I have problems with open sights...



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Offline UlteriorModem

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I have problems with open sights...
« on: September 16, 2018, 02:22:04 PM »
Today I decided to try some target practice at 10 meters using the open sights in stead of the scope.

I have discovered when using the open sights on my rifle that I cannot focus on them and the target at the same time.

I have pretty bad astimatisim and wear gradient 'bi focals'.

Is this a common problem? Am I relegated to always using scopes or dots?

Would painting the foward sight white help?

Any other suggestions?

Thanks in advance :D

Offline 45flint

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Re: I have problems with open sights...
« Reply #1 on: September 16, 2018, 02:30:58 PM »
Today I decided to try some target practice at 10 meters using the open sights in stead of the scope.

I have discovered when using the open sights on my rifle that I cannot focus on them and the target at the same time.

I have pretty bad astimatisim and wear gradient 'bi focals'.

Is this a common problem? Am I relegated to always using scopes or dots?

Would painting the foward sight white help?

Thanks in advance :D

Peep sights help greatly with eyes that have trouble with open sights.  Crazy how good they can be.
« Last Edit: September 16, 2018, 02:40:55 PM by 45flint »
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Offline Paulus

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Re: I have problems with open sights...
« Reply #2 on: September 16, 2018, 02:37:49 PM »
I too wear bi focals, the only iron sights I can use is peep sights on a rifle.  The peep sight controls the light better (like a pinhole camera) cleans up my sight picture a bunch.  On pistols (PBs) I use a novac style sights, big thick front sight. (This I can see) With my airguns I have broke down and scoped everything even my 1322. I just can not see good enough without them. I dont even like red dots as all I end up seeing is a bright flare not a dot.
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Offline UlteriorModem

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Re: I have problems with open sights...
« Reply #3 on: September 16, 2018, 02:42:39 PM »
By 'peep sights' are you referring to an actual replacement sight, or the things you stick on your safety glasses?

Offline 45flint

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Re: I have problems with open sights...
« Reply #4 on: September 16, 2018, 02:54:19 PM »
By 'peep sights' are you referring to an actual replacement sight, or the things you stick on your safety glasses?

Actual sights.  Look through small hole and center post on target.  Here is the peep on my Crosman 108.  Williams makes a lot of peep replacement sights.

« Last Edit: September 16, 2018, 02:58:24 PM by 45flint »
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Offline UlteriorModem

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Re: I have problems with open sights...
« Reply #5 on: September 16, 2018, 02:57:18 PM »
Hrm wonder if I can find one to fit on the Benjamin NP2

Offline Paulus

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Re: I have problems with open sights...
« Reply #6 on: September 16, 2018, 02:59:41 PM »
It is a type of iron sight. If your rifle did not come with them there are after market versions sold that you can add to your rifle. But you might as well get used to scopes as your eyes are not going to get cleaner LOL.
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Offline 45flint

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Re: I have problems with open sights...
« Reply #7 on: September 16, 2018, 03:06:57 PM »
Looks like the NP2 has a rail.  Williams makes a peep that you mount on a rail.

https://www.amazon.com/Air-Venturi-70809-Williams-Diopter/dp/B0085V1R44/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1537120916&sr=8-1&keywords=williams+peep+sight

I use this same sight on a rifle with a scope rail.
« Last Edit: September 16, 2018, 03:08:58 PM by 45flint »
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Online Taso1000

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Re: I have problems with open sights...
« Reply #8 on: September 16, 2018, 03:42:14 PM »
Tom,

Do you still have any of your previous single prescription glasses?  Try shooting with those and see if it's better. 

I have three zone progressives and have trouble.  I think where my eyesight lines up with my head at an angle is the wrong or out of any focus zone.

I see better with my old single vision glasses when shooting.  Yes, it's tougher to handle pellets when everything close is blurry but I think it's a good tradeoff.   ;)

Thanks,

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Offline UlteriorModem

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Re: I have problems with open sights...
« Reply #9 on: September 16, 2018, 03:53:00 PM »
Looks like the NP2 has a rail.  Williams makes a peep that you mount on a rail.

I use this same sight on a rifle with a scope rail.

