Testing new discovery

[Nvreloader]

Here is another source of Mercury, only 50 grams worth,



Tia,
Don

[rsterne]

I came up with another design for a lead shot damper.... one that I can screw onto the existing 15/16"-28 TPI mount on my .172 through .257 cal PCPs.... It uses 1.50" OD x 0.035" wall tubing mounted on an aluminum spool that is threaded inside.... It replaces the solid brass weights I have now, so may provide an interesting comparison between a solid weight "tuner" and a "dense fluid damper".... All I have to do is get the material and find time to make them and shoot them.... 

A dollar per gram is pretty pricy, Don.... 

Bob

[jphef]

I tried a version and believe it does wonders. Filled a small glass bottle 2/3 full of #8 shot, filled almost to top with brake fluid, put some weatherstrip on the bottle and zip tied to my ldc, with weatherstrip in between as a cushion for the glass.
Before:
Shooting 25.34 @ 900 in 22 cal, 3/4" @ 50 yards, 18.1's at 1000 fps shot great, about 1/4" at 50 - that got me thinking this may work on my gun.
After:
Zip tied onto ldc and the 25's shot just as good as the 18's

The only negative I noticed was when I tipped the gun up and laid it back on the rest, POI changed for a few shots - I imagine all the shot was to the rear of the bottle until a couple shots were fired.

[grand-galop]

And that is only 1 variable to add to the picture.. In my view , this viscosity damper would only make sense if was apply CONCENTRIC TO THE BORE..  The weight ADDITION of this device is only LIMITING  the amplitude and the amplitude being outward in a 360* chase, you have 50/50 chance to put the weight ALIGN with the vibration..  I don't want to discourage people thinking and development of this kind of ENHANCE DEVICE but, I want the good input being translate to a more PRODUCTIVE collective effort developing this device..  Good luck in your effort..

[Nvreloader]

Joe

As pictured,
What is the total weight of your MAD device?

Tia,
Don

[darkcharisma]

And that is only 1 variable to add to the picture.. In my view , this viscosity damper would only make sense if was apply CONCENTRIC TO THE BORE..  The weight ADDITION of this device is only LIMITING  the amplitude and the amplitude being outward in a 360* chase, you have 50/50 chance to put the weight ALIGN with the vibration..  I don't want to discourage people thinking and development of this kind of ENHANCE DEVICE but, I want the good input being translate to a more PRODUCTIVE collective effort developing this device..  Good luck in your effort..

Alain, what is your current MAD device set up like? i see that you lean towards the concentric design, but most people have had success with MAD mounted under the barrel. why would you discard that fact?

i know some didnt get the improvements including Bob, but most have seen better groups. i also think it takes time to get the right combination to work...JMO.

 i am designing a concentric type but only because it appeals better. my design will have 4 longitudinal chambers that houses lead shots individually so that the weights will distribute evenly around the bore. not just under the bore. we will see how it goes when i have time to go to the range.

the chambers will divide at 1:30 oclock through to 7:30 oclock and 4:30 to 10:30.
  from 10:30 to 1:30 is the first chamber. 1:30 to 4:30 is second, 4:30 to 7:30 is third and 7:30 to 10:30 is fourth.

never mind i said "evenly" it still is bottom heavy but there will be some weight at the top chamber. and weights on 2nd and 3rd chamber will be more lateral.

[Nvreloader]

Duy
+1

IMHO,
There is NO WAY your can have a CONCENTRIC device using any lead shot/light oil materials designed MAD device,
the lead shot will migrate to the lowest spot, leaving a void of space/air etc in whatever design,
unless the lead is packed inside whatever device to completely fill the tubes etc, if it packed tight,
HOW CAN THE LEAD MOVE, it must have some space for movement and will provide an air space etc?

The only material that would work the best in this situation is a heavy metal material, ie MERCURY.
IF used in a concentric device, there will be a void, unless design differently etc.

The question is?
Just how much weight is needed in a MAD device, to provide the best results for caliber and FPS range,
being used?

IMHO, I believe that a lot more work needs to be investigated, to find the best results, for caliber/fps range etc.
If you HAVE a better designs, present the info here with all the info required, including photo's etc, etc,
DON'T judge others designs on their lack of merits................

Tia,
Don

[darkcharisma]

I agree Don. i cannot judge or comment on anyones design based on theory. and would recommend we all do the same.
 Observe, refine and submit is a typical cycle of "science" and we are doing a little science here...just watch for best results and build our own devices based on proven data.

yeah, my design will have weight on top and bottom with side weights but there aint no way fluid will be distributed "evenly" to the bore.

[KnifeMaker]

Great news mike , maybe Donny just has too much in his plate . Please tell us it’s not BWaltonpcp. Hahahaha

Oh "L" No!


but then again, you know who it is.

[KnifeMaker]

No problem Michael.  I'm just pulling my contribution weight too!   

Michael, maybe suggest if they can make a model that extends rearward over the barrel and also allows you to attach an ldc to the muzzle end?  Two devices added to the end of the barrel, if I understand correctly, will make the overall length a little too long.   

