Do You Cast .22 or .25 bullets or pellets?

[KnifeMaker]

I am having excellent results with the NOE Ranch dog 80 gr. decked to throw them at 46 grains with the huge HP cavity. Very accurate, sized down to .2495 in my Rainstorm.

[rsterne]

I also designed a 41 gr. BBT in .250 cal, and there are lots of them in the NOE Store, although the only HPs left are single cavity moulds....  http://noebulletmolds.com/NV/index.php?cPath=554_467



I have the 0.253/0.255" version which I bought to try in a LW barrel and have never opened the box.... There was a guy here on the GTA last year who was shooting the 0.250/0.252" in an LW barrel and he loved it.... The HP version is 39 gr.... It is 0.333" long....

I mention this because that might mean that the lighter version in the poll would make more sense because the heavier one is pretty close to this BBT.... Comments?....

Another thought just hit me.... I wonder if we can get Al to re-run this design in the RG2 and RG4 moulds with all cavities having the HP (and other) pins.... Once he gets some bullets out there with the small RG pins, it would be worth asking him....

Bob

[Lion]

Thanks a lot. I have just bought a RCBS 25 acp mould 51 grains and hope that the slug will be accurate in my Sumatra and Sparrow.
I'll let you know if I have shot these slugs.
The NOE 250-50-FN-BB3 like Kinetic45 wrote will be my next buy.

[KnifeMaker]

I also designed a 41 gr. BBT in .250 cal, and there are lots of them in the NOE Store, although the only HPs left are single cavity moulds....  http://noebulletmolds.com/NV/index.php?cPath=554_467



I have the 0.253/0.255" version which I bought to try in a LW barrel and have never opened the box.... There was a guy here on the GTA last year who was shooting the 0.250/0.252" in an LW barrel and he loved it.... The HP version is 39 gr.... It is 0.333" long....

I mention this because that might mean that the lighter version in the poll would make more sense because the heavier one is pretty close to this BBT.... Comments?....

Another thought just hit me.... I wonder if we can get Al to re-run this design in the RG2 and RG4 moulds with all cavities having the HP (and other) pins.... Once he gets some bullets out there with the small RG pins, it would be worth asking him....

Bob

I would very much like to see NOE offer the pins in the small bullet offerings!


Mike

[rsterne]

Good luck with the RCBS 25 ACP bullets.... I have that mould, and had one cavity converted to HP by Erik.... That shortened the RN slightly, of course, and dropped the weight from 52.9 gr. to 46.7 gr. (in pure lead)…. I never got either to shoot really well, the sprue cutter distorts the base of the bullet, so it isn't perfect and square.... I even tried tumbling the bullets to smooth out the corners of the base to no avail.... I was shooting them in a 14" twist TJ's liner with a 0.250" groove and 0.243" lands.... I also tried them in a 17.7" twist LW barrel, not great in that either....



The HP bullets will fit in an MRod mag, the RN won't....

Bob

[Kinetic45^]

Good luck with the RCBS 25 ACP bullets.... I have that mould, and had one cavity converted to HP by Erik.... That shortened the RN slightly, of course, and dropped the weight from 52.9 gr. to 46.7 gr. (in pure lead)…. I never got either to shoot really well, the sprue cutter distorts the base of the bullet, so it isn't perfect and square.... I even tried tumbling the bullets to smooth out the corners of the base to no avail.... I was shooting them in a 14" twist TJ's liner with a 0.250" groove and 0.243" lands.... I also tried them in a 17.7" twist LW barrel, not great in that either....



The HP bullets will fit in an MRod mag, the RN won't....

Bob

Totally agree, I never got them to work well and there are too many good molds out there instead.
Hummm, On second thought, I think I'll just cancel the HP then if you've already tried it and it did not work, I'm not going to re-invent the wheel and waste my time.

[Lion]

…. I never got either to shoot really well, the sprue cutter distorts the base of the bullet, so it isn't perfect and square.... I even tried tumbling the bullets to smooth out the corners of the base to no avail....

Bob

thanks Bob, so to prevent the base of the bullet from distorts, I will have to make a new sprue cutter that's sharper and with smaller holes in it. As soon as I have made one, I'll let you know.

[rsterne]

That will certainly help.... The distorted base on flat base bullets is one of the reasons most guys prefer gas check base bullets, as the rear drive band, which is the part that must leave the crown evenly all the way around, is not disturbed by the sprue cutter....

Bob

[AirGunShooter]

Could someone post a "Beginner's Guide to casting pellets or slugs?  I have an incredible amount of lead saved from the tens-of-thousands rounds I shoot annually and it would be great to put them to use in a second life as a cast pellet or slug.  But honestly, I have no idea where to begin.  The whole process sounds very intimidating for someone just trying to get started casting their own ammo.  Personally I would be interested in casting .22 pellets and slugs, .25 slugs and .30 slugs.  Any and all help listing every thing necessary would be appreciated.  From the molds to anything special like lubes or sizing equipment?
T. Himes

[K.O.]

you are just going to have to read every thing you can... it is truly a very deep subject on it's own since you want to recycle you need to learn alloying  but at first you can just buy some alloyed lead... learning hardness testing...learn to clean (sawdust works) flux(parafin works) etc....etc... ect...

 then casting well it's pacing and other things cause different people use differing methods... I have poured .25 34g pellet without a lot of rejects and do not pressure pour... but I do keep a pace and heat in the sprue plate with a generous sprue puddle... am pouring at about 790* with a 1.5% tin mix... that temp is about 40*F past what the tin likes it loses its ability to help fill out by reducing surface tension... it also really starts oxidizing if I read right(paraffin can help  get it back in the mix)... and that should promote tin oxides building up on my Brass mold... but by the time I get the ladle to the mold and as I pour it is cooling...so I figure its is about down to 750 or so by the time it hits the mold...  the pace needs to keep the base pins hot but you want to run the brass cool as possible for mold longevity... so you balance your pace... will be trying my pour at a lower temp when it warms up and I get back to casting on the back porch...

some use temp probes in their mold and pid temp controllers for there pot to get as much temperature consistency as possible... I do not... and just use the small lee pot... and ladle pour...

using them in a air rifle is another set of issues...

