GTA
All Springer/NP/PCP Air Gun Discussion General => PCP/CO2/HPA Air Gun Gates "The Darkside" => Topic started by: Kinetic45^ on December 31, 2018, 04:44:33 PM
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So Hawke scopes has discontinued Chairgun... they are recommending Strelok as an alternative. But Strelok does not run on PC, only smart phones and I will mention some other stuff below. Cutting to the chase:
In other things like aircraft owners groups or automobile groups or even a couple of software's that the origional company discontinued I have seen it negotiated and taken over by that interested group.
Why couldn't a GTA group aquire Chairgun from Hawke and keep it active? They might even GIVE it to us if we just ASK!
I have usedStrelok Pro and Chairgun both for years (used Chairgun before Hawke bought it!) and will sorely miss Chairgun because they DO NOT both have all the same capabilities.
Strelik is really set up for PB rifle shooting and does not have the drag law for GL (blunt projectile like round nose or HP big bore pistol bullets), GS (round ball) or GC ( cylinder, because shooting .357 wadcutters is done too... and SWC tend to calculate trajectories better with GC than G1!!!)
Also, the Chairgun app was easier to quickly change ranges and speeds in the field which is what I will miss the most.
Maybe we can convince Strelok to incorporate some if the missing Chairgun features in OR perhaps someone could take over Chairgun from Hawke.
If we do nothing a valuable resource will disappear.
Let's organize and try.
Or perhaps one of the vendors here could try to take it over?
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https://www.hawkeoptics.com/chairgun-and-x-act-end-of-life.html (https://www.hawkeoptics.com/chairgun-and-x-act-end-of-life.html)
The way I read it, it's not that ChairGun has been discontinued, it's that they will no longer support or update it. You can still download the app from the page I linked to above. As long as you don't need anything fixed or changed in the app (and assuming they continue to maintain the link to download the software) this may not be a huge issue.
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Without contacting Hawke, we have no idea if they will continue offering ChairGun as a download after the end of December.... For sure they will not be updating it after that....
Bob
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As nice as it would be to take over Chairgun, it poses serious complications without a dedicated team to update the program. Not saying it isn't possible, just would be more difficult without an official "HQ" type building for them to work in. Now I understand that pellets are not added all the time to our arsenal. However, for an AG business owner or forum to take it over, it would certainly have to cover a whole lot more pellets. Someone would have to do all that as well and as with many small businesses, to do it on their own, there just isn't enough time in the day. Throw in a paid programmer to do the leg work and now the program will cost more money.
I just don't see it as feasible. Don't get me wrong, I use CG all the time, love it. However, there is a lot that goes on behind the scenes that would have to be accounted for as well.
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Heck I would be happy if Lapua decided to make a bunch of JSB and used it as an advertising tool... they already have the resources to improve Chairgun's custom profile with more data points and Doppler...
Free loaded with their pellets data.. ;)
still allowing the ability to create your own drag profiles would be nice...
There do seem to be some Eley wadcutters.. ;) https://www.creedmoorsports.com/product/ELEY-177-449MM-VENTUS-PELLETS/Pellets (https://www.creedmoorsports.com/product/ELEY-177-449MM-VENTUS-PELLETS/Pellets)
it is a decent little tool for estimation and education... but it could use updating for current state of the art...
I do wish that an industry leader does see that taking their customers seriously enough that they realize a good ballistics tool is very important and can drive sales...
just being able to get a broad understanding of what performance( trajectory/drift) they will get at 10-20-50 -100 yards etc. with a particular fpe/round is going to speed up the learning curve... and with the compression of range/velocity with air power well you need your customers to be able to understand that performance when going past PBR.. ;)
I mean Now we have more choices in heavy pellets and custom Pellets like NSA... The industry is taking some good steps in seeing air power more seriously as the useful tool it is... More precise info means more precise shots at more distance and Accuracy in the end is what sells...
::)
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By the way... Thank you Hawke Optics for being one of those leaders and your contribution keeping it going this long...
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HEAR HEAR.... Three cheers for Hawke !!!!
Bob
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More cheers for Hawke! Great app for sure :)...hate to see it go extinct.
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By the way... Thank you Hawke Optics for being one of those leaders and your contribution keeping it going this long...
I agree, it is my go to program for my airgun ballistic info.
wll
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https://www.hawkeoptics.com/chairgun-and-x-act-end-of-life.html (https://www.hawkeoptics.com/chairgun-and-x-act-end-of-life.html)
The way I read it, it's not that ChairGun has been discontinued, it's that they will no longer support or update it. You can still download the app from the page I linked to above. As long as you don't need anything fixed or changed in the app (and assuming they continue to maintain the link to download the software) this may not be a huge issue.
And yet when I tried to 'save' a copy on both my Windows 10 PC and my Window 10 notebook this morning from the Windows download link on that page it failed for both.
Note that I had Chairgun PC on my PC but recently suffered a catastrophic drive failure... sure my data was backed up but the programs were not and I had been using the Mobile app mostly anyway and had not tried to download a new copy until I needed the extra PC features.
The problem is that apps that are not maintained when Android updates stop working - since single individuals write apps and keep up with Android updates, again it does not need a team, just a knowledgeable coder who also is an airgunner.
I don't think it needs a team for the PC version, just hosting on a server somewhere (like GTA, for a small fee?). It's fairly mature program and does not need a lot of 'maintenance n upgrades', just hosting.
I know enough to know how it is done but not enough to do the details of doing it. We would need to locate that individualbwho can.
I'm willing to pay $12 or $14 a year for it just like I do Strelok Pro... consider how little that really is individually if we could hire an individual with the thousands who use Chairgun.
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Pyramyd Air sure could use a good ballistics program ;)
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Ya think?.... Theirs uses a "constant drag coefficient" model.... ::)
Bob
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Pyramyd Air sure could use a good ballistics program ;)
Anyone got an 'in' or serious level contact at AOA or Pyramid, etc?
I KNOW! MIKEY, NO, JSAR WILL EAT ANYTHING! Haha. 😉
It is just a matter of beating the bushes to something pops out!
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Also, sent to igor@borisov.mobi who is Strelok (If we can't save Chairgun then we need to get a replacement that works the way we need). :) :D
Please follow this link and see the conversation on Strelik inadequacys vs Chairgun.
Maybe you could consider what is missing in you app that a whole segment if the shooting community needs and fill the gap with some upgrades.
Signed, Kinetic45^, a long time Strelok Pro user/customer
https://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=152800.msg155680591#msg155680591 (https://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=152800.msg155680591#msg155680591)
Carl the Joatmon
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Carl, I just saved Chairgun to my Win 10 laptop with no problem. If you need it, I can send the file to your e-mail.
