About to try my first tune...

[SteveP-52]

About to try my first tune and my Hatsan Edge .25 springer (Striker with a different stock) is the victim. Getting ready to order a can of heavy tar from Maccari, have everything else, should I consider getting the seal kit they have just in case?

[DOKF]

I would definitely get the seal kit.  Just in case.

It would be a shame to have the gun open, and have to wait to re-assemble it for lack of the usual suspect part ...

[GP2004]

I have a Webly VMX. Said to be like a Striker. Are there instructions to disassemble and tune available?

[SteveP-52]

Quite a bit of what I'm going to try is based on some tear downs with pictures I saw on a UK based forum I also belong to. The posters' name is NitroGary and it's in the Stripdown Guides section. Just join the forum, post a quick Hello in the Hello and welcome section, basically what you've joined for and then head for the Stripdown Guides.
He seems to be bouncing between a couple rifles but the pictures are under the Mod55s/60 threads and a little more in the Hatsan Striker thread.
I already have the stock off my rifle and comparing the pictures he posted, they're very similar so it doesn't seem like it should be overly difficult other than being my first time trying this.
The rest as far as tools, lubricants and such I've found here in the Library section.

Hope this helps.

[DOKF]

A spring compressor is a must.  Go slow with the disassemble, and take plenty of pics to help with the re-assemble just in case you don't have a schematic.

[SteveP-52]

Straight from the Webley website and downloadable so you can save it:

http://www.webley.co.uk/Images/Webley%20VMX%20spring%20exploded%20view%20copy.pdf

[GP2004]

Thank you. My Webly should have come with that and a manual too.
I have a spring compressor, and Molycote G, and Moly 60 grease, and a dremel type tool, etc. I recently tuned a Remington Express in .22 cal. Very much improved. I'm happy with the tune.

[SteveP-52]

That website might also have the manual for your rifle...and like DOKF said, maybe a spare seal kit, mine and heavy tar got ordered yesterday, the rest I have. If I could remember where I read it, you might also get lucky if it's a newer VMX built by Hatsan, not need to do any deburring. Seems like the poster said he was surprised everything was smooth when he got everything apart.
May have been the UK forum post about the Striker...which is your Webley and my Edge.

[Methuselah]

About to try my first tune and my Hatsan Edge .25 springer (Striker with a different stock) is the victim. Getting ready to order a can of heavy tar from Maccari, have everything else, should I consider getting the seal kit they have just in case?

Yes, you can try pushing the seal away from sharp edges with a screwdiver, etc. but if it gets damaged during disassembly...

Some manufacturers also are known for using poor quality or undersized seals too (I believe I've heard undersized in Hatsan's case, just not that model).

[SteveP-52]

Thanks Steve. I already ordered the seal set from ARH when I ordered the heavy tar. The description said they might be a little oversized but you could heat them with a hair dryer to help installing them? I should have everything by the weekend and being my first try, I'm planning to go very slowly...lol

[avator]

Polish the ends of the spring and apply some moly. Check the spring in the piston and on the guide to see if the spring spins freely. This is where the twang and torque comes from. You get this right and you will get a good solid "THUNK". And cocking becomes smooth as silk. Apply tar generously. You should see strings of tar reaching from coil to coil. Polish the OD of the piston and apply an even thin layer of moly paste. A good smooth shot cycle will really tighten up your groups. I have a Chinese B2-1 that is a pure joy to shoot. If it only had a better trigger.

[Methuselah]

Thanks Steve. I already ordered the seal set from ARH when I ordered the heavy tar. The description said they might be a little oversized but you could heat them with a hair dryer to help installing them? I should have everything by the weekend and being my first try, I'm planning to go very slowly...lol

Oversized in its fit in the chamber is probably what they meant.  I think I recall the piston should just barely hold without dropping in the chamber.  If the factory seal is good you have a spare?  As to sizing I'm inexperienced but I think someone here can advise 

I hope all goes well for you Steve, maybe take some pictures and let us know how it went (post some one hole groups after for us to drool over   )

[SteveP-52]

Just got a new Samsung Galaxy Tab 4 to use with the Pro Digital chrony and Bluetooth adapter so it will give me a chance to try out the camera in it.
I've been seriously tempted to buy the GRT III trigger and see if there's a way to justttt slightly bend the trigger blade down straighter and add a trigger shoe?? Only reason I didn't originally get one was after seeing the below picture and how short the blade itself would be in the rifle because my Edge stock comes straight across like the wood Striker one does, but if I could make it just a little bit longer....(it's avator's fault...he types and I get ideas..part of why there are 4 white 1/16" butt pad spacers on their way here...lol)

