Well dang .... major Diana 56 failure

[palonej]

Sent all pertinent info, including pics, links and responses directly to Diana over 10 days ago Red. Clearly stating I wanted nothing from them. Only to inform them of a rather dangerous issue that seems to come up quite a bit lately. I sent 3 links from the GTA directly related to this exact issue......and have heard nothing in return.
A little interest shown might've been nice.

If you didn't ask anything from them then I can see how they wouldn't see a need to reply. Sure, that would be the courteous thing to do but in the world of business, time is money and thank you for alerting us to this issue...

More importantly, when do you get this beast back in your hands? I've got an HMO piston that I need to install in my 54, maybe seeing your results will persuade me to get it done!

Clark

Hey Clark. When I stated I wanted nothing from them I was speaking of a free repair or parts. I asked for a response to my concerns and was blown off by Umarex and ignored by Diana.

Rifle will be back Friday!! Can't wait and will let you know how she behaves.

[Sfttailrdr46]

Sent all pertinent info, including pics, links and responses directly to Diana over 10 days ago Red. Clearly stating I wanted nothing from them. Only to inform them of a rather dangerous issue that seems to come up quite a bit lately. I sent 3 links from the GTA directly related to this exact issue......and have heard nothing in return.
A little interest shown might've been nice.

If you didn't ask anything from them then I can see how they wouldn't see a need to reply. Sure, that would be the courteous thing to do but in the world of business, time is money and thank you for alerting us to this issue...

More importantly, when do you get this beast back in your hands? I've got an HMO piston that I need to install in my 54, maybe seeing your results will persuade me to get it done!

Clark

Hey Clark. When I stated I wanted nothing from them I was speaking of a free repair or parts. I asked for a response to my concerns and was blown off by Umarex and ignored by Diana.

Rifle will be back Friday!! Can't wait and will let you know how she behaves.

As a proud owner of 2 Diana's I can safely state the lack of response from both the distributor and manufacturer is a total disappointment Quality control and quality assurance are both sadly lacking in this instance. To be clear when equipment malfunction creates a safety issue all concerned parties should respond in a positive manner especially in today's litigious world.  The piston rod breaking on a magnum springer resulting in an unexpected and unwanted manner is a definite liability for all parties involved not to mention the strong possibility of personal injury to yourself or others

[palonej]

Couldn't agree more Don.
On the other hand, I e mailed Weihrauch after seeing how well built the 98 is. I sent a couple of group pics....to show off a little!!!! Didn't ask for anything from them either. Couple of days later I got this response and they're sending me a hat.
Little bit of a difference no??? I thought this was pretty cool and good biz practice.
Dear Mr. Palone,

we refer to your e-mail of 25.07.2013 an have read with interest that you own one of our mod. HW 98.

Thank you very much for your compliments. We always try to offer our customers the best possible quality and craftmanship "made in Germany".

We wish you good shooting success.

Best regards,

Hans-H. Weihrauch
Weihrauch & Weihrauch Sport GmbH & Co.KG
Industriestr. 13, 97638 Mellrichstadt
Handelsregister: HRA 8080 AG Schweinfurt
Komplementär: Weihrauch&  Weihrauch Sport Verwaltungs GmbH
(HRB 3366 AG Schweinfurt)
Geschäftsführer: Hans-Hermann Weihrauch, Stefan Weihrauch

_____________________________________________________________________________
_


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[White Eagle]

Joe, that is too cool!   And, THAT is what I look for in a company that's potentially going to get my hard earned bucks.   Is HW perfect?  Nothing manufactured is, so that's why responsiveness and good service matter.  I like my Diana, but my next rifle is VERY likely to be an HW.

[chuckinohio]

  I hear ya man.
  I'm wanting a Mod. 48 in .177 pretty bad, but am really thinking about the HW98 instead.
  If I buy a brand new .177 it will probably be a HW98 or Walther LGV. Joes experience has sort of soured me on new Diana purchases.

  I'll wait for one to come up on the secondary market, or a refurb at a decent discount might trip my buy impulse.

[palonej]

Joe, that is too cool!   And, THAT is what I look for in a company that's potentially going to get my hard earned bucks.   Is HW perfect?  Nothing manufactured is, so that's why responsiveness and good service matter.  I like my Diana, but my next rifle is VERY likely to be an HW.

