Diana GISS gear lubrication

[Kragman1]

Hi all,

Can anyone recommend an ideal or nearly ideal grease for the gear teeth of a Giss rifle?
Obviously nothing petroleum based, but it would be nice to find a synthetic that has both high lubricity and high retention.

Thanks!

[Yogi]

Not sure if this is what you are looking for , but Krytox and/or Ultimox are usually the most recommended for non-petroleum "grease".
HTH?

-Yogi

[jkingrph]

Remember this, synthetic lubes, oils and greases are formed from petroleum products or natural gas, by first physically and or chemically breaking down the molecules then rebuilding them to compounds that are more stable and have morbeie of the lubrication properties desired.   Silicone lubes incorporate silicon into the compound, but I understand that most do not have as good of a lubricating property as those of the more pure carbon based organic compounds.  It has been 60 years since I really studied any organic chemistry and even then my focus was being steared more toward medicinal products.
Personally I would use Super Lube synthetic greas with teflon (PTFE), I use in on guns, semi auto slides, and as well as in the high speed spindle bearings on my big Scag riding mower. It seems to be tacky, stays in place and is rather clear and colorless.

[Motorhead]

What your lubricating is STEEL gears on STEEL racks with gears rotating on STEEL posts ... YOU NEED A PETROLEUM based lubricant !!! Not silicone based !!!!!
I have for years rebuilding GISS actions used a thinned down mix of "Bel-Ray" assembly lube and Corrosion-X.
The bel-ray is a HEAVY Moly and Graphite paste and the Corrosion-X an anti rust and multi application lubricant.
They mix readily and don't separate over time.  There ability to offer outstanding lubricity w/o being overly thick and staying put has been proven over & over again with many years of use.
The Piston bores / seals can also use it tho applied VERY SPARINGLY.

After trying the KRYTOX based lubes and there affliction of gumming up if coming in contact with any petroleum based oils or grease residual or applied after the fact has them not a good choice to use IMO unless you are doing the maintenance yourself and willing to invest in the correct solvents that prep and clean a surface they will be used upon.

JMO 

[Kragman1]

Thank you guys!

Scott, that's exactly the kind of info I was looking for. 
I had assumed that a petroleum based lube could/would migrate and lead to dieseling.
I would not have used a silicone based lube.

Do you ever sell any of your magic mixture?
I'd love a small container to use on this and a couple of other rifles.

[Motorhead]

Thank you guys!

Scott, that's exactly the kind of info I was looking for. 
I had assumed that a petroleum based lube could/would migrate and lead to dieseling.
I would not have used a silicone based lube.

Do you ever sell any of your magic mixture?
I'd love a small container to use on this and a couple of other rifles.

First time I've shared this ... as I wind down my tuning after a hard 10+ years and 800+ AG's across the bench, am as i always have been sharing the info, but sadly not providing any product to self tuners / tinkerers 

[Kragman1]

No worries, and I very much appreciate the info you did share.

[Brazos]

Already good suggestions but you may look into Feinwerkbau special grease.  It’s what FWB recommends for all their older rifles like that.  They recommend for all parts, mechanical, seals, etc..  It’s not as easy to find and not too cheap.  I bought some for my FWB 601 and it’s some good stuff.

[Kragman1]

Thanks Brazos!

[KWK]

Thank you guys!

Scott, that's exactly the kind of info I was looking for. 
I had assumed that a petroleum based lube could/would migrate and lead to dieseling.
I would not have used a silicone based lube.

Do you ever sell any of your magic mixture?
I'd love a small container to use on this and a couple of other rifles.

First time I've shared this ... as I wind down my tuning after a hard 10+ years and 800+ AG's across the bench, am as i always have been sharing the info, but sadly not providing any product to self tuners / tinkerers 

And I would like to thank you for all you have shared with us. It's guys like you that have taught me and others so much tried and proven information. When you post my ears perk up. THANK YOU

[Yogi]

Thank you guys!

