Trilogy of a D430L

[truck driver]

This is going to be very long but I don't know any other way to tell the story.
A year ago I bought a 430L from AoA for my first adult air rifle.
I have found out that you either love them or hate them since yes they are hard to cock in OEM form but can be made pleasant to shoot with out much trouble by changing the spring.
I'm getting ahead of my self so I'll back track some.
About a month after I got it I broke a pin in the cocking linkage and had to get Hector to bail me out and make me a new one since I had know idea where to get spares for it. So once fixed I shot it some till I sprained my left elbow cocking it and got tired of switching back and forth cocking and loading with my right hand and arm.
Found a good deal on a D48 .22 and that was much easier to cock and shoot so that put the 430L in the safe for a while and then came a D54 .177 TO1 which I started playing with to replace the 430L and even thought about using it for parts to swoop the piston and trigger pack into the 54 and short stroke the 54. But that didn't happen since I then became determined to make the 430L mine.
So I pulled it down and replaced the breach seal with Hectors kit to fix the air leak and flushed the power plant with electric contact cleaner to remove all the carbon base lubes and Krytoxed everything. Polished up the contact points in the trigger to make it smoother and get a better trigger pull. And while I was at it I added a set screw to the tab in front of the trigger blade to adjust the long first stage pull and set it back some.
Still hard to cock I decided to explore a different main spring. The OEM is 32 coils x .125" diameter wire and is a lot of spring to get 12fpe in my opinion so I decide to explore springs.
I had Tom custom make me a 28 coil X .118 wire spring since everyone was using .120" wire and getting results but not with just changing springs but modifying the cocking linkage also. I didn't want to go that route and I would have had to pay someone to do it since I don't have the equipment it takes for the modification.
Tom sent me my new spring but it wasn't what I ordered since it was 30 coils of .118" wire not 28 so what the heck to do? I put it in the gun as is and tried it. First impression was it made it easier to cock but still not what I wanted since after a while shooting it my elbow would play out and start to ache but it still was putting out 12 fpe with the new spring. I was looking for around 10 fpe thinking that was about right for this gun to be at.
During all this I found OC Bolding (WHITEFANG) and was conversing with him on the phone and through emails.
I wanted  the spring cut and closed and a top hat and guide fitted so he agreed to take the job on for me.
OC did a great job and the new guide and top hat was perfection and fit perfectly. So in the gun for testing it went. I didn't even think about it and cocked it with my left arm and thought I had gone to heaven since it was just what I was hoping for, easy to cock and no elbow pain. I ran some over the chrony and it was running right at 9.5-10 fpe which was what I expected to get from this power plant. After shooting about 100 pellets through it I decide to see what it was doing because I felt it was a little sluggish and slow so back to the chrony I went . It was now running slower and only putting out 8fpe.
OC and I had been talking about spacing the spring from the start since he felt I would loose more then I wanted and to keep the cycle nice and snappy but I didn't do it when he suggested and still didn't do it because I wasn't convinced it would work.
So I ordered a  29 coil X .120" wire spring along with some seals and piston guide spacers .875" wide x .2" thick.
The spring arrived and it went into the gun bare except for the guide and top hat. First impression was it had a nicer shot cycle and was crisper but the cocking effort was heavier and required me to go back to my right arm.
Shot it some and then ran it over the chrony. It ran slower (654.04fps) then the .118" spring (694.03 fps) with less power and harder to cock. Not what I was looking for. So more talk with OC . In the mean time waiting for a response I took the rifle down and put a power guide spacer on the guide and put the .118" spring back in the gun. I could still cock it with my left arm but it wasn't as easy as before but do able so now OC was on the phone and we discussed several things and I said I would get back to him after I ran some over the chrony weather permitting since we are in the April Showers bring May flowers stage of Spring.
The next day I got a break in the rain and ran 20 straight pellets through it to see what was happening.
I was using some Stoeger H&N 8.64 gr pellets and they were all over the place velocity wise but came up with a 786.67 fps velocity avg and 11.87 fpe . A very big gain over just the unspaced spring. So not quite be leaving what I was seeing I got some AA 8.44gr pellets out and ran a 10 shot string to see if it was near the first string.
The 10 shot string ran 3 fps faster at 789.28 fps at 11.62 fpe. I though Wow a blind squirrel found a nut and then for giggles I throw out the high and low shots to get a spread of 4.5 fps I knew I had succeeded in doing what I wanted to do with this gun.
Hope you enjoyed reading my journey with the 430L.