How true Steve!! I will usually send an e mail after I make an order to the company to give them some feed back. I had a question for Vortek this Saturday. I also sent some good feed back. Got this in a couple of hours! Might not seem like a big deal, but means a lot to me and I look forward to doing more business with companies like this. PA is also great in this regard.



Hi Joe,
Thank you for the excellent feed back regarding your Sucessful Tune!
This is good news, and can be shared around the World with others with the same interest. You can find the avenue to do so on the review page of each PG2 tune kit on our site. Heres the one for Diana48/52/46/56, etc:
http://vortekproducts.com/ourstore/Airgun-Tuning-Kits-spring%20tar-spring-piston%20airgun-airgun%20lube?product_id=139

~HW97 FT full powr PG2  tune kit:
http://vortekproducts.com/ourstore/Airgun-Tuning-Kits-spring%20tar-spring-piston%20airgun-airgun%20lube/HW97PG2-15
Cheers, shoot safe!
Vortek Products
Confidentiality Note: This electronic message contains information, which may be confidential, legally privileged or otherwise protected from disclosure.  This information is intended for the use of the addressee only.  If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any disclosure, copying, distribution, printing or any other use of, or any action in reliance on, the contents of this electronic message is strictly prohibited.  If you have received this message in error, please notify the sender by reply and destroy the original message. VORTEK

[palonej]

Update!!!!
Seems Diana sent my e mail to Umarex. I got a response yesterday! I sent an e mail back and will keep you guys updated. The person who reached out to me sounds like a concerned and helpful person. Nothing like my last phone call with them!!
Hoping for the best!

[QVTom]

Joe, this whole thing is very strange.  I would have expected Umarex to contact Diana and say "we have a problem" not the other way around.  Now that word from above has been received at Umarex maybe they will show more interest, I'm not sure what they can do at this point though.  If I was Diana I'd want that broken piston for analysis.

Tom

[palonej]

That, in a nut shell, is ALL I was asking from them Tom. I did not have a problem accruing all shipping, parts and labor costs. Just wanted to see a little concern and proper action on someone's part. As far as I can tell Diana just forwarded the e mail to Umarex with no instruction on what's to be done. Most of all....this is a safety issue.
We'll see and I will keep all updated.

[Motorhead]

Update!!!!
Seems Diana sent my e mail to Umarex. I got a response yesterday! I sent an e mail back and will keep you guys updated. The person who reached out to me sounds like a concerned and helpful person. Nothing like my last phone call with them!!
Hoping for the best!

Joe,
The BROKEN piston is in the side pouch of rifle case ... If they want it back ? ya got it 

PS. Going to be curious on what you think of the Re-tune with the o-ring piston on board  ... tho won't get a chance to read or hear a thing being down at the Western States FT match in Morro Bay.  Be back around a puter @ Monday night / Tuesday.

Hope it's all well and Diana / Umarex give some sort of satisfaction 

Regards,
Scott

[palonej]

Thanks so much for everything Scott!!
And good luck bro!!! Let us know how it goes and lots of pics!!!

[chuckinohio]

 
  Message to Umarex from Germany in the tone of 'Meine gott you schweinehunde, was ist los'?

  At least Umarex acts concerned after getting a rock dropped on them. Hopefully there is some recognition now, that there may be potential for trouble in the design.

  By doing what you did, and being persistent about it, you have done all Diana owners and prospective purchasers, a service Joe. Thanks man.

  This development may serve to moderate the hard feelings towards Diana and Umarex that have developed out of your, up to this point, fruitless dealings with them.
I know that I myself, will base my attitude towards future purchases of NEW Diana products on how this scenario ultimately plays out.

  Once again, two thumbs up to you Joe, for sticking it out and finally getting some response/action out of them.

  Hey, and you too Scott. Don't think that your prompt participation, mechanical wizardry, and technological contribution to this thread have gone unnoticed.
 

[palonej]

Very well put Charles!!! It seems that I found someone from Umarex that finally listened!! What a great dude to deal with!! Please check out our correspondence.
The rifle is being delivered today.....face stuck to window once again!!!
Really glad that this worked out.
First e mail to Diana is the bottom.

No prob Joe and you have a great weekend !
 
 
From: Joe Palone [mailto:palonej513@gmail.com]
Sent: Wednesday, August 14, 2013 5:23 PM
To: Glenn Seiter
Subject: Re: Brand new 56 failure
 
Will do Glenn and thank you for the help!!