[avator]

Just got a new Samsung Galaxy Tab 4 to use with the Pro Digital chrony and Bluetooth adapter so it will give me a chance to try out the camera in it.
I've been seriously tempted to buy the GRT III trigger and see if there's a way to justttt slightly bend the trigger blade down straighter and add a trigger shoe?? Only reason I didn't originally get one was after seeing the below picture and how short the blade itself would be in the rifle because my Edge stock comes straight across like the wood Striker one does, but if I could make it just a little bit longer....(it's avator's fault...he types and I get ideas..part of why there are 4 white 1/16" butt pad spacers on their way here...lol)

LOL... you think I give you ideas? You should hear what I hear while I'm typing. My ideas give my ideas ideas.

[SpiralGroove]

Hey scp52,

Go to the GTA Library on read the article from CDT on lubing a springer.  Also, see his article on making a spring compressor.

Since I have tuned a few of these Hatsans, here is what I have used for lube.
- Go to ARH (see James Macarri - GTA Mall) and buy the Lube package for $22 (Clear Tar, Heavy Tar and Molly) - also buy his piston seals ($12).
- Go to Amazon and buy some Super Lube w/PTFE  $9
1) Use Heavy Tar on main spring only.  Use Molly on spring ends.
2) Use Molly on piston seal and 1" below (roughly) and use molly on 2" of other piston end/slot.
3) Use Clear Tar on all slots and pivot points.
4) Use Super Lube in compression chamber only.
5) Make a batch of Gene Sunday's Mystery oil per CDT article for trigger lube.

Use all lubes sparingly!  My guns all dieseled (sometimes badly) for about 100 shots w/very high velocity and occasionally a bang!  Just clean the barrel often with goo gone.
 
For $31 you will have a lifetime supply of lubes for your guns.

I'm a long way from being a Pro, but My two cents..........

[SteveP-52]

Already sorta have step 1: seals and heavy tar are on the way, which after your post will lead to this question...I have a jar of Air Venturi moly paste, is that gonna work or should I just go back to Maccari and order his as I'll have to to get the clear tar.
Spring compressor, tools and a well lit work areas I have. Camera I have, planning to take more than a few pics of the adventure.
Been lurking in the library but will definitely go back and check out the things you mentioned.
There will probably be more questions, but for now that should cover a few, thanks for the tips!!

[avator]

Hey scp52,

Go to the GTA Library on read the article from CDT on lubing a springer.  Also, see his article on making a spring compressor.

Since I have tuned a few of these Hatsans, here is what I have used for lube.
- Go to ARH (see James Macarri - GTA Mall) and buy the Lube package for $22 (Clear Tar, Heavy Tar and Molly) - also buy his piston seals ($12).
- Go to Amazon and buy some Super Lube w/PTFE  $9
1) Use Heavy Tar on main spring only.  Use Molly on spring ends.
2) Use Molly on piston seal and 1" below (roughly) and use molly on 2" of other piston end/slot.
3) Use Clear Tar on all slots and pivot points.
4) Use Super Lube in compression chamber only.
5) Make a batch of Gene Sunday's Mystery oil per CDT article for trigger lube.

Use all lubes sparingly!  My guns all dieseled (sometimes badly) for about 100 shots w/very high velocity and occasionally a bang!  Just clean the barrel often with goo gone.
 
For $31 you will have a lifetime supply of lubes for your guns.

I'm a long way from being a Pro, but My two cents..........

Hey Kirk... Ya got me wondering here...
Ever since I got back into airguns and joined the GTA I've heard that alloy pellets, desiling and dry firing is not good for a springer. And I'm not questioning your methods. But, wouldn't firing a gun like you are describing 100 times be hard on it? I'm also a long way from being a pro... I guess that's why I'm asking.

[SteveP-52]

Got me thinking now too trying to remember where I read it as I've been reading everything I can find on tuning and lubes and such but somewhere or a couple places it said to never use any kind of lube in the compression chamber or you risked damaging the rifle with the excess force created when the rifle dieseled....off to the Library....sheeshhh, I didn't spend this much time in one when I was in school....lol

Found it:

http://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/library/Oiling%20Spring%20Airguns.htm

[anuthabubba]

General springer tune info.

http://www.network54.com/Forum/79537/thread/1240111527/The+Anatomy+of+a+Tune-

[DOKF]

General springer tune info.

http://www.network54.com/Forum/79537/thread/1240111527/The+Anatomy+of+a+Tune-

Pretty good article. 

For some rifles I would add fitted pivot washers and a Tuna trigger as appropriate.

.