It acutally has two 'rails' a weaver at the back and a M11? dovetail on the barrel where the current iron sight is.

It would probably be better if I could get one to fit the dovetail on the barrel to mitigate barrel droop, and allow me to still put on my scope.

Offline mobilehomer

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Re: I have problems with open sights...
« Reply #10 on: September 16, 2018, 04:06:51 PM »
Actually what you have is normal. The eye can only focus at one distance. This is true of everyone!! Focus on the FRONT sight. The rear sight will then be a bit blurry. The target will be a little less blurry than the rear.
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Online cobalt327

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Re: I have problems with open sights...
« Reply #11 on: September 16, 2018, 04:09:12 PM »
Today I decided to try some target practice at 10 meters using the open sights in stead of the scope.

I have discovered when using the open sights on my rifle that I cannot focus on them and the target at the same time.

I have pretty bad astimatisim and wear gradient 'bi focals'.

Is this a common problem? Am I relegated to always using scopes or dots?

Would painting the foward sight white help?

Any other suggestions?

Thanks in advance :D
Painting the  front sight white definitely can help. Before that, have you checked to determine which of your eyes is dominant?

Using open sights takes a little practice but the main thing is to keep the front sight in focus. Do not try to focus on the front and rear sight at the same time. With the front sight in focus and centered in the rear sight the target can be brought into focus long enough to get the location set, then back to the front sight focus/rear sight centered. The target will be a little less than in sharp focus but it will be visible enough to center on it.

I keep both eyes open. Some prefer to close their non dominant eye. This is up to the individual.
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Offline Bicycleman

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Re: I have problems with open sights...
« Reply #12 on: September 16, 2018, 04:42:35 PM »
Tom, I noticed that your age is not part of your profile - but, I will venture a guess that you are over 40 years of age.  It won't be getting any better as the years pass.  A scope is the way to go. 
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Offline jmars

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Re: I have problems with open sights...
« Reply #13 on: September 16, 2018, 05:07:50 PM »
Today I decided to try some target practice at 10 meters using the open sights in stead of the scope.
I have discovered when using the open sights on my rifle that I cannot focus on them and the target at the same time.
I have pretty bad astimatisim and wear gradient 'bi focals'.
Is this a common problem? Am I relegated to always using scopes or dots?
Would painting the foward sight white help?
Any other suggestions?
Thanks in advance :D

Young people have eyes that are more able to focus on objects at different distances at the same time.
At some time, usually when one is in their 40's this ability starts to go away and prevents seeing an open rear sight clearly. This may be corrected for a while by mounting the open iron sight further away from the eye.

This gradually gets worse until one is also unable to focus on the front sight.

A rear peep sight has a "pinhole camera" effect and allows one to focus both
on the front sight and the target. That is, everything is in focus at every distance. A pin-hole/peep attached to your eyeglasses has the same effect.

Merit sells a eyeglass mounted pinhole setup, I think that it may have an adjustable aperture and I think it is pricey. They are very popular with ageing
shooters who shoot competitively with open sights. 

One may experiment with the pinhole effect at no cost with paper or
tape or thick foil with a pin hole. Too large off a hole negates the effect, too small makes use difficult.

All of this is pretty common knowledge among shooters; there is much info available is you do a Google search for "ageing eyes and iron sights."

This effect is also handy if you lose your glasses and HAVE TO be able to read something, and it allows one to see small objects clearly that are held right up to the eye.
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Offline selittle

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Re: I have problems with open sights...
« Reply #14 on: September 16, 2018, 05:53:36 PM »
I have to say that even a peep sight is not good for me. I have bifocals and the rear aperture is all fuzzy and picking up a target quickly is very difficult. I had to go completely with scopes.
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Offline Lone Star

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Re: I have problems with open sights...
« Reply #15 on: September 16, 2018, 06:15:31 PM »
Currently wrestling with the iron/plastic on my new Diana 34. Thought I would wait until I did the 500 initial break in shots but at 58 and wearing progressives I'm not sure I can tolerate them.
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Offline jmars

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Re: I have problems with open sights...
« Reply #16 on: September 16, 2018, 07:18:57 PM »
I have to say that even a peep sight is not good for me. I have bifocals and the rear aperture is all fuzzy and picking up a target quickly is very difficult. I had to go completely with scopes.
Hi Scott,
The rear aperture is supposed to be fuzzy, the human eye isn't capable of focusing on objects that close.

