Water removal recommendations for Shoebox compressor?

[Taso1000]

I couldn't find what I wanted at the home improvement stores so I ordered from Amazon.  Instead of copper tubing with compression fittings to make the aftercooler pitch I went with 2 45 degree brass elbows.

I found paintball quick disconnects much cheaper than the quick disconnect I pictured a couple days ago so I went with those.

What thread sealant is recommended?  I have Vibratite 444 that I used for my high pressure fittings.  I'd rather use that before it ruins.  I don't know the shelf life but I bought it about two months ago. 

Hopefully I can get all this assembled and have a test run this weekend.

I am eager to see if all this time and effort will have good results.  I hope so!   

Thanks,

Taso

[Buldawg76]

John
Agreed that if it works for us then no need to change the method we use.

Taso
I have never used any Krytox but have thought about trying some in my spring guns. I use divers silicone grease and RC car silicone oil for shocks ( 50 to 100 weights ) to lube the HPA parts and in the PCPs for o rings and to coat the internals of the guns.

For thread sealant I use good old fashioned white Teflon pipe tape. I have used some Harley Teflon pipe dope ( liquid in a small tube ) on fittings as well with good results. I only use it on joints that are not handled regularly since it does not dry to a hard surface so it will come off in your hands on the part of the fitting that is exposed.

I cannot say what the shelf life of Vibratite 444 is since I have never used it. I stick with Loctite products since have used them for years in the auto industry with great success. Just need to use the correct product for the intended purpose and most of my use in air guns is the Blue medium and Purple low strength Loctite's with the red high strength on parts that will seldom if ever need to be removed.

Mike

[Taso1000]

Hi All,

So I got all my fittings and gauges in and mocked up how I'm going to lay everything out.  I also mad the system semi detachable to service the filters and change media in the drier.  There are 3 changes I'd like to make from the attached pictures.  I'd like to put 90 degree elbows on the intake from the shop compressor  and the  output to the Shoebox.  Also I think the shutoff valve may be more beneficial after the output regulator. 

I finally found and ordered 800 grams of indicating molecular sieve to replace the silica gel in the column drier.

I think I'm just going to mount everything to a 2' x 4' sheet of 3/4" plywood and just hang it from a wall.  So this should all be completed this weekend and I can start testing the systems effectiveness.  I hope it was all worth it.   

Taso

[FuzzyGrub]

Getting closer!.....     Given your arrangement, plywood mounting does seem like the way to go. 

[Taso1000]

John,

Thank you.  Unfortunately I was involved in a car accident Wednesday morning so there may be some delays to my project.    

I am ok except for a crushed heel bone, torn ligaments in my knee and I think there was something wrong with my knee cap.  All on the right side.  I need to make an appointment with the orthopedic doctor around the 20th to see what my options are.  I am hoping I won't need surgery.

Taso

[FuzzyGrub]

Unfortunately I was involved in a car accident Wednesday morning so there may be some delays to my project.    
I am ok except for a crushed heel bone, torn ligaments in my knee and I think there was something wrong with my knee cap.  All on the right side.  I need to make an appointment with the orthopedic doctor around the 20th to see what my options are.  I am hoping I won't need surgery.
Taso

Oh man, that sounds painful.    Wishing you a speedy recovery. 

[Taso1000]

Thank you!  Norco is doing it's job about the pain but makes me drowsy and messes with my balance.

Taso

[Buldawg76]

Taso
Sorry to hear about the accident and you having injuries to you right leg and foot. I hope it does not need surgery or other serious procedures to get it you in good shape.

I know how the pain pills affect the senses as well so hopefully you will heal quickly and can not have to take them for very long.

Best wishes for a speedy recovery.

Mike

[Taso1000]

Mike,

Thank you!  I also hope I won't need surgery.  But if I have to then I have to.  My cousin was just telling me that there would be high probability with knee.  Once I the orthopedic doctor sees me I'll know for sure.

