Hey 95 owners, trigger bolt backing out on you?

[GD Giles]

Mine got real loose after 100's of pellets so I took it out, cleaned it w/bore cleaner, dried it off, then slopped it up w/blue locktite and screwed it back in and let it sit for over 24 hours. Tried to zero my scope today and after about 100 pellets the dumb bolt was loose again!!  Anyone else having this kind of issue? Am I just supposed to check it every 50 shots? This is nuts. And bolts. 

[SteveP-52]

If you mean the back stock screw, mine only did it once about 200 shots in. After cleaning and loctite, it's never been an issue and you're the first I've seen saying it's happened more than once.

Also just read your post about trying to sight in and how violent the rifle is and remembered you saying they chronied it at 837fps...the gun is only rated for 800. Seems like Hatsan quality slipped somewhere because they should have flagged the rifle the minute it exceeded its ratings and I would think that stock screw is stripping out somewhere if it keeps coming out. I have a .22 Vortex and it has very little recoil and definitely not enough to be shaking things loose like you're describing.

You might better skip e-mailing and call the guys at Airgun Pro Shop and explain everything to them. You got a year warranty with the factory bulletproofing, kind of sounds like you need to make use of it because from everything you've said, something's not right with that rifle.

[GD Giles]

I've got a chrony now and I'm going to run it through asap, probably tomorrow night. Dude, I mean at 15 yards this gun today was hitting bullseye the first shot and then 4 inches out the 2nd shot. 2 shots just barely made my trap and didn't fly into a wall it was so bad and that was at 15 yards. I'm so stressed right now of hours with the voice in my head every time I went to pull the trigger asking 'I wonder where this one is going to go?'

[SteveP-52]

Like I said, something doesn't sound right if you're getting that kind of recoil. Even my .25 cal Model 95 doesn't have that much recoil and again, same power plant as your .22.
I would definitely call the guys at APS and explain every last bit and see what they say, especially for the money you spent.

[Methuselah]

Mine got real loose after 100's of pellets so I took it out, cleaned it w/bore cleaner, dried it off, then slopped it up w/blue locktite and screwed it back in and let it sit for over 24 hours. Tried to zero my scope today and after about 100 pellets the dumb bolt was loose again!!  Anyone else having this kind of issue? Am I just supposed to check it every 50 shots? This is nuts. And bolts. 

Glen,

Did you also clean the hole the screw goes into first?  If not, it might be worth a try to remove the loctite and try again ... use denatured alcohol for hole/threads first, allow to dry (not wipe), then loctite again.  Purple is better than blue but blue will work.  Not sure how to remove, nail polish remover?

Vibration or damaged threads is what allows a screw to back out.  If anything at all is loose on your gun it may just happen again.  Mine comes loose in 2 or 3 shots (the one Umarex pooched up) due to hidden screw for front fork.  I don't know if any of your screws are hidden but ALL must be tight including the scope and rings, AND the sights or moderator.

Another source of vibration is piston slam.  Can happen if either seal allows air past it --- use tissue test at breach.  Same for air going past pellet skirt (loose fit) or too light a pellet.  Broken spring will also vibrate even if some will still generate decent numbers across a crony.  A cracked stock is also possible ... any place vibration is generated can be your cause (even hidden or unexpected places like something loose inside a scope).

One last thought, push 2 or 3 different type pellets through, check for resistance all the way through the barrel.  Throw them away after one use, and if your bore is oversized I'd consider a warranty claim!  (edit:  well --- don't reuse them, inspect them for rifling pattern spacing/depth, etc.)

My biggest suggestion is set it aside until you are able to think clearly.  I cannot tell you how many times the answer to a problem just came to me before I even started to troubleshoot or experiment (or how many times when I was younger I jumped first and did something that made things harder because I didn't think things through).

Hope you get her ironed out 

[GD Giles]

Glen,

Did you also clean the hole the screw goes into first?  If not, it might be worth a try to remove the loctite and try again ... use denatured alcohol for hole/threads first, allow to dry (not wipe), then loctite again.  Purple is better than blue but blue will work.  Not sure how to remove, nail polish remover?

Vibration or damaged threads is what allows a screw to back out.  If anything at all is loose on your gun it may just happen again.  Mine comes loose in 2 or 3 shots (the one Umarex pooched up) due to hidden screw for front fork.  I don't know if any of your screws are hidden but ALL must be tight including the scope and rings, AND the sights or moderator.

Another source of vibration is piston slam.  Can happen if either seal allows air past it --- use tissue test at breach.  Same for air going past pellet skirt (loose fit) or too light a pellet.  Broken spring will also vibrate even if some will still generate decent numbers across a crony.  A cracked stock is also possible ... any place vibration is generated can be your cause (even hidden or unexpected places like something loose inside a scope).

