GTA
All Springer/NP/PCP Air Gun Discussion General => Air Gun Gate => Topic started by: Underwhere on June 27, 2021, 12:27:44 AM
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History
I bought a used RWS Diana 34 (.177) about 6 or 8 years ago for some pest control around the property.
I never found the rifle to be too accurate. I'd get fliers all the time.
After some time there was a distinct "crunch" when charging the rifle so I ordered a Vortek rebuild kit of sorts. A new seal, new spring etc.
So the crunch went away.
I had hoped that after the rebuild my accuracy issues would go away but that didn't happen. At 25 yards I'm probably around a 2" group.
Fliers all the time. I even thought my scope was broken or losing zero so I bought another one. Still no luck.
My capabilities
I used to shoot pistols competitively (not for accuracy) but I did have plenty of trigger time, and had a solid grasp of fundamentals and follow-through. At one time I used to shoot 2-3k rounds per month. With a 9mm Glock I could hit whatever I wanted. No flinching, no yanking. I can manage pretty decent groups with a 5.56 at 100 yards with non-match ammo. So I don't consider my trigger bad with regards to actual firearms...but perhaps it is bad with airguns. As far as I understand there is a difference. The 34 recoils quite a bit.
My shooting
Most of my pest control is opening up a window on the 2nd story of my house and letting my rifle sit on the sill while I take shots.
I take most of my shots within 20 yards but have taken some as far out as 50.
I would like something quiet as I do have neighbors and this is a semi-residential area.
Chipmunks are ruining my driveway and now I am at the point of needing to spend 35k on repaving it.
My questions
I would like an accurate rifle that I can depend on. I'm not sure the Diana 34 is it...though everything thing I read says it should be.
I have messed with the trigger to try and lighten it. It never changed much. It's not the best. Mediocre. Heavy and mushy without a clean break...but I wasn't expecting a 1911 feel. Is there something I'm missing to shooting this rifle?
My cousin just bought a Gamo Swarm Maxxim Gen 2 in .177 and I feel that it is more accurate than the 34...but still leaves room for improvement.
I'd like to be confident in hitting chipmunks out to 30 yards.
If I didn't want to break the bank what would you do? New rifle? If so which one?
I was looking at the Gamo Maxxim in .22 or the Hatsan Speefire Vortex in .22 (Both are $200)
Given my type of shooting (randomly popping open a window and taking a few shots in between meetings), should I even stay with a break action rifle? PCP (no experience here)? Springer vs Nitro piston?
I'm all over the place and would appreciate a bit of direction from those who know more than I do.
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You've not really given enough information on your Diana 34. Do you know what trigger system it has? For a period of time during production of the T05 series guns Diana used Chinese barrels with twelve lands and grooves. Some of these were quite accurate, others were not. If you've not done so, clean the barrel. I use a patch dampened with Ballistol or Hoppe's Number Nine for any new or used gun I purchase. The trigger could possibly use adjustment or even disassembly and polishing. With a bit of practice half inch center to center five shot groups should be attainable. In short I'd get another Diana 34 before I looked at anything Gamo, but then I have a half dozen different iterations of the Diana 34 models.
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Like Roadworthy suggested, clean the barrel. Check all your stock screws for tightness. I'm going to guess at only 6-8 years old, the trigger is a T06. It will say which on top of the receiver. Whether T05 or T06, you'll find plenty of info in the German Gate for tweaking either or just post a thread there and ask. If you haven't seen that yet, click up on the right where it says Select Gate and in the menu, click on European Gates, then on that page, click on the German Gate. Might also check for any play in the barrel: side to side or up and down as it will cause fliers if the barrel isn't locking up right for you.
Next and probably biggest question is what pellets are you using? Might be as simple as finding a pellet your rifle/barrel likes better that what you're currently using, so you may want to test a few different pellets and weights to find one your barrel really shoots well.
Hopefully that covers a few of the bases for things to look for and try.
