Author Topic: Winchester 1400cs (Read 12749 times))

unionrdr · « **Reply #20 on:** March 23, 2017, 06:17:56 AM »

Well, now that my new hip is installed, I can get back to waiting for a bright, sunshiny day to film some more Chrono shots through my android phone. I figured I'd get velocity numbers to go with the weight numbers. THEN try'em out at the range to see what they do. I still say velocity & range/POI are more closely related than many realize.

RedFeather · « **Reply #21 on:** March 23, 2017, 02:44:57 PM »

Is that a spring powered gun or gas piston? Either way, I would strongly suggest you get some heavy pellets. In the ubermagnums like your Winchester, light pellets will burn/slam the piston seal and snap springs in short order. Plus there is little to gain pushing pellets much over 950 fps due to destabilization nearing the sound barrier. These guns are meant for heavy ammo which "carries up" a lot better at the long ranges you mention shooting at. Just a bit of friendly advice.

Also, if your gun can do this, you can often decock by breaking the barrel, taking a firm grip and pulling the trigger, controlling the barrel as it comes up. I do this on my Ruger Air Magnum. Saves a few pellets and is handy when you can't shoot one out safely.

unionrdr · « **Reply #22 on:** March 26, 2017, 01:22:21 PM »

I don't believe all that stuff about breaking springs and generally blowing the thing up when too many or maybe just a couple light pellets are used. These things are designed for them. And I'm not using 4 or 5 grain pellets, like the 5.2 grain Kenny used to get that 1410FPS. All the testing with light pellets he did didn't blow it up or break anything. BUT, after 20 total shots, it did smoke the breech seal, and a month or so later, I'm still waiting for the seals they sent me to get here. Called them some 2 weeks ago about it, they finally found, as I figured, their computer had generated a bad tracking number. Then hey called the postmaster in Lorain that takes care of our mail. He called me & said he couldn't find it, hasn't found it yet, & would keep looking. That was some 2 weeks ago. So all testing has come to a halt with this rifle. It smoked from the breech like a freshly fired 12 gauge every shot. And I cleaned/dry patched the barrel first. Must've been very liberal with the assembly lubes? Gotta clean the barrel again.
But I did test with JSB Straton 8.44gr, JSB Express 7.87gr, & Beeman Laser 6.5gr. Results are back in post on Feb 26th. I'm liking the JSB Exact Express 7.87gr @ an average of 968.67FPS as a good compromise between velocity & FPE @ POI. I refuse to believe a pellet weighing a jungle ton, slowing the thing waaaay down is going to store all that energy to POI. Like a very heavy flywheel, it's using all that energy to get moving in the first place. It is not going to carry all of it to 50-100 yards. Especially in .177 caliber. But we'll see if/when the seals ever get here. Unless you might know of a non-factory site to get the breech seals from? I'd love to get this going again.

unionrdr · « **Reply #23 on:** March 31, 2017, 04:34:52 PM »

And, after a bit of trouble with bad tracking numbers, etc, I finally got the breech seals. One warranty replacement & two I bought to have extras.

I had to use a small mallet, a paring knife & a small, pocket screwdriver to get the old breech seal out. they fit quite tightly, And must be evenly pried out around their circumference. Then a Qutip soaked in Pellgun oil to clean & lube the seal land. Then coated the seal with lube placed evenly in the end of the seal land. Tapped it in with a small mallet & 3/4 inch diameter dowel rod. left a little bit more sticking out than normal to be sure it found the sweet spot to seal. Shot two Beeman Silver Bear pellets through it (7.1gr). It cracked a bit louder than before & kicked noticeably harder. I'm calling this operation a success. Removed the bipod to save weight, and it actually shifted balance back to in front of trigger guard. Also removed the factory 3-9x32 scope. Replaced it with a Hammers 4-12x40AO scope on Instapark 5-bolt rail mount they call a magnum air rifle mount. Got both on amazon.

When the weather clears & thus brightens up enough, I wanna make a video of chronograph numbers with this rifle & the new pellets I bought to test in it once more, now that it has a new breech seal. I brushed, oil patched and dry patched the barrel again. got filthy after only 20 shots.

SteveP-52 · « **Reply #24 on:** March 31, 2017, 05:15:57 PM »

And I'll bet for all that breech seal swapping, you'll still on occasion get a little smoke after firing...lol. It happens, we all get it and I have rifles that even after 1000+ shots still do now and then and none of them has ever "smoked" a breech seal. Even for being an air rifle, firing one still creates heat from the friction of the pellet against the barrel which translates to that little puff of smoke you see.
It's also not a matter of how much stored energy you can get out to the 50+ yard mark, it's accuracy not to mention making a humane kill at that distance or farther...I don't care how fast you chuck it out the barrel, the farther that .177 pellet gets down range, the more wobbly it's going to get if it's a lighter weight and the more wind is going to start affecting it and turning the spin it started with into a tumble. Although you'll still get it moving up to a 10 or 12 grain pellet, it won't be quite as bad and give you a little better accuracy at longer ranges.
These guys really aren't trying to rain on your parade, just give you solid advice based on lots of experience

unionrdr · « **Reply #25 on:** April 01, 2017, 07:26:45 PM »

Well, that's where some of the newer thoughts differ. Wish I'd have saved every nit-picky dissertation. Anyway, they say now the lighter (not too much lighter) pellet travels so fast, it's actually spending less time in flight to target to be effected by the wind, for one. And all three barrels were filthy after not so many shots. Cleaned them, added new breech seal, shot twice, and no smoke to speak of. For now. It just seems counter-productive to use super heavy pellets that kill all the power to slow it down to more stability. Like a mid-powered rifle. I say we don't have to slow them down that much to get power at range and stability. That's all...

