22mm Skirtless Conversion



Author Topic: 22mm Skirtless Conversion  (Read 3272 times - 2 votes) 
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Offline Nitrocrushr

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Re: 22mm Skirtless Conversion
« Reply #20 on: February 23, 2018, 05:04:09 AM »

Thanks Steve. Sounds like a very nice set up. Keep us posted as you break it in.

By the way..was the TP changed at all with this conversion?

Regards,

Dan

Yes, Tony reduces TP length on his conversions.  He machines them down by 3mm.  This increases velocity by 40fps with the same swept volume on JSB Express 7.9. 
« Last Edit: February 23, 2018, 07:18:07 AM by Nitrocrushr »
  • Lancaster, Pennsylvania
Air Arms TX200 .177 Rifle - 22mm skirtless dual seal conversion from Tony Leach

HW98 .177 - Vortek 12fpe


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Offline TheBman

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Re: 22mm Skirtless Conversion
« Reply #21 on: March 23, 2018, 07:41:13 PM »
Yeah, I gotta do this Steve. Thanks for the write up and info.
  • Norman Indiana
TX200HC .177
PROSPORT .177
HW95 .177
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Offline DanT

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Re: 22mm Skirtless Conversion
« Reply #22 on: October 06, 2018, 09:51:17 PM »
Its been a long wait but I finally got my 22mm conversion parts in from Tony Leach. He was doing the mods on customer supplied comp tubes when Nitrocrusher got his but has come up with a DIY kit. This is going into my Walnut TX200 HC .177. Wanting to keep the factory components so I could go back to FAC as needed I ordered a spare comp tube from PA for this conversion. Tony supplied the threaded sleeve, rod, piston, delrin spring guide and spacers.  Note that his parts will only fit the 15mm ID AA 16J (12ft/lb) spring. I ordered mine from PA. They will not fit the FAC spring as supplied by AA and he does not recommend using a FAC spring for this conversion. Apparently this is a Mk2 type spring with a 14mm ID.

To install:

1. Remove the comp tube threaded on TP nut. Mine took some heat.
2. Clean up threads and install threaded sleeve with removable loctite.
3. Loctite (permanent) in the threaded rod on the piston head. With Tony's rod it will be flush with the piston top. If you re-use the factory rod it will be below the piston head by a few mm's. This is to reduce the stroke.
4. Lightly lube all the parts and install guide rod and spring. I used krytox 205. One 3mm spacer on back of rod.

Enjoy a crazy soft and quick shot cycle @ 800fps with 8.4 AA 4.52 pellets. I could probably pull the spacer and get it under 12ft/lbs but it's shooting really good at the moment. Significantly less mass and movement. This really takes the TX to the next level IMHO.


  • Shawnee, KS

Offline Nitrocrushr

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Re: 22mm Skirtless Conversion
« Reply #23 on: October 06, 2018, 10:09:11 PM »
Very nice write-up Dan 8) I see you have the new double seal as well.  Testing has shown that this minimizes velocity variation due to temperature change.

Nice work!  I couldn’t agree with you more.  The 22mm conversion makes a huge difference ;)

Steve
  • Lancaster, Pennsylvania
Air Arms TX200 .177 Rifle - 22mm skirtless dual seal conversion from Tony Leach

HW98 .177 - Vortek 12fpe


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Offline Gear_Junkie

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Re: 22mm Skirtless Conversion
« Reply #24 on: October 06, 2018, 11:02:31 PM »
Is this available for an HW97?  Also, about how much does this conversion cost?
  • Nevada City, CA
.177 Regal XL & Hawke Airmax 30 SF 6-24x50
.177 TX200 MkIII HC & Hawke Airmax 30 SF 6-24x50
.177 HW50S & UTG Compact 3-12x44

Offline Nitrocrushr

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Re: 22mm Skirtless Conversion
« Reply #25 on: October 07, 2018, 10:53:59 AM »
Is this available for an HW97?  Also, about how much does this conversion cost?

Not yet.  Tony is currently working on a 23mm conversion for the HW97K.

