Is this a industry standard?



Author Topic: Is this a industry standard?  (Read 882 times))

Offline Airnut

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Is this a industry standard?
« on: January 11, 2019, 05:26:08 AM »
First of all, I hope this is the right gate to post this. I recently ordered and received a Hatsan 95 QE from FieldSupply and the gun was obviously used. The box was tore open and the gun was not in the plastic bag.(no biggie) the rifle looked to be in perfect shape. So I proceeded to clean the barrel as I do with all new guns Prior to shooting and to my surprise their was a pellet stuck in the barrel. The pellet was easily removed. Went to cock gun and the cocking pressure was almost nonexistent. No surprise their was a pellet stuck in the barrel!
I notified FieldSupply of the  situation and expressed my concern that they sold me a used gun when it was advertised as new. The sales person admitted that it could have been a new gun that was returned as buyers remorse and that their was nothing wrong with their policy.
Is this a wide spreed policy? It seams to me that once the item is sold to the customer and the box is opened and the item is used then returned to seller it is no longer a new item! How can they sell it as new?? Yes they are refunding me for the gun and that not the issue. I wonder how many of us pay new gun prices for used guns?
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Offline lizzie

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Re: Is this a industry standard?
« Reply #1 on: January 11, 2019, 06:47:05 AM »
I have no idea if it's a wide-spread policy, but if it was a gun that I received that was supposed to have been new, I'd be sending it back. If it was a return from someone, there was obviously a problem of some kind. Maybe it was nothing that would bother me, but I wouldn't want to pay for a new gun, knowing I was not the first and original owner.
Other thoughts....regarding whomever let the gun get shipped out like that- torn box, no plastic covering the gun- and especially a pellet lodged in the barrel- STUPID move on their part!
That's just crazy! Wow.
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Offline mobilemail

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Re: Is this a industry standard?
« Reply #2 on: January 11, 2019, 08:17:38 AM »
I thought it was illegal to pose a used item as new.  But at any rate, if it was sold as new and not refurb, I would definitely get a refund. I don't believe I would want an exchange from a company who has just proven their credibility is already dubious.
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Offline CraigH

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Re: Is this a industry standard?
« Reply #3 on: January 11, 2019, 08:27:32 AM »
I would not be pleased.   A pellet does not get stuck in the barrel with normal operation of a functional gun.   I would return it.
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Offline SteveP-52

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Re: Is this a industry standard?
« Reply #4 on: January 11, 2019, 10:30:43 AM »
The 4 I have ordered from them all came in sealed bags with boxes intact and if I'd gotten one the way you did, I would have returned it, no questions asked. NOT good policy!

That being said, I know MidwayUSA sells guns as "Blemished" that tend to be returned items that, after a function check by them to insure the rifle has no function issues and shoots as it should, is then resold as blemished at a very reduced price. I have a Hatsan 95 QE Vortex .22 I bought that way that turned out to be a returned rifle from another GTA member who, when I pm'd him said he took all of 3 shots with it, didn't like how hard he thought it was to cock the rifle and returned it. Nothing at all wrong with the rifle, cocks just like a 95 should and trust me, I ran it through it's paces to make sure.
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Offline Airnut

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Re: Is this a industry standard?
« Reply #5 on: January 11, 2019, 12:44:05 PM »
I thought it was illegal to pose a used item as new.  But at any rate, if it was sold as new and not refurb, I would definitely get a refund. I don't believe I would want an exchange from a company who has just proven their credibility is already dubious.
I am with you 100% I shipped it back the day after I got it. I did some checking and it seams that all the seller has to do is offer you a refund. Aint that some (beep) and that makes everything ok.
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Offline Airnut

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Re: Is this a industry standard?
« Reply #6 on: January 11, 2019, 12:55:30 PM »
The 4 I have ordered from them all came in sealed bags with boxes intact and if I'd gotten one the way you did, I would have returned it, no questions asked. NOT good policy!

