Some basic scuba/paintball tank questions for the disco from a PCP Noob

[bobster]

I've been researching what a disco can run on and it's pretty confusing so far. I understand the pump of course but I know zero about scuba or paintball tanks.

A few questions I have:

1) Assuming I had a 80 scuba tank, what fittings, regulators/guages, or hoses do I need to be able to fill the disco (I'm looking for the very basic setup, not fancy)?  How much does that cost?  Any good places you know of to get it?

2) Can I just use paintball tanks in C02? 

(same Q as above: what fittings, regulators/guages, or hoses do I need to be able to fill the disco?  How much does that cost? Any good places you know of to get it?)

3) Can I have a paintball tank filled with HPA instead of CO2? (I know zero about paintball tanks so don't be offended please if this is a stupid question)

(same Q as above: what fittings, regulators/guages, or hoses do I need to be able to fill the disco?  How much does that cost? Any good places you know of to get it?)

Thanks a lot for any help!

[minkling]

The first thing that you need is a fill adapter k-type.  You can find them all over the place.  Just make sure to get one with a hose and a gauge.  Like this one: http://www.airtanksforsale.com/IMG_7702.JPG

Joe's are expensive but nice.  You can buy an adapter on eBay (search for paintball fill adapter.) and then buy a hose (search eBay for in-flight refueling).  You will lose some air with a longer hose but it makes it much easier.  As far as CO2 Crosman makes an adapter that uses Paintball tanks.

No you cannot fill a CO2 paintball tank with HPA.  They are not rated for the pressure.  You can get an HPA paintball tank but most of those have a 850psi output.  There are some dealers that sell them with a 2000psi output especially for the disco but you don't get very many fills.

[bobster]

Cool! Great info! So if I had the scuba tank and one of these http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-Paintball-37-In-Flight-Refueling-Remote-Fill-Hose-/180747994955#ht_3534wt_967

and one of these http://www.ebay.com/itm/Scuba-Fill-Station-Paintball-HPA-tank-fill-Adapter-Blk-/170482073263?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_2&hash=item27b185feaf#ht_2495wt_1077

then I could fill it?

[lloyd-ss]

Bobster,
Yes, those two items will do it.  I am assuming that the remote whip has a female foster quick disconnect on one end (definitely looks like it) and a male foster quick disconnect on the other (not positive, but looks like it).  You might instead be able to find a k-valve adapter that already has the whip on it, but those prices are very good especially if they will combine the shipping charges.

For a tank, go to a scuba shop and see if they will rent you one for cheap until you figure out what you really want.  I did that with my first tank, and after a couple of refills I ended up buying it for cheap from the shop because it was dinged up and didn't match anything else they had. They were happy to get rid of it, and it still had 3 years on the hydro test.

You will love the Disco!
Lloyd

[rsterne]

I agree wth most of the above information.... but if the CO2 tank you have is stamped with an 1800 psi rating (which it should be) you can safely fill it with HPA to that pressure.... DO NOT EXCEED 1800 psi in a CO2 TANK.... That makes it pretty much useless for filling a Disco, BTW....

Bob

[DFWdude]

The choice of what kind of compressed air storage to buy depends in large part on what kind of PCP gun you want to buy, and you should consider both at the same time. Most all the foreign PCP rifles take fills to 2800-3300psi, in which case you will want to find an SCBA (fireman's) tank. For guns that operate on 2000psi-2500psi fill pressures, like the Disco, then SCBA is great, but you may also get away with a conventional 3000psi SCUBA diving tank. SOME Scuba shops will resell a used SCUBA tank to you that they have taken in trade, some will not sell used equipment. However, if you think you may eventually buy a rifle that requires higher fill pressures, then avoid the SCUBA tank entirely, and go straight to the SCBA tank.   

I initially bought a used 3000psi SCUBA tank for my Marauder from a local dive shop...  Within months I was buying a 4500psi SCBA tank, instead.  Fortunately I was able to resell the SCUBA tank. 

The rule of thumb is the higher the pressure vessel you acquire, the more rifle fills you can achieve, requiring fewer trips to the refill source. 4500psi Carbon Fiber tanks will fill any rifle you buy now (or additional rifles in the future that may require the higher pressures), while a SCUBA dive tank will have fill limitations.

Notice I haven't addressed your paintball question?  That's because you should avoid all these.  It's not that you can't use them for your Disco... you can.  However, they use fill adapters that will NOT fit SCUBA or SCBA equipment, and once you've concluded that the paintball tank option doesn't give enough fills (and you will), you will then realize that you've also wasted money on paintball adapters that can't be transferred to more appropriate tanks (SCUBA or SCBA).  IMO, paintball is for paintball, period.

Before you buy anything, determine where you will get it filled...

