Cannot decide for my first PCP airgun! Help me choose!

[jeffsenpai]

Hello everyone,

I have recently decided to make a purchase of my first PCP airgun, and after some research I have narrowed my choices down to a few models. There are so many options out there and this forum has helped guide my decisions so far before even becoming a member, so hopefully some opinions can help sway my purchase. This may be a long post, but I love doing research, as it is one of my favorite parts of buying a new gun. Your inputs are valued and appreciated!

So, the "two" main guns I am looking at right now, are the Benjamin Discovery and the Mrodair M-10 PCP. (also looking at the Maximus and Marauder in the periphery too)

Both rifles are available as a package set with a hand pump included so I have to take that into account - I cannot find the Benjamin Marauder available anywhere with a discounted included hand pump - even on Crosman's site (maybe because it is not a great fit with a hand pump - too much psi?)

So, comparing the Discovery and the M-10,

The Discovery is a bit less expensive and likely seems to have greater aftermarket support. Maybe greater manufacturer support as well. It seems to be a solid platform that has been around for awhile, and on a forum such as this I bet it would be easy to get troubleshooting help since so many Discovery rifles are out in the wild. Low PSI seems like it would be easier to fill with a hand pump, and performance, by all reports, seems very good. Made in the USA is a bonus as well.

The M-10 seems also like a solid rifle. I do have some concerns though. I do like that it is available with a hand pump combo from Mrodair, and on that website it looks very appealing. I do have to admit that the mrodair site is a bit confusing to navigate, and there seems to be a pittance of actual, real life pictures and video of this rifle and its performance. Even the pictures on the mrodair site seem to be mostly computer renders and mockups of the rifle, rather than real photographs. Google images shows some images of the gun in use, but not nearly as much information out there about the M-10 as there is the Benjamin Discovery. The price point of the M-10 is higher than the Discovery, and I would assume that there is a corresponding increase in quality from the gun. This gun seems to be imported as well, and as a result, when searching for information on this rifle, I tend to get information on its other variants, which may or may not differ from what mrodair offers. I know that just because it is from China, does not mean it is poor quality, especially if a US shop tunes them before selling them, as advertised, so that is not really a negative for me.

What I find MOST attractive about the M-10 is that on the Mrodair site, they say that there will be a conversion of that platform in the future to a .308/.357. That sounds like an amazing option - but, in my research here on this forum, and other places online, I see posts mentioning this upgrade dating back to 2014. Currently in June of 2016, it says on the Mrodair site that it is "coming very soon", but I am not sure how long that "very soon" has been there. A possible upgrade to big bore on the same platform would really seal the deal - but I do not want to make the purchase soley based on something that could be vaporware.

I realize the M-10 fills to higher PSI, and may be harder to fill with a hand pump as well. The Marauder has this issue as well. It seems that the M-10 may be more comparable to the Marauder than the Discovery in many regards, excepting the M-10 appears to be a single shot rifle.

And as an afterthought, I was looking at the Benjamin Maximus, which is a little less $ than the Discovery - but I am not sure if its quality is as good, or if it will enjoy the same aftermarket support and popularity as the Discovery. One thing I would like to know for any owners, is if the performance of the Maximus is close enough to the Discovery to warrant the difference in price between them. I would not mind spending a bit more for the better rifle, because after doing the research, it often is only about a $40-$60 difference in the final price between the two guns.

I hope this was not too rambling, but I do value this community's opinion. Thanks for reading.

[tennx]

Still a newbie here, but this is on my 2 git list...popular package and out of stock at the moment....good luck on your choice..
http://www.crosman.com/lowcountry-explorer-pack

[vigilandy]

OEM parts,  custom parts,  and forum support for the M10 is almost nonexistent compared to the Discovery/Maximus.   For a first PCP,  you don't want a project. 

One of my favorite rifles is the B50.  I've got a 177 and like it I so much that I have a 25 cal conversion coming.  Currently babysitting my dad's Mrods (tuned and regged 177 and 22), but when it's time to grab and go,  I almost always take the B50.  It's accurate and durable (my guns see a lot of bumps around the farm).     

[Rivers3Plinker]

I could be wrong but I believe the Maximus is essentially a Discovery with a plastic stock and cheaper open sights than discovery. Otherwise same valve, trigger, barrel, and mechanicals as far as I'm aware. If anyone knows otherwise please follow up to this post.

What do you plan to do with the rifle and where are you primarily going to be shooting it?