If target acquisition is dificult, it probably means that the hole on your peep sight is too small.  Either drill it out or obtain another with a larger hole.
Merit and some other companies make peep apertures that are adjustable.

Under very low light conditions the peep aperture may be removed completely, but a hole that large probably won't sharpen the image.
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Offline UlteriorModem

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Re: I have problems with open sights...
« Reply #17 on: September 16, 2018, 08:03:49 PM »
Well looks like you guys are right. I am not alone.

For now I will just continue with the scope or dot sights for the pistols.

I looked at a peep sight, actually the one linked above. It's a bit pricey for what it is so I will stick with what I have for now.

Thanks for the knowledgable input :D

Offline Frankly

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Re: I have problems with open sights...
« Reply #18 on: September 16, 2018, 08:11:00 PM »
Eventually you won't be able to clearly see both your sights and the target. The most important thing is to see your front sight clearly, whether pistol or rifle, air or powder. The target may be a blob but you'll be surprised how accurate you still will be. Of course if you're squirrel hunting you'll be hungry but you can still punch paper and hit steel. (Or just use a scope like most sane older people.)

Most of us start out with decent 20-20 vision but as we age we develop farsightedness. This accounts for all the $10 "reading glasses" we see in the store. Now that we spend hours looking at screens it's worse. Most people with farsightedness need a "plus +" reader to magnify close distance text and details. Obviously if you read a book or screen 6" from your nose versus 24" you'll need a different optimal prescription. For instance I use a +2 for general reading but keep a pair of +3 in my workshop for doing close work.

For shooting I have bought many cheap regular and bifocal type shooting glasses, consulted with my Ophthalmologist (not an Optician or Optometrist, someone who went to medical school not LensCrafters Tech). What I've ended up with is a customer pair of glasses with a +1.75 bifocal section at the top of my right eye (which is my dominant). The bulk of the right lens is clear, as is the entire left lens.

This allows me to tilt my head down slight and my pistol sights come into focus. I only need a +1.75 because they are further away than a book or screen where I need a +2.0.

With the same glasses I can get onto my scoped rifles and shotguns/rifles with fiber optic front sights looking through the clear section. The front sight is slightly blurred but not very much and the fiber optic glow helps significantly. I can no longer shoot black front sighted guns unless I'm shooting against a light background (not likely).

Also my brain is able to "join" the left and right images so I get a partially in focus view of the target at distance (but not everyone can do this).

This way I can still do 3-Gun without needing to switch glasses between which weapons I am using. And if I need to operate on the weapon (clearing a jam for instance) I can tilt my head and see details well enough when I need to.

For the 10m air pistol I use a cheap pair of top bifocal shooting glasses: https://sspeyewear.com these are a great way to start.

These guys do a nice job with custom eyewear: http://tacticalrx.com I have some Smith tactical style frames that are very strong and safe, fit well, worth the investment.

As for trap shooting abandon all hope, those guys are nuts about eyewear and do all kinds of crazy $$$ stuff.

« Last Edit: September 16, 2018, 10:32:50 PM by Frankly »
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Offline selittle

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Re: I have problems with open sights...
« Reply #19 on: September 16, 2018, 09:49:36 PM »
I have to say that even a peep sight is not good for me. I have bifocals and the rear aperture is all fuzzy and picking up a target quickly is very difficult. I had to go completely with scopes.
Hi Scott,
The rear aperture is supposed to be fuzzy, the human eye isn't capable of focusing on objects that close.

If target acquisition is dificult, it probably means that the hole on your peep sight is too small.  Either drill it out or obtain another with a larger hole.
Merit and some other companies make peep apertures that are adjustable.

Under very low light conditions the peep aperture may be removed completely, but a hole that large probably won't sharpen the image.

Trust me, I bought larger aperture inserts. no go and both front and rear sights are fuzzy. I much prefer scopes now.
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