decent job of being stable. then did an auto tune, and it would keep shooting 12 degrees high. gonna have to play around with the settings. just need to figure out what changes what.
did a small run and they all but 10 came out perfectly. this were running so smoothly it was scary. then i checked the pot temp with my other k type and volt meter. found a 20 degree difference. the pot was running colder. so put the changes into the controller and the temps now match on both. did another small run and they all went back into the pot. my flow had dropped off. did another calibration auto tune cycle. filled the pot back up and we'll see what the next run does.
the last auto tune seemed to be pretty stable on temp, but it seemed like it was struggling a bit to get to the setpoint before it would drop back down 6 degrees. i know some manual tweaking would probably clear this up. If it drives me to crazy, then i'll just reset to where the factory numbers were. weight checked last night's run and the majority were 27.2 grains. 3 of them were 27.0 grains. mould is finally adjusted properly and i didn't see much skirt flash finally. bottom pour is nice. the cycle rate is crazy. i think it took me maybe 30 min to cast out 100.

[scion19801]

So tonight my spout was dripping a lot and my flow was getting really slow. Even with constant cleaning. So I broke my pot down. My spout hole was pretty plugged up with oxides. Got the pot all cleaned up and out. Got my spout cleared out. Man does this thing flow lead now. Did a run of my 27.2 gr noe Hunter pellets and they all looked really good. Things are running way better now. Got the pot setup to run at 800°f on my next session to see how they do at that temp now that it's flowing the way it should.

[Wayne52]

I'm still using the basics myself, 4lb pot, pure lead from Rotometals and a hooded ladle from the mid 70's. I've been shooting only my cast stuff for the past couple years now and couldn't be more happy.  All my ammo is made right here in Michigan with molds that are built in Utah (NOE).  My most recent casting was another run with the 250-27-RF and they were all between 25.9g and 26.22 grains.  They're what I call my 26 grain Hunters and very comparable to the JSB 25.39's but heavier and softer.

[scion19801]

just weight checked mine. 26.8-27.0 gr. Love that variance. Manufacture's cant beat that per tin.
Anyone know if the new batch of NOE 250-27-rf hunters is dropping on spec?

[triggertreat]

As long as they shoot straight enough.  I cast more .249 slugs yesterday using the two other pins to see how they do.  All were cast at 735° and that work well using the new NOE guide for the 4-20 pot.


I'm just trying to catch up to Wayne's success.  I keep getting non-rounded looking bases.  They roll fine when sized, but it's clear the end of the bases look like they have flat sides in places, or out of wack regardless of temps or methods used.

[scion19801]

Keith.
are you talking about the 249-37-rf mold not give good bases? If so, check that your sprue plate is level and not to tight on one end or the other. Also how fast do you cut your sprues off? i do mine with a 3 count of the sprue freezing up. longer than that and it get tough to cut it by hand. I quit using a mallet to do that and find better results doing it with a gloved hand.

[triggertreat]

Keith.
are you talking about the 249-37-rf mold not give good bases? If so, check that your sprue plate is level and not to tight on one end or the other. Also how fast do you cut your sprues off? i do mine with a 3 count of the sprue freezing up. longer than that and it get tough to cut it by hand. I quit using a mallet to do that and find better results doing it with a gloved hand.

Yes, that's the mold.  I didn't cut off the sprues any sooner than 15 seconds past in this round.  I am always trying something different, but for this round I would primarily fill the slots and sit it on top of the pot while checking the previous four with a scale (this is after I get the mold temp up and get going good).  I didn't get in a big hurry with pouring or cutting this time.  Maybe that's the issue but I have went faster and more steady also with the same results.  I use a rubber mallet and it takes two strikes typically.

I don't like my plate too loose to come back around and bite me with heat on the back of the hand.  I don't generally wear gloves when casting (not good I know).  I did loosen the plate more (very floppy now) about a quarter way through casting as the bases didn't look good and was trying something different there.  They did look much better before ejecting them.  I also cleaned the plate and mold surface while hot just to make sure.  I also use lube on the plate hinge.

I did flip the sprue plate around when new because I am a lefty and wanted the NOE temp probe slot to connect opposite the handle end... Maybe I screwed up with that?

[scion19801]

temp probe slot?? I never seen this option on mine or even when i ordered it. i was hoping to get that with this mold. I try to cut my sprues the instant it freezes or just a sec after and i haven't noticed the cut pulling a flat spot of the 249 slugs. now the 250-27 hunter pellet mold of mine will do that if i'm not careful. but that is on the meplat edge.

[triggertreat]

temp probe slot? ? I never seen this option on mine or even when i ordered it. i was hoping to get that with this mold. I try to cut my sprues the instant it freezes or just a sec after and i haven't noticed the cut pulling a flat spot of the 249 slugs. now the 250-27 hunter pellet mold of mine will do that if i'm not careful. but that is on the meplat edge.

It's an option that reads "drill for probe" when ordering a mold.  That option wasn't there when ordering this mold, so I put my request in the PayPal notes.  NOE saw it because it came drilled for a temp probe.  I have NOE's electronic temp gauge, so they know what size and depth the hole needs to be.  I have all of mine drilled.  It typically cost $5 more.

I'll keep working with the bases, or call NOE about it.  I do cast another slug and don't have these base issues with that mold from NOE.