The Discovery and Maximus are relatively easy to pump quickly to 1600psi and work fine for target and small game. Effective out to 45 yards or so depending on game and caliber, more so in .22. Usually remarkably accurate out of the box. They are easily customized and modified. Both great candidates for a first gun IMO.
The .25 or larger caliber idea you have will require more air and typically more PSI and while you can pump these guns, it's going to be more of a chore than using a tank. Tanks are much more $$.
I have for example, a Marauder .25 and a Discovery .22 and the Marauder is a lot more work to fill between sessions. The higher pressure requires both more effort and more time. I deal with it because I love shooting it.

If you're looking at a Discovery or Maximus you'll want to consider an LDC if shooting quietly is your preference.
They are loud without them.

[Nomadic Pirate]

One thing I would consider is not getting the package, I would spend a bit more and get a HILL pump and a Disco

[Taso1000]

Jeff,

Welcome to GTA!  There is a lot of information in this forum and the members are great about offering assistance.

I am a newbie compared to others but I can give you my opinion, based on what I've seen and read, on what would be a good first pcp option.

I would pick a Marauder in .177.  I think you will have the best experience out of the box as delivered.  As you said you would like to make modifications in the future eventually. 

Here is my reasoning:

I am not a big fan of the way the barrel is mounted in the Discovery and Maximus.  I have read that the barrel shifts and has point of impact repeatably issues and air leaking at the transfer port.  Lately, it seems, a lot of Discovery's have been leakers.

Don't get me wrong.  All pcp's leak or will eventually.  It's just a case of how much is perceivable.

I have read that the M-10 has bad after sale support in the past.  I don't know if this has been rectified.  I don't know what replacement parts availability is.

Daisy and Crosman are head and shoulders above all domestic big companies for support and parts availability.

There is no perfect pcp rifle.  All designs have pro's and con's that you will have to weigh.

So lets talk about why for my vote on the Marauder in .177. 

PRO'S

1)  Excellent warranty, customer support and parts availability.

2)  Easily adjustable powerplant when you are ready to do so.

3)  It's a very common rifle and there is a lot of documentation out there to tune to whatever you want.

4)  Aftermarket parts to customize.  I think it has the biggest aftermarket, period.

5)  Noise reduction system.

6)  It is a very solid and robust foundation from the start.

7)  Bigger air reservoir.

8.)  It's a repeater with a 10 shot magazine

CON'S

1)  It's big and heavy compared to a Discovery/Maximus.

2)  Initially setup for 3000 psi fill.   (but you can change this to a much lower fill at the cost of shot    count)

There are other platforms out there but I can only comment on the ones I know.

Thanks,

Taso

[Sfttailrdr46]

  I am from the repeater camp with the exception of my springers. The Marauder is considered heavy by many but like hanging if you do it long enough you will become accustomed to it . If you want lighter it costs more for a nice backyard friendly rifle the Marauder .177 will fill the bill others will require the addition of an LDC to tame the backyard bark and that will drive up the cost $50 to $100 USD

[Rico14]

Before you make your final decision, spend some time on this and other forums and research the customer service from both companies. This should make your decision a lot easier

[kbstingwing]

Disco is cost effective and light weight, dual fuel, single shot.
M-Rod ( Marauder) is quiet and accurate in .177 and .25 (not always in .22), 10 round repeater, more shot per fill, heavier.
Both are tunable and have many aftermarket accessories.
Not sure about the M-10.
if your going to be hunting, the disco is much lighter to carry, but it is also loud, quicker to fill but less shots per fill, the M-rod is heavier to carry but it is very Quiet since it has a built in barrel shroud, since it is quite it won't scare game like a non-sound dampened gun, very stable platform, 10 round repeater to be able to get off a second shot or more quickly, more shots per fill.
I purchased the Marauder back when I started in the Darkside, mine is .22 that had a bad barrel, Crosman did have good customer service but they didn't have good .22 barrels, so I replaced the barrel with a Lother Walther barrel and solved the accuracy issue. even with this problem the Marauder is still a great gun, in .177 and .25 the barrels are accurate and are very good guns, I myself lean toward the Marauder, besides you are going to get tired of the pump and you will wind up getting a Scuba or SCBA tank, or even a compressor...... I did..................and a lot more PCP's too.............it's an addiction......Right Guy's......

[wll2506]

With airguns, customer support by a reliable company is very important. I have had lots of dealings with Crosman, and their customer service and availability of parts is second to non.

For my first PCP in today's market it would get a Maximus, and get a quality pump. I have two Discos and they are very good basic guns.

