Pest control, PCP recommendations (no FX please)

[Blacktalon6]

I would go for an Airforce if available.

[Ozman]

Probably not gonna be easy to get, and is priced pretty high, but I think an American Air Arms Evol would be perfect.  Barrels are threaded in, instead of using setscrews and orings.  Still probably gona have oring on the bolt and in other areas required for sealing the gun, but it's pretty hard to beat a tensioned threaded barrel for rugged reliability.  I don't understand why there are not more rifles available like that.

This is the range we have here in Australia for American Air Arms
gunroom.com.au/product-category/air-rifles/air-arms-air-rifles/
(sorry about the link format, I am not allowed to post proper links here yet because I'm a newbie)

Weird question, apologies if I missed it, but if longer ranges are your goal, why do you prefer a .22?  A .25 would be better suited and retain more energy down range.  Not saying one caliber or the other is wrong- just wondering about the .22 preference. 

The .22 pellet ammo is much more available here, is the main reason. And cheaper.  Longer ranges would be the exception; most shots 30-70m.

Condors are nice, highly adaptable guns...  You can add a regulator down the road, but I've never shot a regulated one, and I'm not sure how adding said reg would/wouldn't affect LOP.   

Thanks, I did not know you could add a regulator down the road. That's nice to know. I'm in contact wirh the Australian importer of this gun right now (spoke to him 10 minutes ago).

How about a Weihrauch HW100?

Taso, I did not think of that. It's now going to be in my top 2 or 3 choices, so thanks. They do sell them here:
gunroom.com.au/product-category/air-rifles/weihrauch-air-rifles/

The Hatsan  BT65 comes to the UK as 12ft/lbs rifle they are designed as a 40 + ft/lbs rifle I don't know if you have a ft/lbs restriction in OZ but in .22 / .25 with a good scope they would suit you . Huma in Holland ship regs worldwide and no problem fitting them . I have a .22 with a FAC self tuned reg fitted and running 40ft/lb , anything you need to know shout out .

Les, thanks, I'll refer back to you if I have questions on this. I do have Hatsan on my list, and it is available here:
winchesteraustralia.com.au/categories/_Winchester/FI/FE/FE03?q=&per_page=12

100-200 yards... in the real world I think that is .257 100-150 fpe+ slug territory... jmho...

I agree, but I have sensitive neighbours (which is why I am using an airgun in the first place instead of a centerfire rifle), and also those 100+ yard shots will be the exception.

I would go for an Airforce if available.

Yes, that is my current #1 choice because of the simplicity of design and high fps attainable.

[Arch_E]

If you're mainly shooting under 70 yards, why a PCP; especially if it's 30-70 yards?

Hope I'm not stirring the pot, here; but there are numerous spring rifles that will beautifully handle that range, plus some.

Ducking out now,

Archie

[Ozman]

If you're mainly shooting under 70 yards, why a PCP; especially if it's 30-70 yards?
Hope I'm not stirring the pot, here; but there are numerous spring rifles that will beautifully handle that range, plus some.

Yes Archie, good point. I owned a springer for many years as a boy, and I know their capabilities. I suppose I was focused on a PCP because

• quieter (neighbours!). Remember that suppressors are illegal here
• easier on scopes (no double recoil)
• more accurate at long distance (from what I've read)

[kbstingwing]

How about a Sam Yang / Seneca Sumatra 2500, it's not regulated but it's adjustable power and very powerful on high power, very consistent Fps, it's very dependable, open sights or scope, available in several calibers, price is good, will shoot many different pellet types and weights and it's not very pellet picky, I like mine, Rabbits would be easy targets for a Sumatra out to 100 + yards.

Sumatra is on the top...... ( the other is my browning Citori)

[Nomadic Pirate]

If you're mainly shooting under 70 yards, why a PCP; especially if it's 30-70 yards?

Hope I'm not stirring the pot, here; but there are numerous spring rifles that will beautifully handle that range, plus some.

Ducking out now,

Archie

Sorry but you out of your mind

I love springers for shooting experience and maintaining technique,...I like to shoot a springer before I take mi PCPs hunting to get tuned up, but.....

PCPs are way more powerful, way more precise and most likely multi shot capability.

