.20 caliber vs .177, .22 or .25?

[SteveP-52]

I have a friend in another forum who occasionally asks why I don't own a .20 caliber and my usual answer is I don't see a need other than to have one in the growing collection. I can get pretty much the same results by using a heavier pellet in my .177's or if I need more, grab one of the now 4 .22's I have so I figured why not pester the GTA and get everyone's thoughts on the subject.
First and foremost, I'm not looking to buy a rifle, I'm just looking for opinions and thoughts on the advantages or disadvantages of the caliber. I already know from looking that pellet choices are scarce although H&N, JSB and Beeman (which is H&N anyway) still make a few choices and the few rifles that still come in .20 except for one are seriously pricey.
Soooo...other than to say I own one and the few pellet choices available, are there any real advantages to the caliber?

[north country gal]

I shoot 20 cal because I collect Sheridan Blue streaks and they've always been 20 cal as far as I know. Grew up with a Blue Streak and I suppose the fact that the Sheridan was 20 cal made it all the more unique and special to me. For sure, never had cause to wish they made a Blue Streak in another cal. Since I will never be without a Blue Streak, I'm planning on adding a 20 cal in a springer.

Is there an objective, quantifiable reason to choose a 20 over a 177 or 22? Have seen arguments both ways. As long as you choose a 20 that likes one of the currently available 20 cal pellets and you're not planning to shoot in competition, though, my feeling is why not? Might be a little harder to sell a 20 cal gun if you decide to get rid of it, but I personally like the caliber.

[bbv13]

If your going to shoot .20 get yourself a vintage Sheridan Streak. The caliber was developed and survived because of these guns. They go together like peanut butter and jelly, ham and cheese or Mom and apple pie.

Americana at it's best.

Bryan

[JimL911]

I have a couple .20's. I find them easier to load than .177 and almost the punch of a .22. I probably won't get another unless a good deal turns up.

[Sfttailrdr46]

I have a couple .20's. I find them easier to load than .177 and almost the punch of a .22. I probably won't get another unless a good deal turns up.

I have my .20 RX2 and like the rifle and the .20 is as accurate as my other rifles but I see no real advantage to the .20 over the .177 or .22 Would I get another  .20 the answer is yes if it was a rifle that I wanted and a great deal besides. That being said I will not go out of my way looking for a rifle that is .20 just because it is .20

[Mr. Panther]

Just because. that is why I like my .20 LOL

[Sfttailrdr46]

Just because. that is why I like my .20 LOL

Just Because is why my collection of shooters is so dang eclectic variety is the spice of life . I also like to tinker with my rifles that's also another just because 

[bantam5s]

Because Sheridan's are the best pumpers ever made, and because .20 is the best caliber you could ever use in a pumper.with my blue streak I can use 2 pumps and effectively kill a mouse inside my house doi without over penetrating, but a .177  has to be going to fast to have enough energy and ,and a .22 may need more power to even shoot properly
( and both will likely over penetrate )

[HectorMedina]

I have a friend in another forum who occasionally asks why I don't own a .20 caliber and my usual answer is I don't see a need other than to have one in the growing collection. I can get pretty much the same results by using a heavier pellet in my .177's or if I need more, grab one of the now 4 .22's I have so I figured why not pester the GTA and get everyone's thoughts on the subject.
First and foremost, I'm not looking to buy a rifle, I'm just looking for opinions and thoughts on the advantages or disadvantages of the caliber. I already know from looking that pellet choices are scarce although H&N, JSB and Beeman (which is H&N anyway) still make a few choices and the few rifles that still come in .20 except for one are seriously pricey.
Soooo...other than to say I own one and the few pellet choices available, are there any real advantages to the caliber?

My usual answer holds: "It all depends what you are going to do with the rifle".

If you are going to shoot at targets at known ranges, then the caliber does not really matter. You need to match the distance to the target with the BC of your pellet (and therefore weight) and you're done.

If you are going to hunt, however, then it is another can of worms.
The 0.20"will shoot as flat as an 0.177" (due to internal ballistic considerations in most cases), and will hit as hard as 0.22" or even a 0.25" (depending on the pellet and rifle used).

Until the advent of the modern PCP. The 0.22's had no chance of hitting the pest (at normal distances) with the necessary velocity to expand an expanding pellet (above 700 fps), so the 0.20" cal. allowed the savvy airgunner to use the Crow Mag or the Predator Poly Mag to hit the pests hard with a flat trajectory, but retain the advantage of the larger hole and wound channel created by a larger frontal diameter.
I've recovered 0.20"cal pellets that expanded to 0.25"in several occasions.

Finding a good expanding pellet in 0.22" is harder, there are some, but they do not have the combination of BC, initial MV and expanding limits as the 0.20" cal. ones.

It is my favorite caliber, especially when shot out of a D54, but there are other piston rifles that can shoot them well.