1) Dive Shop... 1) SOME dive shops will not fill anything other than SCUBA tanks, period. SOME cater only to divers, and will not fill any tank unless you produce a valid diver's certificate. SOME will fill your tank for airgunning if you sign a liability statement. Among those that will accomodate airgunners, you'll find 2) SOME will fill to 4500psi, and some will fill only to 3000psi. If they can fill to 4500psi, 3) SOME will have the necessary adapter needed for an SCBA tank (some will not... their primary business is SCUBA diving tanks, not SCBA fireman's tanks, and the fill fixtures are different for each type, by design, and by law). You will need to spend some time calling around to answer these questions.

2) The primary users of CF tanks are Fire Depts... Large FD's may have several stations and a single firefighter designated as the SCBA tank expert. Call your local FD and ask who that might be. Calling them will determine two things... 1) IF they fill and work on their own SCBA tanks, or outsource it (ask for referrals to that outsourcer, who may also have contacts for the actual tanks, adapters, etc.) and 2) Ask if they will agree to fill your tank either free or at nominal charge. SOME -- if not many -- FD's will NOT fill tanks for non-FD use because of liability issues. Others can be very friendly to your needs.

3) I live in Dallas, where there are two specialized compressed air dealers who sell compressed air compressors and fill fittings to 30+ individual Fire Departments. If you are fortunate to live in a large city like this, then you can also spend some time looking up High Pressure air dealers. Asking a local FD guy "where do you get your compressed air supplies?" may lead you to this kind of source. Otherwise, Google or yellow pages is your friend.

You can call around and get answers to all these questions. Takes a bit of boring time to research both, I know, and it sounds like a lot to do. But I wouldn't be discouraged. Taking it in easy steps as you are, will ensure that you don't make unproductive and expensive mis-steps.

[DFWdude]

For SCUBA tanks...I believe your Disco has a Foster-type Male fitting on it, then here is a shopping list and relative prices, along with a picture of what they look like...







Notes:
The fill fitting is a 6 bearing Hanson female fill fitting (Foster type). Foster is a generic name description, and there are a few manufacturers that make fittings to Foster specs.   

The glycerin-filled gauge (5000psi) can be picked up at Harbor Freight Tools or their online site (used to be, at least). Slightly better gauges can be had for 2-3 times the price.

Some people think they need 4-5 feet of microbore hose, but I have found 1 foot to be more than adequate.

[bobster]

Awesome info.!  Thanks to all.

[RatRacer]

Bob D-
Where did you get the Microbore hose assy. price list? I need a new whip for my FX pump, and I want a 2-3' MB whip and maybe one for my Hill.

[DFWdude]

Bob D-
Where did you get the Microbore hose assy. price list? I need a new whip for my FX pump, and I want a 2-3' MB whip and maybe one for my Hill.

I got the $10 price in part because I only needed (wanted) 1-foot, and the HPA dealer here in Dallas had left-over (short) lengths that otherwise would go unused, or thrown away.  So, I got a better deal on a short length.

I like the 1-foot hose, because the way my tank/fill train is configured... the MB tube and fitting is no longer than my  44df Carbon fiber tank, so it is tucked away against the tank body for protection.  Anything longer than that exposes the end (and hose attached) to all manner of interference, kinking, etc. 

I also like the short hose, because it places the gun and fill tank closely together when connected, where I can monitor all gauges at a single glance.  Less chance of overfills that way.

Been using this configuration for 3 years now, and the MB hose is in almost pristine condition.

[badredbird]

i love the micro hose  saves alot of air waste with my 80 cf scuba i can fill a disco like 90 times as its only requires 2000, tho i have a shoe box compressor now , and i love it , i definitely recommend the micro hose, now a good source for regulators and fittings and yokes and all kinds of stuff is global manufacturing inc   great stuff   good luck

[JerryCup]

Hey, Bob,

What do you think of the Shoebox compressor? Is there one in your future?

J

[badredbird]

i have the shoe box also, works very nice , not too loud, if you get definitly get the 4500 psi and get the belt drive its quieter, you do need a small pancake compressor to feed it set at 85 to 90 psi and recommned you get a water separator, it works great tho, i hook it directly to gun , no heat that way and takes about 15 mins to fill guns depend on ccs,

[DFWdude]

Hey, Bob,

What do you think of the Shoebox compressor? Is there one in your future?

J

No compressor in my future, Jerry.  Here in Dallas, refill sources are a dime a dozen.  So I don't need the hassle or expense of a compressor...

I wonder if anyone has done the math on the electrical consumption of running a pancake/shoebox combo for the extended time (hours) required to fill a cf tank to 4500psi?  Gotta add that to the expense of the shoebox itself, a pancake compressor, consumables like gas, lubes, and moisture filters for both compressors, repair parts (yes it WILL need to be repaired eventually), and your time in babysitting the unit while it runs for a couple hours or more for each fill.  My time is valuable to me.

If I lived out in the boonies, I might reconsider.  No, wait, what am I thinking?  Owning a compressor is a lot like owning a speed boat.  Best NOT to own one, but instead know a friend who has one.  I enjoy taking some time every other month to take a cold six-pack and visit a buddy to fill tanks, chat, etc.  Running a compressor by myself in the garage sounds like a bore...