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Carl, I just saved Chairgun to my Win 10 laptop with no problem. If you need it, I can send the file to your e-mail.
PMed
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It would be nice if they open-sourced it, but I'm not sure enough dev's would be interested in the project to keep it alive
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I got this:
Igor Borisov Mon, Dec 31, 2018, 11:38 PM (3 hours ago)
I can add GS and GL drag models if you want
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Igor has added GA, GL and GS to Strelok for us!
That's great customer service.
I am also talking to him about shot curves in pneumatic guns and maybe some other interesting features can be added later.
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That's great news, Carl.... I wonder if he can add a function to be able to input a custom drag profile.... If so, I hope it has lots of Cd input points, not the very few that ChairGun had.... That ability could be a precursor to being able to interface data from LabRadar with Strelok….
Bob
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That's great news, Carl.... I wonder if he can add a function to be able to input a custom drag profile.... If so, I hope it has lots of Cd input points, not the very few that ChairGun had.... That ability could be a precursor to being able to interface data from LabRadar with Strelok….
Bob
I'll check with him on that.
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That's great news, Carl.... I wonder if he can add a function to be able to input a custom drag profile.... If so, I hope it has lots of Cd input points, not the very few that ChairGun had.... That ability could be a precursor to being able to interface data from LabRadar with Strelok….
Bob
Bob, yes, Strelok Pro does have the function of an input of a custom drag profile, thankfully! It gives you a very long table to enter the Mach and Cd data pairs, I counted 100 data fields.
You can send the tables of the calculated data via email to your computer, import them into Excel, and then do comparisons, graphs, the works.
The Windows version of ChairGun is of course very powerful, and there are some things right now that Strelok cannot do, as it is designed to be run on a cell phone, not a big screen computer.
However, Strelok is much more powerful and userfriendly than the cellphone version of ChairGun (Android).
Just today the Strelok developer Boris released an update (at least for the Pro version in Android) that added GL and GS drag models, to the already present GA, G1, G7, and RA4 models.
I'm all game to support the developer in adding some functions that we airgunners need. Even having him release a Premium version, the 12$ I paid for the Pro version were well-spent!
Matthias
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Hey, Matthias.... Thanks for the screen shot of the custom drag profile data entry.... that is a NICE feature.... I may just have to get a tablet to try out Strelok Pro....
Bob
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One of the nice things I do with Chairgun is know my shot curve and in the field on the main page change the FPS from shot to shot (for long range, not doing for short range) so my trajectory chart more closely shows what the shot should be.
It's harder to change with Strelok and takes more taps and page changes.
One of the things I'd like is a 'quick' FPS box on the first page so it can be changed fast for shot curves.
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They arent in the IOS version yet. No update yet.
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They arent in the IOS version yet. No update yet.
Well, I put his email address in a previous post, contact him and ask him about IOS. Of course, Apple has a big 'check n review' thing for security so that may be the delay updating.
Sorry, I only checked with him on Android. He seems to be an OK guy from what contact I've had.
Sure deserves some thanks for being responsive to our special needs.
I asked him to show more ranges on the upper dots in the recticle view and he said he'd work on it.
The example I used was if I zeroed at 85 then I would be 3" high at 50 and 3" low at 100 but if I needed to shoot at say, 40 the recticle view page did not show those mrad ranges above the first dot.
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Now, for those long range shooters that can't or don't want to get as detailed as a full custom drag profile for each pellet they use Strelok Pro gives us another option:
A customized variable BC entry for each pellet — as BC varies with velocity (this variable BC is directly linked to your selected gun):
Measure the BC of your favorite pellets at up to 5 distances (i.e., velocities)
Enter those BC values into Strelok.
The app will calculate hold overs/ clicks more accurately.
Happy shooting! :D
Matthias
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Got an update today. Still no new drag functions. I may have to contact him.
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For some time I have been working on a couple of Excel spreadsheets to use LabRadar data to calculate the Cd, and hence the BC, as a pellet slows down as it goes downrange.... I haven't got my own LabRadar yet (coming in 2 years), but thanks to those who have sent me some data to work from, the spreadsheets are coming along nicely.... The LabRadar has the velocity at 5 distances right on the screen, without having to go into the yard by yard detailed data.... I have a spreadsheet for both, but the "simplified" one that uses the 5 velocity inputs from the screen produces 5 BCs as the velocity decays.... It would seem to me to be ideal to interface with that screen on Strelok, that allows 5 BC inputs.... The only glitch is that my spreadsheets use the G1 drag function because I could not get the GA function in a formula like I could the G1.... However, the spreadsheets also output the raw Cd values, and I think Strelok can accept that data instead of the BCs.... The advantage to using the Cd is that it is "pure" and not confused by choosing a less than ideal drag model that may or may not match your pellet....
Bob
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For some time I have been working on a couple of Excel spreadsheets to use LabRadar data to calculate the Cd, and hence the BC, as a pellet slows down as it goes downrange.... I haven't got my own LabRadar yet (coming in 2 years), but thanks to those who have sent me some data to work from, the spreadsheets are coming along nicely.... The LabRadar has the velocity at 5 distances right on the screen, without having to go into the yard by yard detailed data.... I have a spreadsheet for both, but the "simplified" one that uses the 5 velocity inputs from the screen produces 5 BCs as the velocity decays.... It would seem to me to be ideal to interface with that screen on Strelok, that allows 5 BC inputs.... The only glitch is that my spreadsheets use the G1 drag function because I could not get the GA function in a formula like I could the G1.... However, the spreadsheets also output the raw Cd values, and I think Strelok can accept that data instead of the BCs.... The advantage to using the Cd is that it is "pure" and not confused by choosing a less than ideal drag model that may or may not match your pellet....
Bob
Bob i cant just wait when you start, playing around with strelok pro, dont get the free version,, the truing option kinda gives you the exact poi at different ranges, and with truing you dont even need a chronograph to get the exact trajectory plot
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Could someone make a list of features they'd like to see in a replacement app?
Works on iOS, Android, Mac, and Windows..obviously. Use similar inputs..maybe even a similar UI. But what features are most important and used the most?
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Do everything that ChairGun does.... and add the features that Strelok has that ChairGun doesn't.... I personally love the trajectory graph in ChairGun…. I haven't yet used Strelok, but I haven't seen anyone post such a graph.... Does it have one, or is everything presented in tabular form?....
Personally, I would like a way to input Cd vs Velocity for MANY points, and then show the output as a drag model graph, so that it is easy to visualize, and see obvious errors in your data.... Then go back and recheck to see if the data can be improved.... Once you have a proven drag model for a given pellet or family of pellets, then the "company" should have a way to redistribute that drag model to others who want to use it....