If you want to step up I would consider the Marauder in 25 cal..... Lot and lots of accessories, barrels and ?

For me, the importer would have to be well established and have an excellent track record...please read up on the companies you are interested in ..... I know who I would buy another gun from if I was in the market.

wll2506

[bmoney]

It is too bad that low country explorer pack is out of stock.  With the 20% of code, ordered on a Friday that is like 308 shipped.  Pretty hard to beat a disco, high pressure hand pump, Centerpoint 3-9 and a tin of pellets for 308.  I have a crosman/sheridan 2260MB which is basically a tamed down Co2 discovery and the ergonomics/trigger of the rifle are very nice.  I had the low country explorer pack in my cart a couple Fridays ago, should have just ordered it.  Discover is loud without a TKO LDC, I put a TKO on my 2260 and it is quieter than my Umarex Fusion and still launches 18.1grn pellets at 500fps very accurately.

[Ribbonstone]

In reality, the basic PCP's really are  kind of learning experience.  Maximus and Disco are pertty much the same, just the stock being the obvious difference.  If you are up for a little DIY, then the trigger can be made to be decent (if you need it...some actually come with decent triggers). Any other tuning would be by adding or swapping parts, which can be a fun hobby in itself.  Nearly everyone who has one will have someplace in their post and "almost-all I did". Most posts have stuff like:  It's "almost" stock, "all I did" was to  (here you can fill in the blank with trigger job, adding an LDC, adding a 2nd band, adding a power adjuster, adding a custom valve, etc.).

If you can keep it simple, can live with a single shot, can certainly enjoy a Discover/Maximus as a first PCP (and possible your only one).

Maurader is normally set up to be a bit of a gas hog, and the .25's seem worse about that than the smaller calibers.  HAs the adjustments needed built in, so any tuning can just be a matter of turning the right screws.  Does kind of not so good for hand pumping when all you get (in .25) is 8-11 decently close velocity shots...but that can be changed.

Hatsan AT44's are a lot of $ (and can often catch a sale), but they also tend to come out the box as air-hogs.  Also don't have to be, but there factory adjustments are limited...so tuning one often is a matter of mods.  Parts aren't too hard to find, it's a pretty popular/large selling model.

Mrodair M10 has few first hand posts, and of the one's I've read, they seem to be out the box tuned to be fast...but with a low "good" shot count.  Has some design features I'd not be pleased with (seriously...they want you to de-gas and unscrew the gauge  just to get it out of the stock?). Honestly, not a long enough track record and minimal support/parts.

Even with the first paragraphs, still thinkt he Disco/Maximus would be the best first PCP. There is a good bit of stuff for a shooter to learn about PCP's, and one of those is a darned good way to learn it.

[Rallyshark]

One thing I would consider is not getting the package, I would spend a bit more and get a HILL pump and a Disco

I'm going to have to agree with Manny here.  The Hill pump is a much better pump, and I learned the hard way that having a pump with a desiccant(moisture) filter is important.  I almost ruined a regulator and an air tube using the benjamin pump, and dumping moisture in the cylinder.  Hand pumping a disco with a Hill pump would be a cake walk. 

I know what you're thinking about the cost of the Hill pump, but it is worth it IMO.  If someone had told me what I just told you when I first got into this, I probably wouldn't have taken their advice.  Knowing what I now know, I wouldn't do it any other way though

[MDStroup]

I could be wrong but I believe the Maximus is essentially a Discovery with a plastic stock and cheaper open sights than discovery. Otherwise same valve, trigger, barrel, and mechanicals as far as I'm aware. If anyone knows otherwise please follow up to this post.

What do you plan to do with the rifle and where are you primarily going to be shooting it?

The Discovery and Maximus are relatively easy to pump quickly to 1600psi and work fine for target and small game. Effective out to 45 yards or so depending on game and caliber, more so in .22. Usually remarkably accurate out of the box. They are easily customized and modified. Both great candidates for a first gun IMO.
The .25 or larger caliber idea you have will require more air and typically more PSI and while you can pump these guns, it's going to be more of a chore than using a tank. Tanks are much more $$.
I have for example, a Marauder .25 and a Discovery .22 and the Marauder is a lot more work to fill between sessions. The higher pressure requires both more effort and more time. I deal with it because I love shooting it.

If you're looking at a Discovery or Maximus you'll want to consider an LDC if shooting quietly is your preference.
They are loud without them.