Taso

[Buldawg76]

I hope for the best for you and keep us informed

Mike

[TerryH]

Taso,

Just learned of your accident. So sorry. Hoping for a full and speedy recovery for you.

Terry

[Taso1000]

Terry,

Thank you.  :-)  I know I will be all right but the thought of not being able to drive and be mobile stinks. 

Last August I decided to venture out on my own into the I.T . support  field.  I am lucky that I have enough customers to be busy and finally have some financial comfort in that I am making a fair living.

Granted, the majority of my support requests can be completed via remote access the remainder I will have to find a solution for.

I know I may be borrowing worry but I always like to cover all my bases.

Don't get me wrong,  being stuck at home all day will give me more time to play with bb guns but in good conscience I can't do that as I'm not wired that way.  I have commitments to my customers that I need to keep.

I hope that all makes sense.

Thanks,

Taso

[TerryH]

Terry,

Thank you.  :-)  I know I will be all right but the thought of not being able to drive and be mobile stinks. 

Last August I decided to venture out on my own into the I.T . support  field.  I am lucky that I have enough customers to be busy and finally have some financial comfort in that I am making a fair living.

Granted, the majority of my support requests can be completed via remote access the remainder I will have to find a solution for.

I know I may be borrowing worry but I always like to cover all my bases.

Don't get me wrong,  being stuck at home all day will give me more time to play with bb guns but in good conscience I can't do that as I'm not wired that way.  I have commitments to my customers that I need to keep.

I hope that all makes sense.

Thanks,

Taso

Sounds familiar and makes perfect sense.

I've been following here as I have an Altaros in transit. Should have it in a couple of days. I'm going with a much less elaborate setup...at least to start. I have a Sharpe 8130/F88 filter in my system now. Filter is 35 feet from the compressor (240v/2 stage/5hp/80gal). I'm adding a DeVilbiss 130525 QC3 exclusively for the Altaros. Hoping for the best from there. Guess we will soon see.

[Taso1000]

Terry,

Yes, I nerded out a "little" with my filtration setup but I do enjoy researching, planning out and configuring the system.

I was very interested in the Altaros compressor when they were first announced as I am a frugal kinda guy and don't like wasting money.  I don't have a problem spending more money it if I can get a performance benefit.

So I followed a couple threads on the Altaros and found that it was virtually maintenance free and that my current compressor would struggle to support it.  So I went back to the Shoebox.  It has a low cfm requirement so my Sears compressor would be adequate.

The Shoebox I ended up buying had silica gel an calcium sulfate as drier media.  Since I knew nothing about drying air before buying the Shoebox I started researching.

Silica gel an calcium sulfate have low capacities and needed to be regenerated frequently. 

I had read about refrigerated driers so I researched those.  They only removed water vapor to a ~40 degree fahrenheit dew point, were expensive and required more money to operate.

Then I found the membrane air driers.  They block the flow of the water molecules.  The units I found will bring the dew point down to -20 degrees celsius.  Then I figured since I had the media cylinder I'd use it with the best drier medium which is molecular sieve which will give a dew point of -100 degrees.

The membrane dryer will be doing the majority of the water vapor removal.

I don't think I really need the aftercooler but it was only $37.  Since I started from just a compressor I had to get regulators, gauges and the other particle filters.

The membrane drier requires the micro mist separator as any oil will reduce the life of the membrane drier.  I bought the other upstream filters to increase the down stream filter media life.

Is this the optimal setup?  I doubt it as this is my first setup.  Testing will tell us if it has the required results.

I figured I'd try and see how much moisture I could remove with just low pressure filtration.

Thanks,

Taso

[Buldawg76]

Taso
Could you post a link or info on the membrane filter you bought for your system as I must have missed it and would like to see if it helps with my setup on the low pressure side. I am in the process of researching a high side molecular sieve setup as well but would like to remove as much moisture before the shoebox as possible as well like you have done.

Mike

[Taso1000]

Mike,

Here's a link to the product configuration page:

http://www.smcusa.com/products/IDG-Membrane-Air-Dryer-Series~127954

There are different flow capacities and inlet pipe options.