One last thought, push 2 or 3 different type pellets through, check for resistance all the way through the barrel.  Throw them away after one use, and if your bore is oversized I'd consider a warranty claim!  (edit:  well --- don't reuse them, inspect them for rifling pattern spacing/depth, etc.)

My biggest suggestion is set it aside until you are able to think clearly.  I cannot tell you how many times the answer to a problem just came to me before I even started to troubleshoot or experiment (or how many times when I was younger I jumped first and did something that made things harder because I didn't think things through).

Hope you get her ironed out 

I didn't clean the hole but honestly the threads were not really dirty or oily and they did not appear to be damaged. I do have a cleaning rod so I guess I could try to push a pellet or two through the barrel. I'm just checking to make sure it's a snug fit, correct? I will try and chrony it tonight. I just have no clue as to why some shots flew so far off target. Let's say as I'm trying to steady the gun there is a zone that the crosshairs are moving around in and we'll say, for the most part, that zone is the actual bullseye. I'm going for the center of the bullseye, not the edge so I'm aiming at the center and of course when I pull the trigger the pellet flies outside the bullseye, I expect that. But what I didn't expect was for pellets to fly so far outside of the actual target, ie four inches away from dead center. There's no way, NO WAY, my aim was off by that much. You can see how the pellets are flying in this video I did yesterday. The groups are best in the beginning and get worse throughout the day as I didn't know the trigger bolt was getting more and more loose.

[Yogi]

Thanks for the video. 
Several things to consider;
Replacement stock, if your trigger screw threads are buggered, is pretty cheap.  $65 from Hatsan I believe.

Your scope reticle could be buggered!  Wire reticle scopes are terrible on Springers.  Take off your scope and shoot with the open sights.

If you have not already done so, clean your barrel.

Last but to least, send it back!

-Y

ps what target backstop are you shooting into?

[Methuselah]

It will never shoot consistently with screws coming loose ...

First you must determine what is making that screw loosen up and make sure it is the only thing loose on the gun, then you can troubleshoot groups if they are not acceptable!

START BY CLICKING THIS LINK!!!

[wll2506]

Mine got real loose after 100's of pellets so I took it out, cleaned it w/bore cleaner, dried it off, then slopped it up w/blue locktite and screwed it back in and let it sit for over 24 hours. Tried to zero my scope today and after about 100 pellets the dumb bolt was loose again!!  Anyone else having this kind of issue? Am I just supposed to check it every 50 shots? This is nuts. And bolts. 

I check that screw all the time ... Going to Lowe's before work to get some blue Loctite .. that screw must be tight and the Hatsan guns have a lot of smack as they are very powerful.

wll

[GD Giles]

I would hate to think that around 150 pellets would kill this brand new UTG 'True Strength' magnum springer rated scope. But it did fire so violently that it turned the IR on. I cleaned the barrel the day before. I blue locktited the scope mount screws and trigger screw 2 days before. I did everything I could think of to be prepared to do it right.

I've seen that song before.

[Methuselah]

I would hate to think that around 150 pellets would kill this brand new UTG 'True Strength' magnum springer rated scope. But it did fire so violently that it turned the IR on. I cleaned the barrel the day before. I blue locktited the scope mount screws and trigger screw 2 days before. I did everything I could think of to be prepared to do it right.

I've seen that song before.

There are lots of these Hatsan 95's out there that do not have that trigger housing screw coming loose and I'd bet not all of them needed Loctite to keep them in.  SOMETHING is causing enough vibration to make it come loose and no amount of fiddling with things to troubleshoot your 4" flyers is going to help if the screw keeps working loose.  Gotta figure out where that vibration is coming from first, troubleshoot groups after.

Stuff can snowball too.  My bad breach seal loosened the fork screw.  Vibration from subsequent piston slam cracked the front sight to the point it was coming apart, which added to the vibration.  In much the same way if your vibration issue has since damaged your scope now you have two sources of vibration (you count mine --- three sources!).  If you think the scope is a possible source take it off and use the iron sights.  All I can tell you for sure is if you insist on trying to fix the flyer situation when the screw keeps coming loose I just don't think there is anything else I can offer for help except maybe to repost the video link ... it ain't gonna be accurate with loose screws (or anything else that vibrates violently).

Too, just cause the scope screws were loctited, doesn't mean they didn't come loose just like the loctited trigger housing screw did.  Start over, be methodical, take stuff out of the equation as you go if you can (tissue test, push pellets to make sure you don't have a loose pellet fit, check for a solidly mounted muzzle break, remove the scope if necessary).

You can do it Glen, but its going to be more difficult if you don't put the groups behind you for now and find out why that screw keeps working loose 

Good luck!