SteveP-52 · « **Reply #26 on:** April 01, 2017, 08:35:24 PM »

All barrels are dirty from the factory, there's always dirt and gunk left in there from producing them and the factories never clean them before they box them up. I own 20 and every one of them had a mess in there ranging from not so bad to down right nasty.
As far as pellet weights, something in the 10-12gr range which would park you in the middle of the range for .177 pellet weights. Not too heavy yet not too light and should give you real nice accuracy.

RedFeather · « **Reply #27 on:** April 03, 2017, 12:58:39 AM »

Run a couple of searches on transonic shock and diablo or waisted pellets. They aren't the most aerodynamic projectiles. Don't confuse speed with power. A lot of ft lbs on paper never end up leaving the page. Why the prior post recommended a bit heavier pellet. Believe me, you are not giving up anything.

The smoke you see in the breech most likely comes from any volatile vapors combusting in the compression tube. Temps run very high, if only for a fraction of a second. Why we don't use petroleum products in front of the piston.

unionrdr · « **Reply #28 on:** April 03, 2017, 07:04:24 PM »

I know all barrels have used motor oil for rust preventive from the factory. I cleaned all three before shooting the first time. I mean after shooting the Crosman 12-15 times, Hatsan 56 times, Winchester 20 times, those barrels were filthy as new again! So I cleaned all three once more. And the Hatsan and Winchester being break barrels, I had to load and shoot them to, " uncock". The Winchester didn't smoke after two shots this time. I'd swabbed the bores damp with Rem-Oil before using the barrel brushes. Then finished oil and dry patch cleaning.
Without a certain amount of velocity, there will be no power. Velocity is movement. Power comes from movement. I'll see how things go at the range until I get my hip and thigh/back muscles strong enough again after hip surgery 2 weeks ago today to get afield once more next season.

unionrdr · « **Reply #29 on:** April 09, 2017, 01:35:16 PM »

Okay, well, I finally got the new breech seals from Daisy in the mail. Had to use a paring knife, pocket-size screwdriver and tack hammer to R&R it, but I got it. Seals real well now. Which enabled me to test three tins of different pellets I bought in .177 caliber for this rifle with my Caldwell deluxe chronograph. Connected to my cell phone app, here's a video that gives all the information as I shoot this big heavy rifle;

unionrdr · « **Reply #30 on:** May 09, 2017, 03:43:06 PM »

Also interesting, as can be seen in this recent photo, is the fact that the Winchester 1400cs is only about 2 inches longer and about a pound heavier than the Benjamin Trail NP XL725!
http://imageshack.com/a/img922/1492/IdJLyv.jpg

unionrdr · « **Reply #31 on:** June 20, 2017, 04:38:30 PM »

Well, gentlemen, I must concede to the evidence you've presented. Another buddy on one of the Facebook air rifle pages has the same rifle and kills medium-size game with it. Although a couple of his pellet choices are made " for PCP only(*)" per their labeling. His choices for most used in his 1400cs are;
H&N Baracuda Match 10.65gr
Gamo Rocket 9.6gr
H&N Terminator 7.5gr
H&N Baracuda Hunter Extreme 9.57gr
H&N Sniper Magnum 15gr*
Gamo Silent Cat 10.5gr
JSB Exact Monster diabolo 13.43gr*

These are the pellets I currently have, after trying some from 2 boxes of Straight Shooter samples I've since traded for a heavy load of .22 pellets.
http://imageshack.com/a/img924/1510/IoEvcw.jpg
So, in light of these, which would you say I should try next? I think the (*) marked ones are too heavy, made for PCP's additional power.

LeadPoisoner · « **Reply #32 on:** June 20, 2017, 05:51:41 PM »

heres 10 to 14 grain .177
https://www.pyramydair.com/ammo/pellets?orderBy=price_asc

unionrdr · « **Reply #33 on:** June 22, 2017, 02:51:46 PM »

Thanks for the link. I'll order a couple of those when I get paid next week.

LeadPoisoner · « **Reply #34 on:** June 25, 2017, 06:15:14 PM »

H&N Baracuda Airgun Pellets .177 Cal, 10.65 Grains, Round Nose, 500ct $12.97 free ship to store pickup

wish they had the .22

unionrdr · « **Reply #35 on:** June 28, 2017, 10:17:50 PM »

Take a look at Walmart.com. They got a lot of tins of pellets marked new the other day. Saw the Baracuda 10.65's and more I earmarked till Friday. Pyramid air as well. Want shoulder slings from Benjamin and Hatsan. Now if I can just get Winchester 1400cs sling mounts I can use'em on the Striker 1000x.

LeadPoisoner · « **Reply #36 on:** June 28, 2017, 11:14:58 PM »

by the way kenny kormendy had issues with this rifle being too long on barrel i believe, dont go too heavy i think around 10 should be fine

unionrdr · « **Reply #37 on:** June 29, 2017, 07:38:56 PM »

Another guy on the Facebook air rifle pages named Ollom has the same rifle, and even kills coyotes with it. Besides coons and such. He uses heavy pellets (it'd take awhile to read and find which ones) and does fine. I wonder if Kenny just got an off one? I did make a wish list of pellets, all 10.65 or less. For some reason, I felt this was the way to go?

LeadPoisoner · « **Reply #38 on:** June 29, 2017, 08:14:27 PM »

i believe over 8.5 to 14 should work.. 14 might be questionable.

unionrdr · « **Reply #39 on:** July 01, 2017, 12:57:05 PM »

Here's the 3 tins of .177 pellets I finally chose from a long wish list;
http://imageshack.com/a/img922/1263/P12rG3.jpg
Not too heavy, not too light. I think these should give a bit more range? I'll find out. They arrive Amazon Prime tomorrow.

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Winchester 1400cs

Author Topic: Winchester 1400cs (Read 12749 times))