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You've not really given enough information on your Diana 34. Do you know what trigger system it has? For a period of time during production of the T05 series guns Diana used Chinese barrels with twelve lands and grooves. Some of these were quite accurate, others were not. If you've not done so, clean the barrel. I use a patch dampened with Ballistol or Hoppe's Number Nine for any new or used gun I purchase. The trigger could possibly use adjustment or even disassembly and polishing. With a bit of practice half inch center to center five shot groups should be attainable. In short I'd get another Diana 34 before I looked at anything Gamo, but then I have a half dozen different iterations of the Diana 34 models.
Thanks for the reply.
I'll try and provide more info. I bought the 34 back in 2011 and it was already used at that point. Given that, I don't think it's the T06. Perhaps the T05 or T01. It's silver and I don't believe it's ribbed. It does have some adjustment but honestly I don't think it's a great trigger feel regardless of how I adjust it.
I do remember trying to clean the barrel out with some Hoppes #9 patches. No change.
I've taken the AQT (army qualification test) a few times with junk 22LR's and then some nicer 5.56's and have scored "rifleman" every time.
I don't feel like my gunpowder gun shooting skills are lacking. It's just not working out with this 34.
When you say "practice", is there something different about shooting these than say a 5.56 any other rifle? I have tried many times to zero this thing, even bought a new scope and I'm just always getting fliers. I've tightened and torqued the screws that the barrel hinges at.
Using this Gamo, it's clearly a cheaper rifle. A lot of flexible plastic on it...but I believe it's much easier to shoot accurately.
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Like Roadworthy suggested, clean the barrel. Check all your stock screws for tightness. I'm going to guess at only 6-8 years old, the trigger is a T06. It will say which on top of the receiver. Whether T05 or T06, you'll find plenty of info in the German Gate for tweaking either or just post a thread there and ask. If you haven't seen that yet, click up on the right where it says Select Gate and in the menu, click on European Gates, then on that page, click on the German Gate. Might also check for any play in the barrel: side to side or up and down as it will cause fliers if the barrel isn't locking up right for you.
Next and probably biggest question is what pellets are you using? Might be as simple as finding a pellet your rifle/barrel likes better that what you're currently using, so you may want to test a few different pellets and weights to find one your barrel really shoots well.
Hopefully that covers a few of the bases for things to look for and try.
Yes thanks for the advice. I do remember reading threads years ago and ended up taking everything apart, cleaning, lubing and re-assembling.
No side to side play, nor up-down. The lockup is solid.
I tried 3 types of pellets or perhaps more. Digging up some of my email orders here is what I found.
Crosman Premier Ultra Magnum .177 Cal, 10.5 Grains, Round Nose
RWS Superdome .177 Cal, 8.3 Grains, Domed
JSB Diabolo Exact Heavy .177 Cal, 10.2 Grains, Domed
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I think I have the trigger with 2 adjustments screws next to each other in front of the trigger blade.
At one point I adjusted one trigger so much that it was unsafe to be fired and had to back off on it.
But that didn't really make the trigger any better. It certainly made it less predictable but it wasn't crisp at all.
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Slow typer, a few replies already. ;D
There are many possibilities for something to suite your needs. Though baiting stations really help with taking out chipmunks. It's hard to get them "on the fly". If the ranges are fixed and they're not running about it's easier to get them.
On the low end price point, a Daisy 880 ($35-$55) with scope. With a few simple mods (barrel stabilizing mod) it's (usually) an excellent ~30yard chipmunk elimination machine. There are many sub $200 springers/gas rams out there. If you want more power with out recoil, a Benjamin Maximus or other entry level pcp ($200-300) will do the task, but not quiet if no ldc or moderator fitted. You'll need a Pcp pump, but they can be found for $50-$200. Then there's "mid grade" pcp's or higher end springers that run $400-$700.
Your Diana 34 could be the tool you need. I found using a sock filled with airsoft bb's (and tied off) improved my accuracy while rested. Others have used folded towels, or rice filled sacks. Something soft to rest your foreword hand on can tighten groups. Also finding "the right pellet" that the gun prefers, and practice with proper technique (a seemingly never ending task to master). You'll have good days and off days.
