Hatsan 95....where do I even begin?

[renegadelizard]

Hey all, newbie here to the air gun world. I just got a new Hatsan vortex 95 in 22. It is dieseling still after around 40 shots, and I know that isn't a good thing. I want to make it stop, but I can't figure out how to remove the piston and gas ram so I can clean everything. Can anyone point me to a tutorial on how this is accomplished?  I've seen a bunch of videos in the trigger, and how to convert from a spring to a gas ram, but they always start the video with the gun disassembled. Any help would be greatly appreciated, I'll even name my gun after the first person who can send me in the right direction..lol

Thanks
Don

[Roadworthy]

Hi, Dan.  Welcome to the GTA!!  I would start out pulling patches through the barrel - first with Goo Gone or Simple Green, followed by dry patches.  That may stop the dieseling all by itself.  I've never seen a Hatsan but the basics are pretty similar.

If not, and you are DETERMINED to disassemble the gun, the first step is to procure a spring compressor.  Next remove the scope.  The stock usually has two screws on the forearm - one on each side, and one or two on the trigger guard.  The stock will now come off.

The spring compressor should be tightened on the gun just a bit to equalize the spring pressure against the retaining pins.  You may have one or two pins driven through the trigger assembly holding it to the gun.  There can be a square bolt as well.  They should remove fairly easily with the spring compressor in place.

Now back off the spring compressor.  Reassembly is just the reverse.  Don't lose any little springs or clips.  Working on a white sheet or towel is a good idea.

[SteveP-52]

Try Youtube and type Hatsan 95 in the search. You may have to scroll down the list, but I saw some videos awhile back where the guy doing them started from scratch and showed everything he did to take the rifle apart. Part of why I remember is because he was showing how to take the front stock screw out because it's only the one straight through bolt and has to be tapped out after taking the small locking screw off one side. The other stock screw is behind the trigger guard...That one I know because mine started to loosen up and had to be tightened back up with a little blue loctite.
Hope this helps!

p.s. -  Welcome to the GTA!!

[Novagun]

When you take the trigger assembly out be careful. All the Hatsans I have dismantled have triggers with no retaining clips holding the various pins in. The timber work stops them falling out during use and without that restraint you can end up with a lot of bits to reassemble.
remember Murhpy's law. It will happen one day. Don't let that deter you. Everyone has to do it the first time and that is when airgunning becomes more than shooting at the fair.
Just as a footnote, a Hatsan with a bit of fettling and fun can be just as accurate as an HW95 and you can do it yourself. That self part makes it even realy worthwhile.

[SteveP-52]

Posting again because first, I have to agree with Roadworthy, try cleaning it first. Even after cleaning mine it still dieseled a bit for maybe 10 or 12 more shots. Then, if you decide you still want to take it apart, I went to Youtube myself and the guy's name is Mike Ellingsworth...his video is a 2 part deal on how to install a gas ram, but he shows you all the tools you're going to need and starts from scratch on how to take the rifle apart.
You might want to watch both parts before you try...I've only been back into airgunning since April and tearing down my 95 .25 after watching that video is not something I'm ready to try just yet....plus I still have time left on my warranty with Hatsan and they're really good about taking care of any problems you might have.

[renegadelizard]

Thanks all,
I have cleaned the barrel, but i havent tried goo gone yet...im kind of worried that the seal is trashed already, it just doesnt seem to shoot very hard...it could just be me though, its been wet the last two days so the thunk that im used to hearing from my 177 isnt there on the 22, but im hoping its because everything is soggy out...does anyone have any plans for building a spring compressor?

[SteveP-52]

Depending on when and where you bought the rifle, most places offer a 30 day return policy, I know Pyramyd Air does.
You might also find someone local to you on the forum who does rifle tuning and could help you out, check the GTA Vendors gate.
There's also the forum Library that may have a some answers, tips and tricks.
I also know Hatsan doesn't offer How To guides as they consider it a liability issue after trading e-mails with the guys at Air Gun Pro Shop although they do Hatsan repairs and tuning.
Hope this helps a little.

[renegadelizard]

Can anyone tell me an item number on ARH for the piston seal for the 22 cal 95?  I tried posting a link to what i though was the right one but i cant post links for some reason.

[mcoulter]

Just a clarifying question...  what exactly do you mean by dieseling?  Can you describe what's happening?  Are you getting the crack of a .22 LR being shot (which I would call detonation) or are you just getting some smoke coming out of the barrel after a shot?

I've owned a Hatsan 135 for about a year and it detonated a few times (first 3-4 shots) in the beginning but then settled into to jsut smoking for the next 150 - 200 shots.  I shot over a chrony pretty regularly while it was smokin' and never really noticed it affect the rifle's velocity at all.   

[lefteyeshot]

+1 What Matt said. Shoot it and enjoy, if it breaks send it back.

[renegadelizard]

It wasn't detonating..just smoke coming out of the barrel, I shot it about 75 more times tonight and it stopped doing it on every shot...I was mightily perturbed at the groups though..were talking 6 inch groups with open sights and a brand new hawk scope....cpum's (14.3 gr) are not well liked by this gun. I switched to h&n's 14.3 and they shoot much better, but if anyone has any suggestions on a better pellet I'm all ears.

This whole air gun thing is maddening. Lol. I've been building center fire rifles for over 20 years now, and I've built some real shooters, and it seems that all of the knowledge and skills I've accumulated are worth exactly .03 cents when it comes to air guns. Nothing like trying to teach and old dog new tricks!!

