First gun advice: Benjamin Marauder vs Gamo Coyote vs AirForce Talon vs ???

[Zumbooruk]

Thank you all so much,

And I thought you guys would make it easier for me :-)

Instead, I am now going to research all the alternatives you gave me...

I believe that instead of starting by stating my requirements, when I don't even know what I don't know, I should have stated my motivations, and let you guide me as to what I need.

so here we go (should I open a new subject for this "new" discussion?)

the goal is to get my son hooked on a hobby/sport, and get him away from books/internet/iphone/indoors.

I am not good at sports and neither is he, group/team sports not a good idea, and I want something I can get involved in too (I used to shoot .22 rimfire @50m when I was about his age, but was never very good...), started looking at .22 rimfire and realized that getting to the nearest ranges (40min way), cleaning guns afterwards, ammo costs, etc, that air rifles might be the best option, we live outskirts of town, about 2 acres, no worry about noise or neighbors.

knowing my son, I want something which will be easy and early success to get him motivated to continue and get better.

which is why I started looking at PCP with the understanding that I'll have to budget for a pump or a tank (and if tank, drive to down to have it refilled)

with the limited reading I've done (and no experience what so ever), I understood that spring powered rifles are more difficult to shoot well, something about the spring, double recoil and artillery hold...

but now I am not so sure that PCP ("deep end") should be the way to go for a first air rifle, PCP might be overkill for a first gun, and dealing with filling might be more of a hassle (or $$$) than I thought...

so now I am looking at Beeman R9 / HW95 or HW30S or RWS 34 which might be just the right starter guns?

maybe with money saved not getting a pcp tank/pump it would be a better idea to buy two guns, one for me, and one for him?

also, several recommended pistols (Marauder Pistol and 1720T). why pistol over rifle? I thought that rifles would be more accurate (longer barrel, shoulder stock)?

the 50 yard is a "soft" requirement, just me thinking out loud as to how to keep him interested and challenged in case he gets better fast (ever the optimist), and knowing my son, he will get bored quickly if he easily consistently put all the pellets in one hole...

yet if he does not have an early success, i.e. gun/trigger/barrel not good/accurate enough, or if prep is "too much" (filling/pumping), he might abandon the sport

similarly, the "desirement" for open sights, was just in case he gets so good that he gets bored with the scope and wants something more challenging, but truly if that's the case, I will purchase him a better rifle which will fit whatever competition he would want to get into, field target, 10m, 3 position, etc.

bottom line, I want early and sustained excitement...

and once I get him hooked, then I'll come back to you guys for the next rifle.

thanks again so much, I very much appreciate your suggestions and input.

-z

[FuzzyGrub]

also, several recommended pistols (Marauder Pistol and 1720T). why pistol over rifle? I thought that rifles would be more accurate (longer barrel, shoulder stock)?

I recommended the 1720T WITH a carbine stock, which makes it a small, light, rifle.  The Prod comes with one.  Accuracy wise, longer barrel is true only if using iron sights.  The 1720T w/scope will be plenty accurate on your 2 acre range. 

[Nickelsig229]

On one hand, I want to say buy the cheapest gun you can at walmart, because it sounds like you already know your son will move on in a few weeks.

On the other hand, I want to say buy a tank, one of the excellent regulated guns by fx or daystate, with a hawke airmax scope and a bunch of the dartboard or battleship targets. This will take out most of the fear of having "success", the only thing holding you back at that point is your own in ability to shoot. When cousins come over, I set this up at 25 yards, put the scope on 20x and we play cricket while  hanging out. They even set up some track lighting because it's so much fun they want to stay even after dark.

That will get you around 2300 dollars probably. At that point he has everything you and he need to do a lot of fun shooting playing games against each other, or for him and his friends under your supervision. Having someone to "play" against will keep it entertaining and challenging. The quality of the items will retain their value so long as you don't damage them, you'll be able to sell it off quickly for only a 3 or 4 hundred dollar loss, if that.

It will also allow you to have some of the technical fun, like zeroing, using chairgun, setting up ranged targets and teaching your son how to use the clicks on the turrets for different ranges. It will be more then just aim and shoot, I don't know any full grown man, let alone a young boy who doesn't want to move those turrets around just for fun.

And if your disposition allows for it, you can teach him to hunt pests around the yard if there are any. That is a whole new bunch of things to do and master.

I just want to add this in as an edit.  In my opinion, the cheaper pcp guns and possibly even springers, are more fun for accomplished airgunners. They require more knowledge for tuning and maintenance. Advanced airgunners just know what they are capable of and what they offer as opposed to beginners who might get confused or end up with something that doesn't do what they want it to do easily. The higher end guns are actually better for beginners, they are simple to adjust, already tunned to optimized state and are all extremely accurate, usually more so then the shooter. This is just my opinion after 6 weeks of owning an entry level pcp.

[Extreme]

    Which road you chose I wish you the Best!!!!
Best of luck Brother Man

[Smaug2]

If you DO decide not to go with two springers, the following might be a good combo, in your budget: (and your son could shoot BOTH of them)

1) Weihrauch HW30s ($330, with sights) or Beeman R7 ($375, no sights) in .177

2) Benjamin Discovery package (incl. pump) ($350 @ Walmart.com, currently) With the dry air out your way, you could even pump it up outside, without any moisture worries!

3) (2) Burris Timberline 4.5-14x32 scopes ($225 ea.)

4) Medium height, 2 pc. scope mount rings ($30 each set, for good ones)

Total: $1190 (w/ HW30s) or $1235 (w/R7)

This way, you have a low power, easy to cock and shoot springer for target shooting out to 25 yards, and plinking out to 50 AND a good quality PCP that can shoot further. Easy to pump, and a healthy aftermarket, in case it is not exactly what you want. You and your son could switch at will.

If you really need to keep it under $1k, you could go with cheaper scopes, or just Scope the Discovery first, and add a scope for the HW30s later.

[Smaug2]

Another idea: Just get the Discovery package with the quality scope and a spotting scope for the guy who isn't shooting.  Take turns shooting and pumping, with the non-shooter spotting for the shooter. This would leave some budget to mod the Discovery, unless you really go wild with the spotting scope.

[Hajimoto]

I am really interested in what you chose and how it is working for you.

[Zumbooruk]

after lots of reading and asking and changing my mind several times, I ended up getting a used (excellent condition and tuned) HW95 from a GTA member.

did not yet shoot it, got super busy, and just ordered pellets and pellet trap...

I decided against PCP for a first gun, too much to handle as far as charging, tank, pump, etc.

even for my next gun, I am thinking that I'll go with a springer, top on my list are Air Arms TX200 and HW97K

but it all depends on how much my son enjoys shooting the HW95. if he does not, I have no excuse to buy myself another gun. if he does, then I give him the HW95 and can justify buying myself a new one...

-z