In general (for me), I find under lever springers to be more accurate than break barrels. The added weight helps while benched/rested. My HW97 is very accurate, not very jumpy. If you want a recoiless springer the Diana 54 is an excellent choice, but it's not cheap. Springers aren't for everyone. Given the range of up to 50 yards, your best bet may be a pcp, though some springers may be up to the task with excellent skill.
You'll get all kinds of replies. All are of best intentions. Good luck getting those little critters.
Take It easy.
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Airguns do NOT shoot like firearms. With a firearm you feel recoil as the projectile exits the barrel. With a spring piston airgun the recoil happens, the piston moves, pressure builds, then the pellet moves. Consequently when the pellet exits the barrel the gun is not in the same location as when you aimed and pulled the trigger. You are sighting the gun based on where the barrel will end up. It is critical to hold the gun in exactly the same way for every shot. That way the barrel ends up in the same place every time. Some guns like a fairly loose hold (artillery hold) on the forearm so the gun can move front to back like an artillery piece. Others prefer a firmer hold. My T01 Diana 34 thinks the RWS Super Dome is the best pellet ever. There is a date code on your rifle at the very back on the left side just above the stock. It has four digits, the last two of which are the year of manufacture. By the way, my 2000 Diana 34 had a measured seven pound trigger pull when I got it. It is now just over a pound after a bit of polishing and adjustment.
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Like Roadworthy said, The artillery hold, with some spring piston/gas ram rifles you'll want a loose hold. Let the rifle rest on an open palm, don't grasp the forestock. Let the butt of the stock just rest into the shoulder, don't pull it in. Don't grasp the rifle with trigger hand, just enough pressure to keep in position with relaxed thumb. Any hold/pressure differences between shots will affect POI. Just moving forehand up or down the stock one or two inches will open groups.
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Like Roadworthy said, The artillery hold, with some spring piston/gas ram rifles you'll want a loose hold. Let the rifle rest on an open palm, don't grasp the forestock. Let the butt of the stock just rest into the shoulder, don't pull it in. Don't grasp the rifle with trigger hand, just enough pressure to keep in position with relaxed thumb. Any hold/pressure differences between shots will affect POI. Just moving forehand up or down the stock one or two inches will open groups.
And with the artillery hold, a good starting point for your front hand is the balance point of the rifle. Usually a bit in front of the trigger guard. Try a few shots in one spot and adjust if necessary.
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History
I bought a used RWS Diana 34 (.177) about 6 or 8 years ago for some pest control around the property.
I never found the rifle to be too accurate. I'd get fliers all the time.
After some time there was a distinct "crunch" when charging the rifle so I ordered a Vortek rebuild kit of sorts. A new seal, new spring etc.
So the crunch went away.
I had hoped that after the rebuild my accuracy issues would go away but that didn't happen. At 25 yards I'm probably around a 2" group.
Fliers all the time. I even thought my scope was broken or losing zero so I bought another one. Still no luck.
My capabilities
I used to shoot pistols competitively (not for accuracy) but I did have plenty of trigger time, and had a solid grasp of fundamentals and follow-through. At one time I used to shoot 2-3k rounds per month. With a 9mm Glock I could hit whatever I wanted. No flinching, no yanking. I can manage pretty decent groups with a 5.56 at 100 yards with non-match ammo. So I don't consider my trigger bad with regards to actual firearms...but perhaps it is bad with airguns. As far as I understand there is a difference. The 34 recoils quite a bit.
My shooting
Most of my pest control is opening up a window on the 2nd story of my house and letting my rifle sit on the sill while I take shots.
I take most of my shots within 20 yards but have taken some as far out as 50.
I would like something quiet as I do have neighbors and this is a semi-residential area.
Chipmunks are ruining my driveway and now I am at the point of needing to spend 35k on repaving it.
My questions
I would like an accurate rifle that I can depend on. I'm not sure the Diana 34 is it...though everything thing I read says it should be.
I have messed with the trigger to try and lighten it. It never changed much. It's not the best. Mediocre. Heavy and mushy without a clean break...but I wasn't expecting a 1911 feel. Is there something I'm missing to shooting this rifle?