Thanks again to everyone for helping me, I'm sure I'll need it again soon.

Don Newton
Havoc Custom Gun Leather

[mcoulter]

I was mightily perturbed at the groups though..were talking 6 inch groups with open sights and a brand new hawk scope....cpum's (14.3 gr) are not well liked by this gun. I switched to h&n's 14.3 and they shoot much better, but if anyone has any suggestions on a better pellet I'm all ears.

I would give it a few hundred pellets - even a full tin - before judging the rifle too harshly.  I found JSB 18grain pellets best in my 135.  Anything lighter than 15-16 grain really tend to scatter.  There's lots of good information on this site about springer shooting technique.   I won't claim to give you all the facts here.  BUT one thing I recently started noticing is if you're shooting from some sort of rest be aware of where the rest (or your hand) touches the stock.  Be deliberate about what you do and...

ONLY CHANGE ONE THING AT A TIME!

And I would suggest shooting at least 20 or 30 pellets doing that one new thing.  I tend to change too many things and not give the change enough time or shots to settle in.  In fact I have gone from shooting 5-shot groups to 10-shot groups for this exact reason. 

Good luck! Take lots of pictures and notes  then share them here with us!

[SteveP-52]

My 95 Vortex .25 even after almost a 1000 shots still smokes now and then out the barrel.
For pellets, you already have the H&N's but you might give JSB a shot. Don't know what it is about Hatsan's but I see a lot of the shooters that have them say JSB works well regardless of caliber.
For everything else working on the accuracy, read mcoulter's post again, plus at least with my 3 Hatsan's, they don't like a firm hold, the artillery hold seems to work the best, just do like he recommended and get yourself in the habit of doing it the same way every shot.

[renegadelizard]

I am now officially at wits end here. I have tried every variation of the artillery hold i can find, and the only way to get this gun to group under 2 inches at 25 yards is to not touch the gun at all, and squeeze the trigger with my index finger while my thumb rests against the back of the trigger guard...if my face touches the stock, or any other part of me touches the gun, groups go all to heck...im talking 6 inch groups here...ive got heavier pellets coming in on monday, and if they don't produce better groups, the gun is gone...how in the world is a person supposed to hunt with a gun that is so hold sensitive??? or is the 95 not meant to be a hunting gun?...sorry for venting here, i hate it when i try something and it goes to heck...but my GAMO...the bane of the internet that makes grown men shutter and attack their keyboards with wroth and unbridled fury, shoots better than my Hatsan...

[MicErs]

Welcome to the forum!

Spring guns can be pretty picky.  They tend to loosen screws, break scopes, and prefer a particular pellet or two and dislike others.  Make sure that the screws are not backing out.  Keep them snugged down.  Lots of people put blue loctite on the screws.  Keep an eye on all the other rings and screws.

Get a pellet sampler.  Take the gun out to the bench at about 25 yards.  Shoot off a very soft bag or place your hand between the rest and the bag.  Magnum springers that will shoot into a dime are about as good as it gets without custom tuning.  First chore is to find the pellet the gun likes.  It seems like my spring guns all like middle weight pellets.   That will give you an idea of what you've got.

They are very frustrating.  The lower powered spring guns are more easy to shoot well because they don't jump around as badly as the magnums.  So you will see some folks shooting one hole groups at 50 yards with things like AA TX200 sub 12 fpe guns.  Don't expect to do that with a magnum springer.

Good luck.  Keep up posted how it goes.

[mcoulter]

Thoughts:

1) Check the crown as shown here > http://bulletin.accurateshooter.com/2015/05/check-your-crowns-condition-with-a-q-tip/

2) As mentioned check all screws, fasteners, scope mounts, etc.

3) Beg borrow or (if you have) to buy a chrony

4) Give the barrel a *light* cleaning between pellet brands

5) Be patient and keep shooting.  Give it a full tin (500) pellets before giving up!

[renegadelizard]

I packaged it up tonight, waiting on a return label now. I've decided that since i got into this as a way of relaxing and having a backyard hunter, that I probably just need to open up the wallet and get a pcp. Anybody got a disco or marauder for sale?  Lol.

[MicErs]

I packaged it up tonight, waiting on a return label now. I've decided that since i got into this as a way of relaxing and having a backyard hunter, that I probably just need to open up the wallet and get a pcp. Anybody got a disco or marauder for sale?  Lol.

Luke!  We've lost another one to the dark side!

=)

[SteveP-52]

Might very well just be a bad rifle, it's definitely not unheard of and I've read enough reviews to see 1 bad one and 12 or 15 good ones, but I wouldn't give up on springers or gas pistons because of that one rifle.
Any number of the forum members can probably recommend a good backyard friendly .22 in spring or gas piston. Me personally, I have a Umarex Fuel .22, it's the black one in my avatar pic. Not hold sensitive, a fairly firm grip with mine actually seems to work better, plenty of power for squirrels, rabbits and such and a great target rifle and has a Reaxis gas piston.
Broken in and sighted at 30 yards, this was a 20 shot group with H&N Field Target Trophy pellets and again, I'm sure most of the shooters on here can tell you about any number of great .22 rifles.
Might be a good New Topic idea..."Recommendations for a good .22 break barrel?"

[lefteyeshot]

Croquet is back yard friendly.