Is This Really The Kind Of Representation American Airgunners Need?

[DevilsLuck]

NO POLITICAL OR RELIGOUS DISCUSSION!!!
With the topic, it's hard to do. But keep the political comments out.....

It is hard, especially when the very title is political in nature. Maybe time to can this discussion.

The topic of how we airgunners represent ourselves, and whom we allow to represent us is an important topic. Our shared common interest depends on productive dialogue. As far as having a foreign entity drawing scrutiny to American shooters within our shared common hobby... It’s a topic worth discussing.

[ezman604]

NO POLITICAL OR RELIGOUS DISCUSSION!!!
With the topic, it's hard to do. But keep the political comments out.....

It is hard, especially when the very title is political in nature. Maybe time to can this discussion.

Hard but not impossible. If the political comments continue, this WILL go to the trash and the offenders may get a vacation from posting.

[Novagun]

For somebody or nobody whose only interaction with America is this forum I have this to say, relevant or not.

I am amazed at how easy it is for Americans to possess firearms. The comment that was made on this forum to the effect that the people in the congregation would be surprised to find that the old respectable chap was carrying a semi automatic pistol (1911 I recall)  Another comment to the effect that stupid gets you shot over here. Yes I am surprised. Your circumstances are different to a very small  isolated bottom of the world country. Mass shootings a very rare, even anyone getting shot is very rare. Suicide is our biggest killer.

Here airguns are treated exactly the same as powder burners.  Every offence against the Arms Act or the Crimes Act can be committed just as much with an airgun as with a firearm and includes imitation firearms. The only difference between the two is that you must be over 16 years and have a firearms licence to possess a powder burner. You must be over 18 years with no firearms licence or under 18 but have a firearms licence to possess an airgun. Anyone of any age can shoot any gun with immediate supervision by a person allowed to do so.

I think we are very well catered for as far as guns go. BUT, there is new legislation in the offing to do with secure storage of firearms and air pistols that look like real pistols, and they all do.

[Marc In Iowa]

NO POLITICAL OR RELIGOUS DISCUSSION!!!

There are tons of forums for posting political or religious content. I'm happy to have one forum that is just about our hobby. Let's please keep it that way

[Hllrsr]

  A .50 cal air rifle can certainly put a .50 cal hole in a human and it is just a matter of time before it happens and makes main stream news.

Do not know the calibre, but something similar already did in Britain..

hxxps ://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/02/06/ex-armysniper-jailed-using-high-powered-air-rifle-shoot-five/

[anti-squirrel]

NO POLITICAL OR RELIGOUS DISCUSSION!!!

There are tons of forums for posting political or religious content. I'm happy to have one forum that is just about our hobby. Let's please keep it that way

Thank you Marc.

This thread treads dangerously close to The Line.

I live the first state to allow airgun-hunting of larger game.  What is most interesting is that it was a member of our forum that lives in another state that complained to our VA DNR authorities that culminated in some changes that negatively impact airgun deer hunters.  My point?

When one finger points at others, three fingers are pointing at one's self. 

If the laws in the US change, the easy answer is vote the old politicians out and put new ones in place.

[DevilsLuck]

I don't think the thread premise threatens "the line". It's a pretty straight forward question. Should American airgunners take issue with foreign manufacturers involving themselves in American/local politics; for the obvious purpose of driving sales? And does their involvement represent a potential detriment to the status quo of airgunning in the US? And if so... What should the airgunning community do to preserve our sport?

[avator]

DL, with all due respect..
It's not the premise that threatens, it's the temptation that many find difficult to avoid.

[avator]

Have a look at the contents of the Non-Productive gate. Most, if not all of this type thread end up there. Unfortunately, it's been the fate of much otherwise useful information.
Sadly, the writing is already on the wall for this one too.

[DevilsLuck]

Have a look at the contents of the Non-Productive gate. Most, if not all of this type thread end up there. Unfortunately, it's been the fate of much otherwise useful information.
Sadly, the writing is already on the wall for this one too.

I hope not. But it would be somewhat saddening that those most affected by changes, are the same ones who are supposed to remain silent...
My intent is not to discuss politics; but rather scrutinize manufacturers who have taken it upon themselves to do so, for the purpose of getting into our pockets. And whether their actions, and the results of those actions would be welcomed by the air gun community...

[Buldawg76]

The globalization of businesses should not lead to globalization of regulation or restrictions that infringe on rights and freedoms .

Mike

[avator]

It's a good time to live in Alabama... right fellas?   

[Buldawg76]

It's a good time to live in Alabama... right fellas?   