[Motorhead]

100,000.00 dollar questions becomes ... knowing what you know now would have purchased the rifle ? and would you go threw this again by purchasing another ?

[truck driver]

100,000.00 dollar questions becomes ... knowing what you know now would have purchased the rifle ? and would you go threw this again by purchasing another ?

To give you an Honest and truthful answer NO to both questions
I only put this on here so others that have them and are dissatisfied with them can see there is a light at the end of the tunnel and they can be made easier to shoot by anyone with a little mechanical ability.
I'm not a Tuner and don't claim to be.
I have had to lean on OC/WHITEFANG heavily through the whole thing and he has been gracious enough to stick with me.
There was help from others along the way and Hector also gave me some help with things.
Bouncing ideas off him and others to come to a decision on what course of action and direction I wanted to go.
OC reached out to me and offered his help and knowledge so we collaborated on the project.
I did learn a lot with this about air guns and different trigger systems that Diana has used in their guns so it was a learning experience.

[Roadworthy]

Great story, Rodger, especially the part about the happy ending.  I'm not there yet but I'm taking all the 430L information I can find under advisement.  I'm not sure where I'll end up but thanks for taking the time.

[Pavesi]

Thanks for the great post.   I fit into that first group of people you mention that love the 430L, but that may be because it fit my budget and is the most accurate air rifle I've ever had the pleasure of shooting (yup, not much experience here, I've only had a Gamo and a Walther Terrus to compare with).   Giving up a few FPE for a lighter cocking cycle sounds like a potentially worthwhile trade off, though I'm okay with it as it is.   But, if the original spring breaks at some point, or I have to tear into it again to replace the breech seal, it might be nice to try.   Do you think any of the Vortek tuning springs could potentially work as a drop in?   They have a 0.118 with a 780 OD which seems like it might be close (my original spring measures in at 0.819 OD), but I suspect I'm oversimplifying things.         

[HectorMedina]

Thanks for posting that, Rodger!

Interestingly enough, there are a few high end shooters that also like the 430L.
Yes, there IS light at the end of the tunel (and it is NOT a locomotive coming, LOL)!

I am sure we will be talking a LOT more about this little platform in the near future.

;-)





HM

[truck driver]

Thanks for the replies everyone.
This has been a love hate ordeal where at times I wanted to wrap it around a tree and that was not to bend the barrel.
I have been in and out of that gun so much I could probably do it blind folded.
As some have said I also bought it because it is a beautiful gun and it fit my budget thinking I was getting the best bang for my buck and actually it was but even after shooting two of Hectors guns one OEM and one tuned I bought it even knowing it was hard to cock. I just loved the way it looks. I was just hoping it would get better with use but then I hurt myself trying.

Thanks for the great post.   I fit into that first group of people you mention that love the 430L, but that may be because it fit my budget and is the most accurate air rifle I've ever had the pleasure of shooting (yup, not much experience here, I've only had a Gamo and a Walther Terrus to compare with).   Giving up a few FPE for a lighter cocking cycle sounds like a potentially worthwhile trade off, though I'm okay with it as it is.   But, if the original spring breaks at some point, or I have to tear into it again to replace the breech seal, it might be nice to try.   Do you think any of the Vortek tuning springs could potentially work as a drop in?   They have a 0.118 with a 780 OD which seems like it might be close (my original spring measures in at 0.819 OD), but I suspect I'm oversimplifying things.         

I don't really have much experience with Vortek tuning kits and don't care for gimmicks like adjustable top hats to change the power, one of the reasons for not first installing a power spacer as OC had suggested.
Both Vortek and Macarri have tune kits and I would go with the Macarri since I do have experience with them.
JM's ZRT kit in my 48 .22 is great and has turned it into a very accurate long range shooter. I have his GRT spring in my 54 with one of Hector's top hats and guide he made for the 430L but it fit this spring so why not use it in this platform. I wanted 15-16 fpe in the 54 and that spring did what I wanted for less money.
I'm cheap and I admit it and will try work arounds even though they end up costing me more in the long run but some times it's about the journey.