That being said, I know MidwayUSA sells guns as "Blemished" that tend to be returned items that, after a function check by them to insure the rifle has no function issues and shoots as it should, is then resold as blemished at a very reduced price. I have a Hatsan 95 QE Vortex .22 I bought that way that turned out to be a returned rifle from another GTA member who, when I pm'd him said he took all of 3 shots with it, didn't like how hard he thought it was to cock the rifle and returned it. Nothing at all wrong with the rifle, cocks just like a 95 should and trust me, I ran it through it's paces to make sure.
Thats the way it should be done by a reputable seller!
It just pisses me off that Fieldsupply did this and admitted to it,( have e-mails to prove it) and their is nothing that I can do to keep it from happening to more people. I for one will not even think about buying anything from them again!!
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Offline Airnut

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Re: Is this a industry standard?
« Reply #7 on: January 11, 2019, 01:13:25 PM »
 sorry!!! MY MISTAKE

« Last Edit: January 11, 2019, 01:47:55 PM by Airnut »
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Offline Gertrude

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Re: Is this a industry standard?
« Reply #8 on: January 11, 2019, 01:43:59 PM »
Although I do agree with the OP and understand the reasons he is upset, unfortunately, it is a GTA Rule (#15), that we do not publicly post private emails or PM's.

 It is perfectly acceptable to discuss your experiences with sellers, vendors, retailers, etc,... but the actual private communications between the buyer/seller are private.

Here is a copy/paste of the rules (that apply here) for your review:

1- GTA staff members are the authority for the forum. Disrespecting or ignoring staff will get you a warning for the first offence. Second offence gets you a vacation from posting for 7-14 days. Third offence will cause you to lose all access to GTA forums. If there is an issue with a post or member, please report it to the forum staff.

15- Private Messages (pm) are just that, PRIVATE. As private emails are too. If any private communication from pm's or emails are posted in the gates the poster may be banned and message deleted.

All rules are enforced by the Forum owners, administrators and moderators with discretion as needed. Those that habitually disregard these rules may be banned from the GTA Forums.  The Forum owner and administrators reserve the right to amend the rules at any time and ban anyone for repeated violations of the posted rules.

We thank all of you for your cooperation and let's go airgunning!!!!

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« Last Edit: January 11, 2019, 01:47:21 PM by Gertrude »
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Offline Gertrude

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Re: Is this a industry standard?
« Reply #9 on: January 11, 2019, 01:50:46 PM »
sorry!!! MY MISTAKE

No worries, I get it, kind of a "heat of the moment thing"
And yeah, just for the record... I'd be upset with them too, and be sending it straight back myself.
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Offline K.O.

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Re: Is this a industry standard?
« Reply #10 on: January 11, 2019, 02:36:49 PM »
I picked up a .22 Maximus on clearance from Wally World  86$... I am pretty sure it was a return because it had a slightly miscut chamber and was not accurate with any pellet... that was easily fixxed... When done that way then I have no problem with them not saying it why it is on clearance... But to sell a return as new without even checking the rifle out is just wrong...
« Last Edit: January 11, 2019, 02:43:46 PM by K.O. »
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Offline anti-squirrel

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Re: Is this a industry standard?
« Reply #11 on: January 11, 2019, 04:04:05 PM »
I picked up a .22 Maximus on clearance from Wally World  86$... I am pretty sure it was a return because it had a slightly miscut chamber and was not accurate with any pellet... that was easily fixxed... When done that way then I have no problem with them not saying it why it is on clearance... But to sell a return as new without even checking the rifle out is just wrong...
To sell anything as new when it isn't is not just bad policy, it is illegal.  Consumer Protection kind of thing.  Even if they made it right and gave you a freebie gun to boot, I would report them to the BBB on general principle.  I cannot abide with a company that displays such a lack of integrity.

