Airforce Texan SS .357 power level disappointment

[bduares]

All airgun manufacturers, not just Airforce but all of them, publish any furnished max fps data with the lightest available airgun pellets. If they publish foot pound data that is a different matter. This is a standard practice across the board. Some, if you are lucky and if they are so inclined, might provide data for specific weights of projectile. Few do.

Someone familiar with projectile shooting weapons in general, be it an airgun or a crossbow, would automatically know that a max fps provided would logically dictate that the lightest projectile available would reasonably attain that fps. Heavier projectiles would result in slower speeds. Common sense. 9mm/.357 projectiles for airguns vary from the 80ish grain on up, such as the 77grain JSB HADES match diabolo, or the AEA 79 grain center punch. Almost every pellet manufacturer makes an 81 grain 35 cal pellet. FX, Predator, JSB, AEA, etc. That is the industry standard light 35 cal beginning weight for airguns. You started shooting this gun with a projectile at close to double that weight, 150 grains. Common sense again dictates this should result in a fps far below 900. You should have been expecting about 683 feet per second at that weight difference. Yes, that Airforce is a less than 200 ft lb gun, straight from the factory. It is a 155 ft lb gun. Expecting more brand new is not logical.

[redlined_b16a]

Not sure where your info comes from but after they sent a replacement valve it was a 200-220 ft lbs gun just like the Carbine was.

No one in America wants a 150 grain flying at 680 fps for your 150ish ft lbs

Maybe I'll buy some common sense one day.

[bduares]

The "info" is simple math, which is a necessary skill to have when dealing with shooting anything. They advertised 930 fps max, which means with the standard lightest grain projectile, which is 81 grains in .357. They did not advertise 930 fps with a 150 grain projectile. They provided a maximum fps the gun could produce. This automatically logically means the lightest and fastest available, the same way a Gamo break action advertised at 1200 fps is automatically talking about non-lead pellets to reach that speed.

Using simple math, 81 grains at 930 fps = 155.6 foot pounds. Correspondingly, if you take that 155.6 foot pounds and change the weight of the projectile to 150 grains you get 683 fps, which is fairly close to what you got out of the box, when your highest fps was 736, meaning your gun actually exceeded their advertised specs from day one.

Looking at other forums, the same gun shooting 130 grain pellets got 800 fps for several other TexanSS owners, some of whom contacted Airforce and were told this was the correct speed they should be getting for that pellet. That is 184 foot pounds.

regarding 130gr in a TexanSS .357:
Hello. I called Air Force today. They said that low 800 is correct fps - which is really low..

[Struckat]

The "info" is simple math, which is a necessary skill to have when dealing with shooting anything. They advertised 930 fps max, which means with the standard lightest grain projectile, which is 81 grains in .357. They did not advertise 930 fps with a 150 grain projectile. They provided a maximum fps the gun could produce. This automatically logically means the lightest and fastest available, the same way a Gamo break action advertised at 1200 fps is automatically talking about non-lead pellets to reach that speed.

Using simple math, 81 grains at 930 fps = 155.6 foot pounds. Correspondingly, if you take that 155.6 foot pounds and change the weight of the projectile to 150 grains you get 683 fps, which is fairly close to what you got out of the box, when your highest fps was 736, meaning your gun actually exceeded their advertised specs from day one.

I agree that they advertise big numbers by using a light pellet. But they sent him a new valve and now it makes the expected power.

Why is that?

[bduares]

I agree that they advertise big numbers by using a light pellet. But they sent him a new valve and now it makes the expected power.

Why is that?

Expected power for who? Not for Airforce. It was already performing at the level they advertised.
The expectation of the OP, illogical as it is, was this, to quote him directly:

I just expected 150 grains to be in the 900's.....I'll research what can be done.

They sent him parts partially to satisfy his expectations of what he thought the gun should do, but perhaps mainly due to numerous people shooting .356-.357 sized ammo in these and breaking the gun. Airforce has been telling customers they should be sized to .358, and it seems when the ammo is slightly too small this has been breaking a lot of valves in customers' guns, with quite a few posts about it online. 

