GTA
Airguns by Make and Model => Weihrauch Airguns => Topic started by: bReTt on April 24, 2015, 02:04:18 AM
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Hey folks!
I really like the classic look of the HW77 with the "old" style stock. I had thought to attempt to make a walnut version copying the original factory stock style but decided that was too big of a project to take on at the moment. The stock that came with the rifle (actually purchased separately and swapped out with the new style) had some "not so cared for" details that bothered me. ie crooked grip, bulky grip/butt area, not well defined cheek.... So I decided to reshape and refinish the beech stock that I had, saving time compared to making a new one out of black walnut.
Reshaping and stripping old finish is the easy part. Checkering..... well, let's me say that it's not as easy or as difficult as I thought.... not as difficult as I heard but not as easy as I had anticipated.
I reshaped and thinned the grip and butt areas and I have a very nice handling stock now.
(http://i236.photobucket.com/albums/ff95/Line_man01/IMG_2864_zpspr3hf2n8.jpg) (http://s236.photobucket.com/user/Line_man01/media/IMG_2864_zpspr3hf2n8.jpg.html)
First coat of stripper on it. (CitriStrip)
(http://i236.photobucket.com/albums/ff95/Line_man01/IMG_2881_zps7dk4jong.jpg) (http://s236.photobucket.com/user/Line_man01/media/IMG_2881_zps7dk4jong.jpg.html)
Please excuse the mess in the background! ha ha. Momma is going through homeschool books and culling what we don't use or need anymore.
(http://i236.photobucket.com/albums/ff95/Line_man01/IMG_2887_zps8txnbyt4.jpg) (http://s236.photobucket.com/user/Line_man01/media/IMG_2887_zps8txnbyt4.jpg.html)
Here is the raised cheek rest. It's shaped and defined a little better than before.
(http://i236.photobucket.com/albums/ff95/Line_man01/IMG_2891_zpsnzvgnwh7.jpg) (http://s236.photobucket.com/user/Line_man01/media/IMG_2891_zpsnzvgnwh7.jpg.html)
This is the first grip panel checkered. It's the first I have done and the other side will probably be the last that I do! ha ha! It's not for me and more like a chore than an enjoyable hobby. Maybe the next side will be nicer and more enjoyable.... we'll see. It definitely has that "human" element in the final result!
(http://i236.photobucket.com/albums/ff95/Line_man01/IMG_2911_zpsh6vqiv4x.jpg) (http://s236.photobucket.com/user/Line_man01/media/IMG_2911_zpsh6vqiv4x.jpg.html)
This will be an ongoing project post and I will post results as I go along. After the checkering is complete on the other side, I will do a light final sand and use a stain pre-conditioner and then walnut colored gel stain with either some oiling or lacquer.... not sure yet on that last one. More to come.
Thanks for looking and any comments good, bad or ugly always welcome!
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I like it. Nice job bro. What did you use to strip the finish and do the checkering. Ive got a cz 200 hunter. Great gun but the stock is just plain butt ugly. I was thinking about experimenting with this stock. If i ruin it , its not that pricey to replace. Thanks kurt. Oh yeah, youre one heck of a shot too man.
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I like it. Nice job bro. What did you use to strip the finish and do the checkering. Ive got a cz 200 hunter. Great gun but the stock is just plain butt ugly. I was thinking about experimenting with this stock. If i ruin it , its not that pricey to replace. Thanks kurt. Oh yeah, youre one heck of a shot too man.
Thanks k-man! I used Dem-Bart basic checkering set that I purchased from Woodcraft but you can order direct from Dem-Bart too. I used CitriStrip for stripping the finish. It takes a while to start to work and it takes a few coats. The Zip Strip stuff works way faster and better but it's really nasty stuff to breathe, that is why I tried the citristrip. Go for it on your stock, you may end up with a masterpiece!
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Bret,
I think it looks fantastic! I bet you'll do it again some day. Just about the time you have forgotten how tedious the work was, you will look at how nice your stock looks and think, that wasn't so bad. Not many people checker their on stocks, that is taking it to another level. I've been a cabinet maker/wood refinisher for almost 30 years and haven't tried checkering...Yet...