Sent from my iPhone

On Aug 14, 2013, at 6:15 PM, Glenn Seiter <glenn@umarexusa.com> wrote:

Hi Joe,
 
Please fill out the attached form and send along with the piston. On the form just briefly state that we talked about the broken piston and that I agreed to replace the piston and that I’d send a shirt along for you…I don’t think we have any hats but I’ll search. It’s great to hear  that you are very pleased with the rifle! The RWS/Diana guns are very accurate and fun to shoot.
 
Thanks,
Glenn
 
 
From: Joe Palone [mailto:palonej513@gmail.com]
Sent: Wednesday, August 14, 2013 4:05 PM
To: Glenn Seiter
Subject: Re: Brand new 56 failure
 
This is all I've been asking for Glenn!!!! Tell you what, since you are obviously feeling generous!!! I'll send the piston back, my cost, take a new piston AND.....how about a hat and T shirt for my psychological well being? Lol
The rifle will be here Friday so I'll get the piston out to you soon as it shows. Need mailing address.
Thanks Glenn.
One other thing.....this rifle is absolutely awesome!!! Only air rifle I ever shot that will print groups at 100 yards with JSB Heavies!! What a tack driver she is!!!
Thanks
Joe

Sent from my iPhone

On Aug 14, 2013, at 4:04 PM, Glenn Seiter <glenn@umarexusa.com> wrote:

Hey Joe,
 
I see…yes a piston w/broken stem will definitely wreak havoc. If you’ll send the piston then we could either replace it with another piston or if you’d prefer the Shooters Kit then I could send that. I want to make certain that you are happy with our product.
 
Thanks,
Glenn
 
 
From: Joe Palone [mailto:palonej513@gmail.com]
Sent: Wednesday, August 14, 2013 2:45 PM
To: Glenn Seiter
Subject: Re: Brand new 56 failure
 
Hey Glenn!
Thanks for getting back to me so quickly!
I too thought maybe a pellet or debris was jammed somewhere and not allowing lock up, but no.
Please click on this link as their are pics of the problem bro. Much easier to understand if the thread is at least skimmed thru.
The rifle is on the way back and the tuner sent me the broken piston. If you'd like, I'll send it to you.
Please check this out.
 
http://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=50444.0

Sent from my iPhone

On Aug 14, 2013, at 3:14 PM, Glenn Seiter <glenn@umarexusa.com> wrote:

Hi Joe,
 
First of all I do apologize that you were not able to have a conversation with one of my staff in a manner that came across in a professional manner. We have very few piston failures and given the fact that I’m the guy ordering parts from Germany it would be obvious to me if it was a frequently used part. Of course there are thousands of Diana rifles out there and many with some age on them so there are going to be a certain % experience this problem. I asked a couple of my gunsmiths how frequently they have to replace a piston and each of them could only remember one each over the past 5 or 6 months. In regards to the situation where you had to depress the bear trap safety and ride the cocking lever back down…I’m wondering if the gun was ever fully cocked? I’ve seen numerous times when a person thought their gun was cocked but it really needed another good tug in order for the gun to sear up. I’ve decocked my Model 52 many times just as you had done with your Model 56 by riding down the cocking lever. I have also seen situations where there was a piece of debris in the trigger group which resulted in the gun not wanting to sear up. I’ve taken these guns and given them a couple good pulls on the cocking handle at its most rearward point and was able to get them to sear up and then not experience the problem again. I can send you an RWS Cleaning Kit which retails for around $50 if that would help resolve the issue. Just let me know your thoughts and we’ll figure something out.
 
Take care,
Glenn
 
 
 
 
From: Joe Palone [mailto:palonej513@gmail.com]
Sent: Wednesday, August 14, 2013 10:49 AM
To: Glenn Seiter
Subject: Re: Brand new 56 failure
 