The person who made the claim of 170 grains flying at 790 fps was Max at Airforce with a projectile supposedly swaged to fit perfectly.


OP also posted this

I'm not willing to spend $600-$800 to gain more power on this platform by purchasing a 3650 tank,valve and spring.

They sent you a tank, valve and spring didn't they?

At this power level I don't feel its worth the price.
Airforce emailed me their specs on what it shoots with what weights.

Care to share?

[bduares]

I agree that they advertise big numbers by using a light pellet. But they sent him a new valve and now it makes the expected power.

Why is that?

Expected power for who? Not for Airforce. It was already performing at the level they advertised.
The expectation of the OP, illogical as it is, was this, to quote him directly:

I just expected 150 grains to be in the 900's.....I'll research what can be done.

They sent him parts partially to satisfy his expectations of what he thought the gun should do, but perhaps mainly due to numerous people shooting .356-.357 sized ammo in these and breaking the gun. Airforce has been telling customers they should be sized to .358, and it seems when the ammo is slightly too small this has been breaking a lot of valves in customers' guns, with quite a few posts about it online. 

The person who made the claim of 170 grains flying at 790 fps was Max at Airforce with a projectile supposedly swaged to fit perfectly. I have yet to see anyone duplicate his claim.


OP also posted this

I'm not willing to spend $600-$800 to gain more power on this platform by purchasing a 3650 tank,valve and spring.

They sent you a tank, valve and spring didn't they?

At this power level I don't feel its worth the price.
Airforce emailed me their specs on what it shoots with what weights.

Care to share?

[redlined_b16a]

I don't know what your goal is here......


You are right.(if that is what you need to hear)

They sent a factory tank for the Carbine,did not complain about that.
A member said if I want more power just upgrade to a 3650 tank and valve.......that is what I replied to stating I'm not spending more money to get more power.

They emailed me thier results with 127,160and 190 grain ammo. None of those results are advertised with the guns specs.

My point was if they know what the gun is capable of why don't they share that info?

Wasn't really complaining just sharing info since there wasn't much out there on this platform.

I like the gun,it's paid for......I'm stuck with it.
Its not what I expected but will get the job done.

1st SS valve shot 100 feet per second slower than what Airforce stated it shoots with the weights and diameter they stated.

Since new the safety and cocking lever issues were present. Airforce already knew what the issues was and sent instructions to move a spacer that they know was in the wrong place.

Airforce is repairing the gun as of yesterday

If the 200 ft lbs Maxx was advertised I would have not choose this gun,that was my point.
I would just bought another .457 texan instead.
This SS had alot of cycling and safety/sear issues from day 1.
The .357 Carbine was a 220ft lb with the same 150 grain ammo out the box....same platform.

2 weeks later the SS arrives shooting everything 100 feet per second slower......thats what started this thread.

My expectations were higher. Texans are known for being powerhouses. Somewhere i seen the .357 long advertised 400 ft lbs. I expected 250 plus out of it and I don't want to get those ft lbs by using g a 190 grain slug. I wanted a second .357 platform that could use my home casted ammo selection.

I was offered a refund and decided to keep it.

Move on.

[redlined_b16a]

Here are some email screenshots with the Airforce velocities

[bduares]

I don't know what your goal is here......

I don't have a goal. The way I was reading things was I thought you were complaining that you got a gun that was hitting advertised specs, had then taken it apart, blown the poppets, and wanted the manufacturer to make the gun perform above advertised speeds the way you wanted it to be. That did not sound right to me.

I have been a bit testy lately, and it's not your fault at all. I apologize

[redlined_b16a]

😆 all good man.
I dont read into people to much.

Gun was alot less than advertised
2nd valve was withing a few ft lbs

The hammerspring carrier tube is what had loose screws,I did not touch those.
Airforce is correcting all of the issues.

Had the gun since December....itsbeen a few problems after another but working through it with Airforce.

