Airforce PCP Tank Testing?

[Bo3b]

What is the definitive word on the hydro test need for Airforce gun 490cc pcp tanks?

For instance, regardless of practical or financial sense, assume a Condor tank was taken to dive shop for fill - Inspection and/or testing rules apply?

And how are tank markings interpreted? Such as;
Neck (deep stamp) -
FK0042667
TC-3ALJ-207 CLIFFDIV09
C15 VC SL T 66kg

Bottom (lighter stamp) -
6310
53161

Thanks,
Bo3b

[Chickenthief]

A Condor (or any Airforce) tank will not mate with anything they have in a diveshop!
Why would you go to a diveshop to get yout airgun filled in the first place?
Buy a used SCUBA or SCBA tank and a fill kit and be done with it.

Oh and i do believe that DOT do not need tanks under 500cc (re)tested at all.

[keefd]

Chickenthief - here in the US, dive shops can be the easiest place to get to for hydro testing and fills.

[sharpend]

Hello --

Thing is don't expect a dive shop to understand anything outside of what they do. Fill a K-valve tank, sure no problem. Fill a DIN-valved tank and you get strange looks, until you pull the adapters out of your shorts pocket. What with dive shops all wrapped up in there liabilities, and the major agencies teaching a narrowly defined program, shops are loathe to satisfy the needs of "non-divers", &c. Just my experience.

[keefd]

Huh, one near me (Omaha) said they can hydro and fill a CGA-347 SCBA tank. It's a REALLY big dive shop for being in the middle of the continental US.
I went with a local fire safety shop - they were faster and cheaper.

[sharpend]

It's a REALLY big dive shop for being in the middle of the continental US.

Those folks prolly been running that shop for like forever, with little core staff turnover, and have diversified their services in order to stay in business. Fire extinguisher shops are typically go-to for re-tests, given the number of tanks they process. For a while here, the dive shops sent out tanks for re-test to the fire extinguisher shops, and then added a courtesy mark-up on the service. Not the rule industry-wide, but in the tropics...

[Bo3b]

Interesting discussion but no convincing answer regarding the requirement for hydro testing, and 15 year end-of-life, of Airforce PCP tanks. @Chickenthief suggests that he doesn't believe DOT tanks under 500cc need testing. What agency governs pressurized tank regulations and are those published somewhere?

[JohnnyPDX]

Recently this came up on GTA on a post I made regarding my TalonSS. Some say above 500cc needs testing and another person said it was determined by OD of tank. I really don't know for sure.

I CAN SAY FOR SURE...
I purchased the TalonSS from a reputable dealer and it came with an expired tank. I only know this because "The Guy' at the paintball shop wouldn't fill it. I complained about it to the dealer and AirForce sent me a new tank. There's a reason for the DOT stamp. I have a scuba tank, handpump, and CO2 so I don't really care.

At the AF website they state in a Q&A:
"18. Does AirForce Airguns Recommend Hydro Testing Facilities?

A. Yes, you can contact:

Spectrum Gas Products Inc.
2381 E Winston Rd
Anaheim, CA 92806
ph: 714-444-0477
info@spectrumgas.com
Astoria Scuba and Adventure Sports, LLC
100 39th St, Pier 39
Astoria, OR 97103
503-325-2502
fholcom@astoriascuba.com


Bulls Eye Air
2725 State Hwy 32, Ste F
Chico, CA 95973
530-537-3132
info@scubahut.org"
*Source:
https://www.airforceairguns.com/Articles.asp?ID=143#18

[sharpend]

FK0042667
TC-3ALJ-207 CLIFFDIV09
C15 VC SL T 66kg

Bottom (lighter stamp) -
6310
53161

FK0042667
TC-3ALJ-207 CLIFFDIV09 ------>  Transport Canada Aluminum Alloy service pressure 207 bar and maybe catalina mfg
C15 VC SL T 66kg

Bottom (lighter stamp) -
6310
53161

Can't figure the mfg date though, which is the important part. It'll be something like "mm testers stamp yy". "03 arrowhead 07" ---> March 2007 Luxfer tester. Alu HP tanks under 2" diam and shorter than 24" exempted from 5 yr retest if remember correctly. Maybe find someone with a SpareAir cylinder for its markings?

