Under the hood Titan GP

[Toolmaker]

 Maybe the barrel makes the difference in velocity. Perhaps the pellets fit tighter / seal better in the Benji barrel giving more FPS???

[Perry]

Maybe that's the answer toolmaker; I don't know. I ended up returning the gun to Wallmart and now I'm waiting for my Trail NP to arrive.

I'll report on it after it gets here.

[454 Big Block Chevy]

i would like to know the answer of this as well.... i'm goign to try to put in my order with PA tomorrow, for a trail XL

[BrianW]

Hi,

I went to the Crosman website and downloaded the parts manuals for the Trail XL and the ELS22

The ELS:
http://www.crosman.com/pdf/manuals/ELS77-ELS22%20NITRO%20EVP.pdf

The Trail XL:
http://www.crosman.com/pdf/manuals/Trail%20XL%20EVP.pdf

Crosman probably used their "detuned" piston (see ELS22 diagram, item 12, having part number 8RNP-13) to reduce the rearward travel of the cocked piston.

Then assuming Crosman designed the standard Trail and low velocity Titan GP rifle to have the starting load on the nitro compression spring, Crosman would have to place a spacer behind the nitro compression spring, which the GP has.

Perry, did the nitro piston compression springs from the GP and XL have the same model numbers?  What were they?

Or did you measure the lengths of the piston body and rod section and compare the lengths?

When you swapped XL nitro compression spring into the GP, did you kept the spacer in the GP rifle as well?  I suspect you did in order for the velocity to be unaffected by the swap.

I suspect Crosman simply just used the detuned piston to reduce the GP power and velocity.  What would be very telling would be to swap the front piston section (see ELS22 diagram item 12).

Based on my suspicion, I believe that if you swapped the detuned GP piston with the XL piston, and then possibly removing the spacer if needed to cock, I suspect the GP would have the XL's power.

Perry, if you no longer have the GP and you still have the XL, perhaps you and I could measure our pistons to see if there is a difference in the distance from the front seal to the trigger catch point.

BrianW :-)
P.S. I have the Walmart Benjamin Titan GP 22

[gene_sc]

There is no way a XL ram will fit in a Crosman Titan nor a Benji NP. ..Not unless you have a special shoe horn I am not aware of...

Crosman has changed vendors at least twice for the gas rams since they first introduced the NP and XL series nitro guns.

[BrianW]

Regardless of the vendor that supplies a given part, the manufacturer has an engineering drawing that a part must conform with. 

From a manufacturer's point of view, it is essential the parts conform to their specs in order to maintain the assembly of current production lines and to supply repair parts.

That being said, if you have precise measurements of the ram and body that shows the 2 parts cannot fit together, I would then understand your comment.   I would greatly apreciate any dimensions that anyone has.

Still, I feel it is very likely the GP and NP have a minor interchanged parts that makes the difference in velocity.

The main parts are interchangable (see the part numbers in the Part Manuals) with model identifying prefixes.  If the barrel, trigger, and air-piston are interchangable then the piston rams should interchange as well.

[momosgarage]

Then assuming Crosman designed the standard Trail and low velocity Titan GP rifle to have the starting load on the nitro compression spring, Crosman would have to place a spacer behind the nitro compression spring, which the GP has.

Does this mean the Titan GP "low-velocity" and the regular benjamin trail are the same rifle except for the shrouded barrel and lack of a spacer on the piston?  What's the benefit from Crosmans perspcetive to sell a Benjamin Titan GP, Crosman Titan GP, Crosman Titan GP "low-velocity" and a Benjamin Trail?  Seems like it all would just increase prices for consumers, if they are all the same rifle with one difference.

[BrianW]

It somewhat makes sense that crossman would sell the low velocity GP version through Walmart where the prices are lower.  That way it supports vendors selling the normal crossman line from unfair competition since most other vendors don't have Walmart's bully power to demand the lowest price unit. 

[dkwflight]

Ho

Those with multiple gas ram or gas springs should check the pressure to compress the gas springs.
My experience is that some have leaked and some come from Crosman with different pressures.

The pressure to compress is easily checked.
I did mine with a car jack. I raised my car and let it down on a gas spring on top of a bathroom scale.
I have 6  crosman gas springs for the Titans. The best pressure I got was 139 pounds.
If yours does not give this kind of force then you should replace the gas spring.
Call Crosman and get a new spring.

I would like to hear from those that check their gas springs.,

[FriedTater]

Gonna dust this tread off as it appears no real conclusion was reached
determining whether the gas rams will "actually" interchange between the Titan and Trail XL platforms