Beeman Chief - Merry Christmas to Me !!!

[rsterne]

There were a couple of perfect sized boxes under the tree this morning, and I was hopeful they contained what I wanted.... Here is what my darling wife gave me....



It's a .22 cal Beeman Chief PCP, and the scope is a BSA 4-14 x 44 FFP Side Focus with 30mm tube and extended MilDot reticle.... The scope looks a bit big mounted on that gun, but it will be going on my new 6mm PCP project gun anyways.... It is my first FFP scope, and it will be interesting how I get along with that concept.... I stole a scope from my Hatsan AT-44 Long before I gave it to my son for Christmas (and replaced it with a Leapers 4-16 x 50 AO).... The scope from the Hatsan will be going on the new .257 PCP project I am working on concurrently with the 6mm.... It is an older Hawke 6-18 x 44 AO with an SR12 Reticle.... Both scopes should be good for up to 150 yards or beyond, which will be appropriate for the new guns....

The plan for the Chief is to shoot it as is to get a baseline with a bunch of pellets.... and then tear it apart and see what magic I can work on it.... I don't even know when that will happen, maybe not until next winter.... it will depend on how long my current projects take to complete.... Oh, and I finally found some of the new .22 cal Redesigned JSB 25.4 gr. Exact Monster pellets, they will arrive after Christmas.... I'm hopeful I can tune up the Chief to make good use of them, if they prove to be accurate in it.... If not, then I'm sure the 18.1 gr. Heavies will do a stellar job.... Incidently, the Chief weighs 6.75 lbs. naked, and 8.5 lbs. with that big scope on it.... 

Ahhhhhhh it should be a very good year....   

Bob

[Ribbonstone]

She did good...nice present.

Hope you have as much fun with it as I have...something really pleasant about the simple wood-n-metal ones.

Will be looking forward to your evaluation.

[ezman604]

Excellent Bob and congrats on both...the present and the wife!!!

[K.O.]

Merry Christmas!!

[Dan H]

There were a couple of perfect sized boxes under the tree this morning, and I was hopeful they contained what I wanted.... Here is what my darling wife gave me....



It's a .22 cal Beeman Chief PCP, and the scope is a BSA 4-14 x 44 FFP Side Focus with 30mm tube and extended MilDot reticle.... The scope looks a bit big mounted on that gun, but it will be going on my new 6mm PCP project gun anyways.... It is my first FFP scope, and it will be interesting how I get along with that concept.... I stole a scope from my Hatsan AT-44 Long before I gave it to my son for Christmas (and replaced it with a Leapers 4-16 x 50 AO).... The scope from the Hatsan will be going on the new .257 PCP project I am working on concurrently with the 6mm.... It is an older Hawke 6-18 x 44 AO with an SR12 Reticle.... Both scopes should be good for up to 150 yards or beyond, which will be appropriate for the new guns....

The plan for the Chief is to shoot it as is to get a baseline with a bunch of pellets.... and then tear it apart and see what magic I can work on it.... I don't even know when that will happen, maybe not until next winter.... it will depend on how long my current projects take to complete.... Oh, and I finally found some of the new .22 cal Redesigned JSB 25.4 gr. Exact Monster pellets, they will arrive after Christmas.... I'm hopeful I can tune up the Chief to make good use of them, if they prove to be accurate in it.... If not, then I'm sure the 18.1 gr. Heavies will do a stellar job.... Incidently, the Chief weighs 6.75 lbs. naked, and 8.5 lbs. with that big scope on it.... 

Ahhhhhhh it should be a very good year....   

Bob

Dang ! Bob this maybe the most impressive thing I have seen on here ..... just how do you get the wife to buy said air-gun ?  if my wife bought me and air gun I would pinch myself wake up ,and realize it was just a.... fantastical DREAM ! HA ! HA ! 

[WeeHeavy]

Super nice, Bob! I have had that scope on my Marauder since I got the gun. FFP is a really nice feature and it isn't a bad bit of glass for the price. Can't wait to hear what you think of the Chief. I have been considering one myself. Merry Christmas!