If it is anything other than brand-spanking-unopened-new, label it as such and let the buyer beware and I'm good with that.
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Offline Airnut

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Re: Is this a industry standard?
« Reply #12 on: January 11, 2019, 04:10:40 PM »
I picked up a .22 Maximus on clearance from Wally World  86$... I am pretty sure it was a return because it had a slightly miscut chamber and was not accurate with any pellet... that was easily fixxed... When done that way then I have no problem with them not saying it why it is on clearance... But to sell a return as new without even checking the rifle out is just wrong...
To sell anything as new when it isn't is not just bad policy, it is illegal.  Consumer Protection kind of thing.  Even if they made it right and gave you a freebie gun to boot, I would report them to the BBB on general principle.  I cannot abide with a company that displays such a lack of integrity.

If it is anything other than brand-spanking-unopened-new, label it as such and let the buyer beware and I'm good with that.
YEP I am in the process of filing a compliant with the BBB as we speak.
The BBB said that unless they are a member they have no say over the matter. Next step is Consumer Affairs.
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Offline johnnyfoos

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Re: Is this a industry standard?
« Reply #13 on: January 11, 2019, 06:42:36 PM »
YES
report them to the BBB
that is what they ,{BBB}
are for
even if not a member it will help and help others
down the road
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Offline RedFeather

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Re: Is this a industry standard?
« Reply #14 on: January 11, 2019, 07:57:30 PM »
A pellet in the bore made that a used gun. "Buyer's remorse" only works on items that have not been used. And, when you stated that cocking force was negligeable, that indicated a dead piston, hence the stuck pellet. They sold you a defective gun that had obviously been returned. No, that is NOT standard practice. What it is was someone didn't even check to see why the gun came back. No excuse for it.

Offline Yarddog

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Re: Is this a industry standard?
« Reply #15 on: January 11, 2019, 08:58:35 PM »
Contrary to popular opinion, the BBB has NO regulatory power!  They are not a government agency...they are a private concern that businesses pay to e a member of for marketing purposes.

Now, Consumer Affairs is another enchilada!  They ARE a government agency, and they DO have regulatory power.  Don't bother with the BBB...big whoop!  Report them to the state consumer board and push on it.
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Offline Airnut

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Re: Is this a industry standard?
« Reply #16 on: January 12, 2019, 10:06:40 AM »
I filed a complaint with the Attorney Generals Bureau of Consumer Protection State of Pa.
I had to go through the state of PA. because Field Supply is home based in PA. We will see what happens!
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Offline uglymike

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Re: Is this a industry standard?
« Reply #17 on: January 12, 2019, 10:38:15 AM »
Filing charges with a government entity (AKA black-hole-in-space). Good luck to you sir!
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Offline mikeyb

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Re: Is this a industry standard?
« Reply #18 on: January 12, 2019, 12:55:15 PM »
It should NOT be allowed, but it seems to happen.

If the rifle was listed as NEW, I'd send it back for a full refund (including shipping!). I would be very upset with the seller and I would let them KNOW that! Any customer return should be NOT be sold as new. If the seller is confident enough to actually CHECK that the rifle still works properly, they could (IMO) resell as  a "seller refurbished"  rifle. The alternative is the seller should return them to Hatsan for a proper factory inspection. If the seller is not going to do ANY testing on returns and sell them as new, I'd shop elsewhere.

If the rifle was listed as a "factory refurb", then it SHOULD have gone back through Hatsan's factory techs and be fully functional (minor cosmetic blems are allowed). The box should contain the Hatsan checklist with 10 shot chrony average initialed by one of their repair staff. I've had pretty good luck with Hatsan refurbs DIRECT form Hatsan.

I had a sketchy Mod95 refurb from this same seller last year. I'm certain it WAS a Hatsan factory refurb ("R" stamp on breach), but when I recieved it there was no checklist in the tattered retail box. It certainly looked like it had been sold and returned at least once AFTER Hatsan refurbed it. I kept my Mod95 because the price was LOW and I was able to rework it into a really nice smooth shooter with minimal cost and effort. I wasn't expecting NEW, so my disappointment  with this seller was tempered.
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Offline Airnut

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Re: Is this a industry standard?
« Reply #19 on: January 12, 2019, 01:55:46 PM »
Filing charges with a government entity (AKA black-hole-in-space). Good luck to you sir!
Your probably right but I got to try!
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