Author Topic: Synrod accuracy woes ... (Read 2491 times))

archellas · « **on:** March 20, 2018, 12:46:53 PM »

A while back, I purchased a pre-owned Synrod in .22. Shot the gun, and it seemed to do reasonably well. High 800s with CPDomes at 14.3 and fairly accurate. Not one to sit still, I ordered a Hill spring, and got me some o-rings to do a BStaley on it (like on my Prods).
That's when I realized the gun had an SSG already in there. Since the gun was shooting at a power level I was content with (and doing better than 60 shots per fill!) I left it alone and have been playing with my Gauntlet.

This weekend, I took it out to play with my son in law, and it shot like a shotgun!!!!! Power is there, scope is set, count is good, but it will not group very well. I fed several types of pellets from 14.3 through 21.1 H&Ns, and finally settled on JSB 15.89 (duh) at 5.53. Still not the best of my groupings (I shoot 25 yards~).

I have replaced the baffles (a couple were broken when I got it) and did a full cleanup job. Now, I am thinking that maybe I need to replace the barrel .... Previous owner had not shot it much, had got it pre-owned himself, and said he didn't know too much of it's history.

Any ideas from anyone - before I start taking it apart?

Thanks

n2omike · « **Reply #1 on:** March 20, 2018, 12:50:44 PM »

Quote from: archellas on March 20, 2018, 12:46:53 PM

A while back, I purchased a pre-owned Synrod in .22.

This weekend, I took it out to play with my son in law, and it shot like a shotgun!!!!!

Now, I am thinking that maybe I need to replace the barrel

Any ideas from anyone - before I start taking it apart?

Thanks

Sounds like you've already solved your problem. Many of these guns came with &^^& barrels, and a replacement is the only cure, as you can only polish a trrrrd so bright. There's probably a reason you are the third owner...

I had to buy a barrel for my .22 as well.

Good Luck!

Geoff · « **Reply #2 on:** March 20, 2018, 01:43:29 PM »

Quote

Many of these guns came with &^^& barrels, and a replacement is the only cure, as you can only polish a trrrrd so bright.

It seems an over exaggeration when people say many of the 22 barrels were bad. Were some of them bad ?, surely. Were there as many as the urban legend claims ?, I doubt it.

For what Crosman asks for barrels, grab one to try.

It seems you have checked the FPS via a string to know there is not a wide variation between pellets, correct ?

You detect no leaks when shooting ?

Screws are as tight as they should be ?

And you are as certain as you can be that the scope has not gone wonky ?

If yes to all of the above, I am out of ideas since you have tried several pellets. Grab a new barrel maybe.

Buldawg76 · « **Reply #3 on:** March 20, 2018, 01:56:27 PM »

One other possibility could be the barrel band got bumped and rotated so its putting pressure on the shroud causing inconsistency when shot. There should be an even gap between the bands ID and the shrouds OD with the o ring inside the bands ID . If its touching the shroud it needs to be centered on the shroud. It may also
be the shroud is loose on the threaded mount at the breech, It should be tight against the breech to add support to the barrel and front shroud nut should be tight as well..

Mike

nervoustrigger · « **Reply #4 on:** March 20, 2018, 01:56:36 PM »

TJ, have a look at the muzzle to see if the rifling is damaged. It’s quick and easy to do.

http://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=110179

If you want to inspect it further, check out the accurizing link in my signature.

Blue · « **Reply #5 on:** March 20, 2018, 02:12:26 PM »

Just to clarify...

When you said you replaced some broken baffles, was that when you first got it or during this most recent tear down? If it was when you first got it you might check again. Do you know what broke the ones you found and was that resolved? Could be the same issue broke the ones you replaced.

Did you take the shroud off when you disassembled for the b-staley mod? I've heard of accuracy issues when the shroud is screwed back on at a slightly different tension.

When you say power is there and count is good, is that verified by a string over a chronograph? If you're seeing variations in FPS, I'd look for transfer port leaks, hammer drag.

I've had the trigger adjustment screws come loose on a different two stage trigger and cause problems with sear drag on the hammer.

I'd say check the crown but I'd be tough to get a nick or ding inside the shroud, does the hole in the shroud look like it's been clipped or otherwise look uneven or out of round.