Bob
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On my ios device, I cannot find a free version. AU $
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strelok only has a tabular data for inertcepts no graph bob
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Bob
Do everything that ChairGun does.... and add the features that Strelok has that ChairGun doesn't.... I personally love the trajectory graph in ChairGun…
I would think a separation of features for handheld VS desktop. Obviously, the desktop apps..Win an Mac OSX..would have everything (except inclinometer and GPS). But for me, the handheld devices..with the exception of the iPad..don't lend themselves to graphing work..too small a screen size to be really useful.
I see the iOS or Android as being better suited for data collection like entering shot strings. Entering a distance and seeing a holdover displayed on a reticle or the number of -+ clicks from your zero for holding "on". Using the device inclinometer to establish an angle..for doing distance "cuts". Additionally, they would do the drag modeling in real-time..shoot in 2 or 3 distances..note the click diff and calculate the trajectory. No chrony required.
I would like a way to input Cd vs Velocity for MANY points, and then show the output as a drag model graph, so that it is easy to visualize, and see obvious errors in your data.... Then go back and recheck to see if the data can be improved.... Once you have a proven drag model for a given pellet or family of pellets, then the "company" should have a way to redistribute that drag model to others who want to use it....
Instead of velocity at many points, ideally it would be click differences at many points..jmo. You could use the click differences to calculate a velocity. After establishing a "program" velocity you could synch the program to your personal chrony.
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Yes, I'd agree that the handheld versions probably won't need graphs.
🔶 However, what is missing sorely in both mobile ChairGun and Strelok is pellet BC calculation based on two chrono velocities.
🔶 Another function I need in the field — and therefore on a mobile is when I'm shooting up at an angle and have a couple of buildings further down range from the target.
I need to know the terminal range at angle A of gun—pellet combo B.
That way I know how shallow or steep my angle needs to be in order to avoid the houses.
Now ChairGun for PC (but not mobile) does this marvellously, cf. this thread with pics:
https://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=147260 (https://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=147260)
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Chairgun on my phone/tablet is crucial. I'd also like to add new pellets and reticles. I hit them up last year and got a meh response pretty quick. If they let the app lapse something should be done.
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As I said, both fill a niche and without firm hosting Chairgun WILL die.
How long will it stay in the Android 'Play store' (stupid name I winch at every time I go there) because if it is 'abandoned' it will eventually stop working.
So we got sidetracked - I really believe because it's happened with other software programs that users got the program shows it's possible, we or airgunner overall should try to aquire the rights to Chairgun from Hawke.
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Well, I now have an Android tablet and have purchased Strelok Pro.... It is installed but I have no idea how it functions.... I'm going to have to look for an online manual I guess.... Don't be too hard on me, this is the first "smartphone-like" device I have ever laid hands on, I'm still trying to even figure out scrolling, etc.etc…. ::) …. The tablet is a 7" RCA with detachable keyboard (Walmart for $78 CDN), so with Strelok I'm only out about a C-note.... I just need time to play with it, and figure out how to navigate the menus and features....
Bob
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Joining the modern age!
Careful, the handiness of tablets and smartphones can not so good you in (hummm, I had a variation of suction here and it edited it to "not so good") if you explore the capabilities and get the right apps... or is that wrong apps.
I very carefully do not download games, hence can't find out accidentally I'm addicted to one of the stupid things. Only practical tools like compasses and map programs, levels, conversion tools, etc.
Good luck on a Strelok manual, if you find one let me know where. I just tried things hit or miss to educate myself on it and wonder if I've missed parts.
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GL and GS is now in IOS so a .457 lyman 330gr mold #457122 would be what drag model? Lol Ive been using G1 and it’s been pretty close with a 50yd zero at 105yds.
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I would try GL as that is for 'blunt' projectiles and covers round nose rifle and the heavier pistol bullets
GS is for round ball (which is a high drag projectile)
G1 is the flat based artillery shell spitzer so it has less drag than GL
And G7 is the boat tail VeryLowDrag form
GC is wadcutter/cylinder
RA4 is the 22 Long Rifle bullet which also is close to GL
Don't have the SWC drag form, you just have to pick which is closer to the bullets profile GL or GC and adjust as necessary.
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Yes, I'd agree that the handheld versions probably won't need graphs.
🔶 However, what is missing sorely in both mobile ChairGun and Strelok is pellet BC calculation based on two chrono velocities.
🔶 Another function I need in the field — and therefore on a mobile is when I'm shooting up at an angle and have a couple of buildings further down range from the target.
I need to know the terminal range at angle A of gun—pellet combo B.
That way I know how shallow or steep my angle needs to be in order to avoid the houses.
Now ChairGun for PC (but not mobile) does this marvellously, cf. this thread with pics:
https://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=147260 (https://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=147260)
Those features both seem like reasonable asks.
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Yes, I'd agree that the handheld versions probably won't need graphs.
🔶 However, what is missing sorely in both mobile ChairGun and Strelok is pellet BC calculation based on two chrono velocities.
🔶 Another function I need in the field — and therefore on a mobile is when I'm shooting up at an angle and have a couple of buildings further down range from the target.
I need to know the terminal range at angle A of gun—pellet combo B.
That way I know how shallow or steep my angle needs to be in order to avoid the houses.
Now ChairGun for PC (but not mobile) does this marvellously, cf. this thread with pics:
https://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=147260 (https://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=147260)
Those features both seem like reasonable asks.
I wonder if we should discuss with Igor/Strelok having a 'Strelok AIR' version???
He might not want to load up the Pro version with too much of our specialty stuff.
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Excellent idea.... Pellets and some of the commonly used cast bullets, and add more as the need grows....
Bob
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actually strelok has database for pellets,, to get precise trajectory data, use the g1 drag, and get the TV trajectory validation, the farther the better,, and use velocity instead of BC..we been doing that here 4-5yrs now,,anyway it makes you feel good hitting baloon size targets at 200yds with a 22 on your first shot,, and that is not having any dope or data of previous engagement
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As a big bore shooter, I will never get long shot strings and as a hunter all I need is good numbers for a couple of shots.
I can envision a page that has, say a pre entered five shots string and you would tap on the shot you wanted and it would have your sighting data for that shots probable FPS.
Ex:
Shot 1: FPS = 868 {tap on this and it would give trajectory for this FPS}
Shot 2: FPS = 847 {next shot tap this line and get new setup}
Shot 3: FPS = 827
Shot 4: FPS = 806
Shot 5: FPS = 780
As you can see by this example, the trajectories would be fairly different and if I was sighted in for #1 then I would be way off for #5. With a page that I could enter the average shot string from testing I could just select the the one I needed based on where I was in the actual shot string.