My cousin just bought a Gamo Swarm Maxxim Gen 2 in .177 and I feel that it is more accurate than the 34...but still leaves room for improvement.
I'd like to be confident in hitting chipmunks out to 30 yards.
If I didn't want to break the bank what would you do? New rifle? If so which one?
I was looking at the Gamo Maxxim in .22 or the Hatsan Speefire Vortex in .22 (Both are $200)
Given my type of shooting (randomly popping open a window and taking a few shots in between meetings), should I even stay with a break action rifle? PCP (no experience here)? Springer vs Nitro piston?
I'm all over the place and would appreciate a bit of direction from those who know more than I do.
When I start experiencing accuracy issues the first thing I suspect to be the issue, is the nut behind the trigger. While you no doubt are proficient at marksmanship with firearms; springers are a whole nother animal. While many of the fundamentals remain consistent between the two; the differences that do exist are truly different, and make a huge difference.
One of the more difficult things for me to get a handle on when I started out shooting springers was follow through. It’s not like powder burners at all. And it starts with how I was holding the rifle throughout the shot cycle. Something that has aided me, in determining if my hold and follow through were consistent, is to scrutinize my sight picture through my scope, throughout the shot cycle. If at the end of my shot cycle, my cross hairs don’t consistently end up in the same place; I know immediately that I’m not being consistent myself.
It may be your gear. It may not. But if not your gear, and it is inconsistent form; a new springer won’t alleviate the problem. Lots of good suggestions here, and pellet selection makes a huge difference once the shooter is straightened out.
If you’ve already got some pellets, and you have the time, it might be worth examining your form, and follow through again. It could save you some money.
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If you could let someone familiar with springers shoot the 34 they could help you decide the problem, whether it's your hold or gun issue.
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OK great info. Thanks everyone. It makes sense now that the recoil happens before the pellet exits and that being a big difference firearms and airguns.
Most of my shooting I don't use a support hand. I rest the rifle on a window sill or a small sandbag.
It seems like the general consensus is to go light on the hold and let the gun recoil as it will. I'll try that.
With all this being said... Should I even go through this effort if fundamentally the recoil will disturb the shot? Should I just switch to a different platform that doesn't do that. (PCP?)
Do nitro guns recoil less and thus will be less prone to this?
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If time is a rare commodity, then spare yourself shooting a couple thousand pellets and go with a PCP, Break barrels take at the lest 100 rounds just to settle in the working parts before true accuracy starts to shine, then more for the shooter to master the platform.
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Did you replace the breach seal, or barrel seal?
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Dead resting a springer on a hard surface could be most of the problem. The way a springer recoils and bounces around that technique will cause erratic groups. Because of the shot cycle, your body needs to be the rest that absorbs recoil and piston bounce. Put a bag on the sill and place the back of your hand in the notch. Then balance the forend in the palm of your hand with only a light hold. Same with the shoulder. No death grip. A BR technique is to bag the forend against the front of the trigger guard with light pressure from your index finger against the front edge of the stock. Butt loosely touching the shoulder.
A little practice and you will see a huge difference.
Also, air rifles are just as ammo sensitive as a fine rimfire. Try some good quality pellets in the medium weight category - 7.9-9.5 grains in .177. RWS SuperMags are a heavy flathead pellet that can perform very well. H&N Trophys and AA branded JSBs can also provide consistent results. Don't go cheap on pellets. Test them just as you would RF or CF. The dividends are real.
Enjoy. A new shooting world is about to open up for you.
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I am probably not going to add anything meaningful to the thread, other than what has already been said, BUT years or decades of experience with pb's, whether pistol or long gun, will not make you more capable with a springer, other than general technique with breath, follow-through, and other standard shooting habits.
Springers are a different ballgame, and it's almost as if you will have to unlearn some of your pb habits.
I am guessing you have tried the artillery hold. I suggest you continue to practice that, and hopefully, persistence will pay off.
Every once in awhile, you just get a Diana that WILL NOT shoot accurately, no matter what you do. It isn't common, but it does happen. One of my 34s is the same way. Interestingly, it's also one of the "silver" models.
Good luck!