My 20 FPE .22 PCP get over 160 shots per fill, has a 10 shots magazine, is way more quiet and light then my springers,.....even if you handpump the effort per shot is probably less that breaking a springer and surely more pleasureful,

once charged I can just shoot and no need cocking and fumble with placing a pellet in the barrel for every shot.

[Ozman]

How about a Sam Yang / Seneca Sumatra 2500, it's not regulated but it's adjustable power and very powerful on high power, very consistent Fps, it's very dependable, open sights or scope, available in several calibers, price is good, will shoot many different pellet types and weights and it's not very pellet picky, I like mine, Rabbits would be easy targets for a Sumatra out to 100 + yards

Thanks for that, Kevin (I also lived in Vista CA, BTW, in Alta Vista Drive, do you know it?).

My wife has now piped up that I probably would get by with a springer, as Archie suggested, which would leave me with lots of money left over for a Stoeger 12ga dbl barreled shotgun for home defence. She has a point. I'm vacillating now, a bit undecided. It's true that once the few pest animals are killed, I won't have a lot of use for the air rifle, maybe once a year get it out to remove any new pests, and to tie up $2K (in Australian dollars, about US$1.4K) in gun, pump, scope and range finder when I can simply get a AU$400 springer with iron sights and still end up with the same result is a bit silly on my part.

 

[Ronni]

Still, shooting a springer out to further distances takes a lot of practise. I'd choose a PCP since its free of any recoil. Accuracy is especially important for hunting purposes. The Diana Stormrider for example is an inexpensive, lightweight PCP, no recoil, magazine fed and handpump friendly. You can get them for less than 300 I believe. Ideal little pester a beginner. Comes with open sights aswell.

[Arch_E]

If you're mainly shooting under 70 yards, why a PCP; especially if it's 30-70 yards?

Hope I'm not stirring the pot, here; but there are numerous spring rifles that will beautifully handle that range, plus some.

Ducking out now,

Archie

Sorry but you out of your mind

I love springers for shooting experience and maintaining technique,...I like to shoot a springer before I take mi PCPs hunting to get tuned up, but.....

PCPs are way more powerful, way more precise and most likely multi shot capability.

My 20 FPE .22 PCP get over 160 shots per fill, has a 10 shots magazine, is way more quiet and light then my springers,.....even if you handpump the effort per shot is probably less that breaking a springer and surely more pleasureful,

once charged I can just shoot and no need cocking and fumble with placing a pellet in the barrel for every shot.

Obviously, I asked because it's the platform that I shoot.....

But, also, ... because quality springers can be quite accurate, especially below 50 yards, and are capable of longer distances. Most importantly, quality springers are cheaper than many options in the PCP platform. Also, they don't require the added PCP expenses of tanks and pumps/compressors. There is little doubt that platforms capable of shooting heavier pellets and slugs have superior fpe results, and the PCPs are excellent for doing just that. But again, shot placement is just as critical as fpe, if not more so--especially shooting .177, which I wouldn't recommend in this context.

I assumed that shots in excess of 100 yards was what was needed; hence the requirement for a PCP. Lower that range to under 100 yards, and then PCPs are no longer the only option.

Now, I completely plan on buying a PCP but only when I change jobs, retire (head back to the farm), or buy some land locally (for long distance plinking and hunting). So, I'm very interested in what is being discussed here. Also, I'd like to own a magic gun that makes me shoot like a sniper at all distances.      Nonetheless, I believe that there's a lot of FT shooters in over the years that can attest to the capability of some springers at 75 yards or under. You are correct, however, that I'm out of my league.... 

Archie

[Outback]

Mike first off tell the wife the springer is hold sensitive so a pcp  is the way forwards , a Hill pump is good for fitness no gym membership required . In the day Air arm's did some good springers but if you need to have a all purpose out to your limit rifle a pcp is the business .

[anti-squirrel]

Hmmm, killing critters, need accuracy, and likely be shooting at various distances...

Sumatra and a Chinese handpump.  These guns are known to be accurate, have adjustable power (and thus adjustable loudness), aren't pellet picky, and... They look nice!  At this point, I'll put my $45 Chinese handpump against any other handpump made and save a bundle to use on pellets and optics. 

[kbstingwing]

Thanks for that, Kevin (I also lived in Vista CA, BTW, in Alta Vista Drive, do you know it?).
 