[Fussell]

Wow, I'm impressed that your wife actually bought and wrapped them and put them under the tree! That's awesome! I don't know many wives that would take to that level!  You really got a keeper there Bob.
Merry Christmas to you both.

[Nvreloader]

Bob
You had better treat her to a Very Good dinner place,
your better half deserves that at least.............

Tia,
Don
ps, Let the mods begin........

[rsterne]

I cleaned the barrel, removed the open sights and stuck a cheap scope on it.... filled it to 2000 psi and it seems to hold air OK.... so I ran the six different weights of JSB Exact pellets through it.... I did each Chrony string from 2000 psi, and stopped when the first shot dropped below 90% of the highest velocity, and here are the results.... For the number of shots within a 10% ES, drop off the last shot in each string.... so that is only 15-19 shots.... This is fewer shots than the original Disco, from the same pressure fill and at similar FPE.... despite having a slightly larger reservoir.... one of the drawbacks of a shorter barrel (21" vs. 24")....



Note that in every case the first shot was the fastest.... and only the first half of each string fell within my usual 4% ES.... Only with the 33.6 gr. Beasts was there a plateau before the decline.... This means that other than for that pellet (which IMO is way too heavy for a stock Chief), only the first 7-10 shots are within a 4% ES.... This is an indication that, at least in my gun, the hammer strike is a bit too much for the 2000 psi rated fill pressure.... In fact when the gun is filled to 2000 psi on the gauge, the gauge on my Great White says 2100 psi, so it's not a matter of the gauge on the gun reading low, either.... While I was testing, I also shot strings with my BBT 27.4 gr. HP and BBT 29.6 gr. FN bullets.... They are "as cast", and measure 0.217" at the head and 0.219" at the driving band.... I have no idea what the barrel on the Chief measures, but their velocity and energy fit right in with their weights compared to the 25.4 gr. JSB Monsters and 33.6 gr. JSB Beasts.... so I can only assume they are about the right size.... The strings would have fallen right in between those two lines on the chart above.... and they both had a plateau of about 7 or 8 shots before the velocity started to drop....

I shot each string into a target 20 ft. away, at the other end of my shop, to get some idea of how the gun grouped.... as expected, all targets were one ragged hole (they better be at that range with 16-20 shots).... The worst group was the 13.4 gr. RS, the 14.4 gr. Express were much better, the 15.9 gr. Exact the best, closely followed by the 18.1 gr. Heavies.... The 25.4 gr. Monsters (the original design, I don't have any of the "redesigned" ones yet) were noticeably larger, and the 33.6 gr. Beasts were larger again, but still tighter than the 13.4 gr. RS.... The BBT HPs grouped the same as the 33.6 gr. Beasts, and the BBT FN were slightly worse, but still marginally better than the 13.4 gr. RS pellets.... The tightest group (15.9 gr. Exacts) was about 1/8" CTC for 18 shots, and the worst (13.4 gr. RS) was about 1/2" for 16 shots.... The 14.4 gr. Express and the 18.1 gr. heavies both did about 3/16" C-T-C for 17 shots, and clearly the middle weight pellets (14.4 - 18.1 gr.) shot the best from this barrel at this limited range.... From past experience, I would expect them also to shoot the best outside at longer ranges as well....

Here is a summary of the energy and efficiency with each pellet....

13.4 gr. JSB RS - average 854 fps / 21.7 FPE @ 0.86 FPE/CI
14.4 gr. JSB Express - average 845 fps / 22.8 FPE @ 0.89 FPE'CI
15.9 gr. JSB Exact - average 817 fps / 23.6 FPE @ 0.91 FPE/CI
18.1 gr. JSB Heavy - average 791 fps / 25.1 FPE @ 0.98 FPE/CI
25.4 gr. JSB Monster - average 712 fps / 28.6 FPE @ 1.11 FPE/CI
27.4 gr. BBT HP - average 689 fps / 28.9 FPE @ 1.12 FPE/CI
29.6 gr. BBT FN - average 671 fps / 29.6 FPE @ 1.13 FPE/CI
33.6 gr. JSB Beast - average 642 fps / 30.7 FPE @ 1.16 FPE/CI