Just a correction, they have the same Williams firesights iron sights. The only two major differences are the plastic stock and the 2 inch longer barrel on the maximus. That is why i am so surprised that so many maximus arrived so messed up. I am one of the many people that got a bad one. I always hate being  an early adopter for this very reason but i didnt want to pass up the deal and now i have a messed up gun.

[Habanero69er]

Good deal on a .25 Marauder with an SSG from Travis at WAR. Then get a Hill pump to go with it.
http://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=111214.0;topicseen

[Rallyshark]

Good deal on a .25 Marauder with an SSG from Travis at WAR. Then get a Hill pump to go with it.
http://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=111214.0;topicseen

That's a sweet deal!

[jeffsenpai]

Thank you all so much for the replies!

Sounds like a Benjamin rifle is the way to go.

I should have explained more, but I want a .22 caliber rifle, one that will reach out to 50 yards or so for plinking, target, and potentially squirrels.

Several of you have recommended the Hill pump. The pump alone costs as much as a rifle, is the quality and performance so much more than the Benjamin pump to be worth the investment?

I think the choice of rifle will come down to which one I can find on sale when I decide to make the purchase. I can see that right now the Marauder is $399 at Cabelas, I see that Pyramid Air has a great 11% off and a free shipping deal, and Crosman itself has that 20% off as well, so at this point there are many competitive options.

If I go with the Hill pump, I think the Marauder is out; as the price with the gun and pump is a bit more than I have budgeted. I may go with the Maximus or Discovery and the Hill Pump. May be a great starter to get into PCP, and the pump should be compatible with future guns I buy right?

I know its a noobie question, but would the Hill pump out of the box have the correct connector to fill a Maximus/Discovery?

[Habanero69er]

You'll need to order this also. The Hill does not come with a quick disconnect fill adaptor.

https://www.pyramydair.com/product/air-venturi-foster-female-quick-disconnect-to-1-8-bspp-male-5000-psi?a=4926

[Rivers3Plinker]

Thank you all so much for the replies!

Sounds like a Benjamin rifle is the way to go.

I should have explained more, but I want a .22 caliber rifle, one that will reach out to 50 yards or so for plinking, target, and potentially squirrels.

Several of you have recommended the Hill pump. The pump alone costs as much as a rifle, is the quality and performance so much more than the Benjamin pump to be worth the investment?

I think the choice of rifle will come down to which one I can find on sale when I decide to make the purchase. I can see that right now the Marauder is $399 at Cabelas, I see that Pyramid Air has a great 11% off and a free shipping deal, and Crosman itself has that 20% off as well, so at this point there are many competitive options.

If I go with the Hill pump, I think the Marauder is out; as the price with the gun and pump is a bit more than I have budgeted. I may go with the Maximus or Discovery and the Hill Pump. May be a great starter to get into PCP, and the pump should be compatible with future guns I buy right?

I know its a noobie question, but would the Hill pump out of the box have the correct connector to fill a Maximus/Discovery?

The suggestions on a Marauder have merits because it's a better gun in so many ways but if .22 is your preference, then I would go .25 on the Marauder. It's a fantastic gun. Quiet, powerful, accurate, great trigger, and a beast compared to the Discovery. You would not be disappointed.

FWIW I use a Hill and charge both my .25 Marauder and .22 Discovery with it. The Discovery takes about 100 pumps from empty ( completely discharged ) to 1600psi.
The Marauder requires about 75 to go from 2Kpsi to 3kpsi and I never fully discharge that gun because it's a major workout to start from zero on that thing!

Otherwise I agree on the recommendation on a Hill because the quality and longevity is top notch. An alternative you might consider is the Air Venturi G6 which comes with dessicant filters to remove moisture, will have the proper foster fill connector out of the box, comes with wrench tool and o-rings to rebuild it yourself in the future. All pumps wear over time and will need to be rebuilt eventually, sooner rather than later if you don't take it easy, take breaks, and let it cool down during charging.
My brother charges his .25 Synrod with the G6 and has been using it for months without issue. Yet.

This pump from Mike at Flying Dragon is supposedly the same pump as the G6 and is less expensive through Mike.
http://flyingdragonairrifles.org/index.php?route=product/product&path=60&product_id=57

Just received an Airgundepot lightning deal notice.
.22 Benjamin Discovery with pump combo deal.
http://www.airgundepot.com/benjamin-discovery-22.html

[Rivers3Plinker]

This Maximus deal isn't bad either.
Air Gun Depot Maximus combo - scope, better G6 pump, target, pellet sampler, $420.
http://www.airgundepot.com/benjamin-maximus-airgunsarp-special-combo.html