The majority of the models are a housing with a replaceable filter element.  The one I got is all in one, the filter element is not changeable.

There are also links to more information.  I just did a quick check on ebay and there are 2 used units for less than $70.  I don't know the sellers or the condition so those are questions that would need to be asked.  There is also a harmful substance list that needs to be checked as the filter element can be damaged.

Thanks,

Taso

[Buldawg76]

Taso

Thanks for the link and I checked them out but really have no clue as to which one I would need but searched for the IDG1-N02-P part number model that showed to be in the 200 dollar range.
 
I cannot afford that much at this time for a low side dryer. So is that around the cost for the one you are using. I have gotten and been using a high side molecular sieve from china that is doing very good at capturing the moisture before it gets to my tanks or guns. I see no moisture vapor at all when bleeding the air at the tanks but do see moisture if I bleed at the shoebox bleed off port. Here is a link to the sieve for 69 bucks shipped.

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/This-is-a-gift-free-of-mechanical-parts-the-link-is-used-for-customers-pay-the/32602913439.html

I bought some 13x sieve medium off eBay for 22 bucks that is doing very well. The sieve comes with a paper style water trap material so I cut it into about 2 inch lengths and got a thin flexible plastic type of cutting board that's about 1/32" thick and cut it so it could be rolled into a tube the length of the sieve less the threaded portion. I rolled it up to fit in the sieve and taped it so it was a good fit to the inside ID of the sieve. Then I put one of the paper traps I cut onto one end of the rolled up plastic tube and filled the tube with the medium until it left enough room to install the other cut piece of paper trap into the opposite end of the rolled up tube. Then slide that into the sieves aluminum housing and screwed on the caps. The idea is you do not want the 13x medium to make contact with the aluminum since once it is collecting moisture it will start a corrosive reaction with the metal so the plastic cutting board material prevents direct contact with the aluminum so no corrosion can develop. Here is a link to the 13x medium I bought off eBay.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/252222241108

Mike

[Taso1000]

Mike,

I got lucky.  I found mine used on ebay for $88 shipped.  I can't see any signs it was installed or used so it looked like opened package NOS.  I would have preferred the housing models but they were more at the time.

As for sizing I started at flow rate.  I read that the Shoebox Maxx only uses .2 cfm.  My IDG1 is rated for 10 liters per minute.  So 10 liters per minute = 0.353146667 cubic feet per minute.  So I'm using ~57% capacity.  I have attached a pic of the flow rates for the different models.

There are two IDG5's on ebay right now between $70 and $80.  They flow 50 lpm or 1.7657 cfm.  Plenty for a Shoebox compressor.

I bought this indicating molecular sieve from Amazon:



It's 800 grams for $35.  I think my cylinder has a 500 gram capacity so I may have some left over.

Taso

[Taso1000]

I forgot to add.  The IDG models 1 through 20 are rated up to 123 psi (.85 mpa)

Taso

[Buldawg76]

Taso

I will check out the ones on eBay since thats a better price that I can accept for the filters.

The molecular sieve I got off eBay was 3 LBs so I only used about 1/4 LB of it in my sieve and will just change it out as needed. It has some indicating medium mixed in so I should be able to tell when it needs heated to remove the moisture. The reason I went with 13X size versus the 4A you are using is the 13X is designed to trap H2O specifically and can hold almost three times as much moisture as the 4A medium from the research I did on the different make ups of medium that are available. The 13X is also designed to be used in high pressure application so it is better suited for use in the high side of the setups.

I can tell that it is absorbing the moisture completely since I see no vapor when bleeding off the pressure after the sieve. The only drawback to using it on the high side that I see so far is it takes about 10 minutes for the shoebox to pressurize the lines and sieve to 3000 psi before it actually starts to fill a tank or gun. I have bought a on/off valve to put after the sieve so I can shut the valve and trap the pressure in the sieve between changing tanks or gun so I only have to pressurize the sieve once per filling sessions. 

Mike