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OK great info. Thanks everyone. It makes sense now that the recoil happens before the pellet exits and that being a big difference firearms and airguns.
Most of my shooting I don't use a support hand. I rest the rifle on a window sill or a small sandbag.
It seems like the general consensus is to go light on the hold and let the gun recoil as it will. I'll try that.
With all this being said... Should I even go through this effort if fundamentally the recoil will disturb the shot? Should I just switch to a different platform that doesn't do that. (PCP?)
Do nitro guns recoil less and thus will be less prone to this?
Therein lies the problem. You can't rest most springers directly on anything, other than your hand. It'll throw off your shot. You have to hold the gun in your hand, and rest your hand on the sand bag, or windowsill.
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I rarely rest mine in my hand.
Usually, whichever gun I shoot is rested on a hard surface that is padded by a folded towel.
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If you like your springer, you are probably going to want to hold it. Yes, you can use something soft to hold it, but your hand is probably going to give you better control in the situation you are describing. You are hunting.
Cant is a word you are going to want to learn.
Consistency is going to be your second best friend, right after technique.
Have fun!
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Hi Apu
No, nitro pistons don't recoil any less, they just recoil a bit differently as far as the shot cycle.They will still require the same learning curve to shoot with accuracy as a spring piston gun.
My first love is springers, but shooting PCP is a close second. PCPs will definitely be closer to shooting a rimfire than piston guns. Many come with a moderator and adding a moderator to one that doesn't is fairly easy. A PCP with a moderator, then, will usually be your quietest option. That said, there's a lot to consider when buying a PCP, so you might want to post over in the PCP Gate for some suggestions should you want more info.
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If you are shooting a Gamo more accurately than the Diana 34, then the issue is not your shooting ability. Try shooting other springers and see how you do. If the problem goes away, then the rifle should as well. Life is to short for wasting on an inaccurate air rifle. I have been there myself, with a FWB 124 and was greatly relieved the day I sold it. Trying to make one shoot gets old real quick and just because it was manufactured by a good company doesn't mean it's perfect. You got to know when to hold them and when to fold them, so to speak. A wise man once told me,"You have to pay for your education one way or another.". Good luck.
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Google: ARTILLERY HOLD. Start at 10 yards with paper targets. Got to do it the same every time. A little zen helps. If you get that down move back to 20-25 yards.
Try the open sights.
If that don't work get a QB78 co2 gun. Scope it.
AR2078 is a nicer gun.
Get some decent pellets. I like RWS.
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Bottom line? Ditch the Springer and get a PCP for out of the box accuracy. They fire the same as a PB without any "artillery hold" nonsense.
Unless you are a masochist, then by all means, use a Springer.
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Thank you all for the advice.
Here's what I'm going to do:
1. I'm going to try and adjust my trigger (T01) one last time. There is no grit but it's unpredictable and no clearly defined 2nd stage. It's definitely not crisp. My hope is that if I can get this to be a bit better, I will eliminate a poor trigger as one of the reasons for the poor accuracy. I'll document it as well. Just for fun.
2. I'll try the artillery hold and learn to shoot this thing with a loose hold. I do have a range finder so I'll take some pictures of the groupings etc.
3. If the trigger work and the artillery hold don't work, I am just going to get a different gun. I love shooting but don't have the time for it right now. I have a lot of other priorities in life than try and make a pellet rifle work better.
I'll be home in a few days. I'll post pictures. Thanks again for the advice. Gotta build a spring compressor again. I tossed the one I built a few years ago to put in the Vortek kit. Not a big deal.
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Just takes practice.
If you love shooting springers, as I do, the artillery hold is not 'nonsence'.
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Bottom line? Ditch the Springer and get a PCP for out of the box accuracy. They fire the same as a PB without any "artillery hold" nonsense.
Unless you are a masochist, then by all means, use a Springer.
THIS !!!!!
Springers are per se accurate guns but a lot goes into it to shoot them well and some will never even ever get there,.....I have springers that at times I can shoot real well, others just awful,
I put them away perfectly zeroed in then pick 'hem up some time later and my POI is way off, my first shot is usually way off,.....the nature of springers.