Hey Glenn,
 
I appreciate you getting back to me bro.
Hopefully you checked out the link in the previous e mail. This will explain the problem, and what was done to resolve it, much better than I am able to.
I e mailed Umarex and got a response a couple of days later from one of your guys asking me to call him. At this time the rifle had already been shipped to a pro tuner, same guy that installed the Vortek kit.
I called and was literally blown off. Wouldn't even listen to what I had to say. ALL I was asking was if this is a recurring problem and is there a fix from the factory or Umarex?? He kept telling me to ship the rifle to you. NOT why I was calling. Tried explaining this, but he blew me off and e mailed me a return form.
 This is the not the first piston failure in the past couple of months.......on the GTA forum, that I know of.
The only reason I reached out to Diana and you is this is a safety issue. We, my kids and I, were plinking in the yard and I cocked the 56. Went to close cocking lever and there was tremendous pressure on the way back to the closed position. I held cocking lever firmly and released bear trap and fought it closed. My issue is what would have happened if it happened with an inexperienced shooter?? If bear trap button was forced to released there could have been serious injury.
The gun only shoots 10.3 gr ammo and is very well maintained. This seems like a very serious failure on a 5 month old gun.
I have paid all shipping and repair costs, just under $350, and am not looking for anything for nothing. Just some info Glenn. I'm 54 and an avid air gunner. I was treated like a 12 year old with a BB gun. Not cool.
Sorry for rambling but got really aggravated at the way I was treated on the phone.
Please open the link and just skim through it and tell me what you think and if you can do anything.
Again, thanks for the response bro.
Joe

Sent from my iPhone

On Aug 13, 2013, at 8:25 AM, Glenn Seiter <glenn@umarexusa.com> wrote:

Hey Joe,
 
This morning I just received your email which was forwarded from Diana in Germany. If you could please provide an update on where you are with getting the 56 TH back to a properly functioning manner it would be appreciated. I would be more than happy to have whatever repairs are necessary be taken care of for you here in our facility.  I look forward to your reply and will try to make things right with you.
 
Thanks,
Glenn
 
Umarex USA
 
 
Von: Joe Palone [mailto:palonej513@gmail.com]
Gesendet: Montag, 29. Juli 2013 22:11
An: VL_k92-Info
Betreff: Brand new 56 failure
 
Hello,
My name is Joe Palone and I purchased a new 56 TH from Air Guns of Arizona in Feb of this year. What as absolute dream this gun was. Extremely accurate, powerful and fun!!
I only shot JSB 10.3 domes out of her. Had a Vortek PG2 kit installed because she started losing power. Factory spring fatigued. After kit install she was even better.....for 2 weeks. Please see the link for the problem.
This is the second 56 I know of with this problem.
I was able to locate a piston and am paying a pro tuner to install it.
Is this normal??? AOA said there was nothing they could do for me and it was probably my fault. How???
Is there anything you guys can do??
http://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=50444.0
Thank you for anything you can do in advance.
Joe

[QVTom]

Good news Joe.  It seems when Diana speaks, Umarex listens.  The way it should be.  Next time, hopefully there is not, be sure to let them know that those other Germans give away hats just for saying hello
\
Tom

[palonej]

Oh my God!! Takes a lot for me to lose my patience. This did it. Got the rifle back today and the stock is destroyed. Ugh. UPS was supposed to get a signature before leaving the package. We were home and no one rang the bell.....they just left it at the front door.
Opened it up and saw this. Ugh
Naturally Umarex does not have a stock.

[Mpac]

That looks nasty Joe ,UPS is getting worse I'm using FED-X from now on. Sorry to see that .

[palonej]

I was so pumped to get it back Daniel. Ugh

[chuckinohio]

  Holy cow man..................

  Joe, you haven't walked under any ladders recently, or seen an abundance of black cats running across your path have you?

  I got 2 54s my friend, you want, I will peel the stock off of one and send it to you to get yours up, running, and broken in, until you can score a replacement. They're standard 54s, not the TH models, but still.

  That's just gut wrenching, simply infuriating after all the rigamarole.

[palonej]

I'll tell ya Charles....so far this summer I have slipped off the top of a walk in freezer and gave myself 10 stitches, and opened up my temporal artery, right next to my eye. That was fun. I've gotten stung by 3 very angry yellow jackets on my right wrist.....then Found out I'm allergic. Ugh. My arm looked like an over inflated water balloon!!! More fun! This is actually pretty minor, but still quite annoying!
Thanks so much for your offer bro! I'll let you know what happens when Glenn from Umarex finds out the particulars for a replacement. Real good guy over there man. Got right back to me today. Impressed.

[chuckinohio]

  Cool, cool.

  Sounds like someone at Umarex woke up to, or was firmly directed to recognize the fact that without customers, they got no cash flow.
  Glenn sounds like the new 'GO TO GUY' on Diana product service eh?
Hopefully they can drum up a stock for you in short order.

  I got a new version with the full wraparound checkered panel in front of the trigger guard, and the earlier version from a TO1 rifle that is smooth bottomed from guard to tip. Send up a smoke signal, and I will get a relief package headin your way.