Or, it could be done by gauge pressure, if you saw your pressure you could select that and it would give you trajectory based on prior chrony and target info. A field adjustable dope sheet so to speak.
This is very close to how I use Chairgun except what I do is keep the app open before me, and have my shot string FPSs written down on a strip of paper. So if I was on shot four I quickly change the FPS box on Chairguns front page, tap on the enter symbol then hit recticle box at bottom and I got my new sight picture and I'm ready to go/shoot. Note we are talking longer ranges here, more than 100 yards.
This works really well with mrad/mildot.
You CAN do this shot to shot recalculation with Strelok but it takes a lot longer and more taps and screen changes in and out. Awkward and unweldy in the field.
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Excellent idea.... Pellets and some of the commonly used cast bullets, and add more as the need grows....
Bob
hi bob, i think you already found this link,, but if not
http://www.borisov.mobi/strelokpro/android/configuration.html (http://www.borisov.mobi/strelokpro/android/configuration.html)
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Great work guys
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hi bob, i think you already found this link,, but if not
http://www.borisov.mobi/strelokpro/android/configuration.html (http://www.borisov.mobi/strelokpro/android/configuration.html)
And this more wordy user manual page might also be helpful:
http://www.borisov.mobi/strelokplus/manual.html (http://www.borisov.mobi/strelokplus/manual.html)
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Thanks Guys
For adding the Strelokpro info,
I have been fighting on how to use this ballistic program since, since I bought it several years ago,
on my I pad with limited results........
Now I'll go back and read this info, to use it right. LOL
Thanks for the info, Plinker and Gerard.
Question for you all,
Where do you find these ballistic programs for IPad and the Android operating systems,
I have been searching the Apple store selections with NO results etc.
I have a lap top type computer that has several ballistic programs and Quickload program in them,
that I take to the range/field for double checking the info etc.
I would like to have all these programs on both the IPad and lap top etc, as a back up,
as the Ipad is easy to take and use in the field.......
Since I have just started using air rifles, I would like to add air rifle info to both computers also.
Thanks,
Don
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Not quite on topic, but I'm wondering if anyone has any idea how one might increase the scope view field for a Burris 'ballisticplex' reticle such as this:
(http://www.luthier.ca/other/forum/Strelok_reticle_view.png)
There's a little dot at about 6.5x on the Burris Droptine 2-7x scope I'm using on my QB78D in .22", which seems likely to indicate the range to which it's been calibrated. Shooting JSB 18.13gr at 700fps. I was hoping to head out sometime when the weather's a bit nice and trying my hand at the GTA 'nothing under 100 yards' thing - 91.44 metres, which Strelok is showing rounded down to 91 metres. From reading the developer's FAQ page it seems he sort of answers this when someone's asking about introducing a simple duplex reticle - he says that since there are no dots nor lines in a duplex reticle there's no point. And I guess I agree... and can see how this sort of thinking could extend to the un-graduated part of the lower reticle element with the Burris reticle I'm using. But it would be really nice to be able to see the relative position of an 8.5" x 11" piece of paper at 7x zoom. At 4x the top edge of the paper looks like it's almost an inch below the point of the thick bar. And that's cool, it may be usable in the field... but 100 yards is longer than I've shot before, and I'd prefer to use 7x if possible.
Unfortunately Chairgun doesn't include this Burris reticle, though it has a couple which are sort of in the ballpark. If there were a way to draw a reticle and import it into Chairgun that'd be ideal. I use range cards (graphs with numeric values inserted in a box and other notes) for all my airguns, printed from screenshots (higher quality than exporting using Chairgun's menus). So I know approximately how high to holdover for this new distance and can make a simple extension above the target paper at the required height as a point of aim. But I'd rather be looking at the target when shooting, not a secondary target above it. Seems unlikely to get that with either Chairgun or Strelok unless I buy a different scope... and I really like the Burris as it suits my generally shorter shooting distances nicely, besides having lovely clear glass and being very lightweight.
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OK, I have played with Strelok Pro, and I can't find any pellets, nor a way to input pellets or bullets that are not in the database already.... Surely there must be a way to create file for these which have at least a single BC and use the GA profile and save that info so that if you want to use the same pellet/bullet in a different rifle, you don't have to type everything in again?.... For instance, create a .22 cal JSB 181 gr. Heavy as a "bullet" and add it to the database?.... or a Lee 336 gr. FN cast bullet?.... Same thing with a rifle, if you want to use several different bullets or pressures, there must be some way to duplicate what data doesn't change, and just change what you want?....
Bob
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OK, I have played with Strelok Pro, and I can't find any pellets, nor a way to input pellets or bullets that are not in the database already.... Surely there must be a way to create file for these which have at least a single BC and use the GA profile and save that info so that if you want to use the same pellet/bullet in a different rifle, you don't have to type everything in again?.... For instance, create a .22 cal JSB 181 gr. Heavy as a "bullet" and add it to the database?.... or a Lee 336 gr. FN cast bullet?.... Same thing with a rifle, if you want to use several different bullets or pressures, there must be some way to duplicate what data doesn't change, and just change what you want?....
Bob
save data and change rifle bob, have you tried that?
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From what I can see, you have to enter all the data each time you change anything.... and no way to save bullets c/w their BC, weight, etc.etc…. ::) …. I couldn't even find a way to copy a "rifle" so that you could save several pellets / pressures / velocities....
I'm pretty sure this can't be right, surely nobody would rave about such a program?....
Bob
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bob this is saved data from my rifle,
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this is my saved data from other rifles, sample data are different rifles i have diddnt edit the rifle name,, 177is i think my br rig
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data replaced and switched to 177 br rifle,, wanted to see if i can shoot at 100-120yds with 177..not yet finished though and have not validated it
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and with strelok, you actually dont need a chronograph to get the trajectory, bullet /pellet drop, hold hold over and under etc,,, just validate it and your good
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eumel…. What I need to know is how to store the pellet data (weight, BC, drag model, length, etc.) so that when I want to use that same pellet again I don't have to re-enter everything.... Same for a rifle, how do I store the name, caliber, pressure information etc. so that I can recall it, perhaps change the pressure, and have a new dataset.... then just pick my pellet from a list of the ones I have input (better yet, already in Strelok) and it loads all the data for it, like ChairGun does from their pellet database.... Ideally, "rifle" should include your scope setup, "cartridge" should include the caliber, pressure and velocity, and "bullet" should have all the pertinent data on that....