I personally had higher expectations.
Still a power house.....I just expected a little more.
Thats on me.

I don't know what your goal is here......

I don't have a goal. The way I was reading things was I thought you were complaining that you got a gun that was hitting advertised specs, had then taken it apart, blown the poppets, and wanted the manufacturer to make the gun perform above advertised speeds the way you wanted it to be. That did not sound right to me.

I have been a bit testy lately, and it's not your fault at all. I apologize

[redlined_b16a]

Recieved the gun back couple days ago.
Airforce replaced most components in the trigger group and relubed.
Had them spend extra time at the range with it.

I left it on the hammer setting they left it which was a lil more than 50% preload.

After shot 13th shot the  gun had cocking and saftey issues again.
Contacted Airforce and notified them.

Next I decided to try to increase the hammer preload and see what happens.

90% preload and I shot about 50 rounds from 3000 psi down to 1800 psi which is 12 shots.
No saftey or cocking issues.
Notified Airforce of this weird event.

However the gun is Lazer accurate with some casted 152 grain .358 hollow points from a MP molds.

I'm talking hitting oranges at 100 yards with ease. No missing or close shots.
Sitting on the ground with my back against a tree.

So at this point I'm excited and I don't care what the velocities are because accuracy is king.
The gun feels like it's a 220 ft plus though.
Destroyed a toilet at 80 yards without the use of TacoBell....It will bust cinder blocks at 80 yards.
Gun loves to be held firm.

Airforce took awhile to repair but customer service is top notch and that goes a long way with me.

[Back_Roads]

[triggertreat]

That's awesome.  Nothing like having a powerful, straight shooting air gun.  Glad you you were able to get the kinks worked out.  Enjoy!

[redlined_b16a]

I spoke too soon.

When I take it off of safety the gun fires.

Ill request an exchange for another gun.

[triggertreat]

I spoke too soon.

When I take it off of safety the gun fires.

Ill request an exchange for another gun.

That's typically just a minor trigger adjustment.  I couldn't imagine wanting to start all over again.

[redlined_b16a]

Its a lil more to it than that.
I have some vids that I sent them.
The safety won't dis engage without cycling the lever again and when it does that the lever is rough and hard to move.

At times when I get the saftey to release the sear releases the hammer and fires.

The gun just came back from Airforce and had every trigger group internal part changed and lubed.

Customer Service is top notch......it's just a time consuming game.
I have a gun I purchased in mid December that has seen a total of maybe 200 rounds.
I missed deer season all together 😔.

My feelings towards this rifle is.......this is the second time within 200 rounds and out of 3 months I have had a total of 2-3 successful days of operation.
I sight it in....shoot 20 rounds or so......try to hunt.....and something fails or isn't right.

The roughness of the cocking cycle feels like sand inside.

Id rather a new start.

[triggertreat]

I would definitely send it back.  That doesn't seem like a simple trigger adjustment, like I was thinking.  Totally unsafe.  I would be pushing for a refund as it would be hard to trust its safety going forward.

[redlined_b16a]

I have a .357 carbine purchased days before that's a flawless machine,a. 25 condor thats flawless and a .457 CF Long that is a flawless operating machine.

I like and want tgat SS in .357.

I personally expected a lil more power out of it.
First SS was only pushing 150 grain at low 700's fps
Second valve they sent pushed low 800's and I'm ok with that.

If we can get it to work.........i want this platform.

[redlined_b16a]

Much time has passed.
Been pretty busy.
Sent Airforce the gun,it would get stuvk on safety and when it would release the safety it would fire......scary.

Airforce changed all trigger group parts and the carrier tube.
Lubed and tested.
I only ran 15 shots through it but it's butter smooth.

[hvacguy]

Much time has passed.
Been pretty busy.
Sent Airforce the gun,it would get stuvk on safety and when it would release the safety it would fire......scary.

Airforce changed all trigger group parts and the carrier tube.
Lubed and tested.
I only ran 15 shots through it but it's butter smooth.

How's the gun working, is it fixed for good? Did they give you prepaid return labels?