Do you want a gun that you can pick up and shoot on the money on shot one ? ( when it counts if you suddenly have to shoot a critter )
get yourself one of the multitude of good PCPs that are in the market nowadays, a 50 bucks China pump and basically you'll have a much better shooter then your springer for the same money.
Shoot springers if you like it's good practice but for me if I want that first shot to count I pick up a PCP 100% of the time
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One man's nonsense is another mans pleasure.
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Bottom line? Ditch the Springer and get a PCP for out of the box accuracy. They fire the same as a PB without any "artillery hold" nonsense.
Unless you are a masochist, then by all means, use a Springer.
THIS !!!!!
Springers are per se accurate guns but a lot goes into it to shoot them well and some will never even ever get there,.....I have springers that at times I can shoot real well, others just awful,
I put them away perfectly zeroed in then pick 'hem up some time later and my POI is way off, my first shot is usually way off,.....the nature of springers.
Do you want a gun that you can pick up and shoot on the money on shot one ? ( when it counts if you suddenly have to shoot a critter )
get yourself one of the multitude of good PCPs that are in the market nowadays, a 50 bucks China pump and basically you'll have a much better shooter then your springer for the same money.
Shoot springers if you like it's good practice but for me if I want that first shot to count I pick up a PCP 100% of the time
Well said.
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The Diana 34 in .22 is one of my longtime favorites while the .177 is probably my least favorite gun Ive ever owned. But in all fairness, once you master the hold and learn how the gun moves in your hands when shooting, it is a great gun. To me the downfall of the .177 Diana 34 is that it is a strong, fast, and most notably a rather lightweight rifle for the power. This model doesn’t possess the heft to cancel the power output for the .177 caliber making it a somewhat jumpy and hard to handle springer. It is also a mechanical gun with alot of movement going on in the action,….much like any other spring actuated shooter. There is alot of pressure going through a smaller bore and the felt recoil/reverse recoil does have a negative effect on the shooter used to a direct rearward recoil of a powder burner. My suggestion would be to practice your hold, and position. Most of my shooting is offhand so i will leave the bench/rested technique to those that shoot that way. Hold it lightly and let the rifle move. Dont white knuckle the hold. Let it lay on the palm of you hand. My other suggestion would be to us a heavier pellet. Lighter pellets can lead to piston slam, but a heavier pellet can somewhat buffer the shot cycle some and make the 34 a bit less jumpy. Less jumpy usually equates to better a cutacy and consistency for a shooter new to spring guns.
You have a fine well crafted german air rifle and I hope you will be able to get the most out of it real soon. Persistence will pay off. Alot of good advice on this thread so reread your replies and let it sink in A bit. Best of luck!!
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Ditto on the pcp. Any pcp. Sell the 34.
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Well. I'm home.
My 34 was made in December of 97.
It has what I think is a t01 trigger.
I may try adjusting it tonight.
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I'm going to be the odd man out by saying try a firm grip. Yeah yeah yeah, everyone always says master the artillery hold, but I have several rifles that actually shoot better with a firm grip and I've seen the same thought mentioned on several forums and shooters who've tried, to find out their rifles actually shoot better that way. Nothing to lose so consider giving it a try and see what happens.
Sell it?? More hogwash. By all means, get a pcp if you want one and yeah, I own 3, but again I'm the oddball that thinks everyone should own at least one springer and shoot it fairly regular, even just to plink in your back yard.
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Ok apparently a few years ago I already adjusted this thing :)
Wow when you start getting old you really do forget everything.
I did minor tweaking but it sits at 2 pounds 6 ounces at the moment. I went as low as 1 pound 11 ounces but the second stage was almost nonexistent.
It's smooth.
Ok so what PCP should I be looking for?
And a Chinese hand pump is fine?
I'm looking for something I can just pick up and shoot without much worry.
Quiet would be a plus as I have neighbors.
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What Pcp to buy? How much do you want to spend? Do you want to stay with .177?
Hatsan Blitz full auto in .22 or .25, $938 plus scope and pump...
Kidding. Unless you really want it, but I wouldn't want to hand pump it.
