Water removal recommendations for Shoebox compressor?

[Taso1000]

Hi John!  Yeah, I wasn't sure how much water I would be creating.  Lloyd had posted a spreadsheet to calculate how much water would existed in pressurized air.  I think I had calculated about a teaspoon with my setup. 

I didn't know how wide the passages in the couplers and nipples would be so I figured I'd double up so I didn't have to pay for shipping again from August Industries.  Plus those parts were cheap.

I'll see if I can dig up a before picture of the Shoebox.  All I removed was the foster fitting and then added all the new stuff.  Yeah the hanging trap is a limitation but I wanted it to be the lowest point to collect and liquid water from the compressor and the Alpha filter as it cools and gets squeezed out by the increasing pressure. 

The gold fitting at the top of the Alpha filter is a pressure maintaining valve (PMV).  It came with the Alpha.  JB's document taped to the filter states that it is set at 2200 psi.  I don't see a way to adjust it so it's safe to say it's a fixed pressure point.  My understanding is that it performs three functions.  First is to create dwell in the Alpha filter so that the molecular sieve has more time to absorb moisture. Second, molecular sieve works better at higher pressures.  Third, the higher the pressure you get the air to the more humidity gets squeezed and condenses out as liquid water. 

As for the laundry room, it's heated and I can test my setup inside on the counter space    .  I'd rather it was not in the house for safety and will most likely move it to the garage in the spring once it's all set up the way I want it.

Thanks,

Taso

[FuzzyGrub]

I was looking for that type of fitting when I had the large "gold" HP filter.  The SB Max just took too long to fill the filter, vs my 90ci and guppy tanks.   I went with a much smaller "mini me" version of the "gold" filter.    I have inspected the "mini me" after every fill, and have not seen any visible moisture, yet. 

I suspect with your level of low side filtration, that you will not be anywhere near what you have calculated for condensation.  All the plumbing will add up for your fill times, but easy to remove those couplings at any time in the future.  Or leave it pressurized.  If you bleed your tank, everything behind that PMV should stay at 2200psi.  The SB check valve on the HP cylinder should seal it off, I would think.

If I thought it was unsafe, would move it out of the house.  The burst disk in the SB and tanks, along with the pressure switch, and use of a timer that prevents over running it.  My tanks are a couple years away from their first hydro, which I plan to have done even though I don't have them filled by others.   I like the convenience and using the somewhat "conditioned" inside house air.   It was 5 degrees outside this AM, not that much warmer in the garage.     While it makes less noise than the washing machine, I do only fill it when others are not around.   Even with those protections, I monitor it closely during the fill cycle.

[Taso1000]

The membrane drier brings the dew point down to -4 degrees Fahrenheit.  So much below freezing which I wouldn't think humidity was possible.  But I've read that moisture can basically float in the air in it's solid state.  Very interesting!  I thought it would solidify and fall to the ground due to it being heavier than air.

I probably don't need the silica gel canister.  But since I had it I wanted to see if it would catch any moisture.  If after a couple tank fills I don't see a color change I may remove it.

Like I said earlier I want to see what is necessary and what is overkill.  I believe the membrane drier will be the best performer and everything else will remove some minute traces of moisture.

Just finished with the furnace tech.  My furnace was hitting the high limit two minutes after the second stage kicked on.  I was most likely using too restrictive air filters.  I'm gonna run to Menards to get new fiberglass filter and then get to work.   

Taso

[chwillbill68]

Hi All,

Just a small update.  I am still waiting on the first filter I ordered.     It is the micro filter to protect the membrane drier so it doesn't get clogged and fail.

Also I ordered the wrong modular clamps for the SMC filters so they become like one unit.  I ordered the ones that had the integrated brackets trying to kill 2 birds with one stone.  Those brackets interfere with the filter housings and can't be tightened down all the way.  D'oh!!!

So I ordered the correct modular fittings and separate brackets, I think.   

I've attached a picture on how I think the components should be connected together.  Please let me know what you think or have better suggestions.

I am not sure if I should feed the aftercooler and desiccant chamber from the bottom and output at the top.  I'm also thinking to slope the aftercooler so that standing water will drain.

The membrane drier instructions say to use a regulator downstream.  I'm not sure if I should place it at the end of the line as pictured or before the desiccant chamber?

I am also going to mount two shutoff valves so that at the input and exits so that no moisture from the atmosphere can get into the system and needlessly saturate the desiccant when the Shoebox is not in use.

Everything is coming along slowly at least.

Thank you!

Taso

Taso, what kind of desicant filter is that and where did you get it?  Thanks Bill C!

[Taso1000]

Hey Bill!  If your asking about the canister with the blue silica gel, it is a Drierite Laboratory Gas Drying Unit, part number 26840. 

https://secure.drierite.com/catalog3/page5.cfm?activeMenu=1

It came with the Shoebox compressor I bought.  I probably don't need it but it will indicate how the membrane drier is working.

Taso

[Trigger_Finger]

Hey Bill!  If your asking about the canister with the blue silica gel, it is a Drierite Laboratory Gas Drying Unit, part number 26840. 

https://secure.drierite.com/catalog3/page5.cfm?activeMenu=1

It came with the Shoebox compressor I bought.  I probably don't need it but it will indicate how the membrane drier is working.