[Mark 611]

TD, I completely understand! nothing ventured nothing gained! This is why guy's like OC, Scott and I are around, we have taken these adventures in experimenting and tuning and usage and know what were talking about! I'm glad to see u have gotten it where u want it! sometimes that takes a lot to figure out what u want in ur air gun! Not just the common run of the mill offerings! This is why its called tuning!!!! not just installing a spring kit!

[truck driver]

TD, I completely understand! nothing ventured nothing gained! This is why guy's like OC, Scott and I are around, we have taken these adventures in experimenting and tuning and usage and know what were talking about! I'm glad to see u have gotten it where u want it! sometimes that takes a lot to figure out what u want in ur air gun! Not just the common run of the mill offerings! This is why its called tuning!!!! not just installing a spring kit!

Thanks Mark.
I understand what your saying since my adventures started with cartridge guns and reloading for accuracy.
The spring air gun is a totally different animal.
I have gone as far as changing power plants and triggers in my guns by swooping pistons and trigger packs.
The D54 started life as a TO1 which I heard nothing but negative thoughts about so I wanted it to be the best there was so I swooped out the the piston and trigger pack with my D48 .22 and in a sense short stroked the D54 since the piston rod is shorter in a TO1 piston then the TO6 piston.
Played with the TO1 and found it could be adjusted like a single stage trigger and polished the contact points and now have a nice light single stage trigger in the D48 which I like very much so it will stay where it is. The TO6 trigger pack I put into the 54 I polished all the contact points and installed a set screw in the tab to take up the first stage slack which set the trigger back and made it nicer to shoot since the sledge system sets the trigger farther forward when cocked.
Yes I'm learning to tune my own rifles but I'm still not a tuner by a long shot.

[lefteyeshot]

AoA ent me a 430 with open sights instead of a 430L and I decided to keep it. I've done nothing to it but scope it and shoot it and like it  as is.

I mounted a Simmons Protarget 30mm 3-9x40 from Walmart on it with a one piece off set see-thru mount. Didn't need an offset, just what I had in the parts bin. Set the scope and Z mount came with it aside. I haven't shot in a couple of months so I just shot it out he study window. To me it's hard to cock but not that hard, trigger is good and the recoil light. In comparison some of my other underlevers are a Diana 470th, Hatsan Dominator carbine and 155 Torpedo, Proxima and a B40. I cock all of them with two hands. The cocking effort is no worst or easier than any of those and the only one with a better trigger is the B40. The 470th and 155 are beast but manageable.

[WHITEFANG]

Thanks Truckdiver! Our relationship has become a great thing. Always enjoy or conversations that are airgun, pb's and LIFE ln general. I have much respect for you.

I love to help all and what I suggest could always be wrong. As with our adventure I have never seen in person, ownef or had 1 of those guns in my hands. But I can use all my experience with other guns and share the basic, well I will clear that up, it is what I have learned over the years in mechanical knowledge and the airguns.

In the past many years back I had many cheap and expensive airguns. Pcp guns I went stupid in buying high dollar guns. Yet I do not regret that time in my life.
Good quality guns speak for there self. I made big money and could afford all my many expensive hobbies.
Jet boat racing, drag cars, 4 wheel drives that saw hunting and mud and high waters. Then horses. None of any of those when into them are cheap.

I understand many are not as lucky as I in life. But I worked for all of it.

The D430L may be great for many. My help was just a swag in opinion and help. But I have seen guns that you can throw the even the kitchen sink at and not get what you want.

My working guns for others is not a business as I have said before. I claim no tuner status but my guns are tuned for my needs.
A kit and a bucket of tar is not a tune.

But again thanks and we will stay in contact always.

OC/AKA FANG
GHOSTWOLF AIRGUN WORKS
JUNKYARD AIRGUN FORUM

[Pavesi]

I am sure we will be talking a LOT more about this little platform in the near future.