P.S.  Someone else suggested return it.  The folks you bought from are human, they sent it to you with an issue and might just do it again ... it happens.  You have a better chance of them fixing it (if necessary) if you tell them what the problem seems to be.  That is why I'm suggesting here to look at it before I'm suggesting to send it back.  Just my $.02

[GD Giles]

I've checked all screws at this point and everything is tight. I think the next step is to chrony it and see what's going on power-wise. When I paid for the tune job perhaps they juiced the ram pressure a bit and maybe the gun is proving it can't take that extra air. But I won't know that for sure until I run it and get some numbers. The other card up my sleeve is that I have a good friend that was a USA Olympic air rifle shooter and I have yet been able to corner him to give me a hand sighting any AG in. I think he's got me on his radar now and I'm hoping we can get together this by this weekend. If everything is tight, the chrony numbers are good, and we even take the scope off and HE can't get good groups, then I know it's not me.  I think we start with the scope off and see what happens (bear in mind it was never set w/open sights either). Get good groups then pop the scope back on and see what happens. Checking screws the whole time, etc.

[GD Giles]

So, the last time I checked the screws, yesterday, they were tight. Shot for another half hour or so and then checked it again today. It was loose again. Will clean again and do it all over.

[uglymike]

Send it back!!!! It's been "bulletproofed"by the Hatsan "guru" and it ain't right. For the $120 you got charged for "bulletproof", that thing should be nothing but cock, load, shoot, smile. Drop it like a hot potato, the sooner the better.

[Methuselah]

So, the last time I checked the screws, yesterday, they were tight. Shot for another half hour or so and then checked it again today. It was loose again. Will clean again and do it all over.

Is everything else tight?

You did have someone work on it ... perhaps they put it together wrong or left something out of it (lock washer, spacer, etc.).  At this point if you can't find anything loose perhaps a full teardown inspection is called for.  Most of what I suggested presumes the folks working on it before you got it didn't mess up, and simply flowed from an assumption on my part something you could test for or look for was causing the vibration.

Maybe if it was me I'd do what I seem to recall Pappy did, experimented with the gas ram pressure.  Could be you were right - might be too high for the rest of the rifle design to handle the extra forces without detriment?  If the scope's off it, everything's tight (including the barrel pivot), tissue test was good, pellet fit was good, and the thing is still vibrating to the point the Loctite won't keep that screw from vibrating out of it I'm at a loss without the ability to put my hands on it ... been messing with mechanical stuff as long as I can remember, almost half a century, but not enough experience to be much help at this point I'm afraid.

Hope you get her shooting!!!

[GD Giles]

I'm going to give it one more college try with the locktite before I start the process to send it back. If I can get it then that will be weeks ahead of them putting it back in my hands. I was going to buy the locktite brand cleaner but Walmart didn't sell it.

Yogi, missed your question earlier, sorry. This is the backstop, bag of rubber mulch in a 5 gal bucket.



and I printed up targets from here:

http://www.gr8fun.net/AirgunTargets/free-downloadable-airgun-targets-ezp-4.html

[GD Giles]

You can't wave a wand over an air gun and know what's going on. At least I can't.

Let me just take a minute to thank the greater GTA community because on about my first day here someone said, 'Whatever you budget for a gun make sure you get a chrony too.' and honestly I had never considered a chrony, didn't really know why I'd want a chrony, shot for years as a kid and teen w/o a chrony and figured it was just another boring math/science black hole to drag the fun out of shooting. With my sour attitude towards the device I begrudgingly admitted it would be good to have but stubbornly refused to pay for one. So I did the next best thing and traded a pellet gun for one. Sure, it cost me some shipping but I thought that would be worth it. Well, with all the accuracy issues I've been having with this gun and knowing some of it was due to the trigger screw coming loose, I thought there could be other issues....



I have sent an email to airgunproshop.com to ask about starting the return process and I want it returned for service, not a refund. I've also asked them to address the perpetual loose screw issue as well. It wouldn't surprise me if they're away for the holidays but it looks like my shooting has crawled to a halt for the next couple of weeks. Now I know why you guys have more than one gun.

[bebanovich]

I have sent an email to airgunproshop.com to ask about starting the return process . . .

I have been watching this thread silently because I have little justification to offer any kind of advice about airguns, but this sounds like the right move to me. The way you have described your Hatsan has never sounded "right" to me in comparison to the one I got out of the box with no one looking it over (let alone refurbing and "bullet-proofing" it). I understand the feeling that, being the only one in the arsenal, it's worth well more than the budget price paid for it. I hope it gets back in your hands soon.

[GD Giles]

Thanks. I'm going to box it up tomorrow and hopefully I'll have a call tag tomorrow or the next day. I'm also going pawn shopping tomorrow to see if I can't snag a cheap .22 air rifle. A whole other kind of hunting. I hope I bag a good one.

[Yogi]

 Now I know why you guys have more than one gun.

Amen to that! 

Is the only screw that comes loose the trigger-stock screw?  Dollars to donuts, I bet the problem is with the stock
FWIW, on your video, your gun "sounds" right.  I always thought those "refurbished" guns were a great deal, now maybe not so much...

-Y