There are plenty of "cheaper" offerings. A Benjamin Maximus ~$200, any scope is fine (~$50) and a ~$60 ldc (to keep it quiet ;) ), about $370 with Hand pump.
A Marauder (~$430), scope (~$50), about $540 with hand pump.
A Gamo Urban .22, Hatsan Flash, Air Venturi Avenger and a few others(~$300-350) about $400-450 with pump and scope.
A Chinese $50-60 hand pump should do well. 2,000Psi guns are easier to fill than 3,000psi+ guns. But I have no issues hand pumping to 3,000 psi. Just takes a while on initial fill.
Prices vary between vendors. The are discount codes available for some vendors to help save a bit. Just about any pcp will out shoot a springer for those who struggle. Just look for features you like and make sure there's a support base for that brand. I will NOT RECOMMEND the single shot Beeman QB Chief, can't say anything about the Chief 2 or Bullpup as I have no experience.
Don't count out a good multi pumper. They offer the no hold sensitivity of pcp's but are much cheaper. They are slower to reload and less powerful than pcp's or springers but if only going after chipmunks they're plenty powerful enough. You can pump them up and set aside if expecting to shoot that day. And you don't need to load them until ready to shoot. My lowly $35 Daisy 880 from wally world has taken many Chipmunk and other critters, more than all the rest of my guns combined (air power and PB's) and I own a few. Though a few easy modifications are recommended (and a scope). I've had it over a decade and still going strong. They do have a ear catching "snap" when fired if in proximity, don't know how close or picky your neighbors are, but they're not particularly loud in my opinion. LDC's/moderator may be available for certain models, I'm not really sure.
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A recent thread on the Benjamin Fortitude has opened my eyes to an over looked gun that is more than likely one of the best options for a back yard pester/plinker.
https://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=188827.msg156175722#msg156175722 (https://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=188827.msg156175722#msg156175722)
The author may have a nice shooting Maximus going up for sale soon also.
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I'd like to stay relatively frugal as this really for pest control. I have a UTG 3-9x 40mm scope and mount already on the RWS 34 I can swap over so no need for optics.
Just air rifle and pump.
I'd like to be in a .22
Is having something regulated important? I was looking at the stoeger xm1 last night.
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PCPs were once an expensive option, but now you have choices at every price point. My suggestion is to take a look at used, too. We bought this 2009 vintage Benjamin Discovery in 22 with pump and add on moderator used. Got the whole package for $150. Recently did an aftermarket trigger kit, but even the factory trigger was useable.
Have had this entry level PCP for 8 years, now, and it's still going strong. Takes 50 pumps to go from min to max pressure and that gives me 20 good shots before the fps drops too much. Power-wise, it's more powerful than any of our springers and, of course, recoil is not an issue. Shoot it like your 22 rimfire. No issues with mysterious changes in POI, either. Can pick it up, anytime, and it shoots the same. With the moderator that had been added by the previous owner, it's very quiet. Accuracy is quite reasonable. It will keep groups under an inch at 50 yards with a variety of pellets when conditions are favorable.
There's also a synthetic version of the Discovery called the Maximus.
No, it won't compare to our more expensive PCPs for build quality or accuracy, but it's a prefect example of what you can find if you're looking for a gun to keep handy and shoot on the spur of the moment.
(https://i.postimg.cc/8zYJ77DN/P1060941-1.jpg) (https://postimages.org/)
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PCPs were once an expensive option, but now you have choices at every price point. My suggestion is to take a look at used, too. We bought this 2009 vintage Benjamin Discovery in 22 with pump and add on moderator used. Got the whole package for $150. Recently did an aftermarket trigger kit, but even the factory trigger was useable.
Have had this entry level PCP for 8 years, now, and it's still going strong. Takes 50 pumps to go from min to max pressure and that gives me 20 good shots before the fps drops too much. Power-wise, it's more powerful than any of our springers and, of course, recoil is not an issue. Shoot it like your 22 rimfire. No issues with mysterious changes in POI, either. Can pick it up, anytime, and it shoots the same. With the moderator that had been added by the previous owner, it's very quiet. Accuracy is quite reasonable. It will keep groups under an inch at 50 yards with a variety of pellets when conditions are favorable.