For targets, I specially like the JSB Exact at 13.7 grains in full power models or the H&N FTT in lower powered models.

For FORMAL shooting, where rules preclude the use of more than 12 ft-lbs, the disappearance of H&N's  Laser pellets is a sad loss, then the 0.177" will trump the 0.20"

JMHO






Hector Medina

[SteveP-52]

Thanks to everyone that's replied so far. If I decide to get one, there's no Formal shooting...I can shoot and I'm not too bad, but I'm definitely not good enough to consider anything competitive, it will just be my own rules on my own personal target range which is all of 30-40 yards and maybe the occasional tree rat or crows.
I've already looked at a fairly inexpensive Webley VMX at AoA which is basically my Spector only in .20 and the Spector for the whole $50 I paid for it was very accurate out of the box and tuned with a decent scope is even better.
The debate is an on again/off again kinda thing, but feel free to keep the opinions coming, they're definitely welcome

[19Sheridan57]

I have a good many Sheridans , so I like the .20 caliber. I have owned .177 & .22 as well. I think the .20 is a big step up in power , especially for hunting, than the .177 . The .20 & .22 are very close in performance, & even many of the pellets for both, are close in weight. I believe that an older Sheridan is one of the most accurate rifles ever produced, right out of the box !

[Mr. Panther]

They are only $141  on Amazon for the Webley VMX .20 cal. I thought about getting one myself, but wanted to see if any one else had bought one yet. thought it would round out my collection of springers well, and would make a good pester type gun. I also wanted it see if it would keep up with my C9A Sheridan I have.

[nced]

I have a friend in another forum who occasionally asks why I don't own a .20 caliber and my usual answer is I don't see a need other than to have one in the growing collection. I can get pretty much the same results by using a heavier pellet in my .177's or if I need more, grab one of the now 4 .22's I have so I figured why not pester the GTA and get everyone's thoughts on the subject.
First and foremost, I'm not looking to buy a rifle, I'm just looking for opinions and thoughts on the advantages or disadvantages of the caliber. I already know from looking that pellet choices are scarce although H&N, JSB and Beeman (which is H&N anyway) still make a few choices and the few rifles that still come in .20 except for one are seriously pricey.
Soooo...other than to say I own one and the few pellet choices available, are there any real advantages to the caliber?

Partial cut-n-paste from a post I made in 2002.

"I bought the .20 because I felt that it would be a more effective squirrel caliber than the .177. Well, after 2 seasons of hunting with that cal in my R9 I reverted back to the .177 cal because I felt that the small amout of increased effectiveness was more than offset by the more bowed trajectory. I found that a with either the .177 or .20 a well hit squirrel will drop quickly. On the other hand, a poorly hit squirrel may run a good ways with either cal. Another thing I found with the .20 was that the more bowed trajectory made range estimation more critical past 30 yards so I DID get more poor hits with the .20. You can increase the effectiveness of both calibers with hollow point or wad cutter pellets, but in my gun neither pellet style was accurate enough for me past 30 yards, so I used domes with both calibers.

.20 cal pellets that my gun shot best cost as much as .22 rimfire ammo, it was real easy to "burn up" about $8 worth of pellets in one outing.

There aren't many .20 cal pellets to pick from, but this really is a moot point because there are enough good pellets that your gun will probably shoot a couple well. My R9 shot the CPs most accurately, but the heavy weight 14.3 grains gave low velocities and really bowed trajectories. It seems to me that only the CROW Magnum and PCPs can give a really useful velocity with the heavy .20 CP. The Beeman FTS on the other hand gave pretty velocities and were pretty accurate, but I always got about 1 out of 5 fliers that opened up the group.

It seems to me that Dr. Beeman pushed the .20 R1 and maybe this is why the cal is as popular in the US as it is, but also consider that several European airgun makers don't even sell the "20". I personally feel that the .20 is a middle of the road caliber that doesn't shoot as flat as the .177, or have the thump (and pellet selection) of the .22 cal.

To me any "benefits" of the larger .20 cal are more than offset by the 2.5-3x cost over the .177 and the more critical rangefinding required with the more looping trajectory.

IMHO, out to 30 yards it doesn't make a nickeles difference what you shoot in a modern magnum springer, the all shoot flat enough and hard enough. At that distance I can head shoot a squirrel while resting on a tree, and the .177 does shoot flat enough to make 40 yard shots pretty consistent, so I feel that I have no need to mess with the bigger stuff."


