Powered up and seeking MAX power in .22 caliber ... Slugs in the near future ?

[Long_Gun_Dallas]

That's smokin for that barrel length.  I've been having great success with 36gr boat tail .218's  using a FX Crown.  Nearly hole in hole @100yrds.  I couldn't get any nsa's to group very well.  But others people/guns do.  I think I was overpowering them, thus the 36grs.

where or which? i cant find that particular 36gr bt you mentioned.

They're made by "Griffin"  out of Kentucky, I believe.  They sell slugs on eBay.  Have a massive variety of shapes and diameters. 

[Motorhead]

Just received my 2 boxes of Nielsen .22 cal 24.8 dish base hollow points.   Nice looking slug !
Tossed a couple in the Warp and shot across the crony .... 975 / 977 fps for a tad under 53 ft lbs power.  Where as the 23 flat bases were @ 1020 at 53 ft lbs.
Yea my tune is on the knee all right and more weight is not buying me any added Ft/lbs of energy.  ( Both .217 sized )

First chance i can get out ... up go's the 100 yard targets and we'll see soon enough what we have cookin

ALSO ... dug around my stash of barrels and found what is likely a 20+ year old 15mm HW .22 blank at @ 25" long ... 6 groove @ 16 1/2" twist with NO choke.
Machined it up today as an alternate to the 12 groove Choked LW currently on the gun.  Should prove interesting come testing time being there so different in rifling profile etc ...


Scott
 

[KnifeMaker]

Just received my 2 boxes of Nielsen .22 cal 24.8 dish base hollow points.   Nice looking slug !
Tossed a couple in the Warp and shot across the crony .... 975 / 977 fps for a tad under 53 ft lbs power.  Where as the 23 flat bases were @ 1020 at 53 ft lbs.
Yea my tune is on the knee all right and more weight is not buying me any added Ft/lbs of energy.  ( Both .217 sized )

First chance i can get out ... up go's the 100 yard targets and we'll see soon enough what we have cookin

ALSO ... dug around my stash of barrels and found what is likely a 20+ year old 15mm HW .22 blank at @ 25" long ... 6 groove @ 16 1/2" twist with NO choke.
Machined it up today as an alternate to the 12 groove Choked LW currently on the gun.  Should prove interesting come testing time being there so different in rifling profile etc ...


Scott

I'll be watching to find how our light slugs do in such a tight twist.  With the 15 1/2 inch 1-16 twist I got 998-1012 with the 29 gr. slugs. I am fitting a 1 in 20 twist for the light slugs tonight. Probably will go with a 20 to 22 inch barrel this time. The two CF tubes are curing as I type this.


If all goes well, will be testing tomorrow night using a high lume tight thrower light on the gun in order to watch the flight path down range. Really tells the tail. Or if the tail wags. The fairly fresh cast bullet show up like tracers in the scope. With nicks slugs a very light scrape on the base of the bullets should do the same. 


Mike

[Motorhead]

Just went out and did some preliminary testing with the Nielsen 24.8 slugs.
80 yards as previous to find my zero, screw around a bit not really going after accuracy ( tho seemed really good ) but more to get a marker of Efficiency at this power.

Those results having shot 31 shots at an average of @ 975 fps off the 500 cc tank it used exactly 400 psi .... efficiency @ 1.29 Ave FPE / Cu in  *this being at @ 52.4 ft/lbs energy.
All said numbers crunch@ 40 shots per fill 3000/2200 refill with gun at current settings.

Scott S

[HunterWhite]

Scott, too bad it's obsolete!
You could bottle that and sell it.

Hunter

[Motorhead]

Scott, too bad it's obsolete!
You could bottle that and sell it.

Hunter

Naw ... just purchase a JSAR Raptor Mini for similar performance.  After all the JSAR RAPTOR platform is in essence a highly evolved WAR with much refinement and that killer balanced valve with side lever cocking.

[bear air]

How was the accuracy at those velocities? I like how the rifle came together Scott sounds like you will be enjoying it for a long time. You really got it dialed in. That 2nd gen SS valve sounds really good. Power and efficiency what a combo! Do you think it would do good with a larger caliber as well? I hope you keep us informed on how this gun shoots.

[Blutroop]

Did you do any porting on your Jsar gen 2 valve tp or is it just as came from Jsar? I have a gen 2 valve but am still thinking about a lighter weight gun and haven’t even put all the marauder pieces together yet. Do you think the valve could handle 257?