Alta Vista Dr, Yes I know it, long winding road from Crecent dr to Brengle terrace park, I'm west off Olive ave near Emerald,

[Ozman]

Thank you, everyone, for all the kind and smart advice. I'm going to ponder all the points raised and post again when I have made a decision and/or bought the gun.   

Alta Vista Dr, Yes I know it, long winding road from Crecent dr to Brengle terrace park, I'm west off Olive ave near Emerald,

I know it well. For many years my wife and I would take our hour-long evening walks through Brengle Terrace Park. Good times!

[Nomadic Pirate]

If you're mainly shooting under 70 yards, why a PCP; especially if it's 30-70 yards?

Hope I'm not stirring the pot, here; but there are numerous spring rifles that will beautifully handle that range, plus some.

Ducking out now,

Archie

Sorry but you out of your mind

I love springers for shooting experience and maintaining technique,...I like to shoot a springer before I take mi PCPs hunting to get tuned up, but.....

PCPs are way more powerful, way more precise and most likely multi shot capability.

My 20 FPE .22 PCP get over 160 shots per fill, has a 10 shots magazine, is way more quiet and light then my springers,.....even if you handpump the effort per shot is probably less that breaking a springer and surely more pleasureful,

once charged I can just shoot and no need cocking and fumble with placing a pellet in the barrel for every shot.

Obviously, I asked because it's the platform that I shoot.....

But, also, ... because quality springers can be quite accurate, especially below 50 yards, and are capable of longer distances. Most importantly, quality springers are cheaper than many options in the PCP platform. Also, they don't require the added PCP expenses of tanks and pumps/compressors. There is little doubt that platforms capable of shooting heavier pellets and slugs have superior fpe results, and the PCPs are excellent for doing just that. But again, shot placement is just as critical as fpe, if not more so--especially shooting .177, which I wouldn't recommend in this context.

I assumed that shots in excess of 100 yards was what was needed; hence the requirement for a PCP. Lower that range to under 100 yards, and then PCPs are no longer the only option.

Now, I completely plan on buying a PCP but only when I change jobs, retire (head back to the farm), or buy some land locally (for long distance plinking and hunting). So, I'm very interested in what is being discussed here. Also, I'd like to own a magic gun that makes me shoot like a sniper at all distances.      Nonetheless, I believe that there's a lot of FT shooters in over the years that can attest to the capability of some springers at 75 yards or under. You are correct, however, that I'm out of my league.... 

Archie

Again,...sorry but you out of your mind

Maybe, maybe a 700 bucks springer can match precision with a 200 bucks PCP and a 50 bucks pump ( at short ranges ) , and if that happens is because the guy shooting the 700 bucks springer is one crack shot,

put those guns in the hands of average every day shooters and they will always do better with the PCP, at any range.

As you said shot placement is paramount so you are going against your own argument.


I had and still have a German quality springer, I can't even get close to my PCP groups at 30 yards, further out you go and the gap just explodes

and that is after repeating shooting, warm up and so on, ....the 1st cold shot is almost never even to be considered valuable

[Arch_E]

If you're mainly shooting under 70 yards, why a PCP; especially if it's 30-70 yards?

Hope I'm not stirring the pot, here; but there are numerous spring rifles that will beautifully handle that range, plus some.

Ducking out now,

Archie

Sorry but you out of your mind

I love springers for shooting experience and maintaining technique,...I like to shoot a springer before I take mi PCPs hunting to get tuned up, but.....

PCPs are way more powerful, way more precise and most likely multi shot capability.

My 20 FPE .22 PCP get over 160 shots per fill, has a 10 shots magazine, is way more quiet and light then my springers,.....even if you handpump the effort per shot is probably less that breaking a springer and surely more pleasureful,

once charged I can just shoot and no need cocking and fumble with placing a pellet in the barrel for every shot.

Obviously, I asked because it's the platform that I shoot.....

But, also, ... because quality springers can be quite accurate, especially below 50 yards, and are capable of longer distances. Most importantly, quality springers are cheaper than many options in the PCP platform. Also, they don't require the added PCP expenses of tanks and pumps/compressors. There is little doubt that platforms capable of shooting heavier pellets and slugs have superior fpe results, and the PCPs are excellent for doing just that. But again, shot placement is just as critical as fpe, if not more so--especially shooting .177, which I wouldn't recommend in this context.