Steve
  • Lancaster, Pennsylvania
Air Arms TX200 .177 Rifle - 22mm skirtless dual seal conversion from Tony Leach

HW98 .177 - Vortek 12fpe


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Offline Gear_Junkie

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Re: 22mm Skirtless Conversion
« Reply #26 on: October 07, 2018, 11:37:37 AM »
Is this available for an HW97?  Also, about how much does this conversion cost?

Not yet.  Tony is currently working on a 23mm conversion for the HW97K.

Steve

Thanks Steve.  Now that you've had this for awhile, how are you liking it?  Do you still find that there is less hold sensitivity?  I'm hoping that one of these kits in a heavy laminate stock should reduce the hold sensitivity a significant amount in an HW97.
  • Nevada City, CA
.177 Regal XL & Hawke Airmax 30 SF 6-24x50
.177 TX200 MkIII HC & Hawke Airmax 30 SF 6-24x50
.177 HW50S & UTG Compact 3-12x44

Offline Nitrocrushr

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Re: 22mm Skirtless Conversion
« Reply #27 on: October 07, 2018, 03:17:37 PM »
Is this available for an HW97?  Also, about how much does this conversion cost?

Not yet.  Tony is currently working on a 23mm conversion for the HW97K.

Steve

Thanks Steve.  Now that you've had this for awhile, how are you liking it?  Do you still find that there is less hold sensitivity?  I'm hoping that one of these kits in a heavy laminate stock should reduce the hold sensitivity a significant amount in an HW97.

I was really impressed with it Zack.  It does a few things;

Reduces mass due to the lightened piston - less recoil
Reduces stroke - shorter shot cycle; but not so short as to make the rifle jumpy
Speeds up shot cycle (very quick) - lower lock time equals less hold sensitivity
Tony works the transfer port also.  It is extremely efficient, with almost no wasted energy.

From what I understand, Tony is going to lengthen the stroke on the 97K kit a little bit.  This will soften it up a little.  The 97K is rather short on stroke (I think they are around 81mm with a heavy 26mm diameter piston).  While too long of a stroke makes for a sluggish shot cycle, too short can make a rifle buck a bit on the shot.  Getting the stroke just right for the piston diameter and total volume is what Tony goes after on his conversion kits.  The end result is a quick, smooth shot with minimal jump.

I just sold my 22mm TX200HC in preparation for another project ;)  Tony Leach is now offering a 200g lightened piston with a dual seal that shortens the TX/PS stroke by 5mm.  I am planning to either try that, or get another 22mm skirtless conversion with his new dual seal set-up that you see pictured in Dan's post above.

Steve
 
  • Lancaster, Pennsylvania
Air Arms TX200 .177 Rifle - 22mm skirtless dual seal conversion from Tony Leach

HW98 .177 - Vortek 12fpe


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Offline PiterM

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Re: 22mm Skirtless Conversion
« Reply #28 on: October 07, 2018, 04:04:49 PM »
Most impressive!
  • EU, Poland

Offline Gear_Junkie

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Re: 22mm Skirtless Conversion
« Reply #29 on: October 07, 2018, 06:54:17 PM »
Thanks for the detailed information! I'm looking forward to your next project.
  • Nevada City, CA
.177 Regal XL & Hawke Airmax 30 SF 6-24x50
.177 TX200 MkIII HC & Hawke Airmax 30 SF 6-24x50
.177 HW50S & UTG Compact 3-12x44

Offline DanT

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Re: 22mm Skirtless Conversion
« Reply #30 on: October 08, 2018, 06:45:50 PM »
Is this available for an HW97?  Also, about how much does this conversion cost?

 Pretty cool to have something new in the airgun world that hasn't been done before and disrupts conventional thinking. I see this as being a factory option by some OEM down the road. PM me for pricing info. I know he is currently out of conversions but expecting more in soon.
Very nice write-up Dan 8) I see you have the new double seal as well.  Testing has shown that this minimizes velocity variation due to temperature change.