Taso

Taso that's a nice dryer. I was tempted to order 1 but it's max pressure is 90 psig or 104 psi.

[Taso1000]

My Shoebox Max has a max inlet pressure of 85 psi so it's adequate in my situation.  The Gas Purifier version "looks" identical to the one I have and it's rated at 100 psi. 

Off the top of my head you could probably build a nice canister for media with one of those clear whole house water filters like this:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Pentek-150560-3G-Standard-20-x-2-5-Clear-Whole-House-Filter-House-3-4-NPT/201373462933?epid=1727463714&hash=item2ee2cb3195:g:SQcAAOSw1MBZ1-zA

and then get creative with directing the flow to have the most contact with the media.  I would think a small diameter pvc tube for a core with a corkscrew flow director from top to bottom between the core and outer wall of the canister.  The one I linked to is 20 inches and handles up to 125 psi.

Taso

[FuzzyGrub]

I have seen utube videos of making them from whole house water filter housings.  Just be careful with pressure ratings.  They did have to feed the media in via one of the ports, and make a plug to prevent it flowing downstream.  They had a micron filter at the end of the tube, at the bottom of the media. 

Now, a 20" one, probably will last a year without changing media! 

[chwillbill68]

My Shoebox Max has a max inlet pressure of 85 psi so it's adequate in my situation.  The Gas Purifier version "looks" identical to the one I have and it's rated at 100 psi. 

Off the top of my head you could probably build a nice canister for media with one of those clear whole house water filters like this:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Pentek-150560-3G-Standard-20-x-2-5-Clear-Whole-House-Filter-House-3-4-NPT/201373462933?epid=1727463714&hash=item2ee2cb3195:g:SQcAAOSw1MBZ1-zA

and then get creative with directing the flow to have the most contact with the media.  I would think a small diameter pvc tube for a core with a corkscrew flow director from top to bottom.  The one I linked to is 20 inches and handles up to 125 psi.

Taso

  Very interesting Thanks Taso.  If I read everything right I would need something that could handle 125 psi.  Thats what it says the input PSI should be at the shoebox.  I can just see myself getting blasted by what ever I rig up. LOL

[Booger]

I now use this: Just to the right of the air compressor & below the Shoebox. The other filter on top of the shoebox is just an extra filter.

[Taso1000]

I like it Jesse!  I need to get my low side completed this weekend!  It will be my mission.   

Taso

[chwillbill68]

I now use this: Just to the right of the air compressor & below the Shoebox. The other filter on top of the shoebox is just an extra filter.

I like it also! Can you give me the details of your two filters and were to get them or how you made them?
Thanks Bill C!

[Taso1000]

If I remember correctly one of the items Jesse has hooked up is a pressure regulator but I don't remember if the other is a filter or something else.  The long one in the center is full of desiccant.

Taso

[chwillbill68]

If I remember correctly one of the items Jesse has hooked up is a pressure regulator but I don't remember if the other is a filter or something else.  The long one in the center is full of desiccant.

Taso

What's the white item?  Is it a home made filter?

[Taso1000]

It looks like pvc with a foster at one end that's not currently in his filter loop.  Jesse was being creative!   

Taso

[Booger]

It looks like pvc with a foster at one end that's not currently in his filter loop.  Jesse was being creative!   

Taso

+1 on being creative, and it worked fine. The long one with the gauges was bought when I bought my F10, no one wanted to buy it and since I made all my money back from selling other things when I bought my F10 I decided to keep it. I think the original buyer said it cost $600.

[Trigger_Finger]

I now use this: Just to the right of the air compressor & below the Shoebox. The other filter on top of the shoebox is just an extra filter.

I like the one pvc diy. I think the pvc  one beats the $70-$100 gold filter and looks like it can handle 125 psi on the intake side . I could build one like that but I don't want to deal the pain of looking for the right fitting .

[chwillbill68]

I now use this: Just to the right of the air compressor & below the Shoebox. The other filter on top of the shoebox is just an extra filter.

I like the one pvc diy. I think the pvc  one beats the $700-$100 gold filter and looks like it can handle 125 psi on the intake side . I could build one like that but I don't want to deal the pain of looking for the right fitting .

   I agree with you Trigger_Finger.   I may have to look around at some different stores to see what I can come up with!

[Booger]

I now use this: Just to the right of the air compressor & below the Shoebox. The other filter on top of the shoebox is just an extra filter.

I like the one pvc diy. I think the pvc  one beats the $700-$100 gold filter and looks like it can handle 125 psi on the intake side . I could build one like that but I don't want to deal the pain of looking for the right fitting .

   I agree with you Trigger_Finger.   I may have to look around at some different stores to see what I can come up with!

I got everything I needed at Home Depot for about $20 except for the beads. I used a recycled filter from two of the small filters on top of my F10 to protect from the dust that might make it in.

I would sell you mine, but right now I am sick with the flue and might be a week before I could mail it.

[Taso1000]

Is it the stuffy head flu?  I got rid of it about 5 weeks ago and got reinfected with he same one as far as I can tell 5 days ago.  It took me 2 weeks to get rid of it the first time.  😕