Nice work.
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Brett, I've used checkering files before and I think your results look great for your first time. Can't wait to see the final product.
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I think it looks great Brett!!
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Nice work!
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Thanks guys for the comments!
I have a question that I want to throw out there for you opinions....
I thought about staining the stock black/gray so the wood grain shows through.... What do you think? Good idea, bad idea? Look cool and unique or totally ruin a good thing?
Please let me know you YOU think. Be honest now. I am seriously considering it BUT at the same time I don't want to have gone through all this work to have messed it up.
Thanks.
Bret,
I think it looks fantastic! I bet you'll do it again some day. Just about the time you have forgotten how tedious the work was, you will look at how nice your stock looks and think, that wasn't so bad. Not many people checker their on stocks, that is taking it to another level. I've been a cabinet maker/wood refinisher for almost 30 years and haven't tried checkering...Yet...
Nice work.
T-Higgs,
What do you think about using the wood pre-conditioner and gel stain and then some sort of oil to finish the stock? I am a hobby woodworker but I have always used the wood with the color that I wanted for the project. I haven't used stains or dyes hardly at all. Am I headed in the right direction or is there another way to get better results. I don't want a blotchy, unevenly colored stock but I DO want to see the wood through the color,
Thanks!
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Looks great so far, Brett. Really nice job on the checkering!!
I vote "yes" on the dark stain..I've had good luck with the Koa and Ebony colors, and can tell you I really like the Zar products...you can add more for darker or wipe off for lighter. Not as fast-setting as some of the Min-Wax, etc type products.
-Paul
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Brett,
NICE JOB !! ... like you always been afraid to do checkering choosing to stipple instead.
Love it ;D
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I'm impressed by the checkering job. I bet you could get a lot of work on just the GTA for that skill!
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It's looking good. As others have noted, you've done a good job on the checkering. I'm a fan of walnut stain on a beech stock.
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Brett,
I depends on what color you want to do, wood tone or the black/grey look. I am not big a fan of gel stains and therefore don't use them. They can be usefull for glazing or staining fiberglass or fax wood doors and such but not my favorite for real wood. The products I use are commercial type products and are not available in your area (I called the distributor) I did some research and found a sherwin Williams commercial store in Seattle. No idea how close that would be to you but they do have some usefull materials. I talked to one of the SW guys there and they do not have a good water based stain but they do have water based dye that could be usefull for an under tone. I just realized that this post could go very long so I'll answer the questions you asked above and we can PM for further detail. I do not use wood conditioners as I believe they can stop some stain penetration. That's how they help things not go blotchy. Instead I am very carefull with how I sand and which products I choose. When you think your sanding is complete, sand one more time with 150 or 180. (By the way, the grit you use will also alter the color penetration especially with oil based products) Preferably not a brand new piece as it will be too sharp. Go end to end with the same piece of paper. You may want to wear gloves as hand oil or sweat will make blotchy marks. I would not use Min wax penetrating stain. It's the kiss of death when it comes to blotchy color. Dyes are great for an under tone. Some wood lacks warmth, or depth. this is where dyeing the wood first can add life or punch. Generally you would allow the dye to dry then stain over it, but there are times , like Maybe the black tone idea, where you could finish right over the dye if it gave the color you wanted. This is going longer than I had hoped. Sorry if I've put anyone to sleep😶. As for clear coat, I, generally, do not use hand applied finishes. I spray all my clear coats. I use catalyzed lacquer, conversion varnish, or two part urethane. The SW commercial store has a full assortment of clear coating but you would have to spray them. One in particular they told me about was a line of finishes by Sayerlak. They have some waterborne products that sound interesting. One you can, but don't have to, catalyze. As far as oil based, hand applied finishes, there are many. Waterlox is an interesting product. I've used it with good success. I'm not a fan of hardware store polyurethane, so I don't have one to recommend. I have used two part , water borne floor finishes with great success. Street shoe is a great product but not made for vertical surfaces so coats need to be thin and tight. Seeing the stock you made and the checkering you just completed, I would say spraying clear coat would be in your wheel house. A 50$ gravity feed gun from lowes and a compressor and your in. Feel free to PM me for further info. I probably confused you even more.