[darkcharisma]

Just went out and did some preliminary testing with the Nielsen 24.8 slugs.
80 yards as previous to find my zero, screw around a bit not really going after accuracy ( tho seemed really good ) but more to get a marker of Efficiency at this power.

Those results having shot 31 shots at an average of @ 975 fps off the 500 cc tank it used exactly 400 psi .... efficiency @ 1.29 Ave FPE / Cu in  *this being at @ 52.4 ft/lbs energy.
All said numbers crunch@ 40 shots per fill 3000/2200 refill with gun at current settings.

Scott S

what is your plenum volume?

31 shots is excellent! i bet once you hit 60fpe that shot count gets cut if half.

[Motorhead]

Did you do any porting on your Jsar gen 2 valve tp or is it just as came from Jsar? I have a gen 2 valve but am still thinking about a lighter weight gun and haven’t even put all the marauder pieces together yet. Do you think the valve could handle 257?

As stated in the thread opener ...
JSAR SS-2 valve ( Raptor valve actually ) tho using a Custom light weight poppet w/ Custom balance chamber. 
So, the valve is NOT stock. The transfer port itself is also custom being internally TAPERED from the SS valves .280" exit at throat to the transfer ports exit at @ .220"

By AREA within the SS2 valve having a .280" throat, .125" stem it is @ equal in area  to .250 I.D. transfer path which would make it @ bore spec for a .257 build.
High Pressure and plenum volume would be required in doing so IMO.  My WarP can't do it being it lacks sufficient plenum volume as a regulated set up .. unregged perhaps

[Hobbyman2007]

Scott those are some really good base numbers for an “obsolete “ gun . Please post your findings with that HW barrel . I’m really curious to see how it works shooting bullets . 

[Motorhead]

Reading the above ... Ok I'll come clean on whats happening accuracy wise.  To recap what created the below shown target and series of events as it happened is as follows;

WarP as in OP, FITTED with the @ 24" HW 6 groove barrel with no choke. * 1-16.5 twist best i could measure.
NSA 24.8 bullet at .217 size ( New high speed manufactured version ) shot at @ 975 fps being just sub 53 ft-lbs
Lasered 80 yards to target, wind 2-5 mph and variable. Shot on a tri seat with shooting sticks.  16X magnification.


Started by getting a rough Zero with 21.3 grain Barracudas on another target sitting next to the quadrant.  That done loaded a 10 shot mag ( marauder mags used ) and started out ....

BOTTOM RIGHT that is 3 shots stacked, Adjusted scope to the left and up just a tad taking 3 more which hit the BOTTOM LEFT nearly stacking.
That done backed over to the right 1/2 the clicks previous and a few more UP clicks.  You can clearly see the GAP strikes up the middle between the Bottom sections. Further Up adjusting on the 9th or 10 shot ( last in Mag ) hit the center spinner which is 3/4"    From there a few more UP clicks and loaded another 10 shot mag.   All the damage on and flanking the center 3/4" dot is 10 shots more.

Yea the HW 6 groove shoots pretty dang well with the NSA 24.8's at 975 fps.  Not to shabby at all 

[Kinetic45^]

You could do what I did and discard the steel tube for an aluminum one that is longer (and lighter!) to give you more plenum. I know it leaves a gap between the regulator block and the front of the frame but I used that gap for a spare magazine holder I added.

Added 20cc to the stock volume and it works great.

Did the same on one of my FLEXs but there I added 2" additional to get 85cc. It's a titanium tube though. Sorry, no picture of the WARP, just the FLEX but you get the idea. The FLEX pictured has a .251 TJ's barrel and set at 3400 PSI shoots 50Gr slugs for 122 FPE (1050 FPS) This FLEX was modified to be a .22LR simulator... or as close as I could come to the 130 FPE of the .22LR.

I also took a short piece of 1" aluminum angle and attached it to the regulator block so one leg rises up between the two gauges and sticks up enough so that if the WARP rests on it's left side its resting on the guard and not the gauges.

[rsterne]

efficiency @ 1.29 Ave FPE / Cu in   *this being at @ 52.4 ft/lbs energy.

That pretty much says it all.... Those are great numbers, Scott, you can be proud of them.... 