If this is not available in Strelok, why not?.... and why is everyone raving about how good it is, better than ChairGun?.... Do you all have only one rifle and shoot one pellet?....
Perhaps I'm wrong, and these very basic features are in Strelok and I just can't find them.... and nobody has yet told me how to do them.... If they are not there, then we need to contact Igor and send him all the data so that he can add a pellet database, and a cast bullet database for the Big Bore guys.... Even if he does that, however, we still need a way to create additional pellets/slugs/bullets in a database that Strelok can access and input all the pertinent information with one touch of the screen.... JMHO....
Perhaps a link to the HAM pellet BC page would be a place for him to start?.... https://hardairmagazine.com/ballistic-coefficients/
Bob
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use the change cartridge option then bob,
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yes, but can you store that "cartridge" data so you can recall it, and if so, how?....
Bob
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Bob
There is 2 paragrafts on how to enter and save the rifle and ammo sections.
Too wordy for me to copy, see info here: ;)
http://www.borisov.mobi/strelokplus/manual.html (http://www.borisov.mobi/strelokplus/manual.html)
HTH's,
Don
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yes, but can you store that "cartridge" data so you can recall it, and if so, how?....
Bob I think you uave to have profiles seperately I dont think there is an option to copy profiles but you can hit change data in the cartridge screen and copy to another profile
Mrod 25gr
Mrod 34gr
Mrod 42gr
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See why I wanted to save Chairgun?
Although Strelok is good it lacks some major features pneumatic shooters need vs powder burners need.
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Per the instructions listed,
"Adding or editing a Cartridge,
Just like with rifle, to add a cartridge, tap the "Change cartridge" button. A popup with opens.
Select an entry in the popup and configure the profile as needed.
It shall be saved automatically. 10 profiles are possible". ;)
Tia,
Don
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Per the instructions listed,
"Adding or editing a Cartridge,
Just like with rifle, to add a cartridge, tap the "Change cartridge" button. A popup with opens.
Select an entry in the popup and configure the profile as needed.
It shall be saved automatically. 10 profiles are possible". ;)
Tia,
Don
And I have profiles for 45 Texan, 25 Marauder, 25 WARP, 357 Texan, FLEX n Pitbull in Strelok but I did not fall in blind love. Strelok has its strengths but Charigun has different ones that are useful and convenient and I end up using both in different situations. Chairgun is just easier to use in the field. The good thing is everyone here should let Igor know what you need so he can possibly add those things.
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I sent him an email asking if there was a pellet data base,
and posted our sites info for this discussion about Strelok etc,
and what it would do or work for pellets. ;)
We'll see if he responds......
Tia,
Don
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Actually, I found the pellet database, when you select "Caliber", you can select .17 through .35 cal air rifles (what, no .45? )…. Then you can sort by Vendor (eg. JSB)…. So, there is an extensive list of pellets already....
If there are only 10 "cartridges" you can save, and you use one for each combination of pellet and velocity.... that is nowhere near enough, IMO....
but I am gradually getting the hang of it.... (still prefer ChairGun, however)….
Does anyone know how to change from single BC mode to multi BC mode?.... When I tap the bar, it goes back to the main cartridge screen but doesn't change anything.... ???
Bob
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Bob
Attempting to help here,
Per the instructions, this is noted:
Dropbox
Strelok now supports a feature allowing Dropbox users to backup rifle and profiles and sync the device with file uploaded to Dropbox.
Can this feature be used to set separate drop box with 10 shots per drop box, per cal or weights etc?
Tia,
Don
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Bob
Does this help:
By tapping “Table” You can also bring up a shooting table showing the rifle and ammo profile, velocities, energy, bullet flight times, bullet drop, windage at specified distance increments.
All this can be configured in table settings. The table can also be exported by email for storing, printing etc
Tia,
Don
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How to Switch Pellets and Power Seamlessly on Your Mobile Ballistic Calculator
= One of the Advantages of Strelok over ChairGun
To start out with, Strelok has a lot of development work to do if it is to replace ChairGun! Strelok Pro is lacking a lot YET to compete with the desktop version of ChairGun! So, I really hope that the developer who is the most important developer for the airgun world in 2019 will make it happen. Go Boris!
However, Strelok has some distinct advantages over the mobile version of ChairGun.
One of the differences between ChairGun and Strelok, if I understand this correctly, comes into play when you want to use different pellets (also, if you want to use different power settings, if your gun has that feature):
Let’s go through the steps of setting it up, to see where the difference (= the Strelok advantage) comes in:
ChairGun (Android)
Pellet #1
• With ChairGun (Android) you zero your scope for one pellet, #1.
• Reset the scope turrets to zero.
• Enter the pellet data and present weather conditions into ChairGun.
• Store your rifle–pellet combination.
• Let ChairGun calculate a shooting solution for pellet #1 at your target’s distance.
• Click the turrets to ChairGun’s number or use ChairGun’s dots of holdover. Shoot.
Pellet #2
If you want to use another pellet #2, re-zero the scope to shoot for pellet #2.
• Write a LIST of offsets – noting down the up/down clicks, left/right clicks in comparison to pellet #1.
• Reset the scope turrets to zero (yeah, many scopes require an that allen wrench).
• Enter the pellet data and present weather conditions into ChairGun.
• Store your rifle–pellet combination.
• Let ChairGun calculate a shooting solution for pellet #2 at your target’s distance.
• Click the turrets to ChairGun’s number or use ChairGun’s dots of holdover. Shoot.
Now comes the problem when switching between stored pellet-rifle combinations:
If you want to go back to pellet #1, or any other pellet you have stored in ChairGun:
• Find your written LIST of offsets.
• Reset the scope turrets to zero (allen wrench...).
• Pull up your stored rifle–pellet combination.
• Let ChairGun calculate a shooting solution for pellet #1 at your target’s distance.
• Click the turrets to ChairGun’s number or use ChairGun’s dots of holdover. Shoot.
Note: You could get away without resetting the turrets, doing it the following way:
• Take ChairGun’s shooting solution of elevation and windage clicks.
• Add/subtract to that the number of clicks that you have written down in your LIST of offsets.
• Click the turrets to those new numbers. Shoot.
Complicated? Yes.
Strelok Pro (Android)
Pellet #1
• With Strelok (Android) you zero your scope for your most common pellet, let’s call it the universal pellet, Pellet, #1.
• Reset the scope turrets to zero.
• Enter the pellet data and present weather conditions into Strelok.
• Store your rifle–pellet combination.
• Let Strelok calculate a shooting solution for pellet #1 at your target’s distance.
• Click the turrets to Strelok’s number or use Strelok’s dots of holdover. Shoot.