Thanks for all you are doing Michael!

Taso

Thanks for the compliment Taso!  Humbled.

[skorec]

It seriously nice to awaiting for best solution for DAMPER.

Sorry for mistaken you but these thread focused me back to SPA  M30 concept. https://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=132262.0;attach=216752;image.

I like solution all in one.

What about to  add some thread, nut and also believable washers for tensioning the barrel? Front part of air tube may be eventually also fill whit mercury to act as flexible DAMPER.   

Bigger/500cc  and 300 bar  air  tube at future M30 bullpup version will gladden me too. 

[KnifeMaker]

The device for me is intended for bench work. For long range varmint and possibly competition. With it static on a bench, the settling is not an issue.


My device is heavy. Too heavy for hunting. At 14.something oz's. Don't remember exactly right now. This included the mounts.


On the other hand, I  have always fund a heavy, stable platform beneficial in bench work.


Allen, I would love to see you actually contribute by possibly testing yourself, rather than spending all you time being negative. It is kinda getting a little old. All negative comments have no place here.


My Grandmother always said, "Can't never could do a thing". I'm not that nice.
I'm more in the Put up or Shut Up camp. Time for you to put your theories to the test, or let us get on with the work at hand.


Just Say'n!


Knife

[skorec]

I have to repared link in my previous post

It seriously nice to awaiting for best solution for DAMPER.

Sorry for mistaken you but these thread focused me back to SPA  M30 concept.https://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=132262.0;attach=216752;image

I like solution all in one.

What about to  add some thread, nut and also believable washers for tensioning the barrel? Front part of air tube may be eventually also fill whit mercury to act as flexible DAMPER.   

Bigger/500cc  and 300 bar  air  tube at future M30 bullpup version will gladden me too.

[Wayne52]

I'm sure that the damper works good I just haven't tried it yet, too many irons in the fire, even for the rainy days.

[KnifeMaker]

The device for me is intended for bench work. For long range varmint and possibly competition. With it static on a bench, the settling is not an issue.


My device is heavy. Too heavy for hunting. At 14.something oz's. Don't remember exactly right now. This included the mounts.


On the other hand, I  have always found a heavy, stable platform beneficial in bench work.


Allen, I would love to see you actually contribute by possibly testing yourself, rather than spending all you time being negative. It is kinda getting a little old. All negative comments have no place here.


My Grandmother always said, "Can't never could do a thing". I'm not that nice.
I'm more in the Put up or Shut Up camp. Time for you to put your theories to the test, or let us get on with the work at hand.


Just Say'n!


Knife

[KnifeMaker]

Did I just quote myself?


Old age and senility in full force. 

[Mole2017]

Did I just quote myself?


Old age and senility in full force. 

Just missing that modify button, that's all.

[R.K.]

Knife   I call them "senior moments"  or halfzimers. Trouble is they're happening more often   I think.

[jphef]

Joe

As pictured,
What is the total weight of your MAD device?

Tia,
Don

Total weight as pictured is 4.63 OZ

Joe

[grand-galop]

And that is only 1 variable to add to the picture.. In my view , this viscosity damper would only make sense if was apply CONCENTRIC TO THE BORE..  The weight ADDITION of this device is only LIMITING  the amplitude and the amplitude being outward in a 360* chase, you have 50/50 chance to put the weight ALIGN with the vibration..  I don't want to discourage people thinking and development of this kind of ENHANCE DEVICE but, I want the good input being translate to a more PRODUCTIVE collective effort developing this device..  Good luck in your effort..

Alain, what is your current MAD device set up like? i see that you lean towards the concentric design, but most people have had success with MAD mounted under the barrel. why would you discard that fact?

i know some didnt get the improvements including Bob, but most have seen better groups. i also think it takes time to get the right combination to work...JMO.

 i am designing a concentric type but only because it appeals better. my design will have 4 longitudinal chambers that houses lead shots individually so that the weights will distribute evenly around the bore. not just under the bore. we will see how it goes when i have time to go to the range.

the chambers will divide at 1:30 oclock through to 7:30 oclock and 4:30 to 10:30.
  from 10:30 to 1:30 is the first chamber. 1:30 to 4:30 is second, 4:30 to 7:30 is third and 7:30 to 10:30 is fourth.

never mind i said "evenly" it still is bottom heavy but there will be some weight at the top chamber. and weights on 2nd and 3rd chamber will be more lateral.

You see that it has some degree of complexity to make 2  things working together to damper vibration..  I refrain myself of giving opinions due to EMOTIONAL IMPLICATIONS in both side or even the nonbelievers of this device..  After I had my debate with Bob, I have REREAD all the comments and have seen for the most part a BIAS analitic process because people WANT THE DEVICE WORKING.. I am trying to find a fix solution  by replacing the fluid and lead by gel sole squeeze between the LCD and a brass sleeve capped with silicone bead to still retain the movement needed... The silicon gel is more PREDICTABLE AND WILL HAVE CONSISTENT RESULT.. I'M A MEMBER SINCE 2014  but I don't put my input if I don't know the subjects talked about.. Most of my time spent on this forum is to learn.