Bob

[Motorhead]

Leaving the settings where they were … Tried some of the high speed manufactured NSA 23 grain flat bases which were smoken out at @ 1015 fps.

At the same 80 yard distance they were give or take @ 1 1/4" spread.  Yea a bit fast but still at closer ranges the impact damage would be likely devastating. ( tad less accurate that the hand swagged slugs )

Going to stay with the 24.8's and will be trying some @ 28 grain NSA's this coming weekend, which should shoot low/mid 900's which speed wise would be still in the sweet spot.

[bear air]

Learning a lot from this thread thanks Scott.

[Motorhead]

Been a spell sense updating this thread .... That following weekend did get to shoot nielson slugs heavier than the 24.8's i had been using.    NOT AS ACCURATE and not really sure why   * this in the 6 groove HW chokeless barrel.
Went back to the 24.8's in .217" and been shooting those all month with IMO very acceptable accuracy.    Just yesterday hiked out into the BLM property and set up some odd targets at 75 to 150 yards, sat on my stool and used shooting sticks.     Shot @ 40 at these ranges finding when steady could hit the 75 yard target which was @ 1" 10 for 10 proving yea its working pretty dang well.  The 150 yard target @ 1 1/2" being far more challenging tho was able to connect @ 3/10 and the misses where scary close.


With my previous noted VIEWING LIGHT around a seated slug using .217's need to get a box of .218's and see if better or worse ( staying with the 24.8 weight )

Scott

[screwwork]

Scott,
My .22 Prod w/JSAR SS Valve/Mrod barrel & choke removed/double tubed gun would get to max 50fpe with slugs/pellets so I backed off of the hopes of a 60fpe Prod slug idea and just tuned it for high 38fpe range in .177 or .22 cal.  Raptor Mini .25 cal slug gun will replace my .25 cal Mini-rod.   

Nice job on making a .22 slug gun out of the WarP, they are great little shooters! I have a small stash of NSA 28gr boattails that I bought a while back if you're interested in trying em out to see how they fare in our WarP I can drop em in the mail for you. NSA does make them anymore but if you can show they shot well enough maybe NSA can bring them back for the .22 cal Raptor fans?
Randy

[KnifeMaker]

Scott, I have found that a little light showing does not hurt performance. In fact, faster than fully in contact. Seems what little blowby there is, it is less effecting fps thanthe higher friction of a slightly larger slug.


I often use a sizer that shows a little light and continue to polish the interior of the die until accuracy is obtained and starts to drop off, then use a second die to give the spec's learned.  Even though you do not cast, there is no reason you cannot experiment with sizes at .0001 at a time to find perfection. Unlike pellets, such a tiny difference pays huge dividends.


I have also found that a .22 barrel larger in the bore. such as a TJ's or Redmans in .221 or.222 is faster with a given bullet. This is no doubt due to the larger base area to push on.


I now have the Raptor Mini at 72+ fpe with my hand cast at 38.7 grs. in a low cost Brownell's/Redman liner.


Can't wait to try the TJ's Travis is sourcing for it.     I think these guns are going to be World Beaters in the long range match game. 
MIke/Knife

[Motorhead]

Had a bit of DUMB LUCK today digging around in my piles of odd WAR / Crosman parts.
Back in December of 2019 when up in Shasta hanging with Travis, he was cleaning shop and had some parts and pieces for me from his years with WAR.  They were headed to the trash otherwise.
Had thought and visually had confirmed an air tube was in the pile, SHORT air tube ... WarP air tube, so i now have an extra ( Like I'll ever need another air tube ) tossing it when home into the odd pile of parts already stashed away.

Came across said tube earlier in the day and picked it up ... opened Safe and Picked up the WarP.   Well lookee there the tube in hand is longer than the tube on gun ... SCORE it's a FLEX tube being exactly 2" longer at end where drop block threads on.   It will fit the Warp chassis no problem !!!

With the WarP currently wearing the 24" HW barrel,Load up a magazine of H&N barracuda 21.4 grainers .... Over the chrony at @ 1040 fps
TAKE GUN APART ... Change nothing but Air tube & reassemble.
Same pellet over the chrony again ... 1130 fps  Picked up @ 90 fps and near 8 ft-lbs of energy.

WarP plenum length on the 1.058" I.D. tube is @ 1.100", the FLEX tube adds 2" making the plenum 3.100" long being an almost triple increase !!

Free power ... I'll take it !!

Scott S