Pellet #2
• If you want to use another pellet #2, shoot it without adjusting the scope.
• Measure the offset (“zero offset” up/down, left/right) from the bulls.
• Enter the pellet #2 data and present weather conditions into Strelok. Enter the zero offset of pellet #2 into Strelok.
• Store your rifle–pellet combination.
• Let Strelok calculate a shooting solution for pellet #2 at your target’s distance.
• Click the turrets to Strelok’s number or use Strelok’s dots of holdover. Shoot.
Now comes the good part of Strelok, when switching between stored pellet-rife combinations:
If you want to go back to pellet #1, or any other pellet you have stored in Strelok:
• Pull up your stored rifle–pellet combination.
• Let Strelok calculate a shooting solution for pellet #1 at your target’s distance.
• Click the turrets to ChairGun’s number or use ChairGun’s dots of holdover. Shoot.
● ● ● No need for a written LIST of offsets.
● ● ● No need for resetting the scope turrets to zero (no allen wrench...).
● ● ● No need for recalculating the clicks by adding/ subtracting the clicks from some written LIST of offsets.
Hope this is helpful to some! :)
Matthias
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Strelok Pro: How to Copy a Pellet and Reuse It With a Different Rifle
Copying a Cartridge to a Different Rifle
• Go to main screen [the one that calculates holdover and clicks] |
• Tap the gun-cartridge combination |
• Tap the cartridge |
• Tap "Change Cartridge" |
• Select from the list of cartridges [pellets] |
• Tap "Copy" |
• Select from the list of rifles the one you want to copy that cartridge to [you have to have stored more than one rifle in Strelok] |
• OK | Back, or OK | you are now back at the main screen
Selecting the Copied Cartridge
• Tap "Change Rifle" |
• Select from the list of rifles the one that you copied the cartridge to |
• Tap the cartridge |
• Tap "Change Cartridge" |
• Select from the list of cartridges [pellets] |
• OK | Back or OK | Back or OK | you are now back at the main screen
Modifying the Copied Cartridge for the New Rifle
• Go to main screen [the one that calculates holdover and clicks] |
• Tap the gun-cartridge combination |
• Tap the cartridge |
• Now follow the instructions of my previous post for Pellet #2 in Strelok.
Cheers! :D
Matthias
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Thanks, Matthias.... when I have some time I will follow your instructions step by step....
Bob
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OK, I had a good play with Strelok, and I found out how to store various "cartridges", which for our purposes is a combination of bullet/pellet and velocity.... I also found out that you can store more than 10 "cartridges", I don't know how many, but certainly >12.... However, when you change the velocity, it changes it for that "cartridge", ie the velocity is stored as part of the custom cartridge data.... You aren't just storing a bullet/pellet, at least I can't figure out how to do that....
What I would like to see is the ability to ADD pellets/bullets to the list of "cartridges" under each airgun caliber.... At the moment it appears you have the built-in list of pellets, with their weight and BC (and sometimes those are duplicated)…. but anything different you want to store ends up in a single list, with all the calibers mixed up.... It would be nice if you could add, for instance, a Lyman 257420 to the ".25 Airgun" cartridge list and have it store the weight and BC.... Then to access it, you could just go to that list, select that bullet (cartridge) and then change the velocity....
Also, he needs to add .40 cal, .45 cal, .50 cal and .58 cal Airgun calibers to the "Caliber" pull-down menu in the Cartridge database, IMO.... Perhaps Boris can give us an email where we can send a list of Cast bullets (or others), with the weight and BC, and he can add them to his airguns database?.... Under manufacturer, they could be listed by mold maker, eg. Lyman, NOE, Accurate, Lee etc.etc. with the model number?.... Just a thought.... Or maybe that would be more appropriate in the "bullet" database, as they might be used by PBs also?....
Bob
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Guys
And just to add more info, that may help,
The site listed in the Streklok instructions for bullet data base is from Quickload app,
which has a listing for airgun pellets along with cast bullets in numerous sizes.
http://www.shootforum.com/forum/bulletdb.html (http://www.shootforum.com/forum/bulletdb.html)
HTH,
Don
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Thanks, Don, that is a great database.... You have to input the data manually, and then scroll through all your entries to find what you want.... In addition, if there were only 10 spots for custom cartridges (like it says in the instructions) you would run out real quick.... I have no idea what the maximum number is in Strelok Pro, hopefully I'll never find out....
I sure wish you could add the bullets to the bullet database, indexed by caliber and manufacturer.... It would be sooooooooo much more user friendly....
Bob
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Yes, Bob, I tried to add a pellet ("cartridge to the data base, but it does not work.
They can only be added to each rifle separately. Modifying a cartridge in the data base is also not possible. :-\
Yes, I agree, it would really help us users to be able to enter a pellet ("cartridge, bullet") once into the data base, and be able to select it from there.
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SUGGESTION to the Forum Moderators:
Maybe it would make sense to move this thread from the PCP sub-gate to the main gate — as ballistic calculators concern all of us. :)
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I put several 'notices' in other sections/gates linking to this one. The question is "Where was there going to be the most 'traffic' where the most people would see it and consider the problem". If It is in the wrong place it draws no readers and dies. I also had doubts the moderators would allow such notices in every gate but took the chance on a couple. I think MOST people just go to their interest gate and skip the general gates... I know I rarely look at anything other than the Darkside or BigBore. There seems to be more traffic in this gate than others.
I figured CO2 and Springers might sometimes do some chronographing but their velocities are more 'fixed' but PCPs it's almost mandatory to tune one and need more use of a ballistics calculator and in talking to other types of pneumatic gun shooters down through the years seemed to bear this out. So I chose the not perfect but least bad choice also knowing someone would think it should go in the general gates.
I certainly would not disagree to it being moved if the consensus is it should be but you can't please everyone. Here it HAS lead to fulfilling discussion which was my point in starting the thread.
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I think this subject will get the most traffic here, JMO.... Matthias, I am slowly getting used to Strelok Pro, and have several guns input, along with a few bullets for each.... I also figured out how to copy a bullet from one gun to another, and you can change the velocity for one gun without affecting the other, which is nice.... You may even be able to change the BC for one gun only, I haven't tried that yet.... If you select a pellet from the database, eg. Exact King, 25.4 gr., JSB.... once you put it into a given gun you can modify it, including the name.... For instance, I want the manufacturer, JSB, first, because I want to organize alphabetically, and I may want to edit the weight or BC.... You can do that once, then copy it to your other guns.... a nice thing to know....
I'll get there.... eventually.... I sure have a LOT of cast bullets to input.... and since most of them are NOE they aren't in the ShooterForum database.... :( …. This leave me with guesstimating the BC.... ::)
Bob
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Bob, another thing we should consider is having an online Wiki type database for non-pellet bullets data so we could share.