Blue

Couple posts before I finished mine, hope I didn't repeat

Sfttailrdr46 · « **Reply #6 on:** March 20, 2018, 02:13:31 PM »

Also make sure the breech seal is not torn My .30 custom Marauder Gen 2 went from 100 yard ~1.5" groups to off the paper in 3 shots when I tried to feed an oversize slug and damaged the o-ring

n2omike · « **Reply #7 on:** March 20, 2018, 02:24:11 PM »

Quote from: nervoustrigger on March 20, 2018, 01:56:36 PM

TJ, have a look at the muzzle to see if the rifling is damaged. It’s quick and easy to do.

http://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=110179

If you want to inspect it further, check out the accurizing link in my signature.

That's some good stuff! Thanks!

Taso1000 · « **Reply #8 on:** March 20, 2018, 02:29:04 PM »

TJ,

You said the rifle was fairly accurate when you first got it. Have you tried cleaning the barrel? Check that there isn't part of a cleaning patch left over in a baffle. Make sure you put 20 or so pellets through the barrel to season it before you test for accuracy.

All the other things I can think of to check have already been mentioned. Good luck!

Taso

triggertreat · « **Reply #9 on:** March 20, 2018, 03:09:26 PM »

Replace the breech oring first then troubleshoot from there.

archellas · « **Reply #10 on:** March 20, 2018, 07:22:15 PM »

Thank you ALL for taking the time to answer and provide advice!!

I have been so engrossed with the Gauntlet, I've ignored the Synrod and it feels neglected ...

Will start at the breech o-ring and work back from that!

Cheers

Kinetic45^ · « **Reply #11 on:** March 21, 2018, 12:37:15 AM »

I have a couple of things that worked on a similar GenII Synrod that shot badly right from the box.
Owning other rifles I feel I know what I am doing at a basic level (and I am NOT an airgun expert like so many of the amazing guys on here!) so I did not care about warranty and just opened it up.
First thing I noticed is the plastic air stripper on the muzzle had been installed wrong and was cracked and binding inside the shroud. No strikes on baffles or shroud cap but...
This made me look at rifle and I believe it was NOT new and yet had been sold as new. Replaced stripper (took one off another Mrod till I could get a replacement) and rifle shot better but still not right.
Cleaned barrel: patches with Hoppes9 came out OK but not perfect so I did a deep clean. Took barrel out of gun and used some Lead Wipe-Away patches with a tight brass jag and ran it through the bore a dozen times and it came out BLACK, although the barrel looked to the eye clean I ran a second patch back and forth about ten times and it was black but less. Third time patch had just a little black. Next cleaned barrel with patches soaked with Ballistol (5:1, water:Ballistol) until one came out clean. And finally I reassembled the rifle and coated lavishly the nose and sides of pellets with JB Bore cleaner and shot 15 of them then wiped it down with Ballistol again till clean patches... the barrel is a mirror now and shot MUCH better.
But still not as good as others I have so I put on a Hill barrel band - the one that is tighter on the shroud and has the Picatinny rail on the bottom and now it shoots 8 shots into .35 at 50 yards with CLEANED N SORTED JSB 33.95. {took out the lawyer spring and added a TSS too but nothing else}

n2omike · « **Reply #12 on:** March 21, 2018, 11:53:25 AM »

Quote from: Kinetic45^ on March 21, 2018, 12:37:15 AM

I have a couple of things that worked on a similar GenII Synrod that shot badly right from the box.
Owning other rifles I feel I know what I am doing at a basic level (and I am NOT an airgun expert like so many of the amazing guys on here!) so I did not care about warranty and just opened it up.
First thing I noticed is the plastic air stripper on the muzzle had been installed wrong and was cracked and binding inside the shroud. No strikes on baffles or shroud cap but...
This made me look at rifle and I believe it was NOT new and yet had been sold as new. Replaced stripper (took one off another Mrod till I could get a replacement) and rifle shot better but still not right.
Cleaned barrel: patches with Hoppes9 came out OK but not perfect so I did a deep clean. Took barrel out of gun and used some Lead Wipe-Away patches with a tight brass jag and ran it through the bore a dozen times and it came out BLACK, although the barrel looked to the eye clean I ran a second patch back and forth about ten times and it was black but less. Third time patch had just a little black. Next cleaned barrel with patches soaked with Ballistol (5:1, water:Ballistol) until one came out clean. And finally I reassembled the rifle and coated lavishly the nose and sides of pellets with JB Bore cleaner and shot 15 of them then wiped it down with Ballistol again till clean patches... the barrel is a mirror now and shot MUCH better.
But still not as good as others I have so I put on a Hill barrel band - the one that is tighter on the shroud and has the Picatinny rail on the bottom and now it shoots 8 shots into .35 at 50 yards with CLEANED N SORTED JSB 33.95. {took out the lawyer spring and added a TSS too but nothing else}

Sounds like you've been very successful with your rifle!
However, keep in mind... yours is a .25, which comes with a Green Mountain barrel from the factory. His is a .22, which comes with the maligned Crossman barrel. The .22 is well knows for being the worst shooter of the three calibers, and also suffers from a shifting point of aim. My .22 suffered from both... &^^& accuracy, and a shifting point of aim. The only thing that cured it, was re-doing the gun with a new, aftermarket barrel.