The Chief has a 21" barrel, and I estimated the reservoir at 9 CI (~148 cc) to calculate the above efficiency numbers.... The ending pressure was over 1300 psi for the lightest pellets (shortest string), and over 1100 psi for the heaviest pellets (longest string).... and the gun used between 41-43 psi per shot.... All pressure readings were from the Beeman gauge, which has 200 psi increments, so estimating the pressure within less than 50 psi is in reality "guessing".... However, as you can see, the heavier the pellet the greater the total energy in the string, and the higher the efficiency, which is pretty typical for a PCP, particularly one that is "oversprung" and wasting a lot of air with the lighter pellets.... In reality, Beeman have opted for higher velocity numbers over a proper bell-curve, much like Crosman did when they "retuned" the Disco by adding a heavier hammer spring.... This is a wasteful way to tune a PCP, I wish Beeman had done better.... It is begging to be detuned a bit to trade off a bit of power for more shots.... but of course there are other alternatives.... Unless Beeman are hiding one inside, there is no external preload adjuster to easily accomplish a retune....

Now that I have about 150 shots through the gun, I can comment on the trigger, and action.... The bolt operates reasonably smoothly, and I prefer the "cock on open" to the original QB cocking, I don't like not being able to feel the pellet seat in the barrel when I close the bolt.... The trigger is a typical QB trigger, and although Beeman say it is a 2-stage, the trigger pull is heavy enough I really can't tell.... There seems to be a slight increase in trigger pull just before the sear releases, but the initial travel is long and hard, and there is a bit of creep in the "second stage" (if it even exists, I'm still not convinced).... Some work on the trigger will be the first thing I do.... and pulling the receiver off to see what the porting is like will happen pretty quickly as well....

Bob

PS, Yeah, she's a keeper alright.... she even let me put it together, shoot it, and write it up for you guys on Christmas day !!!.... 

[KnifeMaker]

Stepping back for the wonderfuL christmas Present for a moment, bob, once you get use to the FFP, your gonna have a hard time justifying a 2ndfp scope.

My poor Zeiss just sets in the closet now. LOL!!! 

Knife

[Dan H]

man that was quick Bob ! ..... chrono -graphed tested with 8 pellets .. out from the tree into the test shop .. my wife would have killed me LOL ! ...I was going to go out and shoot the carnivore .30 a bit....instead I had to cook a bit today .. we did nice thick ribeye and it was choice !  ...

[tonyps32]

Man I will say I have seen reviews on it and its not the worst airgun out there nor the best. Rough around the edges, but with a little time and magic I bet it will be a good shooter.

[Gertrude]

very NICE Bob,
I will be following with great interest.

[grand-galop]

Amen to your wife..... LOL   This is a good start for out of the box...  On the edge of my seat for the next in developement around this rifle..

Happy new year to you my friend and your family...

[Wayne52]

You've got a good wife there Bob !!!

[Ribbonstone]

Just for comparsion. Using 18.1's.

First shot string was pretty much like yours.  Rifle was a bit over sprung.




The only thing I did to it was to change the spriker spring tension.  Didn't bother with making an adjuster, just went with the old-school cut-try-shim...repeat.


Cut more than I should have at first (didn't cosider how much more making a dead end was going to add to the cut):


Shimmed it back up in tension:



Then tried just one spacer:


I kept it there, but most tests have it running out of 4% by about shot #25...evidently, that one was a bit of a freak.


Did find this particular rifle really likes the 21gr. H&N's (same cut spring/i spacer setting as above):



So...while I usually like getting inside and changing all sorts of things, this time I just let it alone at this point.  Figured 25X25 was easy enough to remember.



If it is any help...this might give you some ideas.




There is already a threaded hole in the rear end cap (for a degasser).  So unlike a QB, you don't have to off center to make an adjuster.

Has that odd hollow tube part of the end cap...but that won't really matter for a properly sized spring guide/adjuster.

Trigger is pure QB (about the only part it shares), and incluseds the 3 adjusting screws.