Yessir it is at that. I am just a good ole red blooded American alive and well in the Heart of Dixie.

Mike

[DevilsLuck]

I just wonder if Sig Sauer, and those who welcome their support have considered any detrimental negative consequences. Or have they been blinded by "instant gratification"? Immediate sales... A new way of hunting... A new level of "respect"... I just can't help but think that some haven't really thought this through, as well as they should have...
If this were a Crosman, and native air gun hunters, I'd have much less of a problem with this. It's their rights no matter what outcome. But for a foreign interest to do so, and to be welcomed at that; seems reckless. Especially when it has the potential to effect us all.

[DevilsLuck]

It's a good time to live in Alabama... right fellas?   

+100!!!

[Motorhead]

Living in one of the MOST Regulated states in the union ... what frightens me most is the Conviction manufacturers such as Sig Sauer that the market and consumers NEED tactical look like copies of actual assault weapons
IMO would agree to the youth leaving computer gaming, Air soft etc where Tacti-cool is all the rage, In the real world among those who take AIR GUNNING serious these guns are a joke !!  They simply are a false representation of a type & power of gun there NOT !!
In a society suffering gun violence coast to coast and the attack of Non shooters agaist those who do .... What the he ll are these tactical look like guns doing to our image and long term survival of the air gun sports overall ?

They will bring attention to us and be at the root of further regulations ... IMO

[Taso1000]

I have two thoughts about this. 

There have been a lot of contributing factors that have led to the increase of air powered guns being used.  People that only used powder burners became attracted to the air gun arena and once the PCP became a common it was only a matter of time before bigger, faster, better has taken such a hold. 

Speed has always been a marketing strategy because people want it.  With PCP it is now practical to expand into the black powder power realm.

Still, look at Britain, they have been regulated for decades to under 12 fpe.

The culture at large would have noticed eventually anyway.  Have fun while the fun is there to get I quess.

Dave,

I'd like to add another reason for the increase in air rifle use.  I like trigger time but in the last 10 or 15 years firearm ammo has become more expensive and firearm ranges have closed.

Since I love trigger time, mostly at paper, the airgun became the better candidate due to cost and convenience.  I can shoot in my back yard or basement any time I wish.

Thanks,

Taso

[Taso1000]

In this talk of the inevitability that big bore air rifles will become regulated, it seems to me we are already there.  Ask someone who lives in Illinois where a .22 is a big bore.

Any air gun over .177 caliber and shooting faster than 700 fps is considered a firearm in Illinois.  You have to have a FOID card for it but there is no federal background check required.  All .177 caliber air guns are exempt.

Taso

[Taso1000]

For somebody or nobody whose only interaction with America is this forum I have this to say, relevant or not.

I am amazed at how easy it is for Americans to possess firearms. The comment that was made on this forum to the effect that the people in the congregation would be surprised to find that the old respectable chap was carrying a semi automatic pistol (1911 I recall)  Another comment to the effect that stupid gets you shot over here. Yes I am surprised. Your circumstances are different to a very small  isolated bottom of the world country. Mass shootings a very rare, even anyone getting shot is very rare. Suicide is our biggest killer.

Here airguns are treated exactly the same as powder burners.  Every offence against the Arms Act or the Crimes Act can be committed just as much with an airgun as with a firearm and includes imitation firearms. The only difference between the two is that you must be over 16 years and have a firearms licence to possess a powder burner. You must be over 18 years with no firearms licence or under 18 but have a firearms licence to possess an airgun. Anyone of any age can shoot any gun with immediate supervision by a person allowed to do so.

I think we are very well catered for as far as guns go. BUT, there is new legislation in the offing to do with secure storage of firearms and air pistols that look like real pistols, and they all do.

Mods, I apologize in advance as I know this comment is about firearms and not permitted.  I just wanted to inform our international members.

Hugh,

I have to disagree that guns are so easy to purchase.  Any gun purchased at retail has to be a Federal Firearms License holder in good standing.  The federal forms need to be filled out for every purchase.  Many states perform stricter background checks and have a waiting period before the purchaser can take possession of the firearm.  In Illinois we are required to have a valid firearm owners id card if we possess firearms.  You can not get the card if you are a felon or other have any other infractions or pending investigations or mental illness.  Also in Illinois private sales require proof of the gun card and the seller needs to record that information if the Bureau of Alcohol Tobacco and Firearms investigates a person or a firearm.

Definitely not easy unless you have been a law abiding citizen your whole life. 

Thanks,

Taso

[Whirligig]

I'm helping!