Good luck to the OP. I hope he finds something simple to get the accuracy acceptable to him... but with these guns equipped with the factory barrel, 'good' accuracy is definitely a relative term.

Personally, I believe there is a reason the gun is already on its third owner... but, it looks like he enjoys a challenge.

Good Luck

archellas · « **Reply #13 on:** March 21, 2018, 01:16:21 PM »

Quote from: n2omike on March 21, 2018, 11:53:25 AM

... but, it looks like he enjoys a challenge.

Good Luck

HE loves the challenge! No really, I DO ....

I have got the Gauntlet to a BORING level! Hole in hole, predictable, 70ish shots at 860~fps, putting a 23ci tank on next. Still boring.

Built up a bottled Prod with a folding collapsible stock which yields OVER 70 shots at 15 fpe, also putting hole in hole. (if interested : https://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=138349.new#new)
I shoot paper or interactive targets in my backyard at 25 yards range. I do not hunt, although every once in a while I will get really aggravated with the squirrels eating ALL my bird food, or my peaches off the tree (not the ones on the ground

) and recently ate through my garden lights (again) so I will take a couple of them down.
My BullBoss is regulated and shooting around 900fps for over 40 shots per fill yielding over 32fpe!

So now, I am going to work on the Synrod, and figure out how to make it boring also!

What else have we got to do ..... isn't that the challenge after all ??

Cheers

Buldawg76 · « **Reply #14 on:** March 21, 2018, 06:23:27 PM »

Let us know what you find and how it turns out when you get it sorted out.

Mike

ray1377 · « **Reply #15 on:** March 21, 2018, 08:18:33 PM »

One other thing you might try is removing the magazine and shooting it single shot. I found that my syn-rod is deadly accurate each and every shot when loaded one at a time by hand. And yes I know, thats labor intensive. But the ability to put the pellet right where I'm aiming is worth the trouble.
It will also tell you if you may have an issue with your magazines. It could also be the lead-in on the barrel. It could be damaged and is scoring the pellets upon loading causing erratic shot placement.
Thanks
Ray

GeraldnGa. · « **Reply #16 on:** March 21, 2018, 09:24:17 PM »

Have you "tapped" a pellet through the barrel? After cleaning I Always do that . I do that by: inserting pellet [like loading a springer] with a stiff rod; I use the palm of my hand to gently, tap the pellet thru the barrel. [sometimes 30 taps to get it thru.] Can be Very Informative!
later, Gerald

archellas · « **Reply #17 on:** March 23, 2018, 01:06:16 PM »

Thank you again ALL, for your suggestions and guidance!

I had failed to mention, along with the baffles I had replaced the shroud cap because the one that came on the rifle was drilled out to a larger size, and I just decided to put a new one on.

Well ..... it was an easy fix! The first thing I did before disassembly, was to remove baffles/shroud, etc. ... I did not have to go very far!
The new one had been clipped, and for what I consider obvious reason, it was affecting my POI. I replaced it with the larger one that came on the gun, and went out and shot. Hello! Tight groups again! I had recently cleaned the barrel, and it WAS shooting fine when I had got it so ..... now I have to sort through some pellet testing to find its favorite, and I can put this one away, and go to the next project.

Cheers

frank320 · « **Reply #18 on:** March 23, 2018, 01:31:56 PM »

My 25 cal Armada was accurate, grouping well and i never felt the need to touch it, other than the occasional barrel cleaning. Then, one day, i decided to remove the shroud and baffles to clean. After putting it back, the POI shifted and I had a couple of flyers. I then removed and re-jigged the shroud and baffles again. Only after a few attempts did i get back the original groupings.

So, might be worth doing that. I have no idea why, could be baffle clipping, harmonics, etc... Since then, i don't touch the barrel/shroud/baffles when it is shooting and grouping well.

Taso1000 · « **Reply #19 on:** March 23, 2018, 01:45:43 PM »

TJ,

I'm glad you found the issue and it was an easy fix!

Taso

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Synrod accuracy woes ...

Author Topic: Synrod accuracy woes ... (Read 2491 times))