I once saw a chart of surface tension and the temp of lead tin/alloys... but can not find it now... point is there is a lot to learn in a bunch of directions how deep do you want to dive in... and which direction...

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?222520-Why-some-new-members-will-do-better-than-others-here 

I have the advantage of having listened to some poeple over the years and have been a mold/core maker on the sand side of an aluminum foundry... I still am looking at  info all over...

http://www.lasc.us/castbulletalloy.htm


casting big bullets is different from casting small hollow points... and thin skirted pellets want what they want...

http://www.lasc.us/Fryxell_Book_Chapter_13_CastingHPBullets.htm 

http://www.hensleygibbs.com/casting/223cast2.htm   

so yeah read everything you can and come up with your methods and enjoy the journey... share your questions and experiences if you are so inclined...

https://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?board=229.0

[AirGunShooter]

Thank you for the info!!

Tom

[K.O.]

Good luck with the RCBS 25 ACP bullets.... I have that mould, and had one cavity converted to HP by Erik.... That shortened the RN slightly, of course, and dropped the weight from 52.9 gr. to 46.7 gr. (in pure lead)…. I never got either to shoot really well, the sprue cutter distorts the base of the bullet, so it isn't perfect and square.... I even tried tumbling the bullets to smooth out the corners of the base to no avail.... I was shooting them in a 14" twist TJ's liner with a 0.250" groove and 0.243" lands.... I also tried them in a 17.7" twist LW barrel, not great in that either....



The HP bullets will fit in an MRod mag, the RN won't....

Bob

 

I keep thinking about how I have never found a good report on that mold air or pb... then I think maybe if the grease groove was opened up to gas check size and then if that does not help... deck the tail off leaving just the pseudo gas check shank... it might do well... depends on if the nose gives enough support and it has enough bearing length...

I was having a prob with the BBT .25 40g boat tail base having one slightly rounded bit and the rest of the base filling well...

well I pour hot with a large sprue puddle to keep the sprue plate hot... that was causing shrink when using the .140 sprue hole... switched to a .125 sprue hole and problem fixxed... it was a different prob than below where the base is sheared and pulls away to one side... but can have the same fix... but yep mine was not a fill or distortion prob it was shrink...

 right after opening the mold if you see one side pulled away like in below thread... this is base distortion... Is this the kind you meant..? I can see the deep grease groove help causing it to be that way...

http://www.mountainmolds.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?t=195

[KnifeMaker]

Like you've I've  never seen a good report on the RCBS .25 molds accuracy. Only bad.  But then again, it is designed for the .25 acp. When is the time you read a accuracy report on a .25 acp. LOL I guess the design isn't accurate, because it doesn't need to be. Just needs to feed reliably.


Now, about the half moon bases. Open too soon, and the base either tears at the spru or smears. Open too late,and the tension causes the lead to move, causing the half moon base. It's a timing issue.  


Casting truly i sa leaned science. [size=78%] [/size]


A smaller spru hole helps a LOT, and additional pressure in the pour will take care of the fallout with the smaller hole.


And whatever you do, make, and keep the spru hole cutter as sharp as possible.


Knife

[Lion]

Thanks, I'll test the accuaracy of the 25 acp in my air rifles and hope to be lucky.....
If not, I can sell the mould again, or let it change and try again.
The problems with the bullet base while casting, is simular for other small bore cast bullets. And there has to be some challenge to make casting more fun.

[USAFANG6799]

you are just going to have to read every thing you can... it is truly a very deep subject

Oh no......not another Rabbit Hole 

[rsterne]

NT

[rsterne]

I just received the official NOE drawing for this bullet (as in Reply #29).... Al says NOE should be back at full production within a couple of weeks and this will be going in the lineup for the mill....

Bob

[Wayne52]

I just got done casting up a bunch of my 19.6 grain from the 217-20-RF mold, I'm weighing them now and it appears to be a decent run so far, I use more of these pellets than anything else.

I've still got my fingers crossed for NOE to start making the .217 wadcutters, hopefully soon.

[rsterne]

The .22 Target pellets are also in the list to hit the mill when it is available.... and also the .30 cal Target pellet and the .45 cal Magnum Hunters.... Al is also aware that most of the other pellet (and BBT) moulds are out of stock....

Bob

[Wayne52]

The .22 Target pellets are also in the list to hit the mill when it is available.... and also the .30 cal Target pellet and the .45 cal Magnum Hunters.... Al is also aware that most of the other pellet (and BBT) moulds are out of stock....

Bob

Great news for sure, then I'll be using the target pellets instead of my 19.6 grainers, the meplats are excellent for lower powered pcp's when hunting and I'll probably use a lot less when I get some target pellets going