[rsterne]

Yours looks to be about 25 fps "hotter" out of the box than mine is, Ribbon.... your first 5 shots with the 18.1 gr. are all faster than mine, starting at 2000 psi....

Bob

[Gertrude]

Yours looks to be about 25 fps "hotter" out of the box than mine is, Ribbon.... your first 5 shots with the 18.1 gr. are all faster than mine, starting at 2000 psi....

Bob

Must be the Luzianna air vs the Canuk air ? 

[rsterne]

Please note I have changed the name of this thread.... Eventually the "Merry Christmas" part will disappear also.... to make the thread easier to search....

Today I pulled the gun out of the stock and removed the trigger and rear plug to have a look.... You have to put the safety on the "safe" position and drive it gently out of the trigger before you can slide the action out of the stock, typical QB trigger.... Here is a photo of the stock trigger with the side plate removed....



Note the generous sear engagement, which causes the long travel.... Also note the stiff trigger spring, which is sitting crooked.... When you squeeze the trigger, just about where the sear releases that spring binds on the edge of the hole, causing that weird "second stage" feel I had noticed.... This is NOT a 2-stage trigger, despite what Beeman say in their manual....  .... However, it soon will be.... 

When I removed the rear plug and took out the spring I found three things.... you can see them in the photo below....



First, the back end of the spring was just cut off, the last coil was not closed.... Secondly, there was a single washer behind the spring.... Thirdly, and most interestingly, there was a threaded insert with a hex hole in the back that you can adjust with a 5mm allen key from the back of the gun.... This provides an EXTERNAL PRELOAD ADJUSTMENT.... Mine was 4 turns from full in.... That washer is important, don't take it out.... The spring and washer are 10mm OD, and the threaded insert is 10 mm x 1mm threads.... The rear of the housing is drilled and tapped for that thread, which means that the ID is about 9 mm.... This means you can't remove the spring through the back hole.... However, the front of the housing is drilled over 10mm, to allow the washer and spring to slide freely.... This creates a shoulder inside the housing where the threads stop.... The washer prevents the spring from going any further back than that shoulder, no matter how far you back out the threaded insert.... Without the washer, that point on the spring might get caught in the front of the threads, or damage them.... This arrangement is quite cleverly designed to give a range of preload adjustment equal to the length of that threaded insert, which is 10 mm.... Because the threads are slightly tapered on the ends, mine actually had about 9.3 turns of travel, which works out to 0.366" of adjustment.... If you back the screw out too far, the washer limits the minimum preload.... If you try and get too much preload, the threaded insert runs out of threads and just spins in the hole.... You can bet when I reassemble the gun, I will be finding out the range of adjustment you can get with this well designed arrangement....

but first I need to fix up this trigger.... 

Bob

[rsterne]

I removed the trigger, spring and sear, here is what they look like stock.... I rubbed the sliding surfaces lightly with 400 grit to highlight the imperfections for the camera....



The trigger is cast, and actually pretty smooth, although there is a bit of fine pitting on the surface that slides along the sear.... The sear, on the other hand, is a mess.... All three rubbing surfaces have heavy lines cutting across the contact areas.... The surface in the photo above slides across the top of the trigger after the sear releases, so not important for trigger feel, but it is for smooth hammer release.... The tiny spring plunger in the photo above will be used to create the second stage....



In the second photo, you can see the stock (heavy) spring, and a typical spring I might replace it with.... longer and lighter.... This photo of the sear shows that it is a real mess.... The upper surface is what locks the hammer in place.... those lines won't affect trigger feel, but they will affect smooth and consistent hammer release, and could even cause wear on the hammer.... You can actually see a burr on the top edge, right where it grips the hammer.... The lower surface is the one that is critical for smooth trigger pull.... Just look at all the lines running across it.... and imagine what that will feel like as you squeeze the trigger....

Time for some TLC with 220, 400, 600 and 800 grit wet-or-dry sandpaper.... It is critical not to change the SHAPE of the contact surfaces, just remove the roughness and polish them.... Stay tuned....

Bob