Another cut-n-paste from a post I made in 2006 after fitting the R9 with a .22 barrel.......
A few years ago before I dumped the .20 barrel I tuned my .20 R9 to shoot at a tad over 17fpe and went squirrel hunting with the thing for a whole week and kept tabs on the "hit vs retrieve" ratio. Well........for a comparison I have a 90% "hit to retrieve ratio" on tree squirrels using my .177 R9 with hard lead CPLs. After the week was over my "hit to retrieve" ratio was a whopping 51% using .20 Beeman Crow Magnum pellets pushed a bit over 17fpe! Yep, at 35-40 yards those .20 Crow Mags really thumped 'em and the pellet hit was a BIG THWACK. I, even knocked one squirrel off a limb with the hit but when it hit the ground it just kept on truckin' and I never saw it again.

That week of hunting with the "fabled" .20 Crow Magnum pellet at over 17fpe cured me of the fatter pellet. Also, proven to my satisfaction, an off center hit with a fat pellet is worse than a spot on hit with a .177, and it seems to me that I got a LOT more off the spot hits using the loopy .20. I attribute my mediocre accuracy to my less than stellar range estimation more than anything else, but the Crow Mag pellet wasn't an especially accurate pellet in my gun to begin with. At distances out to 25 yards the CM worked GREAT, but stretch the distance past that range and it was a different story. The .20 Beeman FTS was more accurate and worked better, as good as the .177 if I didn't stretch the distance past 35 yards, but I can head shoot a squirrel at 35 yards with my .177 R9 so I just don't see the point of handicapping myself to 35 yards (well, unless my range guess is spot on).

 I also bought a couple .22 barrels from Beeman for my R9, had JM chop & choke 'em and the results were the same as with the .20. Matter of fact, my brother hunted with one of the .22 barreal on his gun for a while (I sold the other barrel to Mr Best) and said that NOTHING worked better for squirrels than his .22 barreled R9 shooting light Beeman Silver Bear hollowpoints, as long as the distance didn't exceed 30 yards.

Since then I sold my .20 barrel, both .22 barrels and both my brother and I use the skinny pellet. You're right about the bigger pellet making more noise when hitting the squirrels, but at airgun power levels noise means nothing, and penetration to the vitals means everything. Years ago I used to hunt squirrels with a .22 rimfire and I can report that I've had rib shot squirrels scamper 20 yards after absorbing 100+fpe, so I don't think a measley 8fpe means a whole lot.

I read a reply that claimed the .177 wasn't up to snuff for crows. Well, I'm not a crow hunter but the one I shot through the wing joint just flapped twice and dropped. This past summer my brother dropped two in a row with his .177 and would have taken more if the rest of the murder didn't leave after the second one was dropped. Last month there was a crow in the lane at my brothers place and it was a safe 55 yards away, well....one shot dropped it on the spot. My brother keeps a talley on the squirrels he has taken with his R9 since I sold it to him seven (I think) years ago and he has exceeded the 500 squirrel mark this past season.

Anywhoo.....perhaps the .20 and .22 cal pellets are better in powerful PCPs and the large/heavy powerful piston guns, but for my R9/HW95 springers I found no benefit when using the larger pellets, however the "trajectory issue" was big enough that I reverted back to .177 cal years ago never to look back!

[peanut]

This is a very interesting thread.  I do believe that each cal. has a specific limit to them and in weight to their effectiveness and trajectory.

[bantam5s]

I should ad that a Sheridan can't be beat for backyard bird pesting, if you stand under the tree they're in, 3 pumps will drop starlings and sparrows doi very quietly.
At my moms house ( this was back in January ) I've dropped 1 out of the tree without the other 2 moving and was able to drop another before the last one took off and I was using 3 pumps and had no pellet exits.

[SteveP-52]

They are only $141  on Amazon for the Webley VMX .20 cal. I thought about getting one myself, but wanted to see if any one else had bought one yet. thought it would round out my collection of springers well, and would make a good pester type gun. I also wanted it see if it would keep up with my C9A Sheridan I have.

I checked Amazon for pricing, but I live in one of the forbidden states they won't ship to, so if I decide I actually want to, I then have to have it shipped to my brother in Vermont and then send him another $25 to have it shipped back to me in NY. It's how I got the Spector, which was ok considering that one was only $50, but then i have to get his e-mail saying my "toy" is there...half my family thinks I'm losing my mind because I "play with air guns"....lol 

[Mr. Panther]

Wow Steve, that really is rediculious. Yeah Dave, my .20 Dan is the perfect pesting gun at close range. Those solid pellets hit em hard with out too many pumps.

[lefteyeshot]

I bought my .20 VMX off Amazon just to have a .20 in the collection. They were $160 then. With the longer trigger adjustment screw mod it's a good little shooter. But, as said, there's not a lot of choices in ammo.

[K.O.]

I wonder how fast you could get a 30g-35g .204 going out of a Mrod and Green Mountain Barrel..? 

I would not mind seeing a .244 or .270 developed also...

[bantam5s]

I wonder how fast you could get a 30g-35g .204 going out of a Mrod and Green Mountain Barrel..? 

I would not mind seeing a .244 or .270 developed also...

.270 , like the round originally developed for the garand ?