Scott, that's exactly the kind of info I was looking for. 
I had assumed that a petroleum based lube could/would migrate and lead to dieseling.
I would not have used a silicone based lube.

Do you ever sell any of your magic mixture?
I'd love a small container to use on this and a couple of other rifles.

First time I've shared this ... as I wind down my tuning after a hard 10+ years and 800+ AG's across the bench, am as i always have been sharing the info, but sadly not providing any product to self tuners / tinkerers 

And I would like to thank you for all you have shared with us. It's guys like you that have taught me and others so much tried and proven information. When you post my ears perk up. THANK YOU

Karl.

you hit the nail on the head!

+1

-Y

[jkingrph]

What your lubricating is STEEL gears on STEEL racks with gears rotating on STEEL posts ... YOU NEED A PETROLEUM based lubricant !!! Not silicone based !!!!!
I have for years rebuilding GISS actions used a thinned down mix of "Bel-Ray" assembly lube and Corrosion-X.
The bel-ray is a HEAVY Moly and Graphite paste and the Corrosion-X an anti rust and multi application lubricant.
They mix readily and don't separate over time.  There ability to offer outstanding lubricity w/o being overly thick and staying put has been proven over & over again with many years of use.
The Piston bores / seals can also use it tho applied VERY SPARINGLY.

After trying the KRYTOX based lubes and there affliction of gumming up if coming in contact with any petroleum based oils or grease residual or applied after the fact has them not a good choice to use IMO unless you are doing the maintenance yourself and willing to invest in the correct solvents that prep and clean a surface they will be used upon.

JMO 

I think that is pretty much what I said when commenting about how synthetic lubes are made.   I use Super Lube and have at times mixed a little Moly powder, or tungsten disulfide powder into it, and even HBN(hexogonal boron nitride) power in to make a more paste type application.  HBN is a white powder, chemically inert, and has excellent lubricating properties.  Some folks have coated bullets with it.  I tried that and found with small bullets it made them too slick and hard to handle.  It also used in cosmetics, such a lipsticks, lotions, creams, and shampoo to give a feeling of slickness.  If you see a product that has a somewhat irridescent look that is HBN.  Get some on your fingers and you will immediately see the slickness.  Much less messy than Mo or Tn disulfide products.

[HectorMedina]

Hi all,

Can anyone recommend an ideal or nearly ideal grease for the gear teeth of a Giss rifle?
Obviously nothing petroleum based, but it would be nice to find a synthetic that has both high lubricity and high retention.

Thanks!

Brian;

You already have great answers.
And you are right that silicone is (mostly) NOT to be used between metals because some of the polysiloxanes used, CAN break down into Silica Oxides that are extremely abrasive.
ANOTHER great choice is Ultimox 226, the grease, when you are putting things together and, as Scott correctly mentions, taking the time to get EVERYTHING truly clean and free of fossil oil based lubes. IMHE, the "gum" that is created when Krytox comes in contact with fossil oils derives more from the water content of those oils/mixtures than from the oils themselves. Krytox IS hygroscopic.
Ultimox 226 is not. It still requires a four step cleaning: Simple green washing, then carburator cleaner, then lacquer thinner, and then acetone.
It does make the whole thing easier in the LONG run because after a few thousand rounds, you can use a TINY drop of Teflon OIL (Ultimox 105) through the small cap-retaining screw holes (with a needle applicator), to put everything back on track again, WITHOUT needing to take the cap out.

I am testing BHN in pistons now, that has been an interesting test so far.  But that is another story.

HTH. keep well and shoot straight!




HM

[jkingrph]

Keep us posted about the HBN,  which I am thinking that is what you meant when you said BHN.  I have used it on pivots, sliding surfaces on semi auto pistols, tumbling bullets, even tried some on pellets but it made them too slick to handle, and finally burnished inside the compression chamber in some of the Daisy 747/777 single stroke pneumatics.,   It seems to work good in those applications and much less messy than moly.

[Kragman1]

Thanks again Hector!

I agree with jkingrph - please keep us in the loop as you continue to work with HBN. 
I have been curious about it for a while, but know very little.