It's so wasteful that each of us has to 'reinvent the wheel' for BCs of molds we commonly use.
I had tried to find someone with a Labradar who I could send some .357 and .457 custom bullets to so they could do it but never matched up both someone with TIME, a Labradar and a rifle in those caliburs
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Sent to igor@borisov.mobi
You should also send suggestions GTA members.
Hi again, I am sending you this to show how it would help to have the second dot up show it's distance.
In this case the air rifle is zeroed for 85 yards but the target is 42 yards so you show the first up dot as 66 but the second up dot has nothing.
This is a very common senario with air rifles as we have very arcing trajectories and shoot at short ranges. Similar to pistol hunting ranges and trajectories.
I am hunting deer and hogs in Texas and my ranges are 30 yards to 180. I am using a 128gr .357 round nose HP (basically it is a lead pistol bullet) which leaves the rifle at 940 FPS for the first shot, then the following shots are 919, 892, 870.
Note that this means each shot has a different trajectory, which makes shooting/hunting with airrifles extremely challenging!
If I had a wish list, I would ask for "Strelok Air" that had most of Strelok Pro but also had our specialty stuff. And that way, the regular Strelik did not get too cluttered or complex for the powder burner firearm shooters. We don't need powder temp compensation for example. BC becomes important and others have asked for the ability to import Labradar chronograph data so it could be calculated too.
If you asked the people on the GatewayToAirguns website, specifically the section there called 'The Dark Side' type of Airguns (and one level deeper where I mostly go: section 'Big Bore' which is .25, .30, .357, n .45) for suggestions there are a lot of very, very knowledgeable people who would tell you what we need.
One wish would be a page that had multiple FPS boxes so I could, for example, switch from one shot calculation to another with just a tap, for the same rifle.
Like this
FPS 1= xxx ( here would go the 940)
FPS 2= xxx (919)
FPS 3= xxx (892)
FPS 4= xxx (870)
FPS 5= xxx
I might be shooting at a Sounder if hogs scattered across a field and first shot might shoot the farthest one, then second shot I have a lower FPS and a different range so it takes a lot of tapping and changing to get what I need with Strelok Pro, with what I am suggesting, I would just tap on the next shot FPS and it would take me to the new recticle calculation.
As you can see, the difference between shot 1 and a shot 4 or 5 is large and shows why pneumatic shooters are different than PB shooters.
Carl the Joatmon
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Carl, :)
WELL DONE!
Thanks for emailing the Strelok developer. ✔
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I thought Strelok would be an expensive PC program or something. It's just a 12$ app and looks fabulous. It easily overcomes the chairgun limitations.
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I just wish you could print out a trajectory chart with it....
Bob
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I just wish you could print out a trajectory chart with it....
Bob
You can export your trajectory chart two ways, go to the bottom and it has the arrow down into the envelope for emailing and the XLS uses the Android Google Sheets which you can get by opening a free Google account and is already loaded on most Android tablets n phone's... From Sheets you can print or further send it to editing, etc.
My PC uses Windows email and my phone uses Gmail but I can send from Strelok to either and then open the email and print.
I do wish Strelok had graphs like Chairgun but I guess you learn to live without them.
You can also export the recticle and I print it out in the size I need and rubber cement it inside my scope lens cap... When I flip it open then there it is for quick reference.
If you don't have the costly Microsoft Office with Excell there is the free Apache OpenOffice software for editing XLS documents and spreadsheets, etc.
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Are you talking about the graphic that chairgun has of the trajectory? I haven't seen a way to do it. But the intercept charts are most helpful for me, I'm not looking at the picture.
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I found one of the most useful things in ChairGun was the diagonal lines on the trajectory chart that represented the MilDots…. You could see where those intercepted the trajectory, all at one glance, all on one graphic.... eg. 65 yds, was 1 MilDot down, 80 yds. was 2, 92 yds. was 3 and 100 yards was 4 Dots of holdover required.... I also used the Reticle view with the ranges beside the dots, I printed that, and taped it on my pellet tin.... I don't know if Strelok has a similar feature, I hope so.... Like this....
(http://i378.photobucket.com/albums/oo221/rsterne/Important/IMG_2312.jpg) (http://s378.photobucket.com/user/rsterne/media/Important/IMG_2312.jpg.html)
Bob
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I never used that feature. I just used the charts, but I can totally get it, especially an all setups graph if you're looking air every shot. That makes more sense. The tin sticker is cool too. I've only used both on Android. So you are seeing chairgun things I never have.
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It can be done click on png save or print
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🔶 However, what is missing sorely in both mobile ChairGun and Strelok is pellet BC calculation based on two chrono velocities.
Not sure if its what your looking for, but my ios chairgun mobile app has a BC calc in the toolbox area.
It is a bummer Hawke is no longer supporting ChairGun.
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Just saw this.
I have been using the Lapua Ballistic app for my air rifle come ups.
Will have to confirm how close it is to reality this spring, once the snow melts.
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I sent a message to the guys at Lapua.
Their CSR said he would pass it on to the engineers for consideration.
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Deckard1973,
thanks for contacting them! :)
I figure, the more calculators we have to choose from the better.
Though if ONE calculator did it all, that would be awesome.... (unlikely to find "ideal" in an unideal world — I'm going to enjoy heaven — won't have THAT problem there!).
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I would really like to learn how to use one of these. I've used chairgun, but never really taken it to conclusion.
I just ordered an Edgun R5M in .177 to use in FT. I've really got to learn this stuff, can't afford to waste pellets figuring out what the gun is going to do every time I go to the field.
Biggest problem is I don't shoot often enough to remember the rifle settings from one session to another. I need that dope on my scope so I don't have to remember.
Spring is here now, maybe I'll shoot more. But I've gotten deep into mountain biking and it's consuming a lot of my free time.
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MonsterMaxx,
congrats on your EDgun!! You sure will have some very nice shooting with that gun! 8)
In your profile byline you share a personal problem, rampant around here:
"Is there an Airguns Anonymous Group?"
... ;)
I think you just found the solution to that problem in your previous post...! ;D
You wrote:
Spring is here now, maybe I'll shoot more. But I've gotten deep into mountain biking and it's consuming a lot of my free time.
Solution for airgun addicts:
Get into another hobby even more addictive than airgunning.
Wait?!? :o
...
WHAT?!!
A more addictive hobby than airgunning??
...
Doesn't exist.
Period.
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Interesting that this 'old' thread got resurrected.