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Go with the dark stain.. make it your own.
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Nice job Brett. I've been contemplating stippling because checkering seemed too daunting. Your work has me considering it now. Thanks for posting. BTW, your home-school table looks alot like ours. ;D ;D
Scotty
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Can't wait to see the finished result! I'm a fan of light colored stains. I love, love blonde stocks! That being said, I can't wait to see yours!
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Nice job on the checkering Brett!!! That stock is looking great :D
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Nice job Brett. I've been contemplating stippling because checkering seemed too daunting. Your work has me considering it now. Thanks for posting. BTW, your home-school table looks alot like ours. ;D ;D
Scotty
Hey Scotty! A fellow homeschooler, nice work mom and dad! You can do the checkering thing too. It's not as intimdating once you start. Just don't be in a hurry. Don't expect to get it done in a couple of evening either. plan on a week or two of and hour or so each evening.
OK, I started the other side today. The key is... take your time! Just go slow even though it can be done quicker. Lay out those lines just right. I think that I found the trick to using the line layout tool. I was going to quick and trying to go too deep with the tool and then it tracks off. Just make a light line then go back with the single line tool and deepen it. Make the whole pattern with light lines then go back and deepen them all with multiple passes. At least I think that's the trick! ha ha ;) This second go around is much more enjoyable than the first.
Can't wait to see the finished result! I'm a fan of light colored stains. I love, love blonde stocks! That being said, I can't wait to see yours!
I can't wait either! ha ha! I am leaning towards the classic brown for the stock but still considering the black stock option. I keep an update going. Thanks, Brett
Nice job on the checkering Brett!!! That stock is looking great :D
Thanks Steve! I need to pick your brain and see how you went about your 98 remake and what products you used. Just a bit more detail than in your post. Thanks again, Brett
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Thanks everyone! I appreciate the encouragement. I will keep an update going.
Brett,
I depends on what color you want to do, wood tone or the black/grey look. I am not big a fan of gel stains and therefore don't use them. They can be usefull for glazing or staining fiberglass or fax wood doors and such but not my favorite for real wood. The products I use are commercial type products and are not available in your area (I called the distributor) I did some research and found a sherwin Williams commercial store in Seattle. No idea how close that would be to you but they do have some usefull materials. I talked to one of the SW guys there and they do not have a good water based stain but they do have water based dye that could be usefull for an under tone. I just realized that this post could go very long so I'll answer the questions you asked above and we can PM for further detail. I do not use wood conditioners as I believe they can stop some stain penetration. That's how they help things not go blotchy. Instead I am very carefull with how I sand and which products I choose. When you think your sanding is complete, sand one more time with 150 or 180. (By the way, the grit you use will also alter the color penetration especially with oil based products) Preferably not a brand new piece as it will be too sharp. Go end to end with the same piece of paper. You may want to wear gloves as hand oil or sweat will make blotchy marks. I would not use Min wax penetrating stain. It's the kiss of death when it comes to blotchy color. Dyes are great for an under tone. Some wood lacks warmth, or depth. this is where dyeing the wood first can add life or punch. Generally you would allow the dye to dry then stain over it, but there are times , like Maybe the black tone idea, where you could finish right over the dye if it gave the color you wanted. This is going longer than I had hoped. Sorry if I've put anyone to sleep. As for clear coat, I, generally, do not use hand applied finishes. I spray all my clear coats. I use catalyzed lacquer, conversion varnish, or two part urethane. The SW commercial store has a full assortment of clear coating but you would have to spray them. One in particular they told me about was a line of finishes by Sayerlak. They have some waterborne products that sound interesting. One you can, but don't have to, catalyze. As far as oil based, hand applied finishes, there are many. Waterlox is an interesting product. I've used it with good success. I'm not a fan of hardware store polyurethane, so I don't have one to recommend. I have used two part , water borne floor finishes with great success. Street shoe is a great product but not made for vertical surfaces so coats need to be thin and tight. Seeing the stock you made and the checkering you just completed, I would say spraying clear coat would be in your wheel house. A 50$ gravity feed gun from lowes and a compressor and your in. Feel free to PM me for further info. I probably confused you even more.