[sharpend]

OK, hope this helps in re 2" diam tanks. Thing is the common 13ci/3000psi bottles, for example, are 2.25" diam...anyway...

49 CFR 180.205

https://www.govregs.com/regulations/expand/title49_chapterI_part180_subpartC_section180.205

Scroll down to "Table 1 - Requalification of Cylinders" and see note below, briefly, " Any cylinder not exceeding 2 inches outside diameter and less than 2 feet in length is excepted from volumetric expansion test."

I used to teach gas mixing for technical and commercial divers, but had to flex brain as been a while.

[JohnnyPDX]

My two AirForce 490cc tanks measure 2.37" OD

[sharpend]

TC-3ALJ-207 CLIFFDIV09
C15 VC SL T 66kg

Should be "09C15" ... mfg August 2015. So, due for a hydro this summer. Sound right? Strange there's no "DOT-3AL-3000" also.

[sharpend]

Sorry, Table 1 as referenced above is found in sec 180.209.

[Bo3b]

Followup -

Tank referenced in original post has been replaced by Airforce which has these markings;

   DOT-3AL3000
   TC-3ALM 207 M103905
   FK0050246
   C17 WC.6L T.66KG

@sharpend - Thanks for the Goveregs link. Would seem AF tanks ARE subject to Hydro and Life End.

[sharpend]

Hey Bob you're welcome. Sorry about all the fussing about to get here.

DOT-3AL3000
   TC-3ALM 207 M103905
   FK0050246
   C17 WC.6L T.66KG

So, what have you determined the mfg date to be for this new tank? Is possible paint is filling a couple digits before the "C" of "C17"? Am thinking that a more common mfr tester stamp is the "C" which, venture this to be a 2017 mfg. "M" is mfr ID, "FK" s/n, "WC" is volume...

Did AF explain why tank was replaceable/replaced?

Please find below photos of my 213cc bottle from my Talon P .25, for further comparison.
Photo 1 -- Regulatory body stamps and service ratings, DOT & TC
Photo 2 -- Mfr, M1039
Photo 3 -- Mfg date and test, February 2018, and partial of S/N AJ*****
Photo 4 -- Volume, .21L or 213cc

A hui hou.

[sharpend]

Ok, so your "M1039" is Catalina Cylinder, but think the "05" belongs before the "C17". Transcription error? "05C17" would make for a May 2017 mfr date.

Can you cite your reference for there being an "end-of-life" date on an aluminum cylinder?

[Bo3b]

@sharpend,

Fairly certain the markings are as given but posted not exactly as on bottle. Below is more accurate -
   DOT-3AL3000  FK0050246
   TC-3ALM 207  M1039  05 C17  WC.5L T.66KG
(Appears that "C" in C17 perhaps has smaller "L" inside?)

AirForce unexpectedly replaced original bottle (maybe because it did not have DOT stamp?) when sent back for leak repairs.


In any case, as per the Regs link/doc, Hydro would seem required under "DOT 3AL". Not sure about "End of LIfe"...  Does "AL" indicate aluminum tank and special dispensation?

Thanks again...

[sharpend]

Hey Bob, right on!

The "C" with "L" inside is the mfg test stamp with date, May of 2017, hydro in 2 yrs. M1039 is mfr, Catalina Cylinders West, as was your previous one from Cliff Impact Division, which might be Catalina East. "3AL" is aluminum alloy, prolly 6061.

So, these 3AL tanks are typically engineered to have a service life of something like 100,000 fills. AF suggests visual inspection every three years, which I would follow that recommendation. If you are hand pumping, without dessicant phial, consider getting cylinder vis'd annually. There is no end-of-life date for a modern aluminum alloy (3AL) pressure cylinder.

All the best and happy shooting!
Mark