;-)

HM

Hector, I’m very glad to hear there will be more coming.   I was struggling with accuracy issues on other springers and was about to give up, when I ran across the AOA deal and your articles which gave me the impetus to buy one.   I love the 430L in the same way I love the Italian cars I have owned.  Yes they can be finicky and temperamental at times, but when they work, they work oh so well and are so much fun to drive.   The 430L is a bit of a rare bird, which is nice from one standpoint, but doesn’t lend itself well to aftermarket parts and “how to” articles.   Many thanks for your exceptional and enlightening articles.

TruckDriver,  what is the OD on your 28 coil 0.118 spring if I may ask?    Thanks again for the detailed write-up!

[truck driver]

I am sure we will be talking a LOT more about this little platform in the near future.

;-)

HM

Hector, I’m very glad to hear there will be more coming.   I was struggling with accuracy issues on other springers and was about to give up, when I ran across the AOA deal and your articles which gave me the impetus to buy one.   I love the 430L in the same way I love the Italian cars I have owned.  Yes they can be finicky and temperamental at times, but when they work, they work oh so well and are so much fun to drive.   The 430L is a bit of a rare bird, which is nice from one standpoint, but doesn’t lend itself well to aftermarket parts and “how to” articles.   Many thanks for your exceptional and enlightening articles.

TruckDriver,  what is the OD on your 28 coil 0.118 spring if I may ask?    Thanks again for the detailed write-up!

Pavesi; To be honest I truely don't know with out taking it apart and measuring it. Since Vortek has a .780" OD .118" spring wire that is probably what it is.
You Need to call them and ask how they count the coils since I asked for a 28 coil spring and got what I consider to be a 30 coil since I count all coils including the collapsed spring . That 30 coil spring might fill the ticket for you and you should still get 12 FPE out of it with out a top hat or a 29 coil with a top hat might get you close. Tom can run the numbers for you if you explain what you want to do. He won't make a top hat and guide for you to go with the spring or at least he wouldn't for me.
I hope this helps to answer your question.

[truck driver]

Thanks Truckdiver! Our relationship has become a great thing. Always enjoy or conversations that are airgun, pb's and LIFE ln general. I have much respect for you.

I love to help all and what I suggest could always be wrong. As with our adventure I have never seen in person, ownef or had 1 of those guns in my hands. But I can use all my experience with other guns and share the basic, well I will clear that up, it is what I have learned over the years in mechanical knowledge and the airguns.

In the past many years back I had many cheap and expensive airguns. Pcp guns I went stupid in buying high dollar guns. Yet I do not regret that time in my life.
Good quality guns speak for there self. I made big money and could afford all my many expensive hobbies.
Jet boat racing, drag cars, 4 wheel drives that saw hunting and mud and high waters. Then horses. None of any of those when into them are cheap.

I understand many are not as lucky as I in life. But I worked for all of it.

The D430L may be great for many. My help was just a swag in opinion and help. But I have seen guns that you can throw the even the kitchen sink at and not get what you want.

My working guns for others is not a business as I have said before. I claim no tuner status but my guns are tuned for my needs.
A kit and a bucket of tar is not a tune.

But again thanks and we will stay in contact always.

OC/AKA FANG
GHOSTWOLF AIRGUN WORKS
JUNKYARD AIRGUN FORUM

Fang thanks for the compliments and help. You kept pointing me in the right direction but sometimes I couldn't see through the fog I created for myself.
I have a lot of respect for you and your air gun knowledge also.
Can hardly wait to team up on the next project 

[Pavesi]

Thanks again Roger.  I didn't realize when you said Tom, that meant Vortek.   I take it that the stock spring guide wasn't quite the right size with the new spring.

[truck driver]

Thanks again Roger.  I didn't realize when you said Tom, that meant Vortek.   I take it that the stock spring guide wasn't quite the right size with the new spring.

The OEM spring guide fits snug  but not tight. I sent the spring with the OEM guide to OC/Fang and he thought he should fit a tighter guide and since he was making a Top hat we decided that it should be a complete set that way there is no differences in spring response and takes all the twang out of the spring.

Sorry for the confusion by using Tom's name instead of the companies.
Some times we forget and think everyone knows Tom is the owner of Vortek and he is the one who will answer the phone if he is able to and not setting up a machine to make springs.

One thing to remember is I'm no expert on this gun and just a guy that went on a journey to get answers and make it his own.