A sincere thank you for all of your insight! I am thinking on going with the brown stock. I did a test piece of beech today and I didn't get any positive results with what I used. I will have to try again. I also checked out your R1 restoration.... very nice! I would like to do a project like that also. How is it shooting these days???
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As you already know, Brett, I think you stock is looking great. I'm sure the final product will be one to be proud of.
Tom
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In regards to staining a beech stock:
I've found that a pre-stain (oil based for oil based stains and water based for water based stains) is paramount to getting a good stain. Otherwise it will look blotchy and uneven.
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In regards to staining a beech stock:
I've found that a pre-stain (oil based for oil based stains and water based for water based stains) is paramount to getting a good stain. Otherwise it will look blotchy and uneven.
Agreed. I ruined the first beech stock I attempted to finish. I made two mistakes. I didn't use a pre-stain wood conditioner and I used a very dark stain. I wished I took pictures of it as a warning to others. Since then I use pre-stain wood conditioner on beech and am very happy with the results, even on really cheap B3 wood. The stock I ruined? I finally gave it a few coats of bed liner. It is an improvement. Here is a photo of what a beech stock stained dark can look like. Not mine but it looks a lot like mine did.
Jon
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I really like the looks of that stock, Jon. Outstanding.
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I really like the looks of that stock, Jon. Outstanding.
Uhm, is that sarcasm? :-\ I hope so because that's what I consider a horribly blotched up stain job. If you're sincere... Well then it proves one man's trash is another man's treasure. 8) If you like that look it's very easy to achieve. Use a dark penetrating oil based stain on untreated bare beech wood.
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Hi Brett,
I already mentioned this staining method to you in a PM, but others may be interested as well. I built a Lyman Great Plains Rifle kit a few years back, and the stock was some sort of light colored mystery wood. I wanted a darker finish, so I resorted to a method used by some of the old time gunsmiths for staining maple stocks. As you all know, maple is difficult to stain.
The chemical/stain used is called Aquafortis, which I believe is Nitric acid. Here is an explanation of the use of Aquafortis:
http://www.trackofthewolf.com/pdfs/aquafortis/instructions.pdf (http://www.trackofthewolf.com/pdfs/aquafortis/instructions.pdf)
As I mentioned, I used this on the Lyman kit. Here are a couple photos of the rifle.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/7528900@N07/17094247980/ (https://www.flickr.com/photos/7528900@N07/17094247980/)
https://www.flickr.com/photos/7528900@N07/17255823336/ (https://www.flickr.com/photos/7528900@N07/17255823336/)
I do not believe the stain looks quite as orange in real life as it does in the photos. The pics were taken in afternoon sun which probably adds some to the warm coloring.
Aquafortis is available on-line at some of the gunsmithing sites. I believe I bought mine from Mountain State muzzleloaders, but I am sure it is available many other places. The browning solution used on the metal was also from Mountain State in Vienna WV.
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I started by tracing the corners of the completed grip panel to get the same dimensions to transfer to the other side of the grip.
(http://i236.photobucket.com/albums/ff95/Line_man01/IMG_2926_zpswkqzzdwo.jpg) (http://s236.photobucket.com/user/Line_man01/media/IMG_2926_zpswkqzzdwo.jpg.html)
I turned the paper over and marked the corners with a dot and then cut away most of the paper to make it easier to layout on contour of the wood.
(http://i236.photobucket.com/albums/ff95/Line_man01/IMG_2928_zpshcwugfmh.jpg) (http://s236.photobucket.com/user/Line_man01/media/IMG_2928_zpshcwugfmh.jpg.html)
I marked the points once I got the paper in a position that looked right and then used the point marking guage to draw in the angle for the guide lines and points.