There's also a synthetic version of the Discovery called the Maximus.
No, it won't compare to our more expensive PCPs for build quality or accuracy, but it's a prefect example of what you can find if you're looking for a gun to keep handy and shoot on the spur of the moment.
Yes that's about perfect for me. Looking through member classifieds it seems that finding something like that will be the trouble. Thanks for the tip.
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PCPs were once an expensive option, but now you have choices at every price point. My suggestion is to take a look at used, too. We bought this 2009 vintage Benjamin Discovery in 22 with pump and add on moderator used. Got the whole package for $150. Recently did an aftermarket trigger kit, but even the factory trigger was useable.
Have had this entry level PCP for 8 years, now, and it's still going strong. Takes 50 pumps to go from min to max pressure and that gives me 20 good shots before the fps drops too much. Power-wise, it's more powerful than any of our springers and, of course, recoil is not an issue. Shoot it like your 22 rimfire. No issues with mysterious changes in POI, either. Can pick it up, anytime, and it shoots the same. With the moderator that had been added by the previous owner, it's very quiet. Accuracy is quite reasonable. It will keep groups under an inch at 50 yards with a variety of pellets when conditions are favorable.
There's also a synthetic version of the Discovery called the Maximus.
No, it won't compare to our more expensive PCPs for build quality or accuracy, but it's a prefect example of what you can find if you're looking for a gun to keep handy and shoot on the spur of the moment.
Yes that's about perfect for me. Looking through member classifieds it seems that finding something like that will be the trouble. Thanks for the tip.
Put a Want to buy in the classified for a Disco, a Maximus, a Stormrider or for any budget PCP lots of people that aren't thinking of putting one up for sale will once the see a want to buy ad
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PCPs were once an expensive option, but now you have choices at every price point. My suggestion is to take a look at used, too. We bought this 2009 vintage Benjamin Discovery in 22 with pump and add on moderator used. Got the whole package for $150. Recently did an aftermarket trigger kit, but even the factory trigger was useable.
Have had this entry level PCP for 8 years, now, and it's still going strong. Takes 50 pumps to go from min to max pressure and that gives me 20 good shots before the fps drops too much. Power-wise, it's more powerful than any of our springers and, of course, recoil is not an issue. Shoot it like your 22 rimfire. No issues with mysterious changes in POI, either. Can pick it up, anytime, and it shoots the same. With the moderator that had been added by the previous owner, it's very quiet. Accuracy is quite reasonable. It will keep groups under an inch at 50 yards with a variety of pellets when conditions are favorable.
There's also a synthetic version of the Discovery called the Maximus.
No, it won't compare to our more expensive PCPs for build quality or accuracy, but it's a prefect example of what you can find if you're looking for a gun to keep handy and shoot on the spur of the moment.
Yes that's about perfect for me. Looking through member classifieds it seems that finding something like that will be the trouble. Thanks for the tip.
Put a Want to buy in the classified for a Disco, a Maximus, a Stormrider or for any budget PCP lots of people that aren't thinking of putting one up for sale will once the see a want to buy ad
Also, yes you'll be amazed when you pick a a lightweight PCP and immediately shoots where you put the crossairs :) :)
......also even the single shots like Disco are way more pleasureful to operate then braking a barrel, pushing a pellet in and so forth :)
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+1 for a Disco / Maximus for a entry level PCP. (that is the way I went)
2000 psi and easier to hand pump than a 3000 psi gun.
Crosman customer support is top notch and parts are easily available from MANY sources.
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I think I've arrived at the Benjamin Fortitude as the ideal rifle for me.
I'm drawn to the quietness of it.
Being a regulated rifle seems like it would be a plus too. Now just need to find one.
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I think I've arrived at the Benjamin Fortitude as the ideal rifle for me.
I'm drawn to the quietness of it.
Being a regulated rifle seems like it would be a plus too. Now just need to find one.
Great rifle, and looks nice and is lightweight, great warranty and very consistent. Great choice overall.