I assumed that shots in excess of 100 yards was what was needed; hence the requirement for a PCP. Lower that range to under 100 yards, and then PCPs are no longer the only option.

Now, I completely plan on buying a PCP but only when I change jobs, retire (head back to the farm), or buy some land locally (for long distance plinking and hunting). So, I'm very interested in what is being discussed here. Also, I'd like to own a magic gun that makes me shoot like a sniper at all distances.      Nonetheless, I believe that there's a lot of FT shooters in over the years that can attest to the capability of some springers at 75 yards or under. You are correct, however, that I'm out of my league.... 

Archie

Again,...sorry but you out of your mind

Maybe, maybe a 700 bucks springer can match precision with a 200 bucks PCP and a 50 bucks pump ( at short ranges ) , and if that happens is because the guy shooting the 700 bucks springer is one crack shot,

put those guns in the hands of average every day shooters and they will always do better with the PCP, at any range.

As you said shot placement is paramount so you are going against your own argument.

No argument from me about your articulated premise for a $200 PCP and a $50 hand pump compared to a $700 quality European made springer.

In fact, no argument from me over the superior shooting capabilities of PCPs over 50 yards.

When it's a $1,500-3,000 PCP + a $1,300 compressor + portable tank for shots in the anticipated 30-70 yard range, my personal ethic would be to spend more time practicing rather than spending more money on a platform that is recognized as unmatched at over 100 yds and plain boring at 30. So your ad hominem aside, what Mike is asking for could be done with a quality springer (I don't believe that C02 can shoot reliability up to 75 yards, but ...) but doing so would definitely take more effort.

Again, I didn't intend to raise the ire of the PCP community (of which I've not yet bought into). You folks shoot the holy grails of airguns. One day, I'll hopefully be the proud owner of a top-notch PCP that will allow me to hit what I aim at, over a 100 yards. The hunting videos here are awesome.

Until then, I'm eradicating the pests in my yard, at short (8 yards) to almost 30 yards with my three active pellet rifles--2 springers and 1 gas ram.

Respectfully, but having fun,

Archie

[T3PRanch]

Weird question, apologies if I missed it, but if longer ranges are your goal, why do you prefer a .22?  A .25 would be better suited and retain more energy down range.  Not saying one caliber or the other is wrong- just wondering about the .22 preference.   

Condors are nice, highly adaptable guns...  You can add a regulator down the road, but I've never shot a regulated one, and I'm not sure how adding said reg would/wouldn't affect LOP.   

When the AF gun is dropped in a Mad Dog Stock the bottle length is taken out of the LOP equation.

[Ronni]

Ofc it is possible to shoot 50+ yards with a springer accurately but it takes a lot of practise. And it looks like he wants a gun he can shoot straight away without having to practise. In a hunting situation you have to be flexible and shoot at various angles and distances, sometimes prone, standing unsuported, off of sticks etc. For someone who is not used to springers that can be quite a challenge. POI shifts can always happen.

Diana Stormrider with a cheap pump or some similar setup would be perfect like Hatsan At-44, Vantage 3-9, handpump and a tin of .22 pellets.

Airforce guns are quite expensive aswell.

[Dbez1]

I’ll add my 2 cents worth...I love my Gauntlet and it’s very accurate, even out to 100 yards. However, it’s not quite as accurate as my Taipan and you have to be very careful how you handle it as the unbanded barrel is subject to POI changes. These issues are fixable as is the trigger, but the Taipan is ready to go out of the box, it’s quieter, has more power, and you don’t hear of anyone having problems with them (a major selling point) on the forums.  If you don’t want to spend $1250 on a gun though, I would seriously consider an Urban. Although I don’t have one, it gets good reviews here on GTA, it’s cheap, it’s light, and if you’re a decent shot, you may be able to stretch it out to 75 yards. If I were in your shoes, that’s probably what I would go with for my first PCP. If you enjoy the sport, then you can move up to a Taipan or something equivalent. JMO. Best wishes!

[Ronni]

+1 for the urban

[oldpro]

 Heres a perfect option for your needs https://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=160142.0