Nice work!  I couldn’t agree with you more.  The 22mm conversion makes a huge difference ;)

Steve

Thanks Steve. Really enjoying this conversion. Not often we can get something this cutting edge in the springer community. Looking forward to that HW97 kit too.  ;)

I am still tickling 12ft/lbs with 8.4gr using a 3mm spacer but you couldn't tell by the shot cycle. It also seems to really reduce hold sensitivity.

Regards,

Dan
  • Shawnee, KS

Offline DanT

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Re: 22mm Skirtless Conversion
« Reply #31 on: October 08, 2018, 07:03:16 PM »
Is this available for an HW97?  Also, about how much does this conversion cost?

Not yet.  Tony is currently working on a 23mm conversion for the HW97K.

Steve

Thanks Steve.  Now that you've had this for awhile, how are you liking it?  Do you still find that there is less hold sensitivity?  I'm hoping that one of these kits in a heavy laminate stock should reduce the hold sensitivity a significant amount in an HW97.

I was really impressed with it Zack.  It does a few things;

Reduces mass due to the lightened piston - less recoil
Reduces stroke - shorter shot cycle; but not so short as to make the rifle jumpy
Speeds up shot cycle (very quick) - lower lock time equals less hold sensitivity
Tony works the transfer port also.  It is extremely efficient, with almost no wasted energy.

From what I understand, Tony is going to lengthen the stroke on the 97K kit a little bit.  This will soften it up a little.  The 97K is rather short on stroke (I think they are around 81mm with a heavy 26mm diameter piston).  While too long of a stroke makes for a sluggish shot cycle, too short can make a rifle buck a bit on the shot.  Getting the stroke just right for the piston diameter and total volume is what Tony goes after on his conversion kits.  The end result is a quick, smooth shot with minimal jump.

I just sold my 22mm TX200HC in preparation for another project ;)  Tony Leach is now offering a 200g lightened piston with a dual seal that shortens the TX/PS stroke by 5mm.  I am planning to either try that, or get another 22mm skirtless conversion with his new dual seal set-up that you see pictured in Dan's post above.

Steve

Just went back and looked at your piston. I now see that it did not have the O ring. Good to see he is improving on the design. Tony also mention that the 97K piston rod sear catch can be a challenge to get oriented correctly.  TX has non directional engagement where the 97K is directional with the hook down I believe. It will have to have some form of quide/slot to keep the hook from rotating. Looking forward to that one.

I am also interested in something for my LGU but I recall Tony not liking the barrel lead in chamfer from the factory. He said it is not conducive to a lost volume conversion unless it is modified to act on the pellet skirt. This provides a better seal and contributes to velocity. Cool stuff.

Interesting times in springer land!

Regards,

Dan
  • Shawnee, KS

Offline Yogi

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Re: 22mm Skirtless Conversion
« Reply #32 on: October 08, 2018, 09:27:24 PM »


Good stuff!
Thanks for posting it. :D

-Y
  • San Francisco, CA
Hatsan 95 Vortex, .22
RWS 6G, .177
RWS LP8 Magnum, .177
Diana 340 N-Tec, .22 Compact Lexus
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Offline Hielke

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Re: 22mm Skirtless Conversion
« Reply #33 on: October 09, 2018, 05:20:35 AM »
Am I reading this correctly regarding the 22mm TX200 conversion. Is the Tony Leach piston with the piston rod only 130 grams?
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Offline DanT

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Re: 22mm Skirtless Conversion
« Reply #34 on: October 09, 2018, 11:10:06 AM »
Am I reading this correctly regarding the 22mm TX200 conversion. Is the Tony Leach piston with the piston rod only 130 grams?

A little more...I weighed mine at 147g vs 219g for the factory TX piston. Add in the "hunky" factory AA top hat and the factory piston is 242g. Most remove it when tuning with a new delrin top hat so 219g is a good number.

My TX out of the box was shooting 8.4g @ 900fps. Pretty hot with the heavy AA set up.