(http://i236.photobucket.com/albums/ff95/Line_man01/IMG_2930_zpsqmrdgzvk.jpg) (http://s236.photobucket.com/user/Line_man01/media/IMG_2930_zpsqmrdgzvk.jpg.html)
(http://i236.photobucket.com/albums/ff95/Line_man01/IMG_2932_zpswesspmab.jpg) (http://s236.photobucket.com/user/Line_man01/media/IMG_2932_zpswesspmab.jpg.html)
After that, I sketched in the curved lines from the top to the bottom of the pattern and worked them until I had the proportions that looked good to me and matched the other side.
(http://i236.photobucket.com/albums/ff95/Line_man01/IMG_2933_zpsh7ltc0ql.jpg) (http://s236.photobucket.com/user/Line_man01/media/IMG_2933_zpsh7ltc0ql.jpg.html)
I then extended the point lines to make the first guide lines to follow to start filling in the pattern. I used the single line tool to carve a shallow guideline in both of the intersecting lines.
(http://i236.photobucket.com/albums/ff95/Line_man01/IMG_2936_zpsqoshbjr7.jpg) (http://s236.photobucket.com/user/Line_man01/media/IMG_2936_zpsqoshbjr7.jpg.html)
After that was laying out lines following the guidelines. This is where I am at in the process now. I am taking my time this go around!
(http://i236.photobucket.com/albums/ff95/Line_man01/IMG_2962_zps4ezrfocq.jpg) (http://s236.photobucket.com/user/Line_man01/media/IMG_2962_zps4ezrfocq.jpg.html)
More to come and thanks for looking!
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Looking good, Brett! Now I know where to send any checkering jobs I need done ;D.
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Hey guys!
Here is a progress report for the HW77K stock makeover...
I finally completed the checkering for the grip panels. The second side turned out much nicer than the first but overall I am pleased.
I wrestled with many options for staining and finishing the stock but settled on what I had came up with originally which was to use a pre-conditioner and gel stain. I am going to use a simple spray on lacquer (can) in satin or semi-gloss. Not sure on the sheen yet.
Here are both grip panels checkered.
(http://i236.photobucket.com/albums/ff95/Line_man01/IMG_3079_zpshfandut5.jpg) (http://s236.photobucket.com/user/Line_man01/media/IMG_3079_zpshfandut5.jpg.html)
(http://i236.photobucket.com/albums/ff95/Line_man01/IMG_3080_zpspsktyf2o.jpg) (http://s236.photobucket.com/user/Line_man01/media/IMG_3080_zpspsktyf2o.jpg.html)
The stock with the stain pre-conditioner on.
(http://i236.photobucket.com/albums/ff95/Line_man01/IMG_3083_zpscjq51e3z.jpg) (http://s236.photobucket.com/user/Line_man01/media/IMG_3083_zpscjq51e3z.jpg.html)
This has some walnut colored get stain and cherry Danish oil. I am thinking about one more layer of gel stain after this one is dry to help even the color out a bit more and then the lacquer top coat.
(http://i236.photobucket.com/albums/ff95/Line_man01/IMG_3085_zpsppvscx7v.jpg) (http://s236.photobucket.com/user/Line_man01/media/IMG_3085_zpsppvscx7v.jpg.html)
Checkering with the stain applied.
(http://i236.photobucket.com/albums/ff95/Line_man01/IMG_3086_zpsx9jmmqln.jpg) (http://s236.photobucket.com/user/Line_man01/media/IMG_3086_zpsx9jmmqln.jpg.html)
Thanks for looking and as always, comments welcome, good, bad or ugly! :D
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Hi Brett. The stock looks really great! You did an excellent job with the checkering and the staining. I have never had stain look that even on beech.
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Thanks Tom! The stain doesn't look that bad.... for stain. It did come out fairly even. I will add one more layer and then topcoat. I can't wait to get the rifle back together so I can shoot it!
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I really like the looks of that stock, Jon. Outstanding.
Uhm, is that sarcasm? :-\ I hope so because that's what I consider a horribly blotched up stain job. If you're sincere... Well then it proves one man's trash is another man's treasure. 8) If you like that look it's very easy to achieve. Use a dark penetrating oil based stain on untreated bare beech wood.
Not sarcasm...I actually like it. I'm not a fan of beech in the first place, but if you're going to have beech at least make it interesting.
I've been told I'm not known for my good taste. :-*