I was very disappointed that there was no interest from anyone to have SOMEONE, somewhere aquire the program (just as it was origionally aquired by Hawke) as it would have been a real resource and draw of new members to GTA. I would bet that multiple members have the skill to update and inovate the program.
It's everybodies loss that after a couple of Android updates it will eventually stop working.
Just yesterday, I went long range V-hunting with a friend and although we both have Strelok Pro on our phones we ended up using Chairgun because it was faster and easier to make changes as he was shooting (I'm spotter as I'm healing from shoulder surgery and can't shoot for s few more weeks). Strelok is great but it just is too slow to page back and forth to multiple pages to change this and that to see what the possibility is for changes that air rifle shooting requires in tuning our shots placement. In the competition to get answers I got it a minute and it took him twice as long. Chairgun has a useful niche and unless Strelok evolves eventually we will be missing Chairgun and this missed opportunity for both ourselves and GTA.
Spring is here now, maybe I'll shoot more. But I've gotten deep into mountain biking and it's consuming a lot of my free time.
Don't worry, if three different friends experience with mountain biking holds, you will have free time while bones heal, haha 😁
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As I wrote before, I am willing to do my part and donate $50+ to keep ChairGun functioning.
I'm sure there are others that would spend $10, $30, $80 to have continued use of this awesome program and app.
We have the forums to reach those people.
Who is on board — PRO ChairGun?!
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I'll commit to $150 for Chairgun
I've contributed $250 to GTA in the last three years because I believe in the usefulness of the forum and want to have it's resources continue to be available for as many pneumatic shooters as possible.
If we got the hosting of Chairgun it would be awesome on so many levels.
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Robin
You can use this trick, I use, for the last untold years.
I have flip up scope cap covers on all my scopes, rifle and pistols, have a very bad fine dust problems here etc.
I measure the inside diameter of the eye piece scope cap, and get those gummed stickers (self sticking type), to fit inside the cover.
After I have my shooting dope down, I note that info on the self sticky and put it inside the flip up cover,
when I open the scope cap, all the info is there and gives me the info I need at that time.
If I make/use different trajectory info, I just peel the old info off and apply the new info, always ready to use etc.
HTH's
Tia,
Don
Biggest problem is I don't shoot often enough to remember the rifle settings from one session to another. I need that dope on my scope so I don't have to remember.
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Robin
You can use this trick, I use, for the last untold years.
I have flip up scope cap covers on all my scopes, rifle and pistols, have a very bad fine dust problems here etc.
I measure the inside diameter of the eye piece scope cap, and get those gummed stickers (self sticking type), to fit inside the cover.
After I have my shooting dope down, I note that info on the self sticky and put it inside the flip up cover,
when I open the scope cap, all the info is there and gives me the info I need at that time.
If I make/use different trajectory info, I just peel the old info off and apply the new info, always ready to use etc.
HTH's
Tia,
Don
Biggest problem is I don't shoot often enough to remember the rifle settings from one session to another. I need that dope on my scope so I don't have to remember.
Over the winter I made up a data logbook I am going to use for different distances, compare with different apps and then tape the info to my stock.
I do like your idea. Might do that for my goto pellets.
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I wanted to post to the members here the answer to a question someone asked me.
"Why don't YOU contact Hawke and see if they would be interested in doing something?"
The answer is I thought about it but there are several reasons why I have not.
1. There had to be enough interest by MULTIPLE people who would have to form a group to be in charge of it. Not many people got behind the idea. (Are you familiar with the theory that 3% of people lead and produce and the rest follow?)
2. I'm not a good leader as I'm crude and blunt and call out dumb sh*t so not PC enough. I am creative and a problem solver (160 IQ) but always need my good ideas sold by someone else - I made a lot of money with my ideas but only after getting a spokesperson for them.
3. Sad for me but I'm making every day count because I have heart failure and could be dead any day... If I took on leadership of the project then it could fail if I was the driving force then died. Hence needing someone else to take charge or a group to form that would survive as members came and went.
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Carl, :D
that was good and frank talk in your post. I appreciate that. And your reasoning is well thought out.
I’m sorry about your heart condition. I wish you well.
As you hinted at this already:
There are those who want to see ChairGun get a second chance to remain in our airgunning lives.
However:
Maybe we need to see how much real interest there is.... :)
Maybe all you who are indeed interested could chime in!
“Interested” here means not: “Yeah, I’m interested that others do the work and pay the bills, so I can benefit from it...” ;D –
● “Interested” here means = “Before my fellow airgunners I am now committing to a voluntary amount of money to support this project”.
● Or = “I’m committing to spend some time in a steering committee to move ChairGun into the next phase of life,
or writing or calling Hawke, or a programmer/ app developer, etc.”
To make this a reality I think on this forum there is more than a fair share of people who can be trusted and who have shown selfless service to our community.
For me this was a totally new experience when I joined GTA a couple of years ago – totally unexpected. That’s really awesome, especially considering how self-focused and selfish our world has become....
So, to put actions to my words:
I, Matthias, aka JungleShooter, commit to give $100 to support the maintenance of ChairGun.
I also commit to be part of some kind of steering committee, should I be selected so serve in that capacity.
April, 7, 2019
JungleShooterX@gmail.com
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Wow, so is this the end of ChairGun?
No responses, no committments, no suggestions how to keep this program working for us? :-\
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Wow, so is this the end of ChairGun?
No responses, no committments, no suggestions how to keep this program working for us? :-\
Classic example of the 3% rule:
Watch the group dynamics anywhere, anytime and it is true. I had hoped for others to step up or discover something in themselves. Disappointed but not surprised.
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I wonder about a couple of things involved with the problem at hand:
- What percentage of airgunners are software developers?
- What percentage of airgunners who use Chairgun think it needs further development, as compared to those who are fine with it as it stands?
- Has Hawke indicated that they will share the source code with anyone?
The first tso are obviously rhetorical, as we have no practical means to assess such numbers. It seems likely (though again no way of knowing for certain) that most Chairgun users don't even participate in forums. For the third, seems a simple enough thing to find out. Email Hawke and ask if they're comfortable sharing the resources needed to further develop their software. If yes, great, perhaps someone could be hired or volunteers found to work further on it. I was for years a tester on a very small team (one lead developer, two secondaries, two other testers) who took a small portable email program from a Japanese developer and worked on a UK version. No money involved for anyone. Perhaps a thousand users, perhaps 1,000,000, who knows? I still use the program (nPOPuk) on my Windows 10 tablet, wish I could on Android, but time and interest just wouldn't allow the translation from the Pocket PC platform to these new phones. It takes a lot of time. But in that case the Japanese developer of nPOP was happy to share his source code. If Hawke isn't, that's the end of this story.