Regards,

DT
« Last Edit: October 09, 2018, 11:15:18 AM by DanT »
  • Shawnee, KS

Offline Hielke

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Re: 22mm Skirtless Conversion
« Reply #35 on: October 10, 2018, 11:24:13 AM »
Thnx Dan, think I will be ordering a set as well.
  • Heerenveen

Offline Gear_Junkie

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Re: 22mm Skirtless Conversion
« Reply #36 on: October 11, 2018, 12:18:46 PM »

You guys really have me reconsidering the HW97 and going for a TX200.  Really, the power level that you got with his kit is exactly where I would want to be.  I really liked my HW97 at about 11fpe.  Having this amount of energy with the shot cycle improvements from Tony's kit sounds like a dream.
  • Nevada City, CA
.177 Regal XL & Hawke Airmax 30 SF 6-24x50
.177 TX200 MkIII HC & Hawke Airmax 30 SF 6-24x50
.177 HW50S & UTG Compact 3-12x44

Offline TonyL

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Re: 22mm Skirtless Conversion
« Reply #37 on: December 05, 2018, 09:23:12 PM »
Gents

I see a few of you guys are getting interested in my 22mm conversion...if you can get your head around my accent i have produced a few short video's in the AVE and This old Tony stylee to help you ;)

have a look round my YT channel, you can search for Tony Leach on YT, there is a pic of me wearing a bobby hat and i have a white beard...click that and you will get links to video's about the 22mm conversion

I'm hoping the video's for now answer most questions...

Please remember, this kit was designed for sub12fpe use, it will deliver more BUT it has not been designed to, however running a .22 set up with a .177 kit/spring set up is probably very safe ;) Over springing the kits is VERY easy to do, the kit is designed to work with the OEM 16j /12fpe AirArms mk3 spring ONLY...stifffer springs will break the rear guide...don't push the kits to do what they are not designed to do ;) Running a full length Mk3 12fpe AA spring is to much... trust me i know!

I will do my best to drop by, or you can get me on my Lost Volume facebook group of message me on my Airguntech facebook page...

Tony

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Offline Nitrocrushr

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Re: 22mm Skirtless Conversion
« Reply #38 on: December 05, 2018, 09:30:17 PM »
Hi Tony, Welcome to the GTA forum ;D

For those who are considering a 22mm conversion, Tony has some very helpful info on the following site;

https://www.youtube.com/user/ocztony


Steve
  • Lancaster, Pennsylvania
Air Arms TX200 .177 Rifle - 22mm skirtless dual seal conversion from Tony Leach

HW98 .177 - Vortek 12fpe


N.U.A.H. Club - Master

Offline Gear_Junkie

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Re: 22mm Skirtless Conversion
« Reply #39 on: December 05, 2018, 10:26:32 PM »
Gents

I see a few of you guys are getting interested in my 22mm conversion...if you can get your head around my accent i have produced a few short video's in the AVE and This old Tony stylee to help you ;)

have a look round my YT channel, you can search for Tony Leach on YT, there is a pic of me wearing a bobby hat and i have a white beard...click that and you will get links to video's about the 22mm conversion

I'm hoping the video's for now answer most questions...

Please remember, this kit was designed for sub12fpe use, it will deliver more BUT it has not been designed to, however running a .22 set up with a .177 kit/spring set up is probably very safe ;) Over springing the kits is VERY easy to do, the kit is designed to work with the OEM 16j /12fpe AirArms mk3 spring ONLY...stifffer springs will break the rear guide...don't push the kits to do what they are not designed to do ;) Running a full length Mk3 12fpe AA spring is to much... trust me i know!

I will do my best to drop by, or you can get me on my Lost Volume facebook group of message me on my Airguntech facebook page...

Tony

Thank you Tony - these videos should be super informative!  I look forward to getting my kit.  (I'm the guy who's been bugging you with all of the questions throughout the day.  ;D)

Edit:  I just got finished watching the videos and, YES, they are very helpful - THANK YOU!
« Last Edit: December 06, 2018, 02:12:57 AM by Gear_Junkie »
  • Nevada City, CA
.177 Regal XL & Hawke Airmax 30 SF 6-24x50
.177 TX200 MkIII HC & Hawke Airmax 30 SF 6-24